WA WA - Shantina Smiley, 29, & Azriel Carver, 8 (fnd deceased), Olympia, Mar 2010 - #6

[SMK]

That's a good point. She was taking a HUGE chance that someone might report her, or that by going into so many convenience stores and a diner, a plain-clothes, off-duty or regular ol' officer would see her. At least around here, they'll post LE in and around these stores after dark; some hire off-duty officers to provide security.

Right, I think offduty security at convenience stores is pretty well known. Do you have any thoughts on my other above posted, about the tide and the items? You are a shrewd and quick thinker!!:dance:

 

[houndstooth]

Thanks, you raise excellent points and questions.....

The biggest argument against a random person following her is the last leg of her journey. If they had been following her then they too would have gone past or turned around at the Mercantile. Then followed her and been lurking while she went inside the Williams. Then LED her directly to the spot on the beach? It doesn't make sense to me. There is no time and no one on video that is seen that LE has speculated about some other vehicle that appeared to follow or lead her. If enough of the passing traffic was visible on video, I would be checking out those descriptions of any vehicles that came and went from around 9pm to about 1am.

 

[houndstooth]

Cannot figure out:
The items found by the woman and reported by her, and her husband, were located beneath the stairs on the beach. They either washed ashore there, or someone left them or placed them there. Chief Deputy Chamberlain felt it was unlikely they washed ashore, due to their different weights ( they would not have wound up in one area like that).

Lt. Mealy said the high tide was "ferocious" enough to drag SS and Az into the water and cause them to drown....

if that tide is ferocious enough to cause them to be pulled in, and carry Azriel clear to Fox Island and cause Shantina to not be found at all: How is it, then, this same high tide current did not carry away those items found on the beach? if the tide washed those items IN... yet, strong enough to carry out two bodies, why didn't that same tide wash those items out to sea as well?
They were perhaps placed there just before the woman found them? Why does none of this make sense to me??? Any thoughts, or is it just me? I am puzzled......

It seems to me that the stairs were built above the highwater mark lest they themselves be washed away! You can see if you look closely at the google and bing map photos zoomed from above what areas are within and above the high tides just by the color of the sand. You can see on the bing map that it was taken not too long before high tide because it is a short distance to where the dark sand changes in color and texture. You can see the water where it is shallow and where it changes in color and depth what the low tide mark is even. There is a wide swath of permanent dry beach all along this whole stretch. It is not as though the whole beach is inundated at high tide.

 

[BeanE]

7, 8, 9, 10. Almost exactly every hour. Know what that indicates to me? Level emotion, level condition. No more - or less - reason to stop at 7 than at any other time for 3 hours. No more or less hungry, tired, sleepy, sick, achy, intoxicated, drugged, happy, sad, distressed, worried, compelled to flee, thirsty, frightened, intimidated, in pain, or anything else. However she arrived at that payphone at 7 is how she was at 8, 9, and 10.

She stopped to:
- get directions
- get a drink
- get a drink for Az
- get something to eat
- use a phone
- have personal human contact
- have voice contact

7, 8, 9, 10. Then something changed. At 11. 7, 8, 9, 10, 11.

She no longer needed to:
- get directions
- get a drink
- get a drink for Az
- get something to eat
- use a phone
- have personal human contact
- have voice contact

She no longer needed any of the things she needed every single hour on the hour from 7 until 10.

But back to my initial observation, to me more important, she was exactly the same at 7 as she was at 10, but no longer at 11.

Timeline:

6:45 p.m.– Shantina stops off at an unknown location and calls her fiancé Robb Simmons. She tells him her cell phone was left at home, and she was hoping he could bring it with him on his way to Castle Rock later.

7:55 p.m.– Lt. Mealey says there is video of Shantina stopping off at the Handy Pantry, where she made a purchase and left.

9:08 p.m.– Shantina stops off at the Martin Way Diner and orders one corndog to go. This is odd because this is a sit down diner, not an establishment you order carry out from. Although she placed the corndog order, she did not pick it up. Instead, police say Shantina walked outside, tripped before getting into her van, and drove off with her son.

9:55 p.m.– Lt. Mealey says there is more surveillance video of Shantina stopping off at a local store on a rural county road. The store was closed, so she left.

