Found Deceased WI - Kathleen Ryan, adult, teacher, car found burned with body inside, St. Francis, 2 Feb 2019

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Kittybunny said:
Great summary and questions! One more (may have been answered by other posters already, sorry if repetitive):
1. Did Kathleen and her husband live in the same house?

Also, someone posted earlier that the owners of the driveway where her car was found refused to be interviewed? Interviewed by whom - LE, or the media? Is there a MSM link? It's much less suspicious if they meant refused to be interviewed by a reporter - easily understandable - they were likely very very upset, and then the whole online sleuths/social media thing. However, if they wouldn't talk to LE, that's a whole different story.
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In this radio interview with the son, the son states that his Mom and Dad lived together @ 22:20

Lake County Sports Talk, Ep. 71: Zack Ryan

MOO
 
meanmaryjean said:
While I am leaning toward suicide- I do NOT think it was suicide by fire. More likely scenario to me anyway is intentional OD while sitting in the passenger seat, final cigarette smoldered and then started fire after she was unconscious.
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And the reasons I agree MOO- There was no ATM or credit card activity. There was no crime committed with the car. No traffic cams or other video has surfaced of someone else driving the car. No video of her at a gas station or store, shopping or being abducted. The SO seems to have an alibi. Not a zero crime area of course, but a lower than average likelihood area.

It could also have been an accidental OD with the same outcome.
 
The place that has the most cameras is the inside of Gurnee mills and every store (for theft) so that afternoon should be covered easily, then there's the parking lot where most of these abductions occur at least in the area I used to live!
 
meanmaryjean said:
While I am leaning toward suicide- I do NOT think it was suicide by fire. More likely scenario to me anyway is intentional OD while sitting in the passenger seat, final cigarette smoldered and then started fire after she was unconscious.
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This adds an improbable to an improbable: accidental conflagration following an overdose suicide committed, for some reason, miles from home. Suicide by fire is improbable but would fit at least the location, having been committed in a mobile vehicle.
 
TedERoosevelt said:
(I think this may be my first post. I've lurked for a while and read the rules. Hoping all goes well for post number one. Hi!)

I've gone through a bunch of this thread and perhaps someone can help me understand why people/LE think it was suicide? Clearly a "newbie-sleuth-er" here... I'm just trying to put the pieces together in a logical way.

Her friends and family seem to believe that it wasn't. Also... has anyone ever heard of suicide by fire before? I mean, I'm sure it has happened before, but as someone who has suffered from depression and had suicidal thoughts (in the past), I can definitely say "fire" was not my first thought of how to end it (or any thought, honestly). Not to mention that statistically when women commit suicide they usually use non-violent means and I would generally categorize fire as a more violent way to go. Plus, why pull into a random person's driveway to do it?

I keep seeing that quote from LE stating 'There is nothing that has brought us to any conclusion that somebody did this to Kathleen,' .... is this the most up-to-date information we have from LE? Do you guys take this to suggest they think she committed suicide as well or simply "we don't have any evidence"...

MOO
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If you read upthread there are links to examples of suicides committed by fire in vehicles.
 
Justice4242 said:
How do any of you know if there were no cameras? Transactions, etc. LE hasn’t released anything. How do you know they don’t have information and are just withholding from the public?
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MOO- Of course you never know for sure but LE has released a statement to the effect they have no evidence someone did this to her or that she was the victim of a crime. If they had reviewed evidence that was inconclusive or that showed an actual or probable crime, they would say nothing. While LE often withhold evidence about the crime scene itself, they did not do that in this case. They usually will ask the public for help identifying a person trying to use someone's ATM card or credit card, they did not do that in this case. If there is a last-reported sighting of a person, LE often releases that information to allow witnesses to come forward, they have not done that in this case.
 
Justice4242 said:
How do any of you know if there were no cameras? Transactions, etc. LE hasn’t released anything. How do you know they don’t have information and are just withholding from the public?
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From the recent article:

That night her body was found inside her own burning car. It was located just off Highway 41 in Lake County, but what makes this such a mystery is so far the Lake County Sheriff's Office has found no evidence she stopped anywhere in Lake County. They also have no suspects, no motive for her death and the coroner has not been able to determine how she died.

