AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #15

[Lillymac]

I think it's pretty darn common in Wisconsin.

Common in Texas for women to carry in their purse...especially if traveling at night alone.

 

[Fancierose94]

I strongly agree! Great post! I think the perp had studied the house and the day to day lifestyle of the family. I think this was absolutely planned. I think former military is a good possibility and I definitely think the perp is an avid hunter. I think he has a hunting cabin somewhere and is not currently employed so he is not missed at work. I also think he's a loner that had a fixation on either Denise or Jayme. JMO, and thank you for your great post!

I think you’re right about the perp having a fixation, as you called it. That’s a good word. My guess would be an obsession with Jayme, but only based on the fact that she was the individual taken away from the scene. I also agree that our perp is unemployed, and I’d venture kind of a loner in general.

As always, just my opinions here, and thank you for being welcoming!

 

[Wrenny]

MsBetsy I hear what you are saying. The numbers are probably still in the minority of people that have guns in their vehicles.

So most likely someone brought a gun with them for the purpose of committing a crime.

It was duck season. And maybe goose season (not sure which zone is which.) Which means more people would be carrying shotguns. Fwiw.

 

[tmar]

I think you’re exactly right, based on what I’ve read and learned so far. I would add my suspicion that the perpetrator was one person with really good aim. The neighbors are quoted as having heard two shots from a “big gun”. I know very little about shooting but I’d imagine the killer would have had to be a good shot if they managed to kill two moving targets with two shots fired. My guess is someone formerly in the military, or perhaps a hunter.

Further, I find it intriguing that the dog was left unharmed, and presumably did not attack the intruder. I only assume the dog didn’t attack because no unidentified DNA was found at the scene, as far as civilians know. In line with this is the knowledge we have that the Closs home was “easy to miss” and the intruder had known where he was going, implying intent. My belief is that the perpetrator was at the very least familiar to this home and its residents.

Of course this is all conjecture on my part, just my opinion, and this is my first time posting so I apologize if I’m supposed to be linking sources, etc. I’m on mobile so I’m going to try to log on to a desktop version this evening.

Welcome, Fancierose.
Your first Post.
I agree, your opinions appear very sound.
Waiting to hear more, once you post from your laptop.

 

[Wrenny]

Yes. Twin mattress. No sheet, which may have been bagged?

I figured the bedding had already been removed in earlier searches. When they did the one last search they figured, might as well dig deeper, just in case.

 

[Tippy Lynn]

I think it's pretty darn common in Wisconsin.

Concealed Carry Statistics: Quick Facts by State (2017)

Here are the numbers for each state. (2017)

 

[Wrenny]

On US Hwy 41 which parallels I-75 (north Atlanta). At first I thought it was an odd location, but figured it out on the way home.
Multiple distribution centers with 24 hr tractor trailer traffic going on I-75 and US 41, which goes from Florida to Michigan.

UP Michigan. Through Wisconsin.

 

[Auntie Cipation]

James kicking the door in is an interesting notion.

I'm not a burly or pumped-up man, but if I approached my normally-unlocked house and it was locked and I knew or suspected my family was in trouble inside, I think I would run around to one of the other doors, perhaps the garage door, before I would even think of kicking in the locked door...

forgive me if I'm mistaken but didn't the neighbor who gave all the interviews say that her dog was acting strange around 1 am? obviously police were beginning to arrive and that might draw attention but its possible the dog was reacting prior to LE arrival... and who knows how accurate her timeline is but I thought I read that in one of the articles.

Anyway, my point or question is, if her dog was acting strange, could the dog have sensed the possible perp taking Jayme via the back way and not highway 8 to escape?

I think this is a great point. Maybe the perp ran through or near their yard with Jayme, or Jayme ran past in an escape attempt. Just close enough for the dog to pick ip on it. Or maybe just a deer ran by and that's what agitated the dog. But I hope LE followed up on that comment and searched the neighbor's yard for tracks or other sign.

 

[retiredrickyinCO]

I still think everyone at the plant should have a sniff dog sniff them, to check for Jayme's scent.

