weekend discussion thread: 4/14-16/2012

[crazyladi]

Why is there a publication ban on the one girl? When they had one for TLM it was because MTR had to have his day in court and they didnt want the information leaked. /is it possible this person is going through the courts for something else?

I just dont understand why its banned. What would be the reasoning?

 

[antiquegirl]

Who do you mean by "someone"? TM?
Why would "someone" tell TLM, a veritable stranger, save for two chance drug related meetings, that Tori was going to walk home alone?

Tori never walked home alone: her brother or grandma dealt with that. Besides, no one knew that she was going to be walking home alone since TM assumed her brother was going to walk with her, and he did go back to find her, it was just too late.



http://www.lfpress.com/news/london/raffertytrial/2012/03/07/19472771.html
When she did not return home from Oliver Stephens school with her brother, mom and her family began a frantic and futile search before going to the police about 6 p.m.

http://www.lfpress.com/news/london/raffertytrial/2012/03/07/19474236.html
This was supposed to be the first time Tori and her brother were walking home from school alone.

No one knew Tori was going to walk home alone because she wasn't supposed to.

moo

Perhaps you're right. As I wrote, it was just a guess. But no one knows exactly where TM, JG, and TLM were every minute of that day or who all they talked to. Maybe we will know more when the ban on TLM's edited ASoF is lifted.

JMO

 

[fats]

anything for a "piece" I guess....I don't call that misrepresentation...that's too big of a word for MR to know..... I would call that just plain lies to suit the situation....who knows...maybe he was constipated a lot and thought he had something major wrong with him.... still doesn't make him a murderer or rapist...I need more than that to convince me...:moo:

MR was lying is pervasive and IS deceptive. <modsnip>....He fits the description to a T. Further--he knew Victoria was MURDERED and IN GARBAGE bags, hid evidence, lied constantly in the OPP interview. He is deeply involved and I would not be surprised he is both a MURDERER and a RAPIST.:jail: imo <modsnip>!

 

[matou]

If anyone told TLM anything about Tori walking home alone that day, then why was MR driving past the school at 9:05 that morning? He was trolling for a stray kid IMO. Sorry, the drug conspiracy thing just doesn't work. <Mod Snip> After throwing rocks on a dead child's body, he obsessed over her and tried to shag anything that moved. He's aK<Mod Snip>. He saw Tori dead. I think he raped and killed her. That's the motive: rape. In terms of drug involvement, he's a junkie just like TLM and has been since at least 2005, according to his 17-18 year old girlfriend from that time. JMO

 

[Flossie JMO]

Thanks. I was looking for more detailed tweets but only found the LFP recaps. The part I bolded above doesn't mesh with Tori being allowed to walk home alone though. One sentence says "they" meaning Tori and her brother and the other says Tori alone. Frustrating!

I thought I read something before about her brother walking another kid home and then going back for Tori, which indicates to me that they were going to walk home together. I'll have to find that, unless any one else wants to do that.

Just a link, I know

That day was the first time she had planned to make the short walk home alone from Oliver Stephens Public School. The petite blond-haired, blue-eyed girl never made it.

http://www.canada.com/Tori+Stafford+trial+begins+accused+killer+Rafferty/6251470/story.html

 

[Flossie JMO]

Rafferty's lawyer, Dirk Derstine, questioned McDonald further about the possibility McClintic somehow knew Tori before the abduction.

"What you know of her (Tori) do you think there's any that she would go off with someone she didn't know?" he asked.

"No," McDonald answered.

Derstine also questioned McDonald how Tori came to walk home alone that day.

Tori was supposed to wait for her brother, Daryn, to walk her home, after he helped two disabled children get to their townhouse next to the school, McDonald testified.

When he came back to the school, Tori was already gone, she said.

"Did you tell Tori to wait for her brother?" Derstine asked.

"We didn't discuss it," McDonald said.

McDonald agreed that sometimes her mother, Linda Winters, drove the children home from school.

But not that day.

"Who's idea was it that they would walk home?" Derstine asked.

"Mine," McDonald said.

"Did you ask your mother to drive them home?" he asked

"I believe so but she was busy that day," McDonald replied.

McDonald testified she didn't recall telling her mother not to pick the children up that day, but agreed it was possible she did.

