Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #15 *Arrest*

[LinasK]

Kelsey Berreth’s tragic murder brought me to WS since I’m from nearby it interested, then Suzanne Morphew and evil BM

He was arrested today if you didn't know.

 

[LinasK]

Only as a possibility for literal English

Not when your mother is an English professor it doesn't. And we don't know that the grandmother didn't speak English. She could well have learned English or been bi-lingual.

 

[LinasK]

If you're convinced of guilt you'll see it everywhere.

The reality is that there are gaping issues in this case that are not easily dismissed. Before I get hounded, I'd say there are gaping issues with both her innocence and her guilt.

People convinced of her guilt skirt over some huge problems, like expecting her not to realise she couldn't kill 4/5 people and pass it off as an accident. The fact there was no gain for Erin, just likely more difficulties.

Then you consider what the prosecution has proven and what the jury doesnt have access to. They don't have the evidence of Simon's illness and they haven't proven that Erin couldn't have got as sick as them or that bulimia wouldn't have worked.

Don't forget, we're talking reasonable doubt, not whether they think she is innocent.

You keep ignoring that her "gain" isn't financial- it's revenge and having these people out of her life, since they wouldn't take her side and pressure their own son to agree with her. She wasn't thinking of her kids when she made the decision to poison them IMO. She also apparently didn't expect to get caught and think much of the aftermath. I think that they HAVE proved that Erin couldn't have gotten as sick or bulimia wouldn't have worked. It's too bad that Simon's illnesses couldn't be introduced.

 

[Woolly]

Please correct me if I am wrong. Didn't she say the mixture was too moist, and that is why she added dried mushrooms. MOO

She said the mixture was too bland, so she added some pungent dried mushrooms from the Tupperware, sprinkling some water on them first to rehydrate them.

 

[LinasK]

I'm usually reasonable at remaining impartial during the cases I follow, but I'm way past that point now. I had to stop reading about Colin Mandy's defence closing because it was making me feel both ill and angry.

In my opinion, Erin's actions and inactions paint a clear picture: She's a danger to society.
Not just (allegedly) plotting to kill five people, who all cared about her and showed her so much respect and love that she clearly didn't deserve.
But the way that she actively obstructed a health investigation, a police investigation, the way she stood up lied about it all on the stand, and in the process suggested that every single witness in that case were in fact lying themselves. Even her own two children!

Nothing is going to bring those kind folk back, and nothing is going to fill the void that's been left in the hearts and minds of Ian, Simon, the two kids, the rest of the family, and the community.
But at least if Erin is incarcerated, she'll be in position of being constantly watched and her ability to hurt others will be dramatically reduced. If she has to be in isolation for her own protection, even better. She won't be able to hurt other inmates. I really hope that justice is served.

And... if the Death Caps really were in the food supply, by obstructing and claiming not to remember which "Asian" grocery store she purchased them at.

 

[LinasK]

I'm not certain what happened by any stretch. The vast majority of people are going off 2 theories:

1) it was an accident

2) she planned to kill all 4 and probably 5 had Simon attended

I find issues with both of these that are extremely difficult to overcome. The top one requires a considerable amount of misfortune on the part of EP with a significant degree of lying.

I've explained many times my issues with number 2. It seems extremely illogical for a number of reasons nonemoreso than the lack of planning after the murder. I argue that there is a 3rd possibility:

3) she wanted to poison them but underestimated the effect it would have

The reason I find this appealing is because it covers a lot more of the problems that 1 and 2 have. It explains the lack of planning, the lack of motive etc whilst still explaining all of the lies and coincidences etc. I've also indicated that most of us suspect she actually did poison Simon a year earlier.

Of course like any theory there are issues. However, I find it easier to believe that EP underestimated the effect of DC than that she killed 4 people based on some pretty mild grievances and then didn't think she would be suspect number 1.

Mild grievances to you. To narcissist any slight is major and unforgiveable.

 

[LinasK]

I also think this is a critical piece of information that clearly points to guilt. IMO

Yes, if the Death Caps were visible, you'd have a much stronger case for it being an accident. The fact that she pulverized them to hide them and then used non-toxic mushrooms- to say "see it couldn't be the mushrooms in the dish", implies duplicity to me- just like any other poisoner watching their victims ingest the murder weapons themselves.