10:00 p.m.– Shantina and her son stop off at a residence occupied by an elderly couple. She used the phone in the residence and called her grandfather to say she was lost, and there was an accident of sorts, but she did not elaborate. The elderly couple fed her son a slice of pizza and gave her directions to get back on the main road.

http://www.michellesigona.com/2010/03/shantina-smiley-still-missing-remembering-azriel/

 

[Calliope]

Complaints against mother

Smiley has been the focus of investigations in the past. Since 2005, the Washington state Department of Social and Health Services has received ten complaints about her parenting. Three of those were serious enough to be investigated.

* June 2005: allegations of abuse were ruled inconclusive when Azriel suffered bruises and a broken arm. Smiley's ex-boyfriend was blamed and arrested, but investigators never determined who hurt Azriel.
* March 2007: a claim that Smiley abused Azriel was ruled "unfounded."
* August 2007: the state said Smiley was negligent when she passed out after drinking alcohol while caring for Azriel.
Snipped
http://www.nwcn.com/home/Search-to-...m-after-sons-body-washes-ashore-88553242.html

Again, one complaint against SS that was found actionable.

Examiner.com received an email from Sherry Hill, M.S., Communications Director at Children's Administration (CA) that said, "There have been 10 cases of abuse reported to Children's Administration in Azriel's case; three of those reports to CA were investigated by Child Protective Services."

So, what happened to the other seven reports? Hill said, "Children’s Administration is in the process of conducting a fatality review of the case. The state has 180 days to conduct the review – so it will not be available for some time—the timeframe started upon his body being found."

To get an idea of what the Fatality Review will contain, Hill said to visit http://www.dshs.wa.gov/ca/pubs/fatalityreports.asp. Hill said CA will inform Examiner.com when the report becomes available. We will report the findings at that time.

In 2005 CA received a report that Shantina's ex-boyfriend abused Azriel. Hill wrote, "An investigation reported serious physical abuse of Azriel; Smiley’s boyfriend was suspected of severely abusing him when he was 4 years old. The boyfriend was arrested (Cowlitz Co. Sherriff’s dept.) but never prosecuted for the assault due to lack of evidence; Children’s Administration investigation resulted in an inconclusive finding."

According to KIRO TV, Hill said investigators concluded a March 2007 complaint that Smiley abused her son was unfounded.

Then, Hill stated that in August 2007 Longview Police found Shantina passed out from alcohol. She lost custody temporarily while she underwent treatment for her alcohol problem and voluntarily relinquished Azriel into her grandparents' care.

Upon completion of the program, Hill said, Azriel was returned to Shantina's care in the fall of 2007. At that time, both Azriel and Shantina were living with Shantina's grandparents. That case was closed in January 2008.

http://www.examiner.com/x-34328-Sea...l-Carver-allegations-of-child-abuse-Slideshow

Same director interviewed here, same facts:

Sherry Hill of CPS told reporter Chris Legeros that of 10 complaints filed involving 29-year-old Shantina Smiley and her son, 8-year-old Azriel Carver, three were investigated.

Investigators looked into a June 2005 complaint that Azriel suffered serious physical abuse at the hands of Smiley's ex-boyfriend, and the man was arrested but never prosecuted, Hill said.

Investigators concluded a March 2007 complaint that Smiley abused her son was unfounded, Hill said.

In August 2007, CPS investigators found Smiley neglected the boy when he was unsupervised while she was passed-out drunk. Azriel was taken from his mother's care but returned to her after she got treatment, Hill said.

http://www.kirotv.com/news/22891964/detail.html


I've seen nothing to indicate they ever suspected Shantina may have broken his arm.

 

[BeanE]

That's a good point. She was taking a HUGE chance that someone might report her, or that by going into so many convenience stores and a diner, a plain-clothes, off-duty or regular ol' officer would see her. At least around here, they'll post LE in and around these stores after dark; some hire off-duty officers to provide security.

She was not acting like someone who was trying to hide, that's for sure.

