4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 72

[ktm44]

Snipped for focus. I don't believe LE stated it, at least not in the PCA. We can maybe argue it was suggested, but definitely not stated. MOO.

I’m inclined to believe the PCA implies that someone wearing a certain sole type, not associated with any member of the household was in proximity of a roommate that happened to see a masked male that she didn’t associate with the household, heading towards an exit point.

What happens behind the scenes on a PCA is nothings I’m familiar with and needs to be addressed by one of our professionals but I really don’t think it is the only footprint in the house.

 

[TL4S]

like I said, in WA, bring your most compelling evidence. imo jmo ime

Imo, it is compelling enough for what its worth. LE didn't know who that shoe print belonged to then. They did, however, have the other evidence linking directly to BK. DM's statement narrative was a couple paragraphs in the PCA, while the vehicle and other digital evidence was pages and pages. I guess I'm inclined to think that at a time when LE didn't have BK's shoes to compare with, even a thousand bloody shoe prints weren't useful in an arrest PCA. That's why I lean towards the ideas I've posted. Now, if LE does indeed find a diamond-patterned pair of shoes at BK's with victim DNA on it, then these shoe prints become binding, for sure.

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

Imo, it is compelling enough for what its worth. LE didn't know who that shoe print belonged to then. They did, however, have the other evidence linking directly to BK. DM's statement was a couple paragraphs, while the vehicle and other digital evidence was pages and pages. I guess I'm inclined to think that at a time when LE didn't have BK's shoes to compare with, even a thousand bloody shoe prints weren't useful in an arrest PCA. That's why I lean towards the ideas I've posted. Now, if LE does indeed find a diamond-patterned pair of shoes at BK's with victim DNA on it, then these shoe prints become binding, for sure.

But they were key to the search warrant. that was my point. and WA law has a higher bar. bring the best evidence.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

YET. Apparently PA cold cases are under review for possible links.
IMO Washington wasn't BK's first time stalking women.

Pennsylvania cold cases under review for possible links to Bryan Kohberger

Kohberger was arrested at his parents’ Albrightsville home on Dec. 30.

nypost.com

'Is his name out there?' Authorities search unsolved cases for links to Idaho murder suspect

Authorities in at least two Pennsylvania counties where Bryan Kohberger went to college have made no connection to cold cases.

www.king5.com

But they've so far found nothing. I think that's important to note too. JMO.

 

[10ofRods]

He wasn’t notified until he got home. It doesn’t appear his father knew at the time of the police stops in Indiana.

But surely he knew he wasn't meeting the requirements of his PIP and that things were shaky?

You bring up a really interesting issue. What if BK thought he could get away with everything (bad TA-ing; mass murder).

What if, inside his mind, all of his transgressions were equal - and not only that, but that whatever an individual sets their mind on, no matter how narcissistic and self-serving, it's still a viable plan as long as it fulfills its own "reasonable" goals?

Because Rational Choice Theory is according to Prof B, one of his favorite theories. In this theory, here is a category of criminal who is completely rational. Indeed the theory claims that serial killers and mass murderers should be understood (at least on the first pass) as rational actors who have an illegal or immoral goal - but set about to accomplish it in the most logical and rational manner possible.

I keep thinking about that. Prof B also mentions Script Theory (where a criminal labors over a plan - but thinks of it as a kind of script or movie; in which the ending is decided by themselves)

A Knife Sheath, Phone Pings and Trash: The Hunt for a Killer in Idaho (Published 2023)

On the night four college students were killed, a roommate saw a man clad in black walk through the home. It took a cross-country investigation to find a suspect.

www.nytimes.com

He was being taught (and perhaps rewarded for) using these theories. Rational Choice Theory is particularly scary, because it was intended for economic theorists, when people are in a rational state of mind about markets. It wasn't intended for criminals who decide that their reasonable premise is (for example) that there are too many people, or too many people of a certain type, and it's up to them to devise a rational plan to fix it. All of their choices are thereby reasoned.

Simply stated, it's the ruination of logic by asserting that all premises are equal (and leaving morality or ethics out, altogether, IMO).

This whole case mesmerizes me because it puts into play some ideas that I know people have, but takes them to their bloodiest conclusions. IMO.

I believe BK is not stupid; but I also think he's quite mad (but thinks he's rational - as most crazy people do).