"There is nothing that has brought us to any conclusion that somebody did this to Kathleen," said Lake County Sheriff's Office spokesperson Sgt. Christopher Covelli. "We don't have any evidence somebody caused this to happen to Kathleen."

Sons ask for answers in Milwaukee mother's mysterious death
 
So...I'm thinking if someone waited on her at the mall in a particular store, perhaps they would come forward and say something, like "hey, I remember that lady...she bought this and that". Unless of course they dont listen to the news or read the paper, and know nothing abt her death.

This kind of reminds me of that lady who committed suicide by climbing in to the trunk of her car and shooting herself. I think her name was Rita. This case is just as puzzling.
imo
 
OhThatVictoria said:
The various theories we have flushed out are just that, theories. We have members convinced that Kathleen committed suicide and members who lean toward abduction, carjacking, planned “hit” etc.


What we know as fact about the day of Kathleen’s disappearance:

- She last spoke / face timed family members the morning of February 2nd

- Her plan was to attend an Illinois high school basketball match at 4:30PM, meet-up with family.

- The drive from S. Milwaukee to the Illinois match was approximately 1.5 hours (give/take)

- She was last seen leaving her home at 12Noon on February 2nd.

- She last used her credit cards in the Milwaukee area (near her home)

- Her husband was a sports referee that day in the Milwaukee area

- Her body was identified in a burning car that was found at Stearns School Rd and Hwy 41, near the Gurnee Mills mall (Illinois) at approx 10PM on February 2nd.

- The location of Kathleen’s vehicle was not on her regular route to visit family in Illinois.

- We cannot account for approximately 10 hours of activity that day.


I have questions . . .

- What were the purchases made by Kathleen and her husband one month prior to her death?

- Had Kathleen visited a doctor / had follow-up (routine) cancer screening in the past 90 days?

- Did she have (or anyone take out) a life insurance policy (on her)? If so, when was it written?

- What is her husband’s occupation?

- Where was her husband refereeing that day? Could she have stopped there?

- Regarding Kathleen’s burned vehicle location, when did the property owners last use their driveway?

- When is the last time that Kathleen’s vehicle was serviced? Had there been any issues with it?

- Who reported the car fire to 911?

- Which Milwaukee-area PD is pursuing the WI side of the investigation?


What questions do you folks have? (Forensic experts, would love to hear yours!)
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Great questions. Your questions got me thinking more about life insurance. What if Kathleen knew life insurance wouldn't pay out in the event of suicide so staged her death for that reason. We know how loving she was and how much she loved those boys. I wonder if they are the beneficiaries (if such a policy exists)? That would make this far more likely IMO. This would also explain her FaceTime call that morning (sort of a goodbye). She was a very intelligent lady who could've pulled something like this off.
 
Rosiebones said:
The medical examiner may never be able to determine cause of death for prosecution or life insurance pay out. Then what?
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It would be ruled a suicide by a civil court as that is more logical a conclusion than is murdered and her body incinerated in a car by her killer. Also, police have already hinted broadly that no external factors were causal here. If a significant insurance payout were in effect (particularly one recently secured) it would be indicative of planning.
 
blankenship said:
It would be ruled a suicide by a civil court as that is more logical a conclusion than is murdered and her body incinerated in a car by her killer. Also, police have already hinted broadly that no external factors were causal here. If a significant insurance payout were in effect (particularly one recently secured) it would be indicative of planning.
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Do you know that for a fact? (If in doubt, it’s a suicide?)
 
It seems many policies have small print that says the company will pay out after a suicide providing two years have passed. This would indicate incredible premeditation on her part.
I do not believe this is a suicide in any way.
 
OhThatVictoria said:
Do you know that for a fact? (If in doubt, it’s a suicide?)
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I know that if there were a sizable payout at issue, insurance companies would expect to win by similar arguments. I am not aware of civil precedent that would automatically signal judgement in their favor, however.
 
blankenship said:
I know that if there were a sizable payout at issue, insurance companies would expect to win by similar arguments. I am not aware of civil precedent that would automatically signal judgement in their favor, however.
Click to expand...

It’s all hypothetical but an interesting discussion. Personally, I wrestle with the possibility of suicide but I imagine we all haul our own perspectives into discussion.
 
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