Australia Australia - William Tyrrell Disappeared While Playing in Yard - Kendall (NSW) #79

[SouthAussie]

There was mention of a neighbours car that was similar to foster dads. Does anyone know what neighbour the podcast was referring to or what car the fosters had?

IIRC Paul Savage's car looked similar. I think he had a white or grey/silver 4WD. There was a photo of it somewhere back in the threads, but I can't find it now. I think maybe we saw it on Google streetview, back in the day. Or maybe it was a photo of the police search of his place.

From memory his vehicle had one of those covers that extend over the back (boot) section. Or we speculated about it. I remember discussion about whether the police looked under there, when William disappeared.
His wife's (maroon coloured) vehicle was parked in the carport that day, as was their campervan, so we presumed that PS' vehicle was parked in their driveway. (I just looked back over some past discussion.)

FP's car was a new green-grey coloured 2014 Land Rover Discovery. Link

imo

 

[Chrissy74]

Dan says that Paul Savage was outside packing his car (presumably for the trip he was going to - but didn't - make that day to stay with his brother) - which is something I hadn't heard or thought about before. From about the 56 min mark in the podcast, where Dan is saying that William's sister said William went to look for daddy's car.

And this is interesting ... Dan and his crew have been working on a parallel investigation. One which they will speak of in this podcast in the future. About things that have happened on the mid-north coast. Things that Dan can't believe haven't been made public. Some of the things, Dan has found to be quite shocking. From about the 58 min mark in the podcast.

What Now? | 11 - Witness: William Tyrrell

The investigation comes to a stop, and the police commissioner speaks out. Witness: William Tyrrell is the new, landmark investigation from news.com.au. Read more and watch exclusive video content here Follow us on socials: Instagram: @newscomauhq Facebook: News.com.au TikTok: @news.com.au...

omny.fm

That’s interesting SthAussie. PS was packing his car with the intention of going to see his brother in Casino. So it seems PS wife Heather drove her car to bingo that morning. As discussed in earlier threads it’s been said that PS wife drove a maroon coloured car. Peter the truck driver sees a maroon coloured car (old 80s bmw) drive past him on Batar Crk Rd as he was leaving. He was seen leaving Kendall at 10:39 (cctv tennis club) so that confirms the 10:35 time Heather left home as it takes roughly 2min to get to Cobb n Co from Benaroon Dr and another 4min to get from Cobb n Co Rd to Comboyne St. FF claims to have sent a text to fm at 10:30 and arrived home at 10:35. If that were true then why wasn’t ff car seen by Peter as he left CnC around 10:35? We know CCTV from the tennis court captures ff car drive out of Kendall but no reports on seeing his car on cctv coming back into Kendall. If cctv captured Peter’s time of arrival and departure then surely it captured ff car not only leaving but returning as well. Other than the text message ff claims to have sent but was strangely deleted, what evidence is there to confirm ff arrival in Kendall at 10:30? I’m not accusing the ff of anything as LE have confirmed the only poi at present is the fm. But if L tells police she saw W running to daddy’s car and from all the evidence we now know W disappeared closer to 10am, does this mean ff arrived home some time closer to 10am and not 10:35?
there’s no evidence corroborating fm drive and there’s no evidence confirming ff time of arrival but there is evidence of cars in and around that street at those times, so the evidence speaks for itself.

 

[drsleuth]

IIRC Paul Savage's car looked similar. I think he had a white or grey/silver 4WD. There was a photo of it somewhere back in the threads, but I can't find it now. I think maybe we saw it on Google streetview, back in the day. Or maybe it was a photo of the police search of his place.

PS had a white Mitsubishi Pajero.

HS had a Maroon Ford Falcon

From memory his vehicle had one of those covers that extend over the back (boot) section. Or we speculated about it. I remember discussion about whether the police looked under there, when William disappeared.
His wife's (maroon coloured) vehicle was parked in the carport that day, as was their campervan, so we presumed that PS' vehicle was parked in their driveway. (I just looked back over some past discussion.)