IMO

 

[Dotta]

Isn't it amazing? I truly have never seen anything like this.
.....
He couldn't do it.

IMO.

But how could he succeed while having so many unresolved issues???

Living under protective wings of devoted parents till mid 20ties?

He ran across the continent to be independent at last.

Consumed by morbid obsessions.

How can such a person be a good teacher???
Respected educator???

Words simply fail me.

JMO

 

[TL4S]

But they were key to the search warrant. that was my point. and WA law has a higher bar. bring the best evidence.

Okay, well, I'm outta ideas.

I will say, I think the dark clothing and shoes would be key pieces of evidence to look for while serving a search warrant, because imo, they laid out their case in the PCA that the man in black, who left the shoe print, is the killer. Jmo.

 

[10ofRods]

1. Worked in pizza restaurant
2. Worked as security guy at school

Links in threads - many of them

Do you have a link for the security job being paid? Because I think he started as a kind of volunteer/intern (supported by his dad, who was doing the same work?) Was he actually paid?

Thanks for the pizza restaurant citation. I'll look it up. I wonder how long that lasted.

So, he goes from pizza restaurant (beginner worker?) to TA at a fairly major university? Fascinating.

IMO.

Okay, I've searched and cannot find anything about Bryan working at a pizza place. So - do you have a link? I too get tired having to look them up, but, well, those are the rules. I was told it was not okay to post and ask others to go find a link - it's probably late where you are, as it is where I am, so no hurry.

But I'd love to see who said he worked at a pizza place. AFAIK, neither he nor his family have revealed that. All I see when I google "BK pizza restaurant employee" is that he ate at a pizza restaurant. If he did work - when was it? High school or community college or DeSales period? Surely it wasn't in Pullman?

TIA.

IMO.

 

[iamshadow21]

Do you have a link for the security job being paid? Because I think he started as a kind of volunteer/intern (supported by his dad, who was doing the same work?) Was he actually paid?

Thanks for the pizza restaurant citation. I'll look it up. I wonder how long that lasted.

So, he goes from pizza restaurant (beginner worker?) to TA at a fairly major university? Fascinating.

IMO.

Okay, I've searched and cannot find anything about Bryan working at a pizza place. So - do you have a link? I too get tired having to look them up, but, well, those are the rules. I was told it was not okay to post and ask others to go find a link - it's probably late where you are, as it is where I am, so no hurry.

But I'd love to see who said he worked at a pizza place. AFAIK, neither he nor his family have revealed that. All I see when I google "BK pizza restaurant employee" is that he ate at a pizza restaurant. If he did work - when was it? High school or community college or DeSales period? Surely it wasn't in Pullman?

TIA.

IMO.

Re: the pizza job, I don't have a link, but it was in the same article as the guy who talked about them doing heroin together. Might be in the media thread?

MOO

 

[acutename]

At the time BK drove with dad back to PA, he had not been fired yet. He certainly might have anticipated it though, with the build-up of "altercations" regarding his behavior.

He may or may not have been planning to return to WA, though certainly (IMO) he didn't plan to bring the Elantra back if he did return.

I'd really like to know what story he had told his parents at that point.

MOO

could have told them that all the turmoil on campus was disrupting his concentration IMO

 

[Dotta]

But I'd love to see who said he worked at a pizza place.

Idaho murders: Bryan Kohberger's former friend speaks out on social behavior, alleged drug use | FOX 10 Phoenix

www-fox10phoenix-com.cdn.ampproject.org

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

Okay, well, I'm outta ideas.

it's just that the diamond pattern tied to the search warrant -- places to be searched, things to be seized, nexus to crime. Asking to search for all shoes won't fly b/c too broad, but asking for shoes with diamond pattern, that is specific, but then to show that pattern ties to the crime scene (nexus). then you've been specific as to place (his apartment), thing (shoe with diamond pattern) nexus (footprint outside witness' door - so likely that of the killer). that's why all those things matter, and that's why the best evidence of that shoe pattern is important. and imo jmo ime that means that is the best evidence they've got. if they had a big old honking full diamond pattern footprint next to the bed on the third floor, they'd have used it because even more compelling as to place/thing/crime. imo jmo they don't have it, so that was why I asked the question much earlier.

