AUS - Khandalyce Kiara Pearce (Wynarka) and mum Karlie Pearce-Stevenson (Belanglo) #7

[Panda]

Oh, for sure Wolfie, after all DS Bray said they believed Khandalyce was alive for up to a month after Karlie was allegedly murdered. With all of the movement of Karlie's keycard immediately after her alleged murder the only place I can think of where Khandalyce would have been kept/left would be somewhere near the Broadview SA OTR service station; from just before Christmas until the first week of the New Year:

From the draft timeline:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/en...-Kiara-Pearce-and-mum-Karlie-Pearce-Stevenson

Transaction at Charnwood ACT (16/12/08)
Transaction at Deakin ACT (19/12/08)

Transaction at BP OTR Broadview SA (22/12/08)

Transaction at Coober Pedy, SA (06/01/09)
EFTPOS purchase from Mobil, Alice Springs NT (07/01/09)

ATM withdrawal at Broadview SA (10/01/09)

This would fit with the stated 'up to a month' time period. This then brings up the circumstances of Khandalyce being 'kept in terrible conditions' and 'a violent death' if she was still barely alive at the end if that period of time. Who, if anyone was she with during this time? Where was she left? Or even worse, how was she concealed if she travelled around during that time?

I believe that DJH is firmly in the frame for Karlie's alleged murder. It worries me greatly that her keycard wasn't used from 24/11 until 16/12/08. Of course, there could be other transactions we don't know about, but given her Karlie's GM was said to be worried for the same reason and a similar time period; I can't help but draw the conclusion those times coincide.

There are other people involved in the identity theft and fraud. I think there could also be another person/people involved in Khandalyce's death, or yes, can place a certain person/people with her from the 24/11-16/12/08; in Canberra and elsewhere until around the 10/01/2009.

DJH is firmly behind bars but he's the only one. I suspect there should be one, or maybe a couple, more.

I don't think that the police believe Khandalyce was murdered a month after Karlie.

"We can confirm now that we believe that Karlie and Khandalyce were killed in mid to late December 2008."

http://www.nova969.com.au/news/furt...ave-emerged-murder-case-karlie-and-khandalyce

If Karlie was killed 15 or 16 of December, that would mean Khandalyce may have been alive for a period of 15 or 16 days after her mother was killed.

 

[Oona]

From the draft timeline:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/en...-Kiara-Pearce-and-mum-Karlie-Pearce-Stevenson

Transaction at Charnwood ACT (16/12/08)
Transaction at Deakin ACT (19/12/08)

Transaction at BP OTR Broadview SA (22/12/08)

Transaction at Coober Pedy, SA (06/01/09)
EFTPOS purchase from Mobil, Alice Springs NT (07/01/09)

ATM withdrawal at Broadview SA (10/01/09)

Thanks for providing the timeline Bohemian. I am curious about the trip to Alice Springs between the Broadview S.A, transactions. If DH had the card at that time who or what was in Alice Springs?
If DH had Khandalyce with him surely it would be risky for him to be seen alone with her in her hometown.... especially if he was driving Karlie's car (not saying he was, just speculating). I think it makes more sense that Khandalyce was left somewhere or with someone in Canberra.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Intuition (story partially known to each member)

