Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, NSW, 12 Sep 2014 - #68

[FromGermany1]

Did we ever search for a stone colored BMW in our whole "mess" of cars? (I stumbled over it re RD at the Tennis court.)

 

[SLouTh]

Did we ever search for a stone colored BMW in our whole "mess" of cars?

No, not to my knowledge From Germany 1 ..... So many other cars, but never a BMW.... and none described as "stone" in color.

I am quite surprised RD (Richard, not Robert) has been discussed here, as he is not currently named as a suspect or POI by Police.

IMO

 

[Travelling Wilbury]

Are you thinking she buried her top after she spoke with Constable Rowley?

Its probably 1 line of investigation that’s continuing.
The fact that police released cctv still footage of the FP’s at maccas the day before he went missing, then released pics of a red/pink shirt-like material and black pant-like material near to what she was wearing, could be an investigative tactic IMO. In the video walk through it shows a clothesline in the background with none of these items hanging there.
This is why small parts of evidence form part of a larger picture.

<modsnip>

 

[JLZ]

No, not to my knowledge From Germany 1 ..... So many other cars, but never a BMW.... and none described as "stone" in color.

I am quite surprised RD has been discussed here, as he is not currently named as a suspect or POI by Police.

IMO

BBM. Speaking for myself, I used his full name so as not to confuse him with the POI of similar name. I think what DM did linking his time discrepancy with the other two, the photographs of William and the tennis club CCTV, was unreasonable.

 

[SouthAussie]

Its probably 1 line of investigation that’s continuing.
The fact that police released cctv still footage of the FP’s at maccas the day before he went missing, then released pics of a red/pink shirt-like material and black pant-like material near to what she was wearing, could be an investigative tactic IMO. In the video walk through it shows a clothesline in the background with none of these items hanging there.
This is why small parts of evidence form part of a larger picture.

<modsnip>

<modsnip: Quoted post was modsnipped>
We discussed this faded red fabric further back, and some of us think that it is a heavier fabric ... possibly something from a horse accessory like a feedbag or the like.

I saw a pic (again) yesterday of an officer carrying a replica of the Spiderman suit at the most recent search site. I think their hopes likely were that they would find something of William's clothing. Perhaps they have already scrutinised the FF clothes from the relevant time period, so were focusing on the possibility of finding Spiderman suit fabric. And perhaps not.


"Two pieces of degraded material were found at the search site yesterday afternoon, with officers seen comparing the pieces to samples of a red and blue Spider-Man suit – the same outfit William was wearing when he vanished."
https://www.news.com.au/national/ns...d/news-story/47586f06aa48ca5bdffe3777ee5fcfcb

 

[SLouTh]

BBM. Speaking for myself, I used his full name so as not to confuse him with the POI of similar name. I think what DM did linking his time discrepancy with the other two, the photographs of William and the tennis club CCTV, was unreasonable.

Yes and Thanks JLZ you gave me time to "edit" the confusion ......

 

[Couldbe]

<modsnip: Quoted post was modsnipped>
We discussed this faded red fabric further back, and some of us think that it is a heavier fabric ... possibly something from a horse accessory like a feedbag or the like.

I saw a pic (again) yesterday of an officer carrying a replica of the Spiderman suit at the most recent search site. I think their hopes likely were that they would find something of William's clothing. Perhaps they have already scrutinised the FF clothes from the relevant time period, so were focusing on the possibility of finding Spiderman suit fabric. And perhaps not.


"Two pieces of degraded material were found at the search site yesterday afternoon, with officers seen comparing the pieces to samples of a red and blue Spider-Man suit – the same outfit William was wearing when he vanished."
https://www.news.com.au/national/ns...d/news-story/47586f06aa48ca5bdffe3777ee5fcfcb

Previous discussion on the faded red / pink fabric found by the searchers was not able to resolve this (There are probably still those who believe it to be faded red, and those who believe it to be pink). No doubt, LE would have been able to have access to a 'cloth Expert' to determine the fabric texture and colour, etc.
Currently, we are not privy to the results of LE evidence which was bagged and taken for further investigation.
What we are able to do though is to explore angles of trying to determine, from details we can access, some actual facts which can be pieced together.
If LE did / or did not find evidence of William's existence there (clothing, bone fragment,dna or the like) then other useful evidence found may be usefully connected in some way. JMO

 

[Limaes]

Previous discussion on the faded red / pink fabric found by the searchers was not able to resolve this (There are probably still those who believe it to be faded red, and those who believe it to be pink). No doubt, LE would have been able to have access to a 'cloth Expert' to determine the fabric texture and colour, etc.
Currently, we are not privy to the results of LE evidence which was bagged and taken for further investigation.
What we are able to do though is to explore angles of trying to determine, from details we can access, some actual facts which can be pieced together.
If LE did / or did not find evidence of William's existence there (clothing, bone fragment,dna or the like) then other useful evidence found may be usefully connected in some way. JMO

Yes, they have stated early in the latest Kendall search that they won't be releasing any results of testing of items found. Therefore we shouldn't assume no news means no evidence.