You know what you smell like after cleaning/gutting turkeys for 8-10 hours? I wouldn't wish that on any dog. Actually even with all the huge fans around Jennie-O the smell is not that pleasant.

 

[Mollyandme]

I think you’re right about the perp having a fixation, as you called it. That’s a good word. My guess would be an obsession with Jayme, but only based on the fact that she was the individual taken away from the scene. I also agree that our perp is unemployed, and I’d venture kind of a loner in general.

As always, just my opinions here, and thank you for being welcoming!

Well your opinions are just as important as everyone else's and I know we all appreciate you sharing them. I think based on the fact that Jayme was the one taken from the home the obsession was likely with her. There was a really great post by @oceanblueeyes where she discussed a Mark Fuhrman interview where he said he felt Denise was the target. This was really interesting and also made sense to me. I will try to find a link to it if you haven't read it already. I definitely agree that the perp is currently unemployed and would be described by others as a loner. I truly think he was known, even if just an acquaintance to the victims. I think he knocked on the door, James either refused to answer or opened the door partially and slammed it. He then shot through the door and killed James before going for Denise and Jayme. I think he was parked behind the home and had been casing the home for awhile. JMO

 

[BlinkOfAnI]

So it seems the best we can come up with is meth users at the wrong house breaking in to steal a cheap drug and/or whatever money/valuables they have and killing two people in the process (leaving one person missing endangered?)

This does not seem like a strong motive although meth users may act in a violent manner.

I know I keep leaning that way but it's pure speculation. I can't even call it a theory because theories are usually based on facts and there are few known facts. Circumstances of meth cases I dealt with keep screaming METH but there are so many other possibilities. We know so little.

 

[Confusion]

Sorry, I never seem to post at the same time as the posts that trigger thoughts for me. I hope this hasn't been mentioned (I didn't read it if it was), and that people haven't totally dismissed BIC's idea.

I've been thinking that it was possible that James did have company that night for a few hours, and at least one of them had indulged in too much alcohol. As was said earlier, they could have argued, the guest could have been kicked out and gotten a firearm from his vehicle. If the door was shut (and possibly locked), he may have kicked it in and shot James, who was still standing by the door. DC may have started to run and been shot right away. This would be about 12:30, and the 2 shots heard by the neighbors. The shots may have woken JC up and being scared she grabbed her dog and hid in the closet. Meanwhile, the guy is in the living room trying to clean up and remove any sign that he'd been there. He might have checked JC's room and thought she was gone for the night because she wasn't visible and he wasn't sober enough to think about checking the closet. JC thought she heard him leave so she went to her parents' room and grabbed a cell phone to call 911. The guy was actually just putting his firearm back in his vehicle and came back to make sure he hadn't forgotten anything. He catches her calling 911 (at 12:51) and grabs her, knocking the phone from her hand. He throws her over his shoulder as she's kicking and screaming, he's yelling at her to shut up, Molly may have also been barking at him, and then he disables the phone - stomps on it, kicks it against the wall, shuts it off or whatever. If he kicked Molly, or even attempted to, she may have run and hid rather than following them out the door. He didn't really plan on anything that happened, but he couldn't shoot JC right away because he had already put his weapon in his car.

It wouldn't be good for JC because he'd probably kill her as soon as it was safe to, but not in his car where it would leave too much evidence. Not one of the ideas I'd want to have happened, but it could make what we know fit together unless I forgot something. MOO

 

[Wrenny]

If James did require a day off following a Packer's game to some it may imply he may have an issue with alcohol especially if he was willing to forfeit the next days wages

After 27 years with the same employer, he probably had oodles of PTO.

 

[BlinkOfAnI]

I was talking about the "story" that was told about a farmer who had a so called relation with the sheep. That's what I meant by far fetched. I was comparing it to the likelyhood of " El Chapo" ordering kidnappings and murders from his jail cell. Its just not believable that there is a connection. Imo

That was my 1st thought when I read your post relative to timing. Much needed chuckle!

