Zodiac Killer

[DaisyChains]

Something to note: Lloyd Cunningham who ended up being the first graphologist for the Secret Service responded to the Stein murder scene that night. He also was hired by the authorities to examine the Ramsey’s ransom letter. A little random factoid. Daisypedia

 

[Purpose2Help]

Some of it is probably is the same code used by minutemen, however some of it must be something else, or it would be solved. In just saying
Never thought about Cunningham that is a good factoid drom DaisyPedia. Thank you.

I did find my little book and even thought it was made in 2013 the symbols and trademarks have been around for up to 200 years old. It is called Miller's Antiques Marks by Judith Miller. There is more than 6,000 marks to identify your antiques.
Look on page 216 the forth symbol down looks like the sideways Z he used to use.Then on 202 there is a bunch of the same symbols used in his message including Zodiac sign, exactly the same. I would post a picture but I don't know how.
Thank you and Merry Christmas Everyone

God Bless

 

[chlban]

Something to note: Lloyd Cunningham who ended up being the first graphologist for the Secret Service responded to the Stein murder scene that night. He also was hired by the authorities to examine the Ramsey’s ransom letter. A little random factoid. Daisypedia

Interesting. These are my two "unsolved" case obsessions and I did not not know this little connection. So I did some googling and it appears he had no opinion on the Ransom Note and seems to really know his stuff on Zodiac. Thanks for the info.

 

[DaisyChains]

Interesting. These are my two "unsolved" case obsessions and I did not not know this little connection. So I did some googling and it appears he had no opinion on the Ransom Note and seems to really know his stuff on Zodiac. Thanks for the info.

Interesting enough - with the Ramsey case - it is rumored that Cunningham actually befriended the Ramsey's and even went to church with them sometime during or after the investigation. He actually examined a document for me in relation to the zodiac case (wanted him to check on an exemplary of a one of many killers that was active in the bay area during the time of the zodiac) . Cool guy. I bet if you have any interesting questions about forensic graphology - particularly in relation to the zodiac case or Ramsey case - he would be happy to inform/educate. He is getting up there in age.

info on Lloyd: http://www.sfgate.com/news/article/Zodiac-s-written-clues-fascinate-document-expert-2644828.php

 

[DaisyChains]

Some of it is probably is the same code used by minutemen, however some of it must be something else, or it would be solved. In just saying
Never thought about Cunningham that is a good factoid drom DaisyPedia. Thank you.

I did find my little book and even thought it was made in 2013 the symbols and trademarks have been around for up to 200 years old. It is called Miller's Antiques Marks by Judith Miller. There is more than 6,000 marks to identify your antiques.
Look on page 216 the forth symbol down looks like the sideways Z he used to use.Then on 202 there is a bunch of the same symbols used in his message including Zodiac sign, exactly the same. I would post a picture but I don't know how.
Thank you and Merry Christmas Everyone

God Bless

Thats very interesting about Miller's Antique Marks! The one thing I did learn from the minutemen knowing code is that many people in prison would learn ciphering to write secret correspondence in hopes that guards checking the letters wouldn't be able to solve it. So it is very possible that Zodiac had been in the system in some way prior to the attacks and perhaps that is where he learned how to code. Lots of time to read (he referenced books) and learn new languages/writing styles (code). He also seemed to dislike cops and authority -something a person with prior convictions who has dealt with LE and is still a criminal would also feel. JMO

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!

 

[YESorNO]

SF cop who hunted Zodiac killer dies. Dave Toschi was 86

"Dave Toschi, a dapper cop who became the lead San Francisco police investigator for the Zodiac serial-killer case in the late 1960s and ’70s, has died at the age of 86.

Toschi died at his home in San Francisco on Saturday after a lengthy illness, relatives said..."

https://www.sfgate.com/news/article/SF-cop-who-hunted-Zodiac-killer-dies-Dave-Toschi-12488886.php

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[DaisyChains]

I really believe this guy Silas Boston should be looked at. I always wondered if his wife Mary Lou could have had a run in with Z when I saw her casefile throughout the years and NOW I see that her husband murdered her and he had very similar MO to the Zodiac. He was a white male who would be the appropriate age for the zodiac. He worked for a Sacramento ambulance company (weren't some of the victims connected to hospitals/nursing?). He killed a couple by beating them and throwing them in the Caribbean waters after they were hog tied. He also claimed to have killed two other people by taking them out in a rubber boat, robbing them, subduing them, and then slitting their throats only to leave their bodies in the jungle! Very Most Dangerous Game! He murdered his wife Mary Lou in 1968 by telling her to run from the car and then shooting her as if he was hunting her. He seemed to have liked boats and water. He would take epic excursions with his child/teen sons from Sacramento to Belize and Mexico via boat. Seems he liked to "hunt" down there and use his boat as a way to get people to remote areas to murder them. Also was escaping a statutory rape charge. Oh and he was arrested in Paradise, CA - re the Paradise card and many CA folks who have followed the case (like me) have thought Z was pointing to the city with that card. Not sure if he lived in Paradise during the times of the Z spree/letters, but the significance of Paradise might not just be residence but gravesite location of victims.