Yesterday, when I coincidentially came to a forum "Vintage caravans", I saw pics of a very shabby Furness caravan in a shed, same coincidentially photographed 2008 on the way from Mt. Gambier to Adelaide. The photographer is a fan of those caravans and had liked to inspect the vehicle, but it was locked up and no owner available.
My personally intuition, sorry, unfortunately not more than this:
I can imagine a shabby caravan or something like that in an old shed, more or less far away from a home, nobody except the maybe 60yo owner has access/allows access to it, there he is hiding a little 2yo girl until her death (providing her with insufficient food and drink).
A suitcase with mixed clothing of a "family" (partially deceased) belonges to the little one, no idea why mixed and not only the girl's clothing. Maybe, there is another suitcase with only girl's clothing and the man chooses the wrong suitcase.
Years later there is an urgency to sell the home and shed. The content of the shed has to disappear. The caravan can be sold to fans of vintage caravans, perhaps via ebay. A suitcase containing clothing and the remains of the little girl has to be dumped somewhere, no matter where. The man in March 2015 knows: nobody has searched the girl between 2008-2015. The man, who brought him the little 2yo is since around that time (beginning 2015) in prison; he is charged with something unrelated to kidnapping a child or killing a mother. So the man hasn't to fear anything and may dump the suitcase on a road side, 100-150km away from home, return to his home and sell the empty shabby caravan with the effect of all pieces of evidence have disappeared.
Maybe he has given the suitcase to a son or SIL who is trucker/driver or in any case is driving the way to Wynarka regularly and who throws the case from the loading area. Maybe the elder man does it himself.
To my picture doesn't belong a mysterious suitcase man who is walking along in a town, because that is just inexplicable.

 

[Oona]

Intuition (partially known to each member)

Yesterday, when I coincidentially came to a forum "Vintage caravans", I saw pics of a very shabby Furness caravan in a shed, same coincidentially photographed 2008 on the way from Mt. Gambier to Adelaide. The photographer is a fan of those caravans and had liked to inspect the vehicle, but it was locked up and no owner available.
My personally intuition, sorry, unfortunately not more than this:
I can imagine a shabby caravan or something like that in an old shed, more or less far away from a home, nobody except the maybe 60yo owner has access/allows access to it, there he is hiding a little 2yo girl until her death (providing her with insufficient food and drink).
A suitcase with mixed clothing of a "family" (partially deceased) belonges to the little one, no idea why mixed and not only the girl's clothing. Maybe, there is another suitcase with only girl's clothing and the man chooses the wrong suitcase.
Years later there is an urgency to sell the home and shed. The content of the shed has to disappear. The caravan can be sold to fans of vintage caravans, perhaps via ebay. A suitcase containing clothing and the remains of the little girl has to be dumped somewhere, no matter where. The man in March 2015 knows: nobody has searched the girl between 2008-2015. The man, who brought him the little 2yo is since around that time (beginning 2015) in prison; he is charged with something unrelated to kidnapping a child or killing a mother. So the man hasn't to fear anything and may dump the suitcase on a road side, 100-150km away from home, return to his home and sell the empty shabby caravan with the effect of all pieces of evidence from 2008/09 have disappeared.
Maybe he has given the suitcase to a son or SIL who is trucker/driver or in any case is driving the way to Wynarka regularly and who throws the case from the loading area. Maybe the elder man does it himself.
To my picture doesn't belong a mysterious suitcase man who is walking along in a town, because that is just inexplicable.

What about the little girl's cause of death in this scenario? I think we have been told she died a violent death.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

What about the little girl's cause of death in this scenario? I think we have been told she died a violent death.

I think, we can imagine the treatment (except no food, drink, cleanliness) and I haven't to explain.
Though I admit: 2 different persons, who kill mother and daughter and both very violent - that's odd. If I assume, Karlie's killer/s had perhaps used a car for work out the violence (severely injured upper body), only then there are differences.

 

[Oona]

I think, we can imagine the treatment (except no food, drink, cleanliness) and I haven't to explain.
Though I admit: 2 different persons, who kill mother and daughter and both very violent - that's odd. If I assume, Karlie's killer/s had perhaps used a car for work out the violence (severely injured upper body), only then there are differences.

Yes it really is too horrible to imagine the awful details. I misunderstood you when I read your scenario and thought you meant that she had died from neglect rather than a deliberate violent act.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Yes it really is too horrible to imagine the awful details. I misunderstood you when I read your scenario and thought you meant that she had died from neglect rather than a deliberate violent act.

In any case I would assume neglect plus abuse plus voilence, how very sad and terrible ever.

