AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #27

[stargazer17]

MOO after reading new article and comments…

Door is kicked in. James goes to see what is going on and is immediately shot. Denise is then shot as she comes to see what going on. Jayme grabs nearest phone which is moms and calls 911. Before call even is connected Jayme is told to drop phone/or drops phone on her own and told by unsub to come with him. She doesn’t resist as she is in shock and he is pointing a gun at her.

Or

Door is kicked in. James goes to see what is going on and is immediately shot. Denise calls 911 and is shot before call is connected and phone drops to floor and slides away a little. Jayme is told by unsub to come with him. She doesn’t resist as she is in shock and he is pointing a gun at her.

911 tape only hears a commotion, no words, and sounds to be from another room (Fitz said it was a distant commotion like it was in another room or the hallway) Unsure of why everyone talks about yelling on call as I only remember it being described as a commotion.

Maybe the original shots were fired outside because unsub(s) wanted to see if it drew the police or not. When no one reported the shots after 20 minutes, they put their plan into action, knowing there would be additional shots that would not be reported and would also be muffled as they were shot inside.

If the neighbors heard two shots fired at 12:30 that means James and Denise most likely heard them them also. I doubt Jayme would be outside walking her dog after that in addition to the time of night.

Denise’s brother stated in an interview that he has a couple of ideas of what happened, wish I knew his thoughts.

Why did Fitzgerald do an interview with the Daily Mail out of all news outlets available?

 

[photographer4]

Nothing solid. But a strong belief based on following the case closely and the facts that we have so far. And I would consider re-interviewing relatives to ask whether any friendships they had seemed abruptly more distant after that day

I'd think a lot of friendships would seem more distant after that day. Either because the family closed ranks around themselves to protect themselves from a perceived "outsider" threat (friend, acquaintance, stranger), or because they were busy grieving and well intentioned friends didn't know what to say or how to bring comfort in a helpless situation, so they just went quiet after an initial "omg I'm so sorry!".

I think even in a situation not as horrific as this, people get uncomfortable and just don't know what to say, or how to help, so they distance themselves.

 

[Mistermagoo]

I have not seen the video only read the article. I will try to find it and watch

Jayme Closs' aunts still believe their niece will be found | Daily Mail Online

 

[WiseOwl]

MOO after reading new article and comments…

Door is kicked in. James goes to see what is going on and is immediately shot. Denise is then shot as she comes to see what going on. Jayme grabs nearest phone which is moms and calls 911. Before call even is connected Jayme is told to drop phone/or drops phone on her own and told by unsub to come with him. She doesn’t resist as she is in shock and he is pointing a gun at her.

Or

Door is kicked in. James goes to see what is going on and is immediately shot. Denise calls 911 and is shot before call is connected and phone drops to floor and slides away a little. Jayme is told by unsub to come with him. She doesn’t resist as she is in shock and he is pointing a gun at her.

911 tape only hears a commotion, no words, and sounds to be from another room (Fitz said it was a distant commotion like it was in another room or the hallway) Unsure of why everyone talks about yelling on call as I only remember it being described as a commotion.

Maybe the original shots were fired outside because unsub(s) wanted to see if it drew the police or not. When no one reported the shots after 20 minutes, they put their plan into action, knowing there would be additional shots that would not be reported and would also be muffled as they were shot inside.

If the neighbors heard two shots fired at 12:30 that means James and Denise most likely heard them them also. I doubt Jayme would be outside walking her dog after that in addition to the time of night.

Denise’s brother stated in an interview that he has a couple of ideas of what happened, wish I knew his thoughts.

Why did Fitzgerald do an interview with the Daily Mail out of all news outlets available?

The Operator who took the call at 00.53.26 stated she could hear a lot of yelling - please check the call log on page 1 of this thread

 

[mickey2942]

I still go back to the "Panty Thief". How did he know Jayme? Why was he obsessed with her panties?

If this random guy broke into the house for Jayme's panties, that opens this up to alot of questions...not any of them necessarily appropriate for conversation without more information. He was ruled out, but investigating his computer might be informative.

 

[sleuther0192837465]

Still no Jayme
I’ve been quiet for awhile now because this is the kind of case that gets to me as a parent. My worst nightmare would be one of my kids being abducted, but this...killing the 2 people that felt they could protect their child, Jayme’s parents knew as this was happening that they could not protect her To have those as your last thoughts as you stand there helpless, I can not imagine the horror My belief is Jayme was so traumatized, being in shock, she went with the perp by gun point.
I said many many threads ago that this was personal. I still believe that one of the Closses’ knew the perp at some point in their lives. I can’t even venture a guess as to who did this, but my gut keeps telling me this perp knew one (or all) of them.
I know the chances are slim to none, but I hope that Jayme will be found alive. MOO

 

[photographer4]

MOO after reading new article and comments…

Door is kicked in. James goes to see what is going on and is immediately shot. Denise is then shot as she comes to see what going on. Jayme grabs nearest phone which is moms and calls 911. Before call even is connected Jayme is told to drop phone/or drops phone on her own and told by unsub to come with him. She doesn’t resist as she is in shock and he is pointing a gun at her.

