Who molested/abused Jonbenet?

[Ambitioned]

No idea. I've never seen any evidence that would suggest that Burke had been sexually abused. Odd behavior, yes. But any number of things might have contributed to that behavior. In the absence of evidence, I don't think it's helpful to speculate. For me personally, I mean. I'm one of those people who doesn't function well in a mind filled with chaos.

I always wondered because of Burke smearing feces.

 

[dogperson]

I have what is probably a stupid question but I'm going to ask it anyway. JonBenet had frequent vaginal irritation/yeast infections, maybe from taking antibiotics and maybe from the bed wetting issues. Those types of infections can be excruciatingly itchy and I would expect a child to scratch. Is there any way she could have caused hymenal trauma to herself? By repeatedly trying to get to the itch? I would think that would hurt enough to make her stop, but maybe not. Thickness of the hymen can vary from female to female (mine must have been like Fort Knox) but could repeatedly trying to scratch inside have caused her hymen to erode, making it appear as if she was molested?

 

[MsJosie]

Go on, MsJosie. Please.

Ahhh...I just read this and I honestly do not remember posting this....I am racking my brain and I do not remember this at all....that is creepy. I will need to go back and read this entire thread and see if it can jar my brain cells. No one gets on my computer either....I just do not remember this....going back to read....it will be awhile....

 

[BBB167893]

I have what is probably a stupid question but I'm going to ask it anyway. JonBenet had frequent vaginal irritation/yeast infections, maybe from taking antibiotics and maybe from the bed wetting issues. Those types of infections can be excruciatingly itchy and I would expect a child to scratch. Is there any way she could have caused hymenal trauma to herself? By repeatedly trying to get to the itch? I would think that would hurt enough to make her stop, but maybe not. Thickness of the hymen can vary from female to female (mine must have been like Fort Knox) but could repeatedly trying to scratch inside have caused her hymen to erode, making it appear as if she was molested?

Well, the experts didn't think that could happen, but as for me...highly doubtful. And just how frequent were these yeast infections/vaginitis? I didn't think they were that often.

 

[ElleElle]

Well, the experts didn't think that could happen, but as for me...highly doubtful. And just how frequent were these yeast infections/vaginitis? I didn't think they were that often.

If PR did not teach her proper toilet training, then I disagree. A young girl who is not cleaned or bathed regularly would have them often, and I think PR was a slob.

 

[BBB167893]

If PR did not teach her proper toilet training, then I disagree. A young girl who is not cleaned or bathed regularly would have them often, and I think PR was a slob.

It is possible that she had more of them than were recorded by her doctor. But the idea that a small girl could do THAT kind of damage to her own vagina? That stretches credulity for me.

 

[Linda7NJ]

It is possible that she had more of them than were recorded by her doctor. But the idea that a small girl could do THAT kind of damage to her own vagina? That stretches credulity for me.

I had a friend that did daycare in her home. She cared for a 4 year old girl that would stuff one of those big fat crayons in herself. Nap time should Would masturbate to self soothe- toe curling & everything. My friend called child protection believing she must have been abused. ... long story short, she wasn't -according to experts, it's not outside "normal range" and after several experts interviewing the child determined she was healthy, happy and no abused.

So yeah I think it's possible for a child to do that to themselves.
That said, I do believe Burke poked her once with that paintbrush handle. I also believe he left her naked from the waist down & handle inserted, I think that's how Patsy found her and why she determined the desperate need to conceal what really happened.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[reintarnation]

Pausing for a moment here.

I read an article today from a journalist in Maine drawing comparisons between JonBenet and a 20-month old named Ayla Reynolds. Ayla went missing in 2011. There is history of abuse by the father, and she was last in her father's home on the night of her disappearance. Blood, saliva, and vomit was found in the father's home and vehicle - not just a little bit, either, but enough for the police to declare that they are not expecting to find Ayla alive. But somehow, the father is NOT being prosecuted for this crime. It's baffling and frustrating and heartbreaking.

If you go to the websleuths forum on this case (link below), you'll see some recent links to two podcasts about Ayla as well as links to a petition for Justin's prosecution and Ayla's Go Fund Me page to raise money for pursuing her case.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...highlight=ayla

We all know that JonBenet deserved better, and she deserves for the truth to come out. Ayla, too, deserves better. She deserves to be found and properly laid to rest. She deserves to have her killer prosecuted.

I never make pleas like this, but Ayla's case has touched me just as JonBenet's had. There are so many sad cases, I know. Just for your consideration, and many thanks.