 

[Found]

Intuition (partially known to each member)

Yesterday, when I coincidentially came to a forum "Vintage caravans", I saw pics of a very shabby Furness caravan in a shed, same coincidentially photographed 2008 on the way from Mt. Gambier to Adelaide. The photographer is a fan of those caravans and had liked to inspect the vehicle, but it was locked up and no owner available.
My personally intuition, sorry, unfortunately not more than this:
I can imagine a shabby caravan or something like that in an old shed, more or less far away from a home, nobody except the maybe 60yo owner has access/allows access to it, there he is hiding a little 2yo girl until her death (providing her with insufficient food and drink).
A suitcase with mixed clothing of a "family" (partially deceased) belonges to the little one, no idea why mixed and not only the girl's clothing. Maybe, there is another suitcase with only girl's clothing and the man chooses the wrong suitcase.
Years later there is an urgency to sell the home and shed. The content of the shed has to disappear. The caravan can be sold to fans of vintage caravans, perhaps via ebay. A suitcase containing clothing and the remains of the little girl has to be dumped somewhere, no matter where. The man in March 2015 knows: nobody has searched the girl between 2008-2015. The man, who brought him the little 2yo is since around that time (beginning 2015) in prison; he is charged with something unrelated to kidnapping a child or killing a mother. So the man hasn't to fear anything and may dump the suitcase on a road side, 100-150km away from home, return to his home and sell the empty shabby caravan with the effect of all pieces of evidence have disappeared.
Maybe he has given the suitcase to a son or SIL who is trucker/driver or in any case is driving the way to Wynarka regularly and who throws the case from the loading area. Maybe the elder man does it himself.
To my picture doesn't belong a mysterious suitcase man who is walking along in a town, because that is just inexplicable.

I'm sorry but this just seems to be an illusion there is no reason to think it was a shabby caravan sold to enthusiasts. I don't think Khandles dying after 1 month and reportedly violently supports this theory. I doubt the wrong suitcase wound be picked up... Unless it was a hotel with hundreds of similar suitcases, that's far fetched. I just think a photo of an old caravan leading into this is a bit over the top.....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Deleted member 102539]

I'm sorry but this just seems to be an illusion there is no reason to think it was a shabby caravan sold to enthusiasts. I don't think Khandles dying after 1 month and reportedly violently supports this theory. I doubt the wrong suitcase wound be picked up... Unless it was a hotel with hundreds of similar suitcases, that's far fetched. I just think a photo of an old caravan leading into this is a bit over the top.....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

As I said: only intuition, 100% feeling. The story of reading forum, seeing pics is only an introduction.
A possibility is: someone had sold property and an old car/caravan/similar around the same time before ca. March 2015 and was living 100-150km around Wynarka (maybe Broadview). Though it is only playing with opportunities.

 

[they'll get you]

I'm sorry but this just seems to be an illusion there is no reason to think it was a shabby caravan sold to enthusiasts. I don't think Khandles dying after 1 month and reportedly violently supports this theory. I doubt the wrong suitcase wound be picked up... Unless it was a hotel with hundreds of similar suitcases, that's far fetched. I just think a photo of an old caravan leading into this is a bit over the top.....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I don't think Alfred Hitchcock could make up a story as bazaar as this.
It's very real and it's over the top.

 

[Makara]

MOD ALERT: Posting this one more time! Brainstorming theories is encouraged, but must be based on fact. For our purposes, "fact" refers to information published in mainstream media (MSM) or other acceptable sources, such as academic and professional publications.

When you state something as fact, you must back it up with a link to an approved source. If what you are stating is your opinon, please state that it is only your opinion.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

I don't think Alfred Hitchcock could make up a story as bazaar as this.
It's very real and it's over the top.

Identity fraud re family/bank/Centrelink seems to be as same bizarre and over the top as my little "fairy tale". I have not even installed anything we may also suspect ...