Or

Door is kicked in. James goes to see what is going on and is immediately shot. Denise calls 911 and is shot before call is connected and phone drops to floor and slides away a little. Jayme is told by unsub to come with him. She doesn’t resist as she is in shock and he is pointing a gun at her.

911 tape only hears a commotion, no words, and sounds to be from another room (Fitz said it was a distant commotion like it was in another room or the hallway) Unsure of why everyone talks about yelling on call as I only remember it being described as a commotion.

Maybe the original shots were fired outside because unsub(s) wanted to see if it drew the police or not. When no one reported the shots after 20 minutes, they put their plan into action, knowing there would be additional shots that would not be reported and would also be muffled as they were shot inside.

If the neighbors heard two shots fired at 12:30 that means James and Denise most likely heard them them also. I doubt Jayme would be outside walking her dog after that in addition to the time of night.

Denise’s brother stated in an interview that he has a couple of ideas of what happened, wish I knew his thoughts.

Why did Fitzgerald do an interview with the Daily Mail out of all news outlets available?

RBBM:
1. The dispatch call log specifically says they heard a lot of yelling on the 911 call
2. That is a good point, and I hadn't considered it. I had thought the shots heard by the neighbours were the fatal shots, but now, reading this new DM article, it seems police don't seem to count the neighbour's account of shots into the timeline. Why not? Surely you're right - if the neighbours heard the shots, DC and JC and Jayme probably all heard the shots as well. Maybe that is what drew their attention, and they investigated the sounds? Lights went on? Door opened? Is it at all possible that something happened near the house, that didn't involve this family, but then b/c they reacted to the shots, it brought down a reign of terror to them as well?
- > could that be why the police asked for the 2000 volunteers to search the area? Looking for any sign maybe of anything else that might have happened that night in the surrounding area? Drugs? Weapons? Body? Anything? Purely theoretical idea and just bringing up as possible discussion point.

 

[stargazer17]

Thank you, yes a lot of yelling, I had just recalled Fitz saying commotion and I also believe he said no words could be made out. So most likely Jayme screaming in horror.

 

[photographer4]

Thank you, yes a lot of yelling, I had just recalled Fitz saying commotion and I also believe he said no words could be made out. So most likely Jayme screaming in horror.

But Jayme showed no signs of resistance according to the DM article last night. Would Jayme screaming in horror be considered resistance? To me, it would.

 

[RoChEsTeR Paul]

I'd think a lot of friendships would seem more distant after that day. Either because the family closed ranks around themselves to protect themselves from a perceived "outsider" threat (friend, acquaintance, stranger), or because they were busy grieving and well intentioned friends didn't know what to say or how to bring comfort in a helpless situation, so they just went quiet after an initial "omg I'm so sorry!".

I think even in a situation not as horrific as this, people get uncomfortable and just don't know what to say, or how to help, so they distance themselves.

Yes, I agree with those points as well. They should still re-interview them. Time has passed now. Some friends may have come back, some may have not. Relatives may be able to discern and perhaps tell LE that something just doesn't seem right, and might not unless asked. Could lead to people who have never been interviewed. It is worth trying

 

[Mistermagoo]

I still go back to the "Panty Thief". How did he know Jayme? Why was he obsessed with her panties?

If this random guy broke into the house for Jayme's panties, that opens this up to alot of questions...not any of them necessarily appropriate for conversation without more information. He was ruled out, but investigating his computer might be informative.

I don't think it was just her panties he was obsessed with. He had previous arrests for the same thing. Honestly, with this guy, I think we can just chalk it up in the " worlds dumbest criminals" category. I think he just assumed it was an empty house that he could rob.

 

[andreww]

RBBM:
1. The dispatch call log specifically says they heard a lot of yelling on the 911 call
2. That is a good point, and I hadn't considered it. I had thought the shots heard by the neighbours were the fatal shots, but now, reading this new DM article, it seems police don't seem to count the neighbour's account of shots into the timeline. Why not? Surely you're right - if the neighbours heard the shots, DC and JC and Jayme probably all heard the shots as well. Maybe that is what drew their attention, and they investigated the sounds? Lights went on? Door opened? Is it at all possible that something happened near the house, that didn't involve this family, but then b/c they reacted to the shots, it brought down a reign of terror to them as well?
- > could that be why the police asked for the 2000 volunteers to search the area? Looking for any sign maybe of anything else that might have happened that night in the surrounding area? Drugs? Weapons? Body? Anything? Purely theoretical idea and just bringing up as possible discussion point.

