AZ - Lori Vallow Daybell charged w/ conspiring to kill ex-husband Charles Vallow and another relative, Brandon Boudreaux, Chandler, Maricopa County #3

[mickey2942]

Chad told Julie Rowe in 2018 not to visit him any more because of Tammy's jealousy. In mid-2019 Chad skipped a Preparing a people conference due to a "family emergency". IIRC, in early July (or June) of that year Tammy posted the last pics of her and Chad together on fb. If in July, it would have been after receiving the letter from Charles. IMO Tammy likely saw signs of Chad's infidelity but perhaps thought she was stuck with him. She must have thought he didn't have the guts to divorce her. Perhaps some of his children didn't have too much of a problem with accepting Lori because they knew that his marriage had been dead for a while. For example, they would know if Tammy and Chad slept in separate bedrooms.

I can tell you did not grow up Latter Day Saint. It is cultural. Divorce isn't really part of the vocabulary. And TD probably felt guilty, like she wasn't doing enough to keep CD happy.

 

[kaen]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1912608796448551115

View attachment 579723

I agree. I can't help but think that if the Chandler PD did more than a pro forma job on this case how many people might still be alive. The initial investigation was sooooooo inadequate, sooooo biased toward the two killers that LVD and Alex were emboldened to continue to kill anyone in her and CD's way. Looking at what was presented in court, I find it hard that no hinky meters went off for these detectives. I am happy that the CY testified and it was clear how ridiculous the interview was. The former lead detective was so inept even if it had taken months to go through the data, LVD and Alex would have been on notice that they were being scrutinized.

It is so sad and disheartening.

 

[indicolite22]

Her thinking was spotlight and enjoyment. Lori is not like any human being. She is evil personified. She has no conscience. All she has is a spit fire temper wanting to tell the world Chad loves her and they will be exonerated. After all, the dead were all dark, expendable.

She also loves questioning/antagonizing LE that investigated her, trying to find procedural errors that could magically set her free.

 

[indicolite22]

I can tell you did not grow up Latter Day Saint. It is cultural. Divorce isn't really part of the vocabulary. And TD probably felt guilty, like she wasn't doing enough to keep CD happy.

AFAIK, Lori's family has always been LDS.

 

[indicolite22]

I can't help but think that if the Chandler PD did more than a pro forma job on this case how many people might still be alive. The initial investigation was sooooooo inadequate, sooooo biased toward the two killers that LVD and Alex were emboldened to continue to kill anyone in her and CD's way.

It is so sad and disheartening.

After they established that Charles had been shot when lying down, which was quite early on, at which point they decided it was safe to let Alex roam around? They were also urged to investigate by multiple family members (Charles' and Adam's families). If there had been no further victims, would they have ever charged Alex and/or Lori? When did the investigation actually take off?

 

[indicolite22]

He probably thinks that she won’t be able to help herself, and will decide to mount a defence.

IMO the judge knows that she is out of her depth, but wants to make sure she has no chance of winning on appeal. Lori's problem is that nobody wants to be her witness, not even her parents. Their support would only make them look like enablers more than they already do. Adam's son Zac was openly hostile to her investigator, yet she wants him to contradict Adam's statements. Good luck. She wants Tylee's friends to help her, after what she did to Tylee. Lori is desperate. The only person on her side is Chad.

 

[kaen]

After they established that Charles had been shot when lying down, which was quite early on, at which point they decided it was safe to let Alex roam around? They were also urged to investigate by multiple family members (Charles' and Adam's families). If there had been no further victims, would they have ever charged Alex and/or Lori? When did the investigation actually take off?

I actually think they might have let it ride if there were no other victims. Ynclan's testimony was disturbing for how quickly she bought the narrative. LVD must have been increasingly confident that they would not be questioned after that interview. How could a detective not ask about the whereabouts of the victim's phone after LVD describes keeping it away from Charles? But more concerning, the detective heard her talk about being in fear of him given his hostile messages and she did not connect that LVD was enticing him to become aggressive. LVD allowed him in the house. He had taken the child out to the car. And the detective did not have another thought to sound an alarm to her lead about this information. It is shameful.

I think the investigation took off when Duncan became the lead. He seems to have done some real detective work. Thank goodness for the Vallow family and those in LVD's family who came forward even though they had to yell and scream to get any actions on this case.

 

[TigerLou]

I can tell you did not grow up Latter Day Saint. It is cultural. Divorce isn't really part of the vocabulary. And TD probably felt guilty, like she wasn't doing enough to keep CD happy.

