GUILTY Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 *Arrest* #17

[Two SCents]

Doesn’t that depend on what the actual charge is?

Presumption of Innocence | Rule of Law Education Centre

www.ruleoflaw.org.au

 

[potr]

Has it been said, why EP dehydrated the mushrooms, as roughly 50g would be enough of a DC mushroom to more than likely kill someone 70kgs (that’s just one good size mushroom). As dehydrated mushrooms as well as making them into a powder seems OTT. Unless she thought the powder wouldn’t be traceable within the body?

dehydrated - to preserve them - from april to july

 

[Susjay]

And allegedly had a history of self diagnosis of non-existent health conditions using Dr Google.
MOO

Accused’ dislike of hospitals might be linked to the fact that in hospital you’re not in control. More knowledgeable professionals are making decisions about patient care and the patient role is somewhat passive. Would not have gone down well.

 

[Bats]

So the foraged mushrooms had gone into the container ? How did they do that? She just erased HERSELF from the equation.

Not withstanding that there were probably never any Asian Market mushrooms to add them to anyway.

I was just stating what her testimony is.
And that is, that at the time of preparing the BW meal (her testimony is that) she did not consciously use foraged mushrooms.
You can make of it what you will but that is her testimony.

I think her recklessness is very relevant. I think it will be discussed for quite awhile, imo

Recklessness:
Requires a conscious awareness of a substantial risk and a deliberate decision to proceed despite that risk

As i pointed out above and going back to my earlier post regarding the preparation of the meal, how can it be "reckless" if she didn't consciously use foraged mushrooms?

If you think she did consciously use foraged, dc mushrooms (and i'm getting a subtle impression you may), then that's a whole lot more serious than being "reckless".

 

[Penny68]

Her main excuse was her daughter's ballet rehearsal bag had to be packed. That seems very trivial concerning the dire circumstances.

I too recall that being mentioned. But if my memory serves me well I am sure it was found out that the ballet rehearsal had actually been cancelled. Which of course Erin would have fully known about. That then was another lie she had told.

 

[Porky1]

Bingo IMO... I've always thought the timing of the lunch and the dehydrated mushrooms was interesting to say the least... Surely any doctor wouldnt suspect death cap poisoning right in the middle of Winter.... I think a lot of things after that didn't go to plan

That is an interesting point re middle of winter from a suspicion perspective.

 

[Jake18]

The not being ready to just leave everything and be admitted to hospital is something I would do.

If I turn up thinking I'll be going home afterwards and it's insisted they admit me, I'd be worried about things like needing to pick the kids up, make sure the house was secure and pick up a few needed things.

I think she had to really rely on herself when it came to the kids. I really think there wasn't anyone she could rely on.
I think she'd been on her own really, right from the beginning.

I'd worry that I hadn't set my house security up, lights etc and knowing me I'd be concerned that I hadn't locked all windows and doors, and then there's the dog.

There would very likely be things she would need if she was away from home, like any medications toothbrush etc.

EP it seems was quite alone and it doesn't make her a bad person.

Don’t forget Dr Rogers’ closing though, where she states that Erin turned up to hospital on the morning with a full back pack, and IIRC another bag. We haven’t seen the CCTV but the jury have.

A packed bag suggests she knew she’d be staying. Then she learns of the medical staff suspecting death caps and she leaves. She’s gone for 90 minutes. To - pack a ballet bag and lie on the floor for 45 min while her phone pings in Outtrim again.

I think she said she had to feed the dog as well - by then she’d got the kids ready and off to the bus stop. Who here has a pet that has its breakfast so late?

 

[Deleted member 194006]

The not being ready to just leave everything and be admitted to hospital is something I would do.

If I turn up thinking I'll be going home afterwards and it's insisted they admit me, I'd be worried about things like needing to pick the kids up, make sure the house was secure and pick up a few needed things.

I think she had to really rely on herself when it came to the kids. I really think there wasn't anyone she could rely on.
I think she'd been on her own really, right from the beginning.

I'd worry that I hadn't set my house security up, lights etc and knowing me I'd be concerned that I hadn't locked all windows and doors, and then there's the dog.

There would very likely be things she would need if she was away from home, like any medications toothbrush etc.

EP it seems was quite alone and it doesn't make her a bad person.

If you believe Erin’s versions of events (i.e., she went home to get everything prepared for an extended stay), I’m curious as to your interpretation of the following two pieces of evidence:

1. She brought a duffel bag with her to the hospital. To me, this implies that she did think it were likely that she would be staying at the hospital for an extended period of time. IMO.

2. The prosecution evidence shows that it doesn’t seem that Erin was at home for the whole 90 minutes as she suggests she was. See snipped quotes below. Do you think this evidence is incorrect?