The neighbours simply misread the time. They said it was 12:38 when in fact it was 12:58.

 

[doublestop]

RBBM:
if the neighbours heard the shots, DC and JC and Jayme probably all heard the shots as well. Maybe that is what drew their attention, and they investigated the sounds? Lights went on? Door opened? Is it at all possible that something happened near the house, that didn't involve this family, but then b/c they reacted to the shots, it brought down a reign of terror to them as well?

Well, that's an interesting thought. And would explain why it's so hard to solve, because it would be people with no relationship whatsoever to the Closses.

 

[JnRyan]

As I read and reread some articles on this, I can see LE knowing the killer only went 5 feet into the house. If there was a heavy dew or frost that night there might be tracks into the house and with modern forensic techniques there are ways to see them even though they may not obvious. (Of course, the sheriff says they have no forensic evidence? If that can be taken literally that blows away my theory.) The "4 minutes" I read as not the actual time the killer was in the house, but maybe the MAXIMUM time the killer could have been there. This is probably based on the amount of time between the 911 call and the first LE response while also taking into account the time it would take to exit the house, get Jayme in the car - possibly the trunk - and flee the scene without being seen driving away.

From the time the killer enters it might have taken less than a minute - maybe less than 20-30 seconds - if he killed both parents while only being inside 5 feet. By using a gun on Jayme and threatening he could possibly have her out of the house in less than another minute. If the killer got the door open with 2-3 kicks or even just one, the rest could have gone down in the house less than 60-90 seconds.

I don't know if I follow the sheriff's comments when he says the killer left no forensic evidence. (Of course, in the case of the Daily Mail article was that actually a quote from the sheriff or a conclusion - possibly erroneous - of the writer?) I believe they have the shell casings per the Daily Mail article and shell casings in a case where a gun was used is forensic evidence.

 

[Hap]

Daily Mail .... are they really a reliable and believable source now?

 

[Mistermagoo]

Daily Mail .... are they really a reliable and believable source now?

There is a video. do you think they edited it?

 

[IceIce9]

I believe the perp is a friend of a relative, that he has her in his home, and that she is alive

My thoughts too.

In the article her aunt states she thinks she is alive and being held locally, in Barron.

What gives her aunt that impression?

From the Daily Mail article

• Meanwhile Jayme's aunts Jennifer Smith and Suzy Allard are adamant that Jayme will be found and revealed their belief that she is being held locally
• Jennifer said: 'I feel that she is alive and she is close by. I just feel it. I think someone in Barron is keeping a secret, yes, I do'

 

[Bluepopsicle]

My Dukes of Hazzard opinion.

Originally, they claimed vehicle of interest, so they searched the ditches, 14 miles West.

They removed vehicle of interest and searched land with 2000 some volunteers. Removal of vehicle was not public yet.

They believe it is a local person and have interviewed them.

However, they want answers to after, as seeking a Gun and JC. So now watching surveillance.

FBI marked four people down of concern.

So just exactly how did they escape is my concern.

Previous thread, some time ago, I noted displeasure in the unknown about LE not seeing headlights or tail lights on their arrival at Code 3

BBM
Where did you see that the FBI had marked four people of concern? I had previously read that they made four profiles for the perp, but I have not seen anywhere that they have four specific people?

 

[Bluepopsicle]

Jayme Closs' aunts still believe their niece will be found | Daily Mail Online

I also noticed in this video, the reporter said “many shell casings from the gun”. Whether that’s true or not I guess is up for debate. I’d like to hear it from the sheriff.

ETA Personally, I’ve always felt that the word “multiple” would not be used if it was only 2 bullets.

 

[bizzle2]

I reread the DM article and noticed the bolded part said perp was there four minutes and stepped 5 feet in but down further in the article they have the following in quotations
'But if I'm in your house for minutes and I only step five feet inside your home I'm probably not going to leave a big footprint.'

The quotes say IF and FOR and for and four have entirely different meanings
I see this no where else on MSM
Could be true but I am not putting too much into this

The sheriff said the same thing (at least the part about being in the house for 4 minutes) in another taped interview so it is definitely directly from him.

I don't take that to mean LE is certain that the perp was in the house for exactly 4 minutes and only stepped exactly 5 feet into the house. He's just saying that the evidence they have is showing them the crime was very quick (maybe it was two minutes, maybe it was six minutes) and that the perp didn't spend time going through the house.