http://www.sacbee.com/news/local/crime/article146689419.html

Unfortunately he died in 2017 after being arrested and before sentencing. I am eager if his possessions have been gone through yet since his death? If not Z, at least there might be info on other murders. But I have a feeling about this guy. I've always looked at Mary Lou's face and thought "What if, Z?"

I hope they got Silas DNA to compare to any known Z DNA (as well as EARONS DNA just for good measure). Who knows what this guy was capable of.

This is why it is important to search missing people who disappeared around the time of other killings and match a victim profile. Could be a connection that reveals a notorious murderer. For people in California this wasn't just a pet case, but something that deeply effected our community.

 

[DaisyChains]

It seems to me that many of those obsessed with the Zodiac case don't really want it to be solved. They crucify anyone who seems to come forward with a suspect, or perhaps it is just that every expert has their own favorite suspect.

Almost everything I read from Zodiac community discounts Robert Graysmiths theory about ALA, even though he seems to have a lot of circumstantial evidence.

Most people don't believe Perez.

Most think Dennis Kauffman is after money and has no evidence.

At least the authorities seem to put enough stock in the theories to check them out.

I think the Zodiac case is just a web of dead ends and false hopes. Everyones favorite suspect has that one compelling thing that seems to keep them from being the guy. Somewhere out there is a perfect fit, the real Zodiac killer, but it may be someone nobody suspected.

I don't go for the "team" theory, ever try to get a group of people to keep a secret??

Tom Voight does have an interesting site, but I lost respect for him when he was offering BTK some pictures of people he'd killed. I'm sure it was a hoax, but it wasn't in very good taste.

And regarding Voights favorite Gradowski or however it's spelled, much of this is based on the dispatcher remembering his voice after nearly four decades?? Seems like a stretch.

I hope it's solved. I think every suspect needs to be looked at. Instead of the quick discount of all these people coming forward with wild claims, prove with facts that it wasn't them. It appears that in the Zodiac community suspects are considered fraudulent until proven guilty.

100% accurate. Precisely why I haven't gotten as obsessed with the case as some others. But we keep coming back to it

 

[DaisyChains]

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/world...itish-couple-in-caribbean-heres-what-we-know/

 

[DaisyChains]

Here's a Guy whose photo does not have to be doctored to look like the sketch, he looks as if he posed for the sketch artist

sure Ross kind of looks like the zodiac with the exception he was so big from
pickwickian syndrome that it would have been a defining feature for his victims. His face looks much fuller than the sketch. But I don’t take much stock in whether or not someone looked just like the suspect’s composites. After all, they are just composites not actual photos of the killer. Circumstance is more important to me. Also, the only connection to Ross is that he worked at the RCC library when CJB was killed and was a strange boy. Just because people suspected someone that is strange/mentally different in an era when gay people were still institutionalized means nothing to me. Show me actual evidence he has raped/murdered. As of now all I see is a young man who died before his time because of mental/physical issues who can’t defend himself and who’s family really doesn’t want him stigmatized further. I looked into Ross deeply. He isn’t Z. JMO. I’m not so sure it is Boston either as his DNA was processed and is in the system, but can we be sure someone who worked in an ambulance might not be so meticulous as to use the blood/prints of someone else to plant false evidence (longshot, but hey it’s been theorized). Pretty sure it isn’t Boston though. We should keep looking into missing persons who could have been one of the Z victims he “claimed” to have killed. It isn’t impossible Z killed someone very close to him at one point that he can be linked to easily once their case is solved or their remains discovered. Again JMO - I just think it’s the best route for those who want to solve the case and get it over with. I do appreciate all your hard work digging up stuff on Ross Morf. Good sleuthing there with records etc.

 

[Onaliv]

100% accurate. Precisely why I haven't gotten as obsessed with the case as some others. But we keep coming back to it

Agreed. I don’t think there will ever be an “a-ha” ending to the Zodiac case, it just keeps going on and on... every few years someone else will come out and say it was their dad, brother, uncle etc., and revive the mystery.


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[Bargle]

Back to Zodiac killer. Nobody finds it odd that the dispatcher thought the Zodiac was a black man? Or did they not suggest that it might be the Zodiac?

There's nothing to show it was anything other than a slip of the tongue or garbled understanding.