“Dr Rogers then asked Mrs Patterson about mobile phone data research conducted by digital forensic scientist, Professor Matthew Sorell, producing the “most consistent explanation” that Erin drove down the Bass Highway, south out of Leongatha, towards Outtrim, between 8.55am and 9.45am.”

“Rogers said analysis from Dr Sorell indicated Patterson possibly drove along the Bass Highway, which leads southwest out of Leongatha, after leaving the hospital. Rogers said the mobile phone data contradicts Patterson’s account that she went straight home and no where else after leaving the hospital and later returning.”

 

[Porky1]

I just can't get onboard with the theory she just wanted them to get sick.

She fed them DEATH CAPS---one of the most toxic natural substances known to man.

And she weighed them out. And powdered them to disguise them. And meticulously crafted 6 separate BW's. So she knew how much poison was in each serving. Way more than necessary to make one just feel unwell.

I know, and I agree to a point.

One dc is enough to kill a healthy adult but she may not have intended to use 50g, maybe she was intending to use, say 10g per person. It’s possible drying and using powdered is likely to be intensified both from flavour and the toxin, as heat doesn’t diminish its toxicity.

 

[Scooby-Doo]

Respectfully, she does not have to prove her innocence. The prosecution has to prove she intentionally used DC to kill. Is she saying she did it unknowingly? Maybe she didn't mean for them to die? Only meant to make them sick. To me, that would be manslaughter. Wonder what legal grounds the judge used to take manslaughter off the table? Anyone have any ideas?

The defence didn’t show any evidence of her interest in edible mushroom foraging.

If you were generally into it, why wouldn’t you have a book, some forum posts, or a history of googling edible mushroom pics? Nothing.

In contrast, the prosecution was able to show evidence of web searches for death cap mushrooms specifically.

This is what makes no sense to me if it’s just an innocent mistake.

She didn’t go searching for DEATH cap mushrooms for nothing…

Obviously, the first thing a guilty person would do is throw away evidence.

I personally think the prosecution has done enough through evidence to find her guilty

 

[SarahSherlock]

If she has a dog one would think they might give it some of the leftovers if only a small amount - instead of throwing it out. Unless you knew it would harm your dog?

 

[Porky1]

I too recall that being mentioned. But if my memory serves me well I am sure it was found out that the ballet rehearsal had actually been cancelled. Which of course Erin would have fully known about. That then was another lie she had told.

Wasn’t the flying lesson cancelled?

 

[Penny68]

Wasn’t the flying lesson cancelled?

Might have been, yes!.
Just I am pretty sure of the cancelled ballet rehearsal. I wish I could find that now though.

 

[Kemug]

Respectfully, she does not have to prove her innocence. The prosecution has to prove she intentionally used DC to kill. Is she saying she did it unknowingly? Maybe she didn't mean for them to die? Only mereant to make them sick. To me, that would be manslaughter. Wonder what legal grounds the judge used to take manslaughter off the table? Anyone have any ideas?

No, she doesn't have to prove her innocence of course. But in a way she does. To her family and friends, the families and friends of the deceased, the families and friends of her children's friends, the neighbours, the community, etc. Probably a lot of them have opinions. If I had the energy, I might start to make a list of all the people, past and present, who have been found legally "not guilty" - but then what?

 

[Porky1]

.

2. The prosecution evidence shows that it doesn’t seem that Erin was at home for the whole 90 minutes as she suggests she was. See snipped quotes below. Do you think this evidence is incorrect?

“Dr Rogers then asked Mrs Patterson about mobile phone data research conducted by digital forensic scientist, Professor Matthew Sorell, producing the “most consistent explanation” that Erin drove down the Bass Highway, south out of Leongatha, towards Outtrim, between 8.55am and 9.45am.”

“Rogers said analysis from Dr Sorell indicated Patterson possibly drove along the Bass Highway, which leads southwest out of Leongatha, after leaving the hospital. Rogers said the mobile phone data contradicts Patterson’s account that she went straight home and no where else after leaving the hospital and later returning.”

I’ve found some discrepancies in the mobile data. I’ve dismissed it. I recall Dr Sorrel mentioning that it’s possible she simply went to her back veranda (or visa versa) and she connected to a different tower or that a tower was down and she connected to another tower. He wasn’t confident that the pings definitely placed her in those areas at those times. I also don’t recall that the tower uptime reports were shared.

I was looking forward to Dr Sorells evidence but I was left disappointed, not just for this trial, but also Samantha Murphy’s trial later this year.