 

[Ellery84]

If she is found not guilty though, there’s no legal reason for her not to have access to the children. This is partly why I’m hoping she is found guilty.

The bar is pretty high for department of child safety. They run their own investigations independently of the police and the courts, and so they may have some parameters in place, should she be released and found not guilty.

Also, the kids are older now so may not be minors for too much longer - especially the son.

 

[CityKid]

There is something so sad about Gail (I think) baking a special orange cake for this luncheon and EP gobbling it up and puking it back that just hits me like a punch.

 

[LinasK]

There is something so sad about Gail (I think) baking a special orange cake for this luncheon and EP gobbling it up and puking it back that just hits me like a punch.

And the fact that Gail actually put so much love and effort into this dessert, when her own meal was poisoned.

 

[Scooby-Doo]

Justice Beale was also involved with the Borce Ristevski manslaughter of his wife



He said before he sentenced him to just nine years’ jail with a non-parole period of six years for his wife’s killing.

The maximum available sentence for the offence was 20 years.

This is why, time and time again, Australians feel their justice system is letting them down.



It's going to be interesting what happens with Erin Patterson

https://www.news.com.au/national/courts-law/no-justice-ristevski-sentence-proves-our-legal-system-is-letting-us-down/news-story/5c2ac82582f673ba444833e29a93926f

Major twist as Erin Patterson judge acts after tip-off about juror

The Erin Patterson trial has suffered a major setback with the loss of a juror mid-trial.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Monstradamus]

Justice Beale was also involved with the Borce Ristevski manslaughter of his wife



He said before he sentenced him to just nine years’ jail with a non-parole period of six years for his wife’s killing.

The maximum available sentence for the offence was 20 years.

This is why, time and time again, Australians feel their justice system is letting them down.



It's going to be interesting what happens with Erin Patterson



View attachment 596787


View attachment 596786

https://www.news.com.au/national/courts-law/no-justice-ristevski-sentence-proves-our-legal-system-is-letting-us-down/news-story/5c2ac82582f673ba444833e29a93926f

Major twist as Erin Patterson judge acts after tip-off about juror

The Erin Patterson trial has suffered a major setback with the loss of a juror mid-trial.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Luckily his sentence was increased through the Court of Appeal.

Borce Ristevski's 'deceit' and apparent lack of remorse over killing his wife noted as judges increase sentence

Melbourne man Borce Ristevski has his prison sentence increased from nine to 13 years for the 2016 manslaughter of his wife Karen, after a Court of Appeal ruling.

www.abc.net.au

If there is a guilty verdict for EP, and a short prison sentence hopefully that can be appealed also, imo.

 

[Jake18]

There is something so sad about Gail (I think) baking a special orange cake for this luncheon and EP gobbling it up and puking it back that just hits me like a punch.

I don’t think Erin vomited after the lunch. It’s another convenient lie. But it is so sad.

 

[Susjay]

Of course like any theory there are issues. However, I find it easier to believe that EP underestimated the effect of DC than that she killed 4 people based on some pretty mild grievances and then didn't think she would be suspect number 1.
find it easier to believe that EP underestimated the effect of DC than that she killed 4 people based on some pretty mild grievances and then didn't think she would be suspect number 1.

There is no way that she accidentally picked Death Caps, sorry.

Remember the accused said she just wanted to “look up death caps” on the intertube “to see if they grew in south Gippsland”. Think Rogers has argued the accused knew how they looked, what they were and what they did. She even looked up their presence in her local area.

 

[LinasK]

Remember the accused said she just wanted to “look up death caps” on the intertube “to see if they grew in south Gippsland”. Think Rogers has argued the accused knew how they looked, what they were and what they did. She even looked up their presence in her local area.

Which means she can identify which ones TO pick...

 

[Susjay]

even if Simon's 'illnesses' and his family's deaths were totally accidental, she's clearly on track for being named world's worst cook. I doubt she's going to find it easy to have a normal social life ever again even if found not guilty

Remember that Colin Mandy is claiming Erin's innocence. She couldn't possibly have any reason to kill her beloved family the she loved so dearly.