JMO

 

[Blues Clues]

Its probably 1 line of investigation that’s continuing.
The fact that police released cctv still footage of the FP’s at maccas the day before he went missing, then released pics of a red/pink shirt-like material and black pant-like material near to what she was wearing, could be an investigative tactic IMO. In the video walk through it shows a clothesline in the background with none of these items hanging there.
This is why small parts of evidence form part of a larger picture.

I’m to be honest confused as to why not everyone shares the good sentiments that they’re finding new things. Isn’t all our end goal to find out what happened to William?

The CCTV footage from McDonalds was released by the Coroner and the pics from the search were taken by media who were allowed access to the search site by the police. I don't see a tactical connection in those two events IMO

William Tyrrell captured on CCTV just one day before disappearance - ABC News

In answer to a question from the media during the 2nd press conference given by DCS Bennett, he was asked if they find something highly relevant will we know?.... (his answer is from 3:20) It has been 4mths, I don't know how long forensics take but that seems like quite an amount of time IMO

"In terms of finding something of high significance, it'll be reported up appropriately and I imagine you'll be informed straight away."

Facebook Watch

I've seen hundreds, maybe thousands get their hopes up when Rosann 'appear' to be onto something, only for it to lead nowhere. At this point the 'new things' haven't been announced as evidence of anything, let alone connected to what happened to William.
Detectives follow the evidence to reach a conclusion. They don't decide on a conclusion and then look for evidence to fit that conclusion. The risk of doing so means ignoring evidence to the contrary and potentially a wrongful conviction.
What we currently have are theories, allegations and charges still to be tested by a court of law. That's not enough for me to 'share good sentiments about the new things found' or get my hopes up that we are getting any closer to finding out what happened to William. IMO

 

[SLouTh]

Timeline Question : When did FM take the drive to Batar Creek Road??? As far as the Riding School???

What are your thoughts on when this occurred given the timeline as we know it?????

Sorry for such a long post but I wanted to include a referenced timeline
=========================================================================

Foster Mother admits she drove to Batar Creek Road as far as the Riding School ..... (Video in this link)

The footage of the walk-through was played while the foster mother was giving evidence at the 2019 inquest into William's disappearance and presumed death.
William Tyrrell's foster mother gives her version of what happened at the home where he disappeared | Daily Mail Online

=========================================================================

A critical 96-minute window between when William Tyrrell’s foster dad drove to the shops and police arrived at the scene the day the three-year-old disappeared could hold the key to solving the baffling case.
Mobile phone records have shown that William’s foster father left his mother-in-law’s home in Kendall at 9.30am on Friday, September 12, 2014.
William Tyrrell latest news, theories: Grandmother loses hope | news.com.au — Australia’s leading news site

=========================================================================

Detective Sergeant Laura Beacroft told the inquest last month she put the time William vanished between 10.05am and 10.20am.
William Tyrrell: Mystery over photo throws doubt on timeline of boy’s disappearance | news.com.au — Australia’s leading news site

=========================================================================

He (FF) had a prescription filled at a chemist there at 10.19am.

He (FF) sent a text to his wife about that time to say he'd be home in five minutes.
William Tyrrell inquest: foster father says he searched everywhere | Port Macquarie News | Port Macquarie, NSW (portnews.com.au)
William Tyrrell inquest: search began with hope he would be found | Illawarra Mercury | Wollongong, NSW

FF arrives home about 10:30hrs .... as per inquest ...

=========================================================================

Then after searching up and down the street and all around the house, she (FM) decided to call police.
The inquest also heard from neighbour Anne Marie Sharpley, who was the first to help William’s foster mother search for him.
William Tyrrell Inquest: Foster mother thought someone has taken him (9news.com.au)

No mention of taking a drive during that time....

FF tells FM to call the Police ....
(20+) Watch | Facebook (ACA Chanel 9 Video)

=========================================================================

000 Call made at 10:56am

His foster mother reported him missing at 10:56am
WATCH LIVE: NSW Police Strike Force Rosann announce further searches for missing boy William Tyrrell | Sky News Australia

“We’ve been looking for him now for about 15 or 20 minutes but I thought it could be five or it could be longer because he was just playing here and we heard him and then we heard nothing,” William’s mother told the operator when asked how long he had been missing during audio released by NSW Police today.
William Tyrrell disappearance: Police release mother’s Triple Zero call | The Advertiser (adelaidenow.com.au)

Assuming "We've" means FM, AMS and FGM

Its actually been approx 26mins since FF arrived home by this time..... (Plus additional searching time with AMS, up and down the street..)