 

[Scuffy35]

"Erin says she now believes foraged mushrooms may have made their way into the lunch due to a mistake about the contents of a tupperware container in her pantry"​

Oh my, look at the wording above^^^^----"... the mushrooms may have made their way into the lunch? "
How do mushrooms make their way into the meal?
Another quote from EP:
"I was starting to think: what if they’d gone in the container with the Chinese mushrooms? Maybe that had happened."
'... what if they'd gone into the container' with the Chinese mushrooms?

Have I ever seen a sentence with less personal accountability, ever?

So the foraged mushrooms had gone into the container ? How did they do that? She just erased HERSELF from the equation.

Not withstanding that there were probably never any Asian Market mushrooms to add them to anyway.

​

Erin Patterson says estranged husband asked her about poisoning his parents — as it happened

Erin Patterson is giving evidence for a third day in her triple-murder trial in Morwell. She's accused of murdering three relatives by serving them a meal that contained poisonous mushrooms. Look back at how Wednesday's hearing unfolded in our live blog.

www.abc.net.au

By Judd Boaz​

Erin tells the court the accusation from Simon triggered her to reflect on the lunch.

"It caused me to do a lot of thinking about a lot of things," she says.

"I was starting to think: what if they’d gone in the container with the Chinese mushrooms? Maybe that had happened."

She tells the court it made her feel scared and worried because child protection was now involved.

Erin tells the court that knowing child protection workers were on their way to her home, she decided to throw out her dehydrator.

She says she was worried she would be blamed for making her lunch guests sick, so went to dispose the dehydrator at the Koonwarra tip.
Erin Patterson says estranged husband asked her about poisoning his parents — as it happened



OK, let's look at this^^^ in context---she was NOT saying that she taste tested the DC mushrooms she served her lunch guests. Here is the full context of that^^^ quote:

Ms Patterson told the court she had developed an interest in wild mushrooms in early 2020 when she and her children would go for walks at the Korumburra Botanic Gardens and surrounding areas during lockdown.

"It was a process over several months in the lead-up to it, but when I got to a point where I was confident about what I thought they were … I cut a bit off one of the mushrooms, fried it up with some butter, ate it, and then saw what happened," she said.

{so this story about last testing was described as happening in 2020 when she taste tested some. ----She was not referring to the DC that she served to her in-laws.]


I think her recklessness is very relevant. I think it will be discussed for quite awhile, imo.

I think the theory of her recklessness only will be dicussed to a significant degree after the verdict if she is found not-guilty.

 

[Deleted member 363451]

"Erin says she now believes foraged mushrooms may have made their way into the lunch due to a mistake about the contents of a tupperware container in her pantry"
Erin Patterson says estranged husband asked her about poisoning his parents — as it happened


"It was a process over several months in the lead-up to it, but when I got to a point where I was confident about what I thought they were … I cut a bit off one of the mushrooms, fried it up with some butter, ate it, and then saw what happened," she said.
Erin Patterson tells jury she accepts death cap mushrooms were in meal


Yes, the context around my question of recklessness is lost and has long passed now. No relevance at all, to the above.

"Erin says she now believes foraged mushrooms may have made their way into the lunch due to a mistake about the contents of a tupperware container in her pantry"

Yes, the mushrooms made their own way into the lunch....

 

[Porky1]

If she has a dog one would think they might give it some of the leftovers if only a small amount - instead of throwing it out. Unless you knew it would harm your dog?

I’ve thrown steaks out many times over the years as I wouldn’t give anything to my dogs with traces of mushrooms. They were considered poisonous.

 

[Procrastinator]

Might have been, yes!.
Just I am pretty sure of the cancelled ballet rehearsal. I wish I could find that now though.

A clip from Sentinel-Times 6July2025 (link below) ...

"Mr Mandy also addressed claims made by the prosecution that the Patterson’s daughter did not have a ballet lesson on Monday night, July 31, 2023, for which Mrs Patterson claimed she had to leave the Leongatha Hospital to pack a ballet bag.

According to Mrs Patterson, there actually was a special extra lesson scheduled that evening for the mid-year concert.

Mr Mandy produced a message recovered from Simon Patterson's phone indicating that he had contacted the local ballet school and cancelled the lesson as Mrs Patterson had asked him to do.

Erin Patterson started to cry in the witness box while answering questions about her daughter’s ballet schedule.

She also cried while answering questions about not wanting her son to miss out on his flying lesson on the Sunday after the beef Wellington lunch."

Case all wrapped up in triple ‘mushroom’ murder trial - South Gippsland Sentinel Times

AFTER five days of cross-examination and a gruelling eight days in total in the witness stand, it was all over for Erin Patterson just before lunch on Day 31, Thursday, June 12. It was a significant moment in the so-called “Mushroom Murder...

www.sgst.com.au

 

[Deleted member 363451]

Maybe she had plans to start a home birthing business, given her fear of hospitals. She enrolled in Nursing & Midwifery.