FP's car was a new green-grey coloured 2014 Land Rover Discovery. Link

imo

PS was asked at the inquest about a parcel shelf in his car.

 

[SouthAussie]

As discussed in earlier threads it’s been said that PS wife drove a maroon coloured car. Peter the truck driver sees a maroon coloured car (old 80s bmw) drive past him on Batar Crk Rd as he was leaving.

As per drsleuth's post above, Heather Savage's car was a maroon Ford Falcon - not a dark coloured BMW.

 

[Chrissy74]

As per drsleuth's post above, Heather Savage's car was a maroon Ford Falcon - not a dark coloured BMW.

I googled burgandy or dark red series 5 BMW 84/85 model (as per DrSleuths earlier post) and burgundy ford falcon and the similarities are uncanny. One could easily be mistaken for the other. What’s not mistaken is the time the car was seen by Peter which ties in with the time Heather left home. No doubt cctv can confirm Hesthers drive out of Kendall and what car she was driving and if there was a discrepancy in Heathers statement to police and what was captured on cctv I’m certain LE would have investigated this further.
Back to my point on the time ff arrived back to Kendall. What evidence if any, do police have to confirm his 10:35am time? Dan Box seems to think L statement about daddy’s car is relevant but we don’t know how relevant Ls statement is as it was played to the coroner in a closed court. GJ also seems to think Ls statement is credible and considering he led the investigation for the first 4 yrs, he must have had a very good reason to suspect what L said was true stating she was the last person to see W alive.

 

[Wexford]

Yes will be very interesting to hear what they have found.

Mid North Coast has featured a number of times in the press and more specifically Kendall over the last few years. I would hazard a guess at one of those incidents/arrests is what they are following up on.

 

[JLZ]

That’s interesting SthAussie. PS was packing his car with the intention of going to see his brother in Casino. So it seems PS wife Heather drove her car to bingo that morning. As discussed in earlier threads it’s been said that PS wife drove a maroon coloured car. Peter the truck driver sees a maroon coloured car (old 80s bmw) drive past him on Batar Crk Rd as he was leaving. He was seen leaving Kendall at 10:39 (cctv tennis club) so that confirms the 10:35 time Heather left home as it takes roughly 2min to get to Cobb n Co from Benaroon Dr and another 4min to get from Cobb n Co Rd to Comboyne St. FF claims to have sent a text to fm at 10:30 and arrived home at 10:35. If that were true then why wasn’t ff car seen by Peter as he left CnC around 10:35? We know CCTV from the tennis court captures ff car drive out of Kendall but no reports on seeing his car on cctv coming back into Kendall. If cctv captured Peter’s time of arrival and departure then surely it captured ff car not only leaving but returning as well. Other than the text message ff claims to have sent but was strangely deleted, what evidence is there to confirm ff arrival in Kendall at 10:30? I’m not accusing the ff of anything as LE have confirmed the only poi at present is the fm. But if L tells police she saw W running to daddy’s car and from all the evidence we now know W disappeared closer to 10am, does this mean ff arrived home some time closer to 10am and not 10:35?
there’s no evidence corroborating fm drive and there’s no evidence confirming ff time of arrival but there is evidence of cars in and around that street at those times, so the evidence speaks for itself.

The tennis club camera's corrected time for Peter leaving Kendall (going back towards Kew) is 10:53. I think you're saying it's 4 minutes between Cobb & Co and Comboyne St; that would mean he left Cobb & Co at 10:49, by which time MFC would have been back at FGM's for nearly 15 minutes. Even if it's 7 minutes between Cobb & Co and Comboyne St, Peter would have left Cobb & Co at 10:46, and MFC is already at FGM's before Peter even gets back in his truck. Peter would not have seen Heather on Batar Creek Road because they were travelling in the same direction, and also because the times don't match.

The thing with MFC's times, he does have receipts for being at Lakewood near Laurieton at 10:19 and at Kendall at 10:30. And he's back at FGM's by the time police arrive at about 11:06. You could say maybe he arrived later than 10:33-ish, but if you say he arrived earlier that would mean two trips.