 

[Makara]

Identity fraud re family/bank/Centrelink seems to be as same bizarre and over the top as my little "fairy tale". I have not even installed anything we may also suspect ...

FromGermany, we're not into fairytales here. Please stick to the facts as we know them to date. Police have stated that identity fraud has indeed taken place and that is not a fairytale. They have evidence to prove this statement. Please read my post #898.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Facts:

Angel in Belanglo Forest; Angel in Wynarka.
Mother Karlie Jade dead (found NSW).
Daughter Khandalyce dead (found SA).
Man, charged with murder of Karlie Jade in prison.
This man has min. 3 names/aliases: DJH, DJM, DJB.
Karlie's cause of death unknown, severely injured upper body (consistent with stomped on), violent.
Khandalyce's cause of death unknown, very violent, under shocking conditions.
4 homes searched, one home belongs to man's sister, one home is in Charnwood.
After murder of Karlie Jade (14-30 days) murder of little Khandalyce by officially yet unknown person.
Identity fraud by unknown person/s for known time: family, bank, Centrelink.
Karlie Jade had $25.000 with her, when leaving Alice, allegly for buying/selling drugs.
Karlie Jade allegly was wanted by someone, who wanted her dead and set a bound of $5.000.
Karlie Jade - or only her bank card!! - was driving around North/South/East Australia, before her death and after her death.
Karlie Jade and Khandalyce had been seen 3 times: Police NT, acquaintance Shopping mall, Charnwood.
Khandalyce without Karlie Jade had been photographed at a car show.
A woman, former girlfriend of man in prison, now living in SA, had questioning by police officers.
Same woman had had a car crash, driver was man in prison, 2 of her children died, 1 survived.
The surviving child was a girl, also blonde and of same age as Khandalyce.
The woman was left paralysed after the crash; later she left one leg.
The woman and the man in prison separated after car crash, but came together sometimes later again.
When again separated, the man in prison had engagement with 16yo Teenager from Charnwood.
Before relationship with woman (car crash) the man in prison had a family with 2 daughters and 1 son.
At a certain time he paid child support for his daughters.
The man in prison has a former friend, who told media about the man's character.
The man in prison had several ABNs in different areas. Min. 1 company was founded unter the name of Karlie Pearce-Stevenson.
Wanted by police is an elderly man, who was seen min. 2 times near Wynarka with a suitcase.

 

[Makara]

Facts:

Angel in Belanglo Forest; Angel in Wynarka.
Mother Karlie Jade dead (found NSW).
Daughter Khandalyce dead (found SA).
Man, charged with murder of Karlie Jade in prison.
This man has min. 3 names/aliases: DJH, DJM, DJB.
Karlie's cause of death unknown, severely injured upper body (consistent with stamped on), violent.
Khandalyce's cause of death unknown, very violent, under shocking conditions.
4 homes searched, one home belongs to man's sister, one home is in Charnwood.
After murder of Karlie Jade (14-30 days) murder of little Khandalyce by officially yet unknown person.
Identity fraud by unknown person/s for known time: family, bank, Centrelink.
Karlie Jade had $25.000 with her, when leaving Alice, allegly for buying/selling drugs.
Karlie Jade allegly was wanted by someone, who wanted her dead and set a bound of $5.000.
Karlie Jade - or only her bank card!! - was driving around North/South/East Australia, before her death and after her death.
Karlie Jade and Khandalyce had been seen 3 times: Police NT, acquaintance Shopping mall, Charnwood.
Khandalyce without Karlie Jade had been photographed at a car show.
A woman, former girlfriend of man in prison, now living in SA, had questioning by police officers.
Same woman had had a car crash, driver was man in prison, 2 of her children died, 1 survived.
The surviving child was a girl, also blonde and of same age as Khandalyce.
The woman was left paralysed after the crash; later she left one leg.
The woman and the man in prison separated after car crash, but came together sometimes later again.
When again separated, the man in prison had engagement with 16yo Teenager from Charnwood.
Before relationship with woman (car crash) the man in prison had a family with 2 daughters and 1 son.
At a certain time he paid child support for his daughters.
The man in prison has a former friend, who told media about the man's character.
The man in prison had several ABNs in different areas. Min. 1 company was founded unter the name of Karlie Pearce-Stevenson.
Wanted by police is an elderly man, who was seen min. 2 times near Wynarka with a suitcase.