Editing to add: there was only reason to hold back their best evidence during the investigation. But the PCA was sealed and the search warrant had to tie into that, and it was sealed, too, and the defense was going to know about all that evidence one BK was charged. If they wanted to search for shoes, they needed to show those shoes, that place. jmo imo ime

 

[acutename]

Do you have a link for the security job being paid? Because I think he started as a kind of volunteer/intern (supported by his dad, who was doing the same work?) Was he actually paid?

Thanks for the pizza restaurant citation. I'll look it up. I wonder how long that lasted.

So, he goes from pizza restaurant (beginner worker?) to TA at a fairly major university? Fascinating.

IMO.

Okay, I've searched and cannot find anything about Bryan working at a pizza place. So - do you have a link? I too get tired having to look them up, but, well, those are the rules. I was told it was not okay to post and ask others to go find a link - it's probably late where you are, as it is where I am, so no hurry.

But I'd love to see who said he worked at a pizza place. AFAIK, neither he nor his family have revealed that. All I see when I google "BK pizza restaurant employee" is that he ate at a pizza restaurant. If he did work - when was it? High school or community college or DeSales period? Surely it wasn't in Pullman?

TIA.

IMO.

Idaho murders: Bryan Kohberger's ... - FOX6 News Milwaukee
FOX6 News Milwaukee | Wisconsin & Local Milwaukee News WITI › news › idaho-murders-bryan...
Jan 8, 2023 — "He needed a job, so I worked at a pizza shop at that time and they were hiring ... Bryan Kohberger, 28, is accused of killing Ethan Chapin, ...

 

[Boxer]

He wasn’t notified until he got home. It doesn’t appear his father knew at the time of the police stops in Indiana.

Agree. Pretty sad to hear his Dad proudly tell the officer his son was a PhD student.

 

[10ofRods]

But how could he succeed while having so many unresolved issues???

Living under protective wings of devoted parents till mid 20ties?

He ran across the continent to be independent at last.

Consumed by morbid obsessions.

How such a person be a good teacher???
Respected educator???

JMO

He was neither.

He was in his first semester of teaching. We've fired people unsuited to teaching after 5 years (took that long to get the procedures all aligned). Often, it's within the first year or two.

No one expects grad students to be "good teachers," at least not at first. And in some grad programs, teaching is an unimportant part of the evaluation of a grad student (research and grants are more important).

Let me mention that WSU is not the nation's top criminology program. And he was paying OOS tuition (which can give a potential grad student a couple of extra points in the admissions process).

He was never a teacher. A TA is similar to his mother's job - Teaching Assistant, and while people may quibble, the actual teacher assigned to a classroom has responsibilities that a teaching assistant does not have.

That one woman (Prof B) respected him (apparently). That's all we have that I know of, on the respect topic. Once at WSU, he crashed and burned really quickly. Whole thing is terribly sad.

IMO.

it's just that the diamond pattern tied to the search warrant -- places to be searched, things to be seized, nexus to crime. Asking to search for all shoes won't fly b/c too broad, so asking for shoes with diamond pattern, that is specific, but then to show that pattern ties to the crime scene (nexus). then you've been specific as to place (his apartment), thing (shoe with diamond pattern) nexus (footprint outside witness' door - so likely that of the killer). that's why all those things matter, and that's why the best evidence of that shoe pattern is important. and imo jmo ime that means that is the best evidence they've got. if they had a big old honking full diamond pattern footprint next to the bed on the third floor, they'd have used it because even more compelling as to place/thing/crime. imo jmo they don't have it, so that was why I asked the question much earlier.

We need a lightbulb reaction icon - because this is brilliant.

 

[10ofRods]

Idaho murders: Bryan Kohberger's ... - FOX6 News Milwaukee
FOX6 News Milwaukee | Wisconsin & Local Milwaukee News WITI › news › idaho-murders-bryan...
Jan 8, 2023 — "He needed a job, so I worked at a pizza shop at that time and they were hiring ... Bryan Kohberger, 28, is accused of killing Ethan Chapin, ...

Thank you so much for trying - but the link doesn't go to a story. It's a splash page. But maybe it will help us find the report on the Milwaukee news. I'm searching by your quote and will be back shortly.

Found it!

Idaho murders: Bryan Kohberger's former friend speaks out on social behavior, alleged drug use

Rich Pasqua, who said he is a former acquaintance of Idaho murders suspect Bryan Kohberger, recalled the interactions they had and the behavior Kohberger displayed.

www.fox5dc.com

It says the guy worked with Bryan "for a little bit."