 

[SMK]

It seems to me that the stairs were built above the highwater mark lest they themselves be washed away! You can see if you look closely at the google and bing map photos zoomed from above what areas are within and above the high tides just by the color of the sand. You can see on the bing map that it was taken not too long before high tide because it is a short distance to where the dark sand changes in color and texture. You can see the water where it is shallow and where it changes in color and depth what the low tide mark is even. There is a wide swath of permanent dry beach all along this whole stretch. It is not as though the whole beach is inundated at high tide.

Oh, OK, I see. But this would make it seem, still, that they may have been placed there. Or left. Rather than washed. Thanks so much for this clarification.....

 

[SMK]

7, 8, 9, 10. Almost exactly every hour. Know what that indicates to me? Level emotion, level condition. No more - or less - reason to stop at 7 than at any other time for 3 hours. No more or less hungry, tired, sleepy, sick, achy, intoxicated, drugged, happy, sad, distressed, worried, compelled to flee, thirsty, frightened, intimidated, in pain, or anything else. However she arrived at that payphone at 7 is how she was at 8, 9, and 10.

She stopped to:
- get directions
- get a drink
- get a drink for Az
- get something to eat
- use a phone
- have personal human contact
- have voice contact

7, 8, 9, 10. Then something changed. At 11. 7, 8, 9, 10, 11.

She no longer needed to:
- get directions
- get a drink
- get a drink for Az
- get something to eat
- use a phone
- have personal human contact
- have voice contact

She no longer needed any of the things she needed every single hour on the hour from 7 until 10.

But back to my initial observation, to me more important, she was exactly the same at 7 as she was at 10, but no longer at 11.

Timeline:

6:45 p.m.– Shantina stops off at an unknown location and calls her fiancé Robb Simmons. She tells him her cell phone was left at home, and she was hoping he could bring it with him on his way to Castle Rock later.

7:55 p.m.– Lt. Mealey says there is video of Shantina stopping off at the Handy Pantry, where she made a purchase and left.

9:08 p.m.– Shantina stops off at the Martin Way Diner and orders one corndog to go. This is odd because this is a sit down diner, not an establishment you order carry out from. Although she placed the corndog order, she did not pick it up. Instead, police say Shantina walked outside, tripped before getting into her van, and drove off with her son.

9:55 p.m.– Lt. Mealey says there is more surveillance video of Shantina stopping off at a local store on a rural county road. The store was closed, so she left.

10:00 p.m.– Shantina and her son stop off at a residence occupied by an elderly couple. She used the phone in the residence and called her grandfather to say she was lost, and there was an accident of sorts, but she did not elaborate. The elderly couple fed her son a slice of pizza and gave her directions to get back on the main road.

http://www.michellesigona.com/2010/03/shantina-smiley-still-missing-remembering-azriel/

Very interesting. Thanks, I am mulling this over.....

 

[SMK]

The biggest argument against a random person following her is the last leg of her journey. If they had been following her then they too would have gone past or turned around at the Mercantile. Then followed her and been lurking while she went inside the Williams. Then LED her directly to the spot on the beach? It doesn't make sense to me. There is no time and no one on video that is seen that LE has speculated about some other vehicle that appeared to follow or lead her. If enough of the passing traffic was visible on video, I would be checking out those descriptions of any vehicles that came and went from around 9pm to about 1am.

Yes, but perhaps it was not a random person, but someone she had been planning to see there? And a confrontation ensued....Just a thought, which keeps surfacing, but may be all wet here......

 

[powayparent]

I've seen nothing to indicate they ever suspected Shantina may have broken his arm.

FWIW

"In June 2005, someone reported the boy had suffered serious physical abuse, according to Sherry Hill, a spokeswoman for the agency. Smiley's ex-boyfriend was arrested for assault but never prosecuted.

After its investigation, CPS could not determine who had committed the abuse, Smiley or the ex-boyfriend. At that point, Smiley voluntarily sent the boy to live with relatives."

BBM

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2011393025_missing20m.html

 

[fullofsecrets]

7, 8, 9, 10. Almost exactly every hour. Know what that indicates to me? Level emotion, level condition. No more - or less - reason to stop at 7 than at any other time for 3 hours. No more or less hungry, tired, sleepy, sick, achy, intoxicated, drugged, happy, sad, distressed, worried, compelled to flee, thirsty, frightened, intimidated, in pain, or anything else. However she arrived at that payphone at 7 is how she was at 8, 9, and 10.