It was the first time the children were to walk to their new home alone, but no one else knew that, McDonald said.

http://www.sunnewsnetwork.ca/sunnews/canada/archives/2012/03/20120307-164257.html

 

[Flossie JMO]

While her mom had waited anxiously for her to walk home alone from school for the very first time, Tori had been abducted and sexually assaulted. While her brother was riding around the neighbourhood desperately searching for her, her small ribs had been shattered, her liver lacerated by a claw hammer picked up that very afternoon at a Home Depot.

http://www.woodstocksentinelreview.com/2012/03/05/tori-staffords-innocence-no-match-for-her-hunters

 

[crazyladi]

I am going to tell you one thing.

If I was ever in MTR's so called position that his lawyer has put him in and I saw this horrific act upon a child I can tell you one thing I would have fled Woodstock, I would never have even posted anything regarding that child, I would never have thrown out the car seat, I would never have dated anyone, I would never have been asking anyone about what happened to her.

So the question is why did he do all these things? I cant understand it. He was so calm and collected when he was being interviewed its crazy. I would have been shi@ing my pants.

It just doesnt seem to add up to someone who is not guilty. I really wish he would take the stand.

 

[dar107]

I am interested to know everyone's opinions on what will happen after the crown rests. Do you think that Derkstine will be calling witnesses, and presenting a case for MR?

Or do you think the defence will rest with only closing arguments, attacking the crowns case chapter by chapter, trying to create doubt in the jury that the crown has proved it's case beyond reasonable doubt?

I am very curious about this. Also IIRC, the time for Derkstine to make an opening statement would have been right after the Crowns opening, and he chose not too. Am i just confused about this, as it seems more logical that Defence would make their opening after the crown rests? Any input on this would be appreciated!

BBM Actually, i think I am wrong here. Procedure would be for defence to make OS after the crown rests. Example:

http://www.thestar.com/news/article/170653--pickton-defence-allowed-early-opening-statement

"In a criminal trial, the Crown begins first and usually provides the jury with an opening statement that summarizes the facts it says will establish its case. It also provides the jury with a summary of evidence it is expected to lead.

Then it begins calling witnesses.

When it finishes its case, the defence then has the option of making an opening statement and calling witnesses."

 

[fats]

IMO

I must add.............

That I have incredible difficulty trying to understand why MR acted the way he did "after" the crime was committed..........if he had no knowledge it was going to happen.

His conduct following..............is just not explainable, to me.

I could not imagine someone so uncaring, self centered, and morally corrupt that they would hide the evidence and pretend it all didn't happen.

The only explanation I can think of..........is that he has severe disorders himself and his brain is fried from drugs.


That isn't an excuse for his conduct..........but it is all I can think of..........

Even then it is a big stretch.

IMO

That he wouldn't get caught? And that TLM would continue to take the fall?

 

[Flossie JMO]

I am going to tell you one thing.

If I was ever in MTR's so called position that his lawyer has put him in and I saw this horrific act upon a child I can tell you one thing I would have fled Woodstock, I would never have even posted anything regarding that child, I would never have thrown out the car seat, I would never have dated anyone, I would never have been asking anyone about what happened to her.

So the question is why did he do all these things? I cant understand it. He was so calm and collected when he was being interviewed its crazy. I would have been shi@ing my pants.

It just doesnt seem to add up to someone who is not guilty. I really wish he would take the stand.

bbm, me too

 

[fats]

I am going to tell you one thing.

If I was ever in MTR's so called position that his lawyer has put him in and I saw this horrific act upon a child I can tell you one thing I would have fled Woodstock, I would never have even posted anything regarding that child, I would never have thrown out the car seat, I would never have dated anyone, I would never have been asking anyone about what happened to her.

So the question is why did he do all these things? I cant understand it. He was so calm and collected when he was being interviewed its crazy. I would have been shi@ing my pants.

It just doesnt seem to add up to someone who is not guilty. I really wish he would take the stand.

That's because you are just a craziladi and NOT a < mod snip > like MR is! Impossible to apply normal reasoning to his actions because he did not behave like a normal person. Normal people do not leave town with other people's children in their car, take them to remote locations and get involved in murder and coverup to murder!

 

[snoofer]

:moo::moo::moo:

I am going to tell you one thing.

If I was ever in MTR's so called position that his lawyer has put him in and I saw this horrific act upon a child I can tell you one thing I would have fled Woodstock, I would never have even posted anything regarding that child, I would never have thrown out the car seat, I would never have dated anyone, I would never have been asking anyone about what happened to her.