It does stand out for me that not one other person was called by defence to support the claims or arguments. It’s this absence of substance or verification. Defence offered no one who could verify Mandy’s and the Accused’s claims that she shared her family’s religious beliefs and had a deep connection and affection for them?

 

[Susjay]

This reminds me of "The Pirates of Penzance" - "Our revenge shall be swift and terrible!" Sorry, couldn't help myself!

Isn’t revenge a dish served best cold?
Soz, couldn't help it either!

 

[HoneyBunOne]

I'm not certain what happened by any stretch. The vast majority of people are going off 2 theories:

1) it was an accident

2) she planned to kill all 4 and probably 5 had Simon attended

I find issues with both of these that are extremely difficult to overcome. The top one requires a considerable amount of misfortune on the part of EP with a significant degree of lying.

I've explained many times my issues with number 2. It seems extremely illogical for a number of reasons nonemoreso than the lack of planning after the murder. I argue that there is a 3rd possibility:

3) she wanted to poison them but underestimated the effect it would have

The reason I find this appealing is because it covers a lot more of the problems that 1 and 2 have. It explains the lack of planning, the lack of motive etc whilst still explaining all of the lies and coincidences etc. I've also indicated that most of us suspect she actually did poison Simon a year earlier.

Of course like any theory there are issues. However, I find it easier to believe that EP underestimated the effect of DC than that she killed 4 people based on some pretty mild grievances and then didn't think she would be suspect number 1.

BBM
I think she tried #2 and had a "plan" as such, but it went awry. I can't recall what and where I read, but I believe just recently there has been a breakthrough in something like detecting death cap ingestion that Erin may not have been aware of. I think she was banking on the couples just feeling sick and camping by their respective bathrooms for a while. This phase, phase 1, occurs 6-24 hours after ingestion, so by Sat evening or Sun lunch time. A convenient time when it's hard to get in to see a GP if you were so inclined. You enter phase 2 after 12-36 hours (so potentially Sun morning through to Mon evening, depending on when phase 1 hits and how long it lasts), where you think you're getting better. No longer a need to see the doctor, and you'll think you just had some dodgy discount beef or something. Then phase 3 hits, sometime between 3-6 days after ingestion, and conveniently after your body has secreted any signs of death caps (Toxins are generally considered to stay in the urine for a couple of days and in blood for up to 36 hours). This is basically where your body dies from the inside out. If you rode out phases 1 and 2 at home, and phase 3 hit you hard and fast, you'd never even see a medical professional while alive. Even if you did seek medical attention then, you'd likely be in a bad way and the toxins are no longer found in blood or urine, so it would be a race against time to diagnose the issue and treat it.

Now I don't know any of the victims, but I wonder if Erin banked on them being sweet and nice and not wanting to bother anyone with their illness, especially if they thought it may be contagious. What I think Erin didn't bank on, was just how toxic her powder was. I think she was surprised by how hard and fast they went down. Maybe the maths wasn't mathing, or she just didn't factor in their potency in powdered form. A pretty big gamble, really, but one I think she made. I believe she thought that she would be considered the lucky one to survive, only to feel a bit sick and have a few extras poos, and it was all a tragic mistake. It could be deemed accidental food poisoning, and she could claim the discount beef from Woolies was the culprit instead of an imaginary Asian grocer.

MOO

Death Cap Mushroom Poisoning

Find out what you need to know about death cap mushroom poisoning, and discover how to identify it and what to do if you’ve been poisoned.

www.webmd.com

 

[BreakingNews]

Not when your mother is an English professor it doesn't. And we don't know that the grandmother didn't speak English. She could well have learned English or been bi-lingual.

Maybe because of her mother's academic English, she might have been taught to speak the Queen's English. And that leaves no doubt what the meaning is. <modsnip - off topic> Eg. Can you tell me what happened? The child replies 'yes'. They have answered your question. Juvie kids often get into trouble with the police over this. But they are simply answering the question. I have a son who was s a literal speaker, so I have learnt to be very clear with what I say.

 

[BreakingNews]

It does stand out for me that not one other person was called by defence to support the claims or arguments. It’s this absence of substance or verification. Defence offered no one who could verify Mandy’s and the Accused’s claims that she shared her family’s religious beliefs and had a deep connection and affection for them?

However the onus is on the prosecution to prove her guilt. It's not up to the defence to prove her innocence.