 

[drsleuth]

That’s interesting SthAussie. PS was packing his car with the intention of going to see his brother in Casino. So it seems PS wife Heather drove her car to bingo that morning.

Correct that HS drove her car

As discussed in earlier threads it’s been said that PS wife drove a maroon coloured car.

Yep a Maroon Ford Falcon

Peter the truck driver sees a maroon coloured car (old 80s bmw) drive past him on Batar Crk Rd as he was leaving. He was seen leaving Kendall at 10:39 (cctv tennis club) so that confirms the 10:35 time Heather left home as it takes roughly 2min to get to Cobb n Co from Benaroon Dr and another 4min to get from Cobb n Co Rd to Comboyne St.

The Burgandy / dark Red / Back / dark coloured series 5 BMW 84/85 model ( he seemed to concede that it was black & that is what was in his statement ) that Peter said he saw when he was leaving Cob & Co Rd also had a ladder on top ( from his statement ) & was driving towards him as he was driving towards Kendall on Batar Creek Rd. This was on Batar Creek Rd & before Benaroon Drive.

He was seen on the tennis club CCTV leaving Kendall @ 10:53 ( the corrected time ) 10:39 was the actual CCTV time & was out by 14mins.

So, IMO this is not HS's car ( why would she be heading south on Batar Creek Rd & not North towards Kendall, if she was going to Laurieton?

FF claims to have sent a text to fm at 10:30 and arrived home at 10:35. If that were true then why wasn’t ff car seen by Peter as he left CnC around 10:35?

Peter would have still been @ the Cob & Co Rd property @ 10:30 - 10:35 & would not have seen the MFC IMO - I think the police have MFC arriving back & # 48 @ 10:33, which matches up with the text sent @ 10:30 & arriving 10:33 ( 3mins drive ) approx

 

[JLZ]

Back to my point on the time ff arrived back to Kendall. What evidence if any, do police have to confirm his 10:35am time? Dan Box seems to think L statement about daddy’s car is relevant but we don’t know how relevant Ls statement is as it was played to the coroner in a closed court. GJ also seems to think Ls statement is credible and considering he led the investigation for the first 4 yrs, he must have had a very good reason to suspect what L said was true stating she was the last person to see W alive.

Snipped for focus.

None of what's been reported of L's statements/recollections contain anything to say either what time William ran around the corner never to be seen again or what time MFC arrived home.

It was part of GJ's case against PS that his car resembled MFC's, and to put weight on L's account that William went looking for daddy's car. If GJ has led Dan up the garden path, it wouldn't be the first time.

 

[drsleuth]

Snipped for focus.

None of what's been reported of L's statements/recollections contain anything to say either what time William ran around the corner never to be seen again or what time MFC arrived home.

It was part of GJ's case against PS that his car resembled MFC's, and to put weight on L's account that William went looking for daddy's car. If GJ has led Dan up the garden path, it wouldn't be the first time.

Personally I don't see any resemblance to the FF car & PS's.

I think there were many other reasons thou that GJ was looking at PS IMO

 

[JLZ]

Personally I don't see any resemblance to the FF car & PS's.

I think there were many other reasons thou that GJ was looking at PS IMO

I was reflecting on Dan's judgement, not Gary's. Gary's is too big a subject for me.

 

[drsleuth]

I was reflecting on Dan's judgement, not Gary's. Gary's is too big a subject for me.

OK. I trust Dan's judgement, I have no reason not too

I don't understand a lot of the hate he is getting out in the internet streets & personally

He's looking at all the stuff ups. He's asking questions. He's trying to sort thru all the misinformation / rumours / red herrings etc IMO. Not an easy task

All IMO.

 

[JLZ]

OK. I trust Dan's judgement, I have no reason not too

I don't understand a lot of the hate he is getting out in the internet streets & personally

He's looking at all the stuff ups. He's asking questions. He's trying to sort thru all the misinformation / rumours / red herrings etc IMO. Not an easy task

All IMO.