And yet I know as many divorced LDS as I do non-LDS. It's not ideal and we want marriage to last, but dang, it happens. Not the end of the world by any means. I think she would have been absolutely fine with a divorce, and since she was the real workhorse of the fam, she would have been physically fine as well.

 

[indicolite22]

I actually think they might have let it ride if there were no other victims. Ynclan's testimony was disturbing for how quickly she bought the narrative. LVD must have been increasingly confident that they would not be questioned after that interview. How could a detective not ask about the whereabouts of the victim's phone after LVD describes keeping it away from Charles? But more concerning, the detective heard her talk about being in fear of him given his hostile messages and she did not connect that LVD was enticing him to become aggressive. LVD allowed him in the house. He had taken the child out to the car. And the detective did not have another thought to sound an alarm to her lead about this information. It is shameful.

I think the investigation took off when Duncan became the lead. He seems to have done some real detective work. Thank goodness for the Vallow family and those in LVD's family who came forward even though they had to yell and scream to get any actions on this case.

I don't blame Ynclan for not treating Lori as a suspect that early on. But after the first hugely incriminating info came out (second shot, big delay in calling 911), things should have started rolling far faster than they did.

 

[nodamselindistress]

It has occurred to me that the term "bat crazy" was made for this case and Lori Vallow.

 

[kaen]

I don't blame Ynclan for not treating Lori as a suspect that early on. But after the first hugely incriminating info came out (second shot, big delay in calling 911), things should have started rolling far faster than they did.

The idea that LVD talks about CV sending threatening messages without offering those messages AND that LVD admits to being at the killing until she takes JJ to school should be huge red flags for a detective because her behavior does not make sense. Should LVD rise to suspect at that point? Possibly not. But, that it was not a huge red flag to the detective, is concerning about the team on scene that day. This detective went off to another case but did not appear to report that there was some flags that needed to be explored.

For goodness sakes, in a clip above, we see that Lori had a pool party that day. Wish that came into evidence. JJ lost a parent (who had put him in the car to take him to school that mornining) AND this woman had a pool party. She must have been really happy the house was cleared even though it was missing a floor board so she could entertain and celebrate.

 

[Megnut]

I agree. I can't help but think that if the Chandler PD did more than a pro forma job on this case how many people might still be alive. The initial investigation was sooooooo inadequate, sooooo biased toward the two killers that LVD and Alex were emboldened to continue to kill anyone in her and CD's way. Looking at what was presented in court, I find it hard that no hinky meters went off for these detectives. I am happy that the CY testified and it was clear how ridiculous the interview was. The former lead detective was so inept even if it had taken months to go through the data, LVD and Alex would have been on notice that they were being scrutinized.

It is so sad and disheartening.

Saddening and maddening both.

Starting with the 911 call, even before they knew there was a 47 minute delay.

"There's a....I got in a fight with my BIL and I shot him in self-defense."

"There's blood, he's not moving."

How long ago did this happen? "A few minutes."

But he leads with "it was self-defense". Transparent much?

No shock? No panic? No, "I didn't mean for it to escalate", no "he was chasing us with a baseball bat". No "omgomgomg I can't believe I shot him." No, "I was just trying to protect T or LVD." (In fact no mention that anyone else had even been there.) And no, "please hurry, omg, please hurry ."Just a nice, calm, nonchalant "it was self-defense". Alrighty then.

How about we let LE be the judge of that. If only it had been investigated from the start.


The 911 call

 

[indicolite22]

The idea that LVD talks about CV sending threatening messages without offering those messages AND that LVD admits to being at the killing until she takes JJ to school should be huge red flags for a detective because her behavior does not make sense. Should LVD rise to suspect at that point? Possibly not. But, that it was not a huge red flag to the detective, is concerning about the team on scene that day. This detective went off to another case but did not appear to report that there was some flags that needed to be explored.

For goodness sakes, in a clip above, we see that Lori had a pool party that day. Wish that came into evidence. JJ lost a parent (who had put him in the car to take him to school that mornining) AND this woman had a pool party. She must have been really happy the house was cleared even though it was missing a floor board so she could entertain and celebrate.

I don't see red flags per se. Threatening messages could always come in later. None of the red flags would be enough to charge her without stronger evidence.

 

[kaen]

I don't see red flags per se. Threatening messages could always come in later. None of the red flags would be enough to charge her without stronger evidence.