===================================================================

Police arrived at the home at 11.06am
William Tyrrell latest news, theories: Grandmother loses hope | news.com.au — Australia’s leading news site

=========================================================================

So when does the "drive down to the Riding School" appear to fit in this timeline????

AMS and FF have not mentioned the "drive" in their evidence at the inquest, that I am aware of????

Interested to know your thoughts on this, or if anyone has found evidence on when this drive actually occurred to add to the timeline???
All thoughts respectfully accepted.

ALL IMO

 

[JLZ]

After MFC gets home, after rousing AMS, she's dithering about whether to keep searching in the direction of Batar Creek Road or whether to call police. She decides to call police and returns to FGM's. I suggest she changes her mind again and gets in the car instead, drives a little way before going back to the thought that she has to call the police.

 

[SLouTh]

What are your thoughts on when this occurred given the timeline as we know it?????

Only fair, I guess that I tell you my own thoughts.....

I personally think the drive occurred before FM walked the street and got help from AMS.....

My own first thought would probably be jump in a car and look, as it is faster than walking..... especially as Benaroon Drive has acreage / large blocks in a rural area ...... If I couldn't find easily find (William), by doing a quick drive, then I would search more thoroughly on foot and ask for help...

Another reason I think the drive occurred prior to asking for help, and prior to FF arriving home, is that FM took FGM's car. My own first option would be to use a car I am familiar with ..... and if it wasn't available, (FF not home as yet with 4WD), then, use the other car (FGM's) that was there and available....

Another reason the 4WD would be my first option / car of choice in this situation, is that you can see a lot more sitting up high, as in a 4WD, than in a small car like FGM's Mazda.

As neither AMS or FF mentioned the drive at the inquest, then I don't think either of them knew FM had taken the drive.... hence before getting help...

All IMO

 

[drsleuth]

Its probably 1 line of investigation that’s continuing.
The fact that police released cctv still footage of the FP’s at maccas the day before he went missing, then released pics of a red/pink shirt-like material and black pant-like material near to what she was wearing, could be an investigative tactic IMO. In the video walk through it shows a clothesline in the background with none of these items hanging there.
This is why small parts of evidence form part of a larger picture.

I’m to be honest confused as to why not everyone shares the good sentiments that they’re finding new things. Isn’t all our end goal to find out what happened to William?

I wouldn't expect the clothes to be on the line IMO

 

[SLouTh]

After MFC gets home, after rousing AMS, she's dithering about whether to keep searching in the direction of Batar Creek Road or whether to call police. She decides to call police and returns to FGM's. I suggest she changes her mind again and gets in the car instead, drives a little way before going back to the thought that she has to call the police.

Change of mind about calling the Police is a good thought ..... I hadn't thought of that ....
imo

 

[Awakening]

Timeline Question : When did FM take the drive to Batar Creek Road??? As far as the Riding School???

What are your thoughts on when this occurred given the timeline as we know it?????

Sorry for such a long post but I wanted to include a referenced timeline
=========================================================================

Foster Mother admits she drove to Batar Creek Road as far as the Riding School ..... (Video in this link)

The footage of the walk-through was played while the foster mother was giving evidence at the 2019 inquest into William's disappearance and presumed death.
William Tyrrell's foster mother gives her version of what happened at the home where he disappeared | Daily Mail Online

=========================================================================

A critical 96-minute window between when William Tyrrell’s foster dad drove to the shops and police arrived at the scene the day the three-year-old disappeared could hold the key to solving the baffling case.
Mobile phone records have shown that William’s foster father left his mother-in-law’s home in Kendall at 9.30am on Friday, September 12, 2014.
William Tyrrell latest news, theories: Grandmother loses hope | news.com.au — Australia’s leading news site

=========================================================================

Detective Sergeant Laura Beacroft told the inquest last month she put the time William vanished between 10.05am and 10.20am.
William Tyrrell: Mystery over photo throws doubt on timeline of boy’s disappearance | news.com.au — Australia’s leading news site

=========================================================================

He (FF) had a prescription filled at a chemist there at 10.19am.

He (FF) sent a text to his wife about that time to say he'd be home in five minutes.
William Tyrrell inquest: foster father says he searched everywhere | Port Macquarie News | Port Macquarie, NSW (portnews.com.au)
William Tyrrell inquest: search began with hope he would be found | Illawarra Mercury | Wollongong, NSW

FF arrives home about 10:30hrs .... as per inquest ...