You think he's trying? He's got to produce an hour of chat a week. He spent a large part of the last episode softening up the audience for a pivot to a different subject. The best part of the podcast is the transcription errors. "Cheap inspector laid Law", "Gary Gibbling" have stuck in my brain.

 

[drsleuth]

You think he's trying? He's got to produce an hour of chat a week. He spent a large part of the last episode softening up the audience for a pivot to a different subject. The best part of the podcast is the transcription errors. "Cheap inspector laid Law", "Gary Gibbling" have stuck in my brain.

Yes I do. He's been working on this for 2 years I think.

I think he was surprised that the inquest ended ( not sure why as I certainly wasn't )

I've not looked at the transcript.

 

[sleepinoz]

Personally I don't see any resemblance to the FF car & PS's.

I think there were many other reasons thou that GJ was looking at PS IMO

IIRC - The car FF previously had (this one was new), resembled PS's car. Not the current car.

 

[SouthAussie]

Yes I do. He's been working on this for 2 years I think.

I think he was surprised that the inquest ended ( not sure why as I certainly wasn't )

I've not looked at the transcript.

I think Dan was surprised because he expected this tranche of the inquest to look at what has happened over the last four years.

He said that he now thinks the closing means that .... "the coronial team don't think those four years have produced anything that shows what's happened to William. I mean the inquest has heard, you know, from the lead lawyer. He said, it's beyond argument that no forensic evidence has been located that provides a clue to his disappearance. And it's beyond argument that there's no eyewitness who's provided any account of how William left the house where he was reported missing. So four years of police work looking at one particular suspect and the coroners basically said she's not impressed."

Also, the closing was a tip he received. There was no formal announcement to the press. Dan then followed up on the tip and found out the tip was accurate.

What Now? | 11 - Witness: William Tyrrell

The investigation comes to a stop, and the police commissioner speaks out. Witness: William Tyrrell is the new, landmark investigation from news.com.au. Read more and watch exclusive video content here Follow us on socials: Instagram: @newscomauhq Facebook: News.com.au TikTok: @news.com.au...

omny.fm

 

[drsleuth]

IIRC - The car FF previously had (this one was new), resembled PS's car. Not the current car.

Thanks, I don't know what they had prior, but I guess that might make sense to a 3 yr old looking for a familiar car.

 

[drsleuth]

I think Dan was surprised because he expected this tranche of the inquest to look at what has happened over the last four years.

He said that he now thinks the closing means that .... "the coronial team don't think those four years have produced anything that shows what's happened to William. I mean the inquest has heard, you know, from the lead lawyer. He said, it's beyond argument that no forensic evidence has been located that provides a clue to his disappearance. And it's beyond argument that there's no eyewitness who's provided any account of how William left the house where he was reported missing. So four years of police work looking at one particular suspect and the coroners basically said she's not impressed."

What Now? | 11 - Witness: William Tyrrell

The investigation comes to a stop, and the police commissioner speaks out. Witness: William Tyrrell is the new, landmark investigation from news.com.au. Read more and watch exclusive video content here Follow us on socials: Instagram: @newscomauhq Facebook: News.com.au TikTok: @news.com.au...

omny.fm

I just got the impression that there was a good chance that it wouldn't go a head ( maybe a brief summing up 1/2 day at max ) , due to what the coroner said at the end of the last session.

I'm just looking forward to reading the findings & I think that will be in a few months, as I think the Coroner basically had the findings already written prior to the police taking a different direction .

 

[Wexford]

IIRC - The car FF previously had (this one was new), resembled PS's car. Not the current car.

Yes that was my recollection too. I do think though, that, to a 3 year old, most 4wds popular at the time could look similar if they were the same or similar colour. Say, a silver or light metallic colour, or even white, Prado or Landrover or simiar could look the same to someone not overly familiar with car models who is running around and perhaps a bit over-excited and expecting to see a big car.

 

[JBowie]

Some of the things, Dan has found to be quite shocking. From about the 58 min mark in the podcast.

Thanks.

(Wish these podcasts had a speed control on them -- like YouTube where I can listen at 2x and get through it in half the time.)