 

[SavageMarkIII]

I'm just giving that what id's.
Wow Sailor he took home evidence? I remember that someone did that in OJ case. Which had never happened in the officers 25 years on the force.

Back to Zodiac killer. Nobody finds it odd that the dispatcher thought the Zodiac was a black man? Or did they not suggest that it might be the Zodiac?

I really need to find my book with same
Symbols in it. Its actually a antique book of trade marks and symbols marked on antiques. They are to close not to be some symbols he used in his coded messages.

BBM

After reading several zodiac sites and articles relating to zodiac, MOO about the Dispatcher in the Stine case:

1) When the incident happens, it's just a taxi driver shot. No one is immediately thinking Zodiac. Not the Dispatcher or police.

2) The dispatcher was having a heard time hearing and understanding the kids, because all three of the kids were yelling into the phone at the same time, as they were scared. The Dispatcher was doing their best to get the kids to calm down, so they could get a good description of the perp and also relay the info to the responding officers simultaneously. So originally, the dispatcher thought the kids said the perp was a black man, but the Dispatcher later corrected this to a white man. However, some of the responding officers never heard the correction.

 

[Chicago Bulls]

The Zodiac had a map of the Diablo property datum baseline and meridian for property survey in the San Francisco bay area.
The Unabomber, Ted was anti development, allegedly the motive for his terror living in a cabin going back to primal hunting skills.
The Zodiac code was broken.
' I like killing people because it is so much fun it is more fun than killing wild game in the forest'.

 

[Chicago Bulls]

The Unabomber lived in a cabin hunting.

Does anyone have solid evidence that would rule out the connection of these two?

 

[Chicago Bulls]

All the property development in San Francisco based on the baseline meridian of Zodiacs cross on his map.
Aka Devil Mountain.

Their MO was similar but slightly different mindsets.

 

[Dumas911]

Was just reading the 408 cipher of The Zodiac where he says humans are the most dangerous game. I was wondering if investigators have ever looked into names of people who have checked out of the library the book “The Most Dangerous Game” from local libraries. Probably a long, long shot, but you never know.

 

[meticulously]

Can DNA identify the Zodiac Killer now that it has revealed the East Area Rapist suspect?

BY ANITA CHABRIA AND RYAN SABALOW

May 01, 2018
Updated 11 hours 18 minutes ago

"DNA sleuthing helped crack a decades-old cold case,*leading to the arrest*of a man suspected of being the East Area Rapist, also known as the*Golden State Killer.

Now could the same type of detective work on genealogy websites be used to catch another of California's most infamous and elusive criminals —*the Zodiac Killer?

"It is possible," said Pam Hofsass, a former San Francisco homicide detective who worked on the Zodiac case and now runs the forensic lab for the Contra Costa County Sheriff's Office. "It's totally worth looking at, and I hope with all of the news and revelations about the Golden State Killer that it will kind of be the impetus for the Zodiac."

http://www.sacbee.com/news/local/crime/article210156874.html

 

[ktebmf]

Can DNA identify the Zodiac Killer now that it has revealed the East Area Rapist suspect?

BY ANITA CHABRIA AND RYAN SABALOW

May 01, 2018
Updated 11 hours 18 minutes ago

"DNA sleuthing helped crack a decades-old cold case,*leading to the arrest*of a man suspected of being the East Area Rapist, also known as the*Golden State Killer.

Now could the same type of detective work on genealogy websites be used to catch another of California's most infamous and elusive criminals —*the Zodiac Killer?

"It is possible," said Pam Hofsass, a former San Francisco homicide detective who worked on the Zodiac case and now runs the forensic lab for the Contra Costa County Sheriff's Office. "It's totally worth looking at, and I hope with all of the news and revelations about the Golden State Killer that it will kind of be the impetus for the Zodiac."

http://www.sacbee.com/news/local/crime/article210156874.html

Same publication just posted this - my god, imagine if this pans out...

[FONT=&quot]May 02, 2018 04:39 PM
Updated 2 hours 57 minutes ago
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Investigators searching for the Zodiac Killer have submitted evidence to a private DNA lab in the hopes of obtaining a genetic profile of one of California's most elusive criminals — then tracking him down using the same kind of family-tree tracing recently used in the East Area Rapist case.
Vallejo police Detective Terry Poyser, who has worked the Zodiac case for four years, said his agency has submitted two envelopes that contained letters from the Zodiac Killer for a type of advanced DNA analysis that previously had not been available in the case.
Poyser declined to identify the lab, but said it would attempt to obtain a full DNA profile from saliva on the envelope flap and stamps. He said he expected to have results back from the lab as soon as in the next few weeks, and almost certainly by summer.


[/FONT]

http://www.sacbee.com/latest-news/article210320689.html

 

[Hazelnutty]

This is exciting!!

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