She stopped to:
- get directions
- get a drink
- get a drink for Az
- get something to eat
- use a phone
- have personal human contact
- have voice contact

7, 8, 9, 10. Then something changed. At 11. 7, 8, 9, 10, 11.

She no longer needed to:
- get directions
- get a drink
- get a drink for Az
- get something to eat
- use a phone
- have personal human contact
- have voice contact

She no longer needed any of the things she needed every single hour on the hour from 7 until 10.

But back to my initial observation, to me more important, she was exactly the same at 7 as she was at 10, but no longer at 11.

Timeline:

6:45 p.m.– Shantina stops off at an unknown location and calls her fiancé Robb Simmons. She tells him her cell phone was left at home, and she was hoping he could bring it with him on his way to Castle Rock later.

7:55 p.m.– Lt. Mealey says there is video of Shantina stopping off at the Handy Pantry, where she made a purchase and left.

9:08 p.m.– Shantina stops off at the Martin Way Diner and orders one corndog to go. This is odd because this is a sit down diner, not an establishment you order carry out from. Although she placed the corndog order, she did not pick it up. Instead, police say Shantina walked outside, tripped before getting into her van, and drove off with her son.

9:55 p.m.– Lt. Mealey says there is more surveillance video of Shantina stopping off at a local store on a rural county road. The store was closed, so she left.

10:00 p.m.– Shantina and her son stop off at a residence occupied by an elderly couple. She used the phone in the residence and called her grandfather to say she was lost, and there was an accident of sorts, but she did not elaborate. The elderly couple fed her son a slice of pizza and gave her directions to get back on the main road.

http://www.michellesigona.com/2010/03/shantina-smiley-still-missing-remembering-azriel/

Safeway Gas Station at about 8:00pm? Perhaps worried that the mom and pop Handy Pantry wouldn't have a security camera? When you lay it out like that it seems more and more contrived or intentional!

 

[Calliope]

Thinking of Az. Rest in peace, honey.

I saw that photo on Shantina's myspace. Her photos of him are just precious. And this is a follow up to the one above, after he dropped his ice pop. Poor little guy

 

[SMK]

I saw that photo on Shantina's myspace. Her photos of him are just precious. And this is a follow up to the one above, after he dropped his ice pop. Poor little guy

Awww, that is just too sweet and sad!!!!:cry::cry::cry::cry:

 

[sorrell skye]

Hello everyone ~
Still catching up with the thread & all the shoe discussion.

It was reported that RS ID'd the smaller shoe as belonging to Shantina.

Apologies if this has already been posted. I'm still on page 11.

 

[SMK]

7, 8, 9, 10. Almost exactly every hour. Know what that indicates to me? Level emotion, level condition. No more - or less - reason to stop at 7 than at any other time for 3 hours. No more or less hungry, tired, sleepy, sick, achy, intoxicated, drugged, happy, sad, distressed, worried, compelled to flee, thirsty, frightened, intimidated, in pain, or anything else. However she arrived at that payphone at 7 is how she was at 8, 9, and 10.

She stopped to:
- get directions
- get a drink
- get a drink for Az
- get something to eat
- use a phone
- have personal human contact
- have voice contact

7, 8, 9, 10. Then something changed. At 11. 7, 8, 9, 10, 11.

She no longer needed to:
- get directions
- get a drink
- get a drink for Az
- get something to eat
- use a phone
- have personal human contact
- have voice contact

She no longer needed any of the things she needed every single hour on the hour from 7 until 10.

But back to my initial observation, to me more important, she was exactly the same at 7 as she was at 10, but no longer at 11.

Timeline:

6:45 p.m.– Shantina stops off at an unknown location and calls her fiancé Robb Simmons. She tells him her cell phone was left at home, and she was hoping he could bring it with him on his way to Castle Rock later.

7:55 p.m.– Lt. Mealey says there is video of Shantina stopping off at the Handy Pantry, where she made a purchase and left.