 

[Djoop]

When you consider our nature to look away from child abuse, you can imagine how these sick perps get away with it so often. We don't want to believe that it's true, the whole idea makes a 'normal' person sick. But in hindsight, things fall together and collaborating stories usually start to come forward. Now I know one witness said something about JBRs strange (sexual) behaviour, I'm interested to know who that was again, and if there are more collaborating stories. It's hard to imagine that her school, family members & friends wouldn't have suspected anything.

I also believe the first cop who entered the home said something about the dynamic of child abuse or something similar and wonder if she ever explained herself more thoroughly than during her deposition, which I remember to be rather defensive.

If JR abused JBR it's highly doubtful that he'd suddenly be cured of this behaviour. And if Burke abused JBR sexually, there must have been countless incidents pointing towards a distorted relation between him and his sister. And the chances of them both being victims increase tenfold. Same applies to the chances of JR being the main perpetrator or instigator of the abuse if you will. There's few cases in which a mother molests her son to begin with, and in most of those cases there's no male in the household. This basicly leaves 2 viable options: No sexual abuse. Sexual abuse by JR. In case of the latter, JR must have had power over his wife. It's not a nice thing to suggest, but they were pretty religious, and I wonder if anyone ever explored the nature of their beliefs, their church, and the one they grew up with.

-Dj

 

[UKGuy]

Djoop,

Holly Smith, head of Boulder County Sexual Abuse Team, visited JBR's bedroom on the third day of the investigation. Smith says most of the panties in JonBenet’s dresser drawers had been soiled with fecal material.

In her autobiography her chapter on the Ramsey's was redacted and she was removed from the ramsey case, no doubt over her views on potential sexual abuse?

.

 

[Heymom]

When you consider our nature to look away from child abuse, you can imagine how these sick perps get away with it so often. We don't want to believe that it's true, the whole idea makes a 'normal' person sick. But in hindsight, things fall together and collaborating stories usually start to come forward. Now I know one witness said something about JBRs strange (sexual) behaviour, I'm interested to know who that was again, and if there are more collaborating stories. It's hard to imagine that her school, family members & friends wouldn't have suspected anything.

I also believe the first cop who entered the home said something about the dynamic of child abuse or something similar and wonder if she ever explained herself more thoroughly than during her deposition, which I remember to be rather defensive.

If JR abused JBR it's highly doubtful that he'd suddenly be cured of this behaviour. And if Burke abused JBR sexually, there must have been countless incidents pointing towards a distorted relation between him and his sister. And the chances of them both being victims increase tenfold. Same applies to the chances of JR being the main perpetrator or instigator of the abuse if you will. There's few cases in which a mother molests her son to begin with, and in most of those cases there's no male in the household. This basicly leaves 2 viable options: No sexual abuse. Sexual abuse by JR. In case of the latter, JR must have had power over his wife. It's not a nice thing to suggest, but they were pretty religious, and I wonder if anyone ever explored the nature of their beliefs, their church, and the one they grew up with.

-Dj

They were only religious for show. They were members of the Episcopalian church in Boulder, that is the church for wealthy people. Patsy put on a show of being religious but I seriously doubt that either she or John really made it part of their lives. How could they live with what they'd done, if they really had faith?

 

[Djoop]

Djoop,

Holly Smith, head of Boulder County Sexual Abuse Team, visited JBR's bedroom on the third day of the investigation. Smith says most of the panties in JonBenet’s dresser drawers had been soiled with fecal material.

In her autobiography her chapter on the Ramsey's was redacted and she was removed from the ramsey case, no doubt over her views on potential sexual abuse?

.

Either way, they neglected to investigate potential sexual abuse separately from the homocide. I have little knowledge of the american system, but I don't think the same could happen in my country. Police would have used the evidence to put pressure on their prime suspects. I even think they could lose the abuse case and still be able to prosecute the homocide. And they likely would, as this would allow them to -temporarily- separate other potential victims within the family.

 

[Luckymanuh]

I have what is probably a stupid question but I'm going to ask it anyway. JonBenet had frequent vaginal irritation/yeast infections, maybe from taking antibiotics and maybe from the bed wetting issues. Those types of infections can be excruciatingly itchy and I would expect a child to scratch. Is there any way she could have caused hymenal trauma to herself? By repeatedly trying to get to the itch? I would think that would hurt enough to make her stop, but maybe not. Thickness of the hymen can vary from female to female (mine must have been like Fort Knox) but could repeatedly trying to scratch inside have caused her hymen to erode, making it appear as if she was molested?

My daughter when she was 4-6 years old got UTI's and yeast infections from colored and scented TP back in the day. I stopped using it and they went away. So I can see your point of the itching.