And not a caravan in sight!

 

[Panda]

"Both mother and daughter met violent deaths but sustained different types of injuries, sources said."

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/nsw/karlie-and-khandalyce-murders-chilling-photo-of-little-girl-posted-to-facebook-months-before-her-death/story-fni0cx12-1227587780435

In my opinion, just because Karlie and Khandalyce sustained different types of injuries does not necessarily mean they were killed by different offenders. There are two underlying differences which may come into play. Karlie may have been killed in a fit of rage on the spur of the moment. If the offender then decided he/she would have to kill Khandalyce as a consequence of having murdered her mother, there would be a different mindset - the offender would possibly have been very angry (because they offender may have felt they were now in a pickle because Karlie was dead and had to now kill Khandalyce, for example) however, the murder would be pre-meditated, as opposed to a spur of the moment fit of anger, which may have gotten out of control, as opposed to the the offender feeling they have to get rid of Khandalyce.

Further, I imagine it would be very different killing an adult woman, which may have come about from an argument and who may have tried to fight back and been very feisty, as opposed to a 2 year old child. The actual force required to murder a 2 year old in comparison would be very different. Not wanting to get too graphic, but a 2 year old child could easily be killed in a different way to an adult female, but still in a violent manner.

Just some thoughts.

 

[Makara]

Facts:

Angel in Belanglo Forest; Angel in Wynarka.
Mother Karlie Jade dead (found NSW).
Daughter Khandalyce dead (found SA).
Man, charged with murder of Karlie Jade in prison.
This man has min. 3 names/aliases: DJH, DJM, DJB.
Karlie's cause of death unknown, severely injured upper body (consistent with stamped on), violent.
Khandalyce's cause of death unknown, very violent, under shocking conditions.
4 homes searched, one home belongs to man's sister, one home is in Charnwood.
After murder of Karlie Jade (14-30 days) murder of little Khandalyce by officially yet unknown person.
Identity fraud by unknown person/s for known time: family, bank, Centrelink.
Karlie Jade had $25.000 with her, when leaving Alice, allegly for buying/selling drugs.
Karlie Jade allegly was wanted by someone, who wanted her dead and set a bound of $5.000.
Karlie Jade - or only her bank card!! - was driving around North/South/East Australia, before her death and after her death.
Karlie Jade and Khandalyce had been seen 3 times: Police NT, acquaintance Shopping mall, Charnwood.
Khandalyce without Karlie Jade had been photographed at a car show.
A woman, former girlfriend of man in prison, now living in SA, had questioning by police officers.
Same woman had had a car crash, driver was man in prison, 2 of her children died, 1 survived.
The surviving child was a girl, also blonde and of same age as Khandalyce.
The woman was left paralysed after the crash; later she left one leg.
The woman and the man in prison separated after car crash, but came together sometimes later again.
When again separated, the man in prison had engagement with 16yo Teenager from Charnwood.
Before relationship with woman (car crash) the man in prison had a family with 2 daughters and 1 son.
At a certain time he paid child support for his daughters.
The man in prison has a former friend, who told media about the man's character.
The man in prison had several ABNs in different areas. Min. 1 company was founded unter the name of Karlie Pearce-Stevenson.
Wanted by police is an elderly man, who was seen min. 2 times near Wynarka with a suitcase.

BBM: These are not facts.

Karlie's cause of death has not been confirmed by police.

Police have not confirmed that Karlie had $25K to buy/sell drugs. They have only confirmed that a report to this effect was reported to Crimestoppers.