 

[Fancierose94]

Well your opinions are just as important as everyone else's and I know we all appreciate you sharing them. I think based on the fact that Jayme was the one taken from the home the obsession was likely with her. There was a really great post by @oceanblueeyes where she discussed a Mark Fuhrman interview where he said he felt Denise was the target. This was really interesting and also made sense to me. I will try to find a link to it if you haven't read it already. I definitely agree that the perp is currently unemployed and would be described by others as a loner. I truly think he was known, even if just an acquaintance to the victims. I think he knocked on the door, James either refused to answer or opened the door partially and slammed it. He then shot through the door and killed James before going for Denise and Jayme. I think he was parked behind the home and had been casing the home for awhile. JMO

I’d like to see that interview if you can find the link!

And I agree again, that the perp wasn’t a total stranger. It’s just all too meticulous and detailed to be random, IMO.

 

[l84tea2]

Yet all of those things could also be fueled by alcohol. I still think if it was a psychotic drug addict they wouldn’t have gotten away like they did.

I’m a psych nurse I work with patients coming in high on meth and trust me I know they can be violent.

Also I know how they searched high and low for Tibetts. When she was basically just out of the circle of their search. I’m praying that’s not the case here.

 

[Moonracer]

You know what you smell like after cleaning/gutting turkeys for 8-10 hours? I wouldn't wish that on any dog. Actually even with all the huge fans around Jennie-O the smell is not that pleasant.

As they arrive, check them, not after a shift. Teams of dogs would be required, as their noses fatigue. My lab is retired from this work.

 

[UltraViolet4545]

In regards to the little dog (“Molly”), she probably got scared and hung back or hid. She is a Shih Tzu, and they are mild mannered little lap dogs.

I watched an interesting YouTube video where a trainer was showing dog owners what their dog would do in a simulation “robbery” or “break in” scenario. Lots of dog owners believe their dog would jump in to defend them, but it was shocking to watch. Almost every dog tucked tail and ran from the room.

 

[debirlfan]

I see what you mean about a portable scanner. It wouldn't surprise me when you put it that way. It makes a lot of sense, especially if this was planned, because the perp might want to monitor LE activity while fleeing from the scene. He could have brought a portable scanner with him and no cell phone. I'm not sure what, if any tracking ability there is on this type of scanner, especially after the fact, but I find a portable scanner more likely than using an app on a phone that would have a much better chance of being tracked.

A handheld radio scanner is essentially just a radio receiver - not something that would be trackable. I just took a quick look at the Best Buy website, and there are a couple models available for under $100, including one that specifically mentions being able to receive police and fire frequencies. If I was a criminal who planned to break into houses or sell drugs, I'd certainly have one so I could track police movements. (Which is why police will often switch to cell phones or to a scrambled channel if there is something "big" going on. However, that doesn't appear to be the case here, at least not initially.)

 

[Gardener1850]

Dear Members,

In no way will we allow ANYONE to suggest that a minority group, a gang, the Nazi's or a coven of witches are the ones who killed Jayme's parents and kidnapped her.

If anyone hints, talks around or in anyway suggests a group is responsible for this horrible crime that person will be gone from the discussion. Same thing if you mention anyone as a suspect without evidence.

If any reliable information comes out about the suspect or suspects then, of course, we can discuss the new information.

Until then, please stay on topic, do not start discussing any other cases, and remember while Websleuths is first a true crime discussion forum a very close second is we are a victim friendly forum. 99.9% of the time we can easily be both. In Jayme's case, there is no reason to disparage the parents or Jayme. There is no evidence of any issues with Jayme's parents or with Jayme herself.

PLEASE STAY ON TOPIC. We know teenagers can be very difficult, however, there is no evidence to suggest Jayme is anything but a victim.

If your post starts with "Me", "My", "I" it very well could be off topic.

We have the best sleuths in the world on Websleuths. We need to keep on topic to make sure the topics are easy to read. When a post is made about anything that is not directly related to the topics it makes the thread harder to read and way off topic.

The work the mods are having to do on this thread alone is overwhelming.

The rules are easy to follow on Websleuths. Thousands of people follow the rules every day with no problem.

Thank you for your cooperation,

Tricia

I think this needs a bump.