 

[Luckymanuh]

Well, the experts didn't think that could happen, but as for me...highly doubtful. And just how frequent were these yeast infections/vaginitis? I didn't think they were that often.

Who knows how frequent but she was into the doctor 33 times!!! That is alot and for what?

 

[Djoop]

They were only religious for show. They were members of the Episcopalian church in Boulder, that is the church for wealthy people. Patsy put on a show of being religious but I seriously doubt that either she or John really made it part of their lives. How could they live with what they'd done, if they really had faith?

That's basicly my question as well. If they did it, how did they justify it, especially considering the possibility that one had to convice the other.

They read the bible with friends that morning and prayed, they had a bible in their bedroom that JR was reading. Patsy put on a show during the funeral, reaching for the sky as she approached the altar. And then you have the RN, the fact JBR was killed on xmas day..

 

[MsJosie]

SuperDave and madeline....just maybe she was carried downstairs in the blanket and then molested while on top of it, in the basement room.

Okay, I went back and read and read...I know no one here could post to my account and my 70 year old husband did not...that leaves me and I have no idea why I posted here. So, ignore my post....maybe it will,come to me but for now I am baffled. sorry.

 

[BBB167893]

When you consider our nature to look away from child abuse, you can imagine how these sick perps get away with it so often. We don't want to believe that it's true, the whole idea makes a 'normal' person sick. But in hindsight, things fall together and collaborating stories usually start to come forward. Now I know one witness said something about JBRs strange (sexual) behaviour, I'm interested to know who that was again, and if there are more collaborating stories. It's hard to imagine that her school, family members & friends wouldn't have suspected anything.

I also believe the first cop who entered the home said something about the dynamic of child abuse or something similar and wonder if she ever explained herself more thoroughly than during her deposition, which I remember to be rather defensive.

If JR abused JBR it's highly doubtful that he'd suddenly be cured of this behaviour. And if Burke abused JBR sexually, there must have been countless incidents pointing towards a distorted relation between him and his sister. And the chances of them both being victims increase tenfold. Same applies to the chances of JR being the main perpetrator or instigator of the abuse if you will. There's few cases in which a mother molests her son to begin with, and in most of those cases there's no male in the household. This basically leaves 2 viable options: No sexual abuse. Sexual abuse by JR. In case of the latter, JR must have had power over his wife. It's not a nice thing to suggest, but they were pretty religious, and I wonder if anyone ever explored the nature of their beliefs, their church, and the one they grew up with.

-Dj

I can see JR having power over Patsy. As in "you'd be on the street without me" power.

 

[Frigga]

It is terrible, any way you look at it. IF it wasn't John Ramsey then his bahavior would seem mighty curious if it weren't for Burke. But with Burke in the mix and Jonbenet dead he was able to somehow write it off in his head. Patsy's outright denial of something she may or may not know about gives me the answer for her. SHE knew, whatever was going on... whoever the perpetrator was- she knew. MOO.

I think she knew about Burkes inappropriate behavior but I don't think she consciously knew about John's. IMO only- John may have never even touched JB inappropriately- he may have just sexualized her in his mind- he may have crossed an emotional boundary because of what Patsy was going through- like emotional incest.

I think JB was the apple of her daddy's eye and I think that may have contributed to Burkes rage way more then Patsy turning her attention towards JB. I see John as the narcissist in the family- I see Patsy being much more Borderline. Two narcissists don't usually work in a relationship- if Patsy was a kind of inverted narcissist then maybe- but she wasn't... I don't think.

I think now I'm going to have to read their damn books so I can have a better idea of the dynamics. I totally think Patsy was sexualized by her own father and even her mother but with a mixed message from Nedra. You can't be in those pageants and not be. The part that would be weird to me if I didn't think Patsy was a victim of molestation herself is- correct me if I'm wrong- she was a teenager when she started in pageants- Jonbenet was a baby. For a mother to sexualized her baby girl that way I have a BIG problem with. It happens way too fast on its own.

That family was a Petrie dish of disorders, inappropriateness and pain.

 

[wannagonorth]

I can see JR having power over Patsy. As in "you'd be on the street without me" power.

Absolutely! And especially with the cancer hanging over her head. He had the money, the health insurance through his work. And her currency as a trophy wife was at a very low ebb, if not totally obliterated through her illness. I can imagine she felt very vulnerable.

 

[Ambitioned]

Okay, I went back and read and read...I know no one here could post to my account and my 70 year old husband did not...that leaves me and I have no idea why I posted here. So, ignore my post....maybe it will,come to me but for now I am baffled. sorry.

You may want to change your password then, just in case!