=========================================================================

Then after searching up and down the street and all around the house, she (FM) decided to call police.
The inquest also heard from neighbour Anne Marie Sharpley, who was the first to help William’s foster mother search for him.
William Tyrrell Inquest: Foster mother thought someone has taken him (9news.com.au)

No mention of taking a drive during that time....

FF tells FM to call the Police ....
(20+) Watch | Facebook (ACA Chanel 9 Video)

=========================================================================

000 Call made at 10:56am

His foster mother reported him missing at 10:56am
WATCH LIVE: NSW Police Strike Force Rosann announce further searches for missing boy William Tyrrell | Sky News Australia

“We’ve been looking for him now for about 15 or 20 minutes but I thought it could be five or it could be longer because he was just playing here and we heard him and then we heard nothing,” William’s mother told the operator when asked how long he had been missing during audio released by NSW Police today.
William Tyrrell disappearance: Police release mother’s Triple Zero call | The Advertiser (adelaidenow.com.au)

Assuming "We've" means FM, AMS and FGM

Its actually been approx 26mins since FF arrived home by this time..... (Plus additional searching time with AMS, up and down the street..)

===================================================================

Police arrived at the home at 11.06am
William Tyrrell latest news, theories: Grandmother loses hope | news.com.au — Australia’s leading news site

=========================================================================

So when does the "drive down to the Riding School" appear to fit in this timeline????

AMS and FF have not mentioned the "drive" in their evidence at the inquest, that I am aware of????

Interested to know your thoughts on this, or if anyone has found evidence on when this drive actually occurred to add to the timeline???
All thoughts respectfully accepted.

ALL IMO

Aside from the recent charges, AVO and naming of FM as a POI, this drive is really the only thing that makes me suspicious. Other things commonly raised, I can find reasonable explanations for.

It's this drive, and her description of the truck driver who saw her on this road, that got me into this case.

Now this is JMOO, but I cannot see that she mentioned this to police or during the 000 call until that walk through interview 6 days later.

If you look up news articles prior to 2019 (when the coroner released the walk through video) there is no mention of this drive or encounter with the truck driver at all.

Maybe she did tell someone on the first day and we just don't know about it, but if she didn't tell anyone that day, then I personally can't come up with a reasonable explanation for that. I don't believe you would forget you took your mother's car out to check along the road IMO.

 

[Awakening]

Only fair, I guess that I tell you my own thoughts.....

I personally think the drive occurred before FM walked the street and got help from AMS.....

My own first thought would probably be jump in a car and look, as it is faster than walking..... especially as Benaroon Drive has acreage / large blocks in a rural area ...... If I couldn't find easily find (William), by doing a quick drive, then I would search more thoroughly on foot and ask for help...

Another reason I think the drive occurred prior to asking for help, and prior to FF arriving home, is that FM took FGM's car. My own first option would be to use a car I am familiar with ..... and if it wasn't available, (FF not home as yet with 4WD), then, use the other car (FGM's) that was there and available....

Another reason the 4WD would be my first option / car of choice in this situation, is that you can see a lot more sitting up high, as in a 4WD, than in a small car like FGM's Mazda.

As neither AMS or FF mentioned the drive at the inquest, then I don't think either of them knew FM had taken the drive.... hence before getting help...

All IMO

I have come to the same conclusion as Slouth. That the drive was before AMS or FF.

It makes sense, that if he's not in the immediate area, take the car and check he hasn't walked there, particularly with the risk of being hit by a car.

But it doesn't make sense to me if she didn't tell anyone this on the day.

 

[JLZ]

Another reason I think the drive occurred prior to asking for help, and prior to FF arriving home, is that FM took FGM's car. My own first option would be to use a car I am familiar with ..... and if it wasn't available, (FF not home as yet with 4WD), then, use the other car (FGM's) that was there and available....

That's a good point.

Something is brushing against my memory, about which of the foster parents normally drove? Discussed in the context of FFC being familiar or not with the surrounding streets? I wonder if she really wasn't comfortable handling the 4WD.

 

[Serenanicole]

H

BBM. Speaking for myself, I used his full name so as not to confuse him with the POI of similar name. I think what DM did linking his time discrepancy with the other two, the photographs of William and the tennis club CCTV, was unreasonable.

Hey JLZ sorry if I am asking a silly question … I’m not sure of your reference DM? Would you mind elaborating - sorry!

 

[Travelling Wilbury]

H

Hey JLZ sorry if I am asking a silly question … I’m not sure of your reference DM? Would you mind elaborating - sorry!

Daily Mail I think?

I was wondering what AMS was?

 

[Serenanicole]

No

I wouldn't expect the clothes to be on the line IMO

,
No not if the washing machine was not working