9:08 p.m.– Shantina stops off at the Martin Way Diner and orders one corndog to go. This is odd because this is a sit down diner, not an establishment you order carry out from. Although she placed the corndog order, she did not pick it up. Instead, police say Shantina walked outside, tripped before getting into her van, and drove off with her son.

9:55 p.m.– Lt. Mealey says there is more surveillance video of Shantina stopping off at a local store on a rural county road. The store was closed, so she left.

10:00 p.m.– Shantina and her son stop off at a residence occupied by an elderly couple. She used the phone in the residence and called her grandfather to say she was lost, and there was an accident of sorts, but she did not elaborate. The elderly couple fed her son a slice of pizza and gave her directions to get back on the main road.

http://www.michellesigona.com/2010/03/shantina-smiley-still-missing-remembering-azriel/

The only possibilities I can think of:
1. She was done with her "staging" ( I hope not)
2. They were with someone, and were no longer wandering or killing time.
3. It was time to stop: 11 pm. Not going to make it to CRock. Day is over. They were parked on the beach, resting and sleeping ( already had drinks, rest stops, pizza, calls)- awakened later, as Mealy suggested, by high tide.
4. They rode out of the area, and came back, or went someplace where there was no camera, or where the camera was not working. Decided to go back to beach to sleep. Or went there at someone's suggestion.
5. They were already in some confrontation .

 

[sorrell skye]

FWIW

"In June 2005, someone reported the boy had suffered serious physical abuse, according to Sherry Hill, a spokeswoman for the agency. Smiley's ex-boyfriend was arrested for assault but never prosecuted.

After its investigation, CPS could not determine who had committed the abuse, Smiley or the ex-boyfriend. At that point, Smiley voluntarily sent the boy to live with relatives."

BBM

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2011393025_missing20m.html

Thanks for posting that Poway. I'm feeling lazy at the moment & didn't want to go & dig up that article again.

When I read that article a few weeks back, I was alarmed that CPS was unable to determine who had committed the abuse. Azriel would have been 5 at the time, and would have been able to say who hurt him, but legally he would be too young to be a witness in a criminal case. I have wondered why CPS was unable to determine who abused Azriel.

I also wondered why Shantina sent Azriel to live with relatives. Did the boyfriend stay living with her (even after being accused of abusing Azriel?), while Az went off to stay with family somewhere else? I posed these same questions awhile ago, after reading the above article.

I know we don't have the answers to these questions, but IMO they're worth wondering about.

 

[Jules71]

7, 8, 9, 10. Almost exactly every hour. Know what that indicates to me? Level emotion, level condition. No more - or less - reason to stop at 7 than at any other time for 3 hours. No more or less hungry, tired, sleepy, sick, achy, intoxicated, drugged, happy, sad, distressed, worried, compelled to flee, thirsty, frightened, intimidated, in pain, or anything else. However she arrived at that payphone at 7 is how she was at 8, 9, and 10.

She stopped to:
- get directions
- get a drink
- get a drink for Az
- get something to eat
- use a phone
- have personal human contact
- have voice contact

7, 8, 9, 10. Then something changed. At 11. 7, 8, 9, 10, 11.

She no longer needed to:
- get directions
- get a drink
- get a drink for Az
- get something to eat
- use a phone
- have personal human contact
- have voice contact

She no longer needed any of the things she needed every single hour on the hour from 7 until 10.

But back to my initial observation, to me more important, she was exactly the same at 7 as she was at 10, but no longer at 11.

Timeline:

6:45 p.m.– Shantina stops off at an unknown location and calls her fiancé Robb Simmons. She tells him her cell phone was left at home, and she was hoping he could bring it with him on his way to Castle Rock later.

7:55 p.m.– Lt. Mealey says there is video of Shantina stopping off at the Handy Pantry, where she made a purchase and left.

9:08 p.m.– Shantina stops off at the Martin Way Diner and orders one corndog to go. This is odd because this is a sit down diner, not an establishment you order carry out from. Although she placed the corndog order, she did not pick it up. Instead, police say Shantina walked outside, tripped before getting into her van, and drove off with her son.