So a little bit of pizza work was all he had before he went into being a TA. I'm trying to think how I would have been at teaching (in grad school) had I not been in Future Teachers in high school; done peer education in 8-10th grade; and then gotten a pre-grad school teaching job. I worked at fast food before I did any of that. I got tons of mentoring. All of us TA's (except one) supported each other and we had a couple of stellar teachers who had already TA'ed elsewhere.

Work history is, then, apparently, "Pizza worker" (time unknown; witness said short period of observation) and then TA at WSU's criminology program.

Big jump in responsibility, IMO. It's hard not to feel sorry for him, struggling as he was with his neuro thing. What a terrible tragedy - that no one picked up on his fragility or extreme anger issues (although he says he assaulted his dad violently in high school - so someone knew but probably thought he had outgrown that).

Same person (in that article) says that he never had a girlfriend, during the time that he and friends knew BK. Also very significant. This is the guy who also did heroin with BK.

IMO.

 

[Dotta]

Thank you so much for trying - but the link doesn't go to a story. It's a splash page. But maybe it will help us find the report on the Milwaukee news. I'm searching by your quote and will be back shortly.

Look above
I sent it.
In the middle of the article.

 

[10ofRods]

Look above
I sent it.
In the middle of the article.

Yes, I know. But when I click, it doesn't go there. No worries - made it easy to find.

 

[acutename]

Thank you so much for trying - but the link doesn't go to a story. It's a splash page. But maybe it will help us find the report on the Milwaukee news. I'm searching by your quote and will be back shortly.

Found it!

Idaho murders: Bryan Kohberger's former friend speaks out on social behavior, alleged drug use

Rich Pasqua, who said he is a former acquaintance of Idaho murders suspect Bryan Kohberger, recalled the interactions they had and the behavior Kohberger displayed.

www.fox5dc.com

It says the guy worked with Bryan "for a little bit."

So a little bit of pizza work was all he had before he went into being a TA. I'm trying to think how I would have been at teaching (in grad school) had I not been in Future Teachers in high school; done peer education in 8-10th grade; and then gotten a pre-grad school teaching job. I worked at fast food before I did any of that. I got tons of mentoring. All of us TA's (except one) supported each other and we had a couple of stellar teachers who had already TA'ed elsewhere.

Work history is, then, apparently, "Pizza worker" (time unknown; witness said short period of observation) and then TA at WSU's criminology program.

Big jump in responsibility, IMO. It's hard not to feel sorry for him, struggling as he was with his neuro thing. What a terrible tragedy - that no one picked up on his fragility or extreme anger issues (although he says he assaulted his dad violently in high school - so someone knew but probably thought he had outgrown that).

Same person (in that article) says that he never had a girlfriend, during the time that he and friends knew BK. Also very significant. This is the guy who also did heroin with BK.

IMO.

try this

https://www.wfmz.com/news/area/poco...iatrist-weighs-in/article_3c9f8cde-9205-11ed- 80a7-5b450e354968.html

MSM but it is quoted memories from a friend- not his W2

 

[TL4S]

it's just that the diamond pattern tied to the search warrant -- places to be searched, things to be seized, nexus to crime. Asking to search for all shoes won't fly b/c too broad, but asking for shoes with diamond pattern, that is specific, but then to show that pattern ties to the crime scene (nexus). then you've been specific as to place (his apartment), thing (shoe with diamond pattern) nexus (footprint outside witness' door - so likely that of the killer). that's why all those things matter, and that's why the best evidence of that shoe pattern is important. and imo jmo ime that means that is the best evidence they've got. if they had a big old honking full diamond pattern footprint next to the bed on the third floor, they'd have used it because even more compelling as to place/thing/crime. imo jmo they don't have it, so that was why I asked the question much earlier.

Editing to add: there was only reason to hold back their best evidence during the investigation. But the PCA was sealed and the search warrant had to tie into that, and it was sealed, too, and the defense was going to know about all that evidence one BK was charged. If they wanted to search for shoes, they needed to show those shoes, that place. jmo imo ime

Due to the violence, I think we all have a hard time believing that there weren't bloody shoe prints all over the place. I also find it hard to believe the latent print wasn't the tail end of his shoe leaving heavier prints as he walked, but who knows. Perhaps the other prints didn't have as clear a diamond pattern. Your question is fair. I'm not sure we'll get an answer until trial, though.