AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #29

[Wrenny]

The 2 somethings to the right of the patio door just look like bird poop. There is a bird house above them.

Yup that's it.
Ok back to the one on the left of the door.

 

[The Dude]

at this point in time it wouldn't be hard at all to get me to think that society has a problem coast to coast.

It's not just "a" problem. It's more problems than we can count. When it's barely shocking anymore that children are mowing down children with assault weapons - not to mention concerts, churches, clubs, etc. - yeah. The de-evolution of humanity.

 

[CuriousMaine]

It's been posted on here before. A interview with Sheriff Fitzgerald on a podcast I had not heard of before then. I find it interesting to listen to. I have no clue as to Sheriff Fitzgerald's LE expertise. For all I know he may not be able to tell the difference between a fingerprint and a DNA strand. But compared to some of the other LE I've heard before - who are like listening to paint dry - he does a decent job as the 'front' man for this investigation. To my best recollection he is the only sheriff or police chief I've heard on a podcast when the case is still fairly fresh.
PodcastOne: 11/14/18 Hour 1 Barron County Sheriff Chris fitzgerald discusses the latest from a troubled town.

This is a good find. I hadn't heard it before. Thanks for sharing!

Sheriff comes on at 6:00 minutes-ish.

Around 6:35, he talks about the Challenger and why they're backing away from it. His words: "discrepancy" "experts" and "tail lights" are what stood out to me.

 

[*Removed_for_profanity*]

My post is a little behind too, just got time to peck it out. Apologies.

I really can’t see LE knowing who did it with how the investigation has gone. That only makes sense if they know she is alive, and then there’s only about three possibilities.
1) The guy has her in a place that is stocked with groceries so he doesn’t have to leave. LE won’t go in because he will most likely kill her.
2) The guy has her in an unknown location while he goes about business as usual. They won’t arrest him until they find that location. After two months, I don’t see that as a possibility anymore.
3) There is an unknown accomplice holding her in an unknown location. They won’t move on him for fear of what the accomplice will do.
The first two are unlikely because of time past and they are fairly easy to counter by LE. The third is a maybe, but again, after two months you’d think they would have dug something up if they knew who did it.

I can’t see them running the investigation like they have if they know who did it, but don’t know if she is alive. The last thing I would think LE would do, especially after a crime like this, is make the public to think they were sitting on their hands or incompetent. If they don’t know her whereabouts or well being, I can’t see them risking losing him. Sheriff is an elected position too...

I do agree with The Dude though, it has seemed a little strange, how they’ve run it. I don’t know... My brother in law is Assistant Chief at a PD, I’ll see if he has any insight on it.

Edit (as if it wasn’t long enough): I have no doubts that if they had enough evidence to know who did it, they have enough to arrest and convict the person. I think they really don’t know much, unfortunately.

 

[bizzle2]

they would probably find SOMETHING illegal in 3 out of 4, if not 99 percent. moo

It's not nearly that high. Maybe 10%, if that. Most sex offenders legitimately do try to turn their lives around.

Here's an example from another state: Deputies conduct 775 sex offender compliance checks, 37 people arrested

To be clear, in no way am I defending the actions of sex offenders. It's a good thing that the registry exists, and that LE checks up with offenders on probation. My first year out of college I found out that one of my neighbors was on it. I didn't have kids (still don't), but I wanted to look into it since he was living right next door to me. I'll just say that I was very surprised that what he did could land him on the SO registry. This was all based on the public records I found, I never asked him about it.

 

[Rubiconbob]

The only 3 reasons I think he/they did not to kill the teen with the parents is
1- sexual assault and then murder, disposing of body
2- sell or use her in a sex ring
3- (this is deleted as one due to no ransom asked) for ransom.

No other reason to take her alive from premise. If it was so she couldn't identify them they would have done it at the home. They needed her for more time to do something else.
Were her parents in a supervisor or mngr position at the turkey business? Because if you read reviews from employees at that plant they do not like there superiors at all. Anyone know?

I’d agree but also another option... she bolts outside and is strangled and puts up fight.
I would think it’s chaotic once 911 call is seen by perp...

She coulda been dead in trunk within 5 minutes ( hope not).

perp or perps are nut jobs....this idea that this guy planned out nice basement life for her I don’t really buy.....it could be possible.....

sex ring seems crazy.. she’s more recognizable than the governor...the perp or sex ring worker wants runways not visible kidnapping victims.

Your option 1 is likeliest and spot on..
Hope this guy gets run over by a semi..

 

[Rubiconbob]

It's been posted on here before. A interview with Sheriff Fitzgerald on a podcast I had not heard of before then. I find it interesting to listen to. I have no clue as to Sheriff Fitzgerald's LE expertise. For all I know he may not be able to tell the difference between a fingerprint and a DNA strand. But compared to some of the other LE I've heard before - who are like listening to paint dry - he does a decent job as the 'front' man for this investigation. To my best recollection he is the only sheriff or police chief I've heard on a podcast when the case is still fairly fresh.
PodcastOne: 11/14/18 Hour 1 Barron County Sheriff Chris fitzgerald discusses the latest from a troubled town.

I think he’s good front person..within 3 hours he’s calling feds and everything in motion.. if u think about county/town/jobs
It’s a tough job... meth bust every 30 days no help... small town short 2nd large employer, main employer is so unattractive to people they immigrate Somalis...

I think he does good... and plays the aw schucks card when he needs to.

He needs evidence... really needs body.. he’s trying like hell to get it..then the conviction.

 

[cluciano63]

I can think of at least three cases when LE knew who had taken off with a teen girl and released his name immediately, and two of those had left behind murdered victims...imo no way LE would just wait and hope if they had an idea who had Jayme. All three girls were found and returned alive. (Hannah Anderson, Brittany Mae Smith and the recent girl taken by her teacher.)