9:55 p.m.– Lt. Mealey says there is more surveillance video of Shantina stopping off at a local store on a rural county road. The store was closed, so she left.

10:00 p.m.– Shantina and her son stop off at a residence occupied by an elderly couple. She used the phone in the residence and called her grandfather to say she was lost, and there was an accident of sorts, but she did not elaborate. The elderly couple fed her son a slice of pizza and gave her directions to get back on the main road.

http://www.michellesigona.com/2010/03/shantina-smiley-still-missing-remembering-azriel/

Reading this makes me think she may have been reaching out, subconsciously wanting to be stopped. I keep going back to how it seems she was reconnecting with people of her past and what that could mean.

 

[BeanE]

Safeway Gas Station at about 8:00pm? Perhaps worried that the mom and pop Handy Pantry wouldn't have a security camera? When you lay it out like that it seems more and more contrived or intentional!

I don't think any of it was contrived. Most of us do function in patterns - we go to the bathroom at fairly regular intervals unless we're drinking more or less than usual, we usually drink about the same amount at the same intervals unless it becomes significantly hotter or colder or we develop a fever etc. We're creatures of habit. So I don't see anything contrived - I see Shantina's habits, her patterns for that evening, and then a significant break from that pattern.

We can look at her pattern for the evening and see, for example, that that knock on the door should have come at 11.

This is telling me that whatever happened to Shantina likely happened before 11 or she would have made human contact, gone to a store, asked for directions, etc. then. Which convinces me even more that it was most likely Az at the door at 1.

Yep. I'm gonna contend that whatever happened to Shantina happened before 11... before the tide came in. And Az didn't know about it until 1. Before the tide came in.

Cue in Alfred Hitchcock music...

Nah. Just kidding.

I can still account for what happened to Shantina before 11 without the tide via a brain event.

I can still account for what happened to Az just after 1 before the tide came in. He went back down to the beach and wandered it for hours before he accidentally drowned because he was in shock and despair from whatever happened to Shantina before 11.

 

[Calliope]

Thanks for posting that Poway. I'm feeling lazy at the moment & didn't want to go & dig up that article again.

When I read that article a few weeks back, I was alarmed that CPS was unable to determine who had committed the abuse. Azriel would have been 5 at the time, and would have been able to say who hurt him, but legally he would be too young to be a witness in a criminal case. I have wondered why CPS was unable to determine who abused Azriel.

I also wondered why Shantina sent Azriel to live with relatives. Did the boyfriend stay living with her (even after being accused of abusing Azriel?), while Az went off to stay with family somewhere else? I posed these same questions awhile ago, after reading the above article.

I know we don't have the answers to these questions, but IMO they're worth wondering about.

He was arrested, so I suspect it came down to a he-said/she-said kinda thing. I don't know that she stayed with him. Without searching through all the articles, I believe it was around that time that they were in NY... soon before or after her mom died, they moved back to WA. Wasn't there something about her mother being a witness and therefore he couldn't be prosecuted? A bit fuzzy on that story, sorry.

 

[LCoastMom]

Sorry if this is old news, I did the sex-offender search. There are 6 within a few miles, 1 who literally lives around the block from Zangle one who lives around the block from the address on 46th Ave, one who lives very close to the Gull Harbor Mercantile.

(The RSO addy's are not complete residences)
From Zangle
6600 (Block) Brinkwood St NE Olympia, WA 98506 (2.0 mi – about 4 mins)

46th Ave NE Olympia, WA 98506 (1.3mi about 3 mins)
700 Block 36th Ave NE

46th Ave NE Olympia, WA 98506 (.9mi - 1 min)
1900 53rd Way NE Olympia, WA 98506

46th in opposite direction (3 mi 5min)
2800 Libby Rd NE Olympia WA 98506
2700 26th Ave NE Olympia, WA 98506 (this is .4 mi from Libby (around 1 corner)
Gull Harbor Mercantile(3.9mi 9 min) to
5600 Lemon RD NE Olympia WA 98506

I had not noticed this before, but in the article in the above link there is this;

The residents told investigators that around 10:00 p.m. Smiley knocked on their door and came in the house to call her grandfather in Castle Rock, because she was lost, according to the residents of the house.