Police have not confirmed that there was a $5,000 bounty on Karlie's life.

It is not clear how many children DH has and it is not relevant here. Leave his children out of this discussion.

Police have never stated that the ABN in the name of Karlie Jade Stevenson was set up by DH.

 

[Panda]

Facts:

Angel in Belanglo Forest; Angel in Wynarka.
Mother Karlie Jade dead (found NSW).
Daughter Khandalyce dead (found SA).
Man, charged with murder of Karlie Jade in prison.
This man has min. 3 names/aliases: DJH, DJM, DJB.
Karlie's cause of death unknown, severely injured upper body (consistent with stamped on), violent.
Khandalyce's cause of death unknown, very violent, under shocking conditions.
4 homes searched, one home belongs to man's sister, one home is in Charnwood.
After murder of Karlie Jade (14-30 days) murder of little Khandalyce by officially yet unknown person.
Identity fraud by unknown person/s for known time: family, bank, Centrelink.
Karlie Jade had $25.000 with her, when leaving Alice, allegly for buying/selling drugs.
Karlie Jade allegly was wanted by someone, who wanted her dead and set a bound of $5.000.
Karlie Jade - or only her bank card!! - was driving around North/South/East Australia, before her death and after her death.
Karlie Jade and Khandalyce had been seen 3 times: Police NT, acquaintance Shopping mall, Charnwood.
Khandalyce without Karlie Jade had been photographed at a car show.
A woman, former girlfriend of man in prison, now living in SA, had questioning by police officers.
Same woman had had a car crash, driver was man in prison, 2 of her children died, 1 survived.
The surviving child was a girl, also blonde and of same age as Khandalyce.
The woman was left paralysed after the crash; later she left one leg.
The woman and the man in prison separated after car crash, but came together sometimes later again.
When again separated, the man in prison had engagement with 16yo Teenager from Charnwood.
Before relationship with woman (car crash) the man in prison had a family with 2 daughters and 1 son.
At a certain time he paid child support for his daughters.
The man in prison has a former friend, who told media about the man's character.
The man in prison had several ABNs in different areas. Min. 1 company was founded unter the name of Karlie Pearce-Stevenson.
Wanted by police is an elderly man, who was seen min. 2 times near Wynarka with a suitcase.

This is how "fiction" can become fact. Not all that you have stated as "fact" is fact - it may be fact, but it could also be hearsay and rumours. And the "suitcase" man according to police, is now irrelevant - so he isn't "wanted" other than to tidy up loose ends. (It could be just the way you've worded it, but you made it sound like he is wanted by the police as a suspect).

 

[Panda]

BBM: These are not facts.

Karlie's cause of death has not been confirmed by police.

Police have not confirmed that Karlie had $25K to buy/sell drugs. They have only confirmed that a report to this effect was reported to Crimestoppers.

Police have not confirmed that there was a $5,000 bounty on Karlie's life.

It is not clear how many children DH has and it is not relevant here. Leave his children out of this discussion.

Police have never stated that the ABN in the name of Karlie Jade Stevenson was set up by DH.

I left out some of those - thanks Makara.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

BBM: These are not facts.

Karlie's cause of death has not been confirmed by police.

Police have not confirmed that Karlie had $25K to buy/sell drugs. They have only confirmed that a report to this effect was reported to Crimestoppers.

Police have not confirmed that there was a $5,000 bounty on Karlie's life.

It is not clear how many children DH has and it is not relevant here. Leave his children out of this discussion.

Police have never stated that the ABN in the name of Karlie Jade Stevenson was set up by DH.

Makara, sorry,
but I worked with full attention to your rules re. MSM.

For our purposes, "fact" refers to information published in mainstream media (MSM) or other acceptable sources, such as academic and professional publications.

I don't find the mistake, except that some people believe in news articles, some people do not, some believe half of the content. I'm trying to become an acceptable member, you can be sure.

bbm
I also stated no cause of death for Karlie (cause of death unknown).