 

[cluciano63]

Also...the newer pics posted yesterday show Jayme to look very different from the primary one being used on flyers etc...I would not think they showed the same girl, at a glance. Jmo

 

[stephlovescheese]

I don’t know ...the police I think have a lot more than they say... they are painting In grays... on no of items.. but if u have 2/4 bullet casings .. hard to hear 911 call .. don’t know what they can do ..younger photos I guess.. make u think abduction.. if they know abduction certainty I guess younger photos... but why stick with em... she goes to store.. that’s not who your looking for.

They could also release toxicology from parents and there text from final days.. along with point by point locations..

Maybe release jayme text and final point by point..day or two..

Only reason I think u hold all info back is they know The Who, they know most of the how, they need need more than this person may or may not have owned a gun..and are praying for slip up to lead to body or girl... I could see 2/3 year investigation until perps ex girlfriend snaps or he brags to fellow idiot .. if they truly have POI, there friends will start going to jail on small items, and noose will tighten at some point.

Just catching up on today’s reading- i like this train of though RB. I think you’re onto something.

 

[ACG2x]

The only 3 reasons I think he/they did not to kill the teen with the parents is
1- sexual assault and then murder, disposing of body
2- sell or use her in a sex ring
3- (this is deleted as one due to no ransom asked) for ransom.

No other reason to take her alive from premise. If it was so she couldn't identify them they would have done it at the home. They needed her for more time to do something else.
Were her parents in a supervisor or mngr position at the turkey business? Because if you read reviews from employees at that plant they do not like there superiors at all. Anyone know?

Read the case of Shasta Groene - a fourth and very plausible reason will be clear. Circumstances of her abduction have many similarities to Jayme's.

 

[Charliegizmo49]

If perp(s) went only 5ft into home...how does the chair with the ties being carried out factor into the crime? Were the ties on the chair just from a chair cushion?

Thin ties to a chair cushion.

 

[DutchTreat]

Regarding the stain on the patio door.
Maybe it's luminol to make bloodsplatter visible. And I'm wondering if the stain isn't on the inside of the house.

I don't want to get too graphic, but the height seems to be the height of someone's head.

If James would have been close to the front door when it was being kicked open and would have moved to the right of the house, not to get slammed by the door. And was shot there. That might be reason to spray luminol on the inside of the patio door.

 

[Wrenny]

You're right... I said "the phone". I was remarking on the location of where Denise's phone was found. You know the one that placed the 911 call?

Ok, so if both phones were plugged in charging in the kitchen, and Jayme quickly grabbed a phone to call 911, I think she'd probably grab her own. I guess unless Denise's were closer.

 

[Wrenny]

Regarding the stain on the patio door.
Maybe it's luminol to make bloodsplatter visible. And I'm wondering if the stain isn't on the inside of the house..

The part on the glass does look like the fogging you can get when double-pane windows lose their seal. But at the bottom, you can see that something dark colored is dripped down on the outside of the door.

 

[Moonsie]

Regarding the stain on the patio door.
Maybe it's luminol to make bloodsplatter visible. And I'm wondering if the stain isn't on the inside of the house.

I don't want to get too graphic, but the height seems to be the height of someone's head.

If James would have been close to the front door when it was being kicked open and would have moved to the right of the house, not to get slammed by the door. And was shot there. That might be reason to spray luminol on the inside of the patio door.

I considered this possibility, but discounted it. Let me know what you think.

1) The use of Luminol is primarily to detect whether blood is present but not otherwise visible (ie., someone tried to clean it up, or someone cleaned something with blood on it). This perp didn’t stick around to clean.

2) LE had no problem removing the front doors. If this door had critical evidence, I think they would have removed it as well.

Clearly something is on the door. I don’t think it’s Luminol. I think it’s just a fogged double pane window.

moo.

 

[JnRyan]

Read the case of Shasta Groene - a fourth and very plausible reason will be clear. Circumstances of her abduction have many similarities to Jayme's.

I also think of the case of Bible and Freeman. I don't like thinking about how that one turned out.

 

[Queencitylaydee]

I wonder if there was a confidant and the confidant took the venting into the wrong context..

 

[JnRyan]

I can think of at least three cases when LE knew who had taken off with a teen girl and released his name immediately, and two of those had left behind murdered victims...imo no way LE would just wait and hope if they had an idea who had Jayme. All three girls were found and returned alive. (Hannah Anderson, Brittany Mae Smith and the recent girl taken by her teacher.)

I see your point. I believe if LE had a good idea of who had her and thought she was still alive they would not have sat back with a wait-and-see approach. They might have watched the place for a short period of time, but would have been in there as quickly as they could. I don't see this group - sheriff, state police and FBI - taking an extended wait-and-see approach.

 

[DutchTreat]

I considered this possibility, but discounted it. Let me know what you think.

1) The use of Luminol is primarily to detect whether blood is present but not otherwise visible (ie., someone tried to clean it up, or someone cleaned something with blood on it). This perp didn’t stick around to clean.

2) LE had no problem removing the front doors. If this door had critical evidence, I think they would have removed it as well.

Clearly something is on the door. I just don’t think it’s Luminol. I think it’s just a fogged double pane window.

moo.

Maybe determination of a splatter pattern on a glass door is harder than on a white wall for instance. So they used luminol to take clear pictures or film the crime scene from the inside, to get a better idea of what happened there.
Could there be a bullet hole in the door that is hard to see, so that spraying from the inside could have seeped through to the outside?

Anyone with knowledge about guns/crimescene's? Can there be a small hole in the glass, without the rest of the glass being cracked?