Does anyone know if that info is correct?
Does she have a grandfater in Castle Rock?
Did they mean her stepfather in Castle Rock?

In RS timeline, he states she called the grandparents in Brinnon and he knew this by chance right after she called them. So he knew where she was at around 10pm.

I'm confused as to who she actually called. Did she call both?

Since the Willians' didn't know anything except what they observed, and were told by Shantina, had she called both, or did they get confused?

Has LE confrimed who all she called at the Williams' home that night?
tia
During this time I was in vigilant contact with the authorities for any information.

So LE knew she had been on 46th ave at 10pm. It seems like everyone knew where to look, so why didn't they?

Because he is in vigilant contact with the authorities, did LE go to the Williams' house before they found the van, b/c there's this guy who is freaking out b/c he can't find his gf and her son, but knows she was in Olympia at 1010pm. Caller id says whose house she was at. Did they check it out? What a sad set of circumstances. moo

Gpa said "You know your not gonna get the news you wanna hear. (answered something unheard) Very, very - just like she phoned me that night.

Rob said his battery was almost dead and he had poor reception, he used stepdads phone while driving around in his truck and called GPA and found she had called from DW's house at 10:10....

In one interview he says they called State Patrol at 9pm another says 10pm; did he call State Patrol and say we got a call she was "here" at 1010?

I think you guys nailed something here, you really made my head spin for a couple moments... Why did they not start the search from there at 10 if they were driving around anyway???

So last night while you all tossed around shoe sizes and did amazing things I replayed the early news video's (BTW Rob said she wears a 9 wide, so does my daughter. She has a pair that look almost exactly like those. No way is the smaller shoe a 9w and no way is the smaller shoe a mens 13. Also someone commented she had retied her shoe, if she "kicked it off" while driving she most likely never untied it... JMO

From ABC News:
Surveillance footage shows Smiley buying a large bottle of wine, and authorities found what they believe is that bottle, half empty and corked, after it washed ashore along with one of her shoes, a ball and an inhaler belonging to Azriel.

Williams said Smiley didn't appear to be drunk or otherwise impaired, but seemed nervous and looked as if she'd been crying. She told the family she'd left the highway to find her son a bathroom. (never heard this before - could be why they went to the rest stops, maybe figuring if she found trouble this would be the place to find it... Still does not explain why they didn't look from the Williams out.

High Tide was at 6 AM. The most that the tide would have risen is barely around the tires. No deep water yet to wade through.

LE states that they can't rule out that she may be alive. And neither can I.

respectfully snipped
Thank you for answering my question, which leads to another... :innocent: I thought from listening to Sheriff Mealy that the tide came in much quicker I am really surprised to know it was day light before the tide was fully in.

Then this is not why they are so sure she was parked there by 11pm...

Is it from a witness statement? Or because she wasn't seen again?

But with all due respect, she DID kill Azriel. Her senseless, rambling actions brought that boy to his death either through gross negligence or something more sinister. And the things I read do allow for the possibility that she was not saintly. While the boyfriend was arrested for breaking Azriel's arm, he wasn't prosecuted since they weren't sure if Shantina or the BF broke it. I don't care if she wanted to get trashed-I just care that she did it with her son, while driving, and endangered his life.

You know I have seen nothing that says she DID anything except drive around senselessly for 4 hours and make a couple phone calls...

"The Pierce County Medical Examiner’s Office ruled that Carver died of an accidental drowning and found no signs of trauma. They are awaiting the results of a toxicology test."

On Friday afternoon the Pierce County Medical Examiner’s Office ruled Azriel’s death an accidental drowning. The Thurston County Sheriff’s Office, which sent a detective to the autopsy, said there were no signs of assault. The discovery of Azriel’s body high on a shoreline at the south end of Fox Island near Gig Harbor the day before brought sorrow to a case that had been filled with mystery and anxiety.

http://www.kitsapsun.com/news/2010/mar/19/missing-boys-death-ruled-accidental/

I saw this question a couple pages back:
Daylight Saving Time always begins on the second Sunday of March and ends on the first Sunday of November.

Daylight Saving Time began on March 14, 2010 - when you set the clocks ahead 1 hour.