So the question is why did he do all these things? I cant understand it. He was so calm and collected when he was being interviewed its crazy. I would have been shi@ing my pants.

It just doesnt seem to add up to someone who is not guilty. I really wish he would take the stand.

Maybe in his life noone ever challenged him on his <modsnip> and they got him out of tight spots before so he just continued and believed that others just believe his lies.

 

[crazyladi]

So how does this work. The crown calls their witnesses, then the defense?

 

[Macright]

Your memory is correct. This is the MSM article from May 16, 2009:

http://www.thestar.com/news/ontario/article/635366--tori-s-mother-admits-addiction

(Not bashing anyone here. Just answering a question and confirming Macright's memory.)

thank you for posting that...I was searching like crazy trying to find it..as I mentioned last evening I started following this case on the "Insessions" site and was pleased to see some of the posters on here now were also on that site with me...we certainly discussed this to no end at the start and followed closely the daily news report with TM & RS.... some things we did get wrong at first...always felt so sorry for RS...he has tried his best to keep Tori's name out there and hopefully open up people's eyes that no one can be trusted, especially when it comes to your children... be so careful of the company that you keep...I heap praise on him for that..:moo:

 

[matou]

<modsnip>

After seeing a dead child and disposing of her body, he immediately moves on to hook up with as many women as possible. That's sexually deviant. He was obsessing over Tori, in my opinion. JMO

 

[snoofer]

I think MTR should also receive a lifetime ban on owning a driver's license on the off chance he ever gets out as he used his vehicle in the current charges and he routinely operated a vehicle wired up on drugs. JMO

 

[Hello_Kitty]

<modsnip>

Flossie JMO, I'm sure Russell Williams's friends and wife didn't think he was a sexual deviant, and never gave any indications that he was, and yet he broke into almost 82 homes, rifles through pantie drawers, photographed himself in his victim's panties, broke into two of his victim's homes, tied them up and forced them to perform sexual acts, and photographed those acitivies, then he broke into two more homes, sexually tortured and killed two more women.


Just because because there is no evidence doesn't mean it isn't so. <modsnip>?

 

[Macright]

I am going to tell you one thing.

If I was ever in MTR's so called position that his lawyer has put him in and I saw this horrific act upon a child I can tell you one thing I would have fled Woodstock, I would never have even posted anything regarding that child, I would never have thrown out the car seat, I would never have dated anyone, I would never have been asking anyone about what happened to her.

So the question is why did he do all these things? I cant understand it. He was so calm and collected when he was being interviewed its crazy. I would have been shi@ing my pants.

It just doesnt seem to add up to someone who is not guilty. I really wish he would take the stand.

actually (and I am not trying to condone how he acted) what he did whether guilty or not guilty was something that I would expect...he went on with his life as if nothing was amiss...running away from Woodstock would throw more suspicion on him, I would think...instead he acted out all the normal things that were his way of life...the car seat is not an issue with me because I don't believe that was ever in the car at the time, I believe the neighbour who saw him remove it and move it to his shed in order to install speakers..it was thrown out long before the LE put out the warning that they were looking for a back seat..remember the pickup was in mid April and <modsnip> didn't confess until mid May so he had no reason to not thrown the seat out because no one was aware that he was involved at the time...so all the things that he did do were normal for him...he stayed in town and went on with his life...he asked the questions about TS because he more than likely thought that if he didn't someone would go.....huh...considering it was the talk of the town...he may have had his own reasons for questioning people but still no one caught on at that time.......:moo:

 

[Macright]

Flossie JMO, I'm sure Russell Williams's friends and wife didn't think he was a sexual deviant, and never gave any indications that he was, and yet he broke into almost 82 homes, rifles through pantie drawers, photographed himself in his victim's panties, broke into two of his victim's homes, tied them up and forced them to perform sexual acts, and photographed those acitivies, then he broke into two more homes, sexually tortured and killed two more women.


Just because because there is no evidence doesn't mean it isn't so. <modsnip>?

the reason we know that RW was is because LE found the evidence when they conducted the searches...I am sure if LE searched the home of MR and found nothing then it stands to reason that he is not a sexual deviant as the likes of RW.....:moo: because nothing of that nature was ever found...