Not charging in my mind but a red flag. Something like, "Hey, something might be off here." We have seen plenty of other cases that gave LE cause for suspicion and lead to closer scrutiny. JJ and Tylee were killed within months. They might be alive if this team had been more inquisitive. Or, at the very least, Alex would have known he was on the radar and maybe he would have not killed them.

 

[kaen]

Saddening and maddening both.

Starting with the 911 call, even before they knew there was a 47 minute delay.

"There's a....I got in a fight with my BIL and I shot him in self-defense."

"There's blood, he's not moving."

How long ago did this happen? "A few minutes."

But he leads with "it was self-defense". Transparent much?

No shock? No panic? No, "I didn't mean for it to escalate", no "he was chasing us with a baseball bat". No "omgomgomg I can't believe I shot him." No, "I was just trying to protect T or LVD." (In fact no mention that anyone else had even been there.) And no, "please hurry, omg, please hurry ."Just a nice, calm, nonchalant "it was self-defense". Alrighty then.

How about we let LE be the judge of that. If only it had been investigated from the start.


The 911 call

No mention of Lori or Tylee or JJ. No mention of the "he came at me with a bat" or "my niece was in fear of him."

I agree. The investigation was pro forma and the lack of scrutiny was appalling.

 

[Megnut]

I actually think they might have let it ride if there were no other victims. Ynclan's testimony was disturbing for how quickly she bought the narrative. LVD must have been increasingly confident that they would not be questioned after that interview. How could a detective not ask about the whereabouts of the victim's phone after LVD describes keeping it away from Charles? But more concerning, the detective heard her talk about being in fear of him given his hostile messages and she did not connect that LVD was enticing him to become aggressive. LVD allowed him in the house. He had taken the child out to the car. And the detective did not have another thought to sound an alarm to her lead about this information. It is shameful.

I think the investigation took off when Duncan became the lead. He seems to have done some real detective work. Thank goodness for the Vallow family and those in LVD's family who came forward even though they had to yell and scream to get any actions on this case.

This reminds me--

LVD's feigned outrage, that CV left JJ -- about whom she couldn't say anything good -- in a car with the engine running.

Shall we compare?

CV left JJ in the car, with it running because he was expecting to return to him but also it was Arizona, he probably left JJ in the car with the air conditioning running. Bet LVD did the very same thing at Walgreen's. But so his grave offense, his supreme irresponsibility that morning was leaving JJ in a car with the engine running....

And LVD... absconded for weeks, incited her brother to conspiracy murder, lured CV into the home and prevented him from leaving, provoked him, while the children were home. Before she was done, CV was dead. And JJ and T were dead soon after.

I don't know that she should be judging anybody.

Such gross superiority.

JMO

 

[Nikynoo]

She has nothing to lose. Shes not going anywhere. Is she going to assert she was framed? I mean there was Charles in July, the kids in September, Tammy in October and Alex dies in December. What I don’t understand and I am hoping you can help me is why the prosecution did not show Charles talking to police about Lori or why the jury didn’t hear Chads phone call to the funeral home about Charles? There’s so much more.

I can be really critical in these cases but this prosecutor feels lame to me. It’s as if she hated being assigned this case and wants it over with.

I remember the Jodi Arias case and how Juan Martinez went toe to toe with her. It’s a shame he is no longer prosecutor in Phoenix. He was awesome. I know he was disbarred for conduct but I’m just saying, I loved the guy.

IMO, IF Lori mounts a defence, it will be on the basis that she suffered from DV at the hands of Charles and was fearful that he would kill her for the insurance money. In reality Lori is projecting (she killed Charles for the insurance money).

ETA - trial strategy changes throughout the trial based on many factors, including jury engagement. Perhaps the prosecutor thought that now was a good time to end their case. Also a minus factor is that Lori defended herself, perhaps this also impacted on how the prosection presented their case.

 

[Cindizzi]

Not charging in my mind but a red flag. something like, "Hey, something might be off here." We have seen plenty of other cases that gave LE cause for suspicion and lead to closer scrutiny. JJ and Tylee were killed within months. They might be alive if this team had been more inquisitive. Or, at the very least, Alex would have known he was on the radar and maybe he would have not killed them.

I think Alex was probably too far gone by the time he killed CV to worry about law enforcement looking at him. Lori had him so lathered up and paranoid about everyone being zombies- she had him truly believing it IMO.
So much so that she and Chad were manipulating him to do anything they wanted done. I think I saw a text yesterday from LVD to Alex from 5 or 6 months prior to CV’s murder ( February maybe) where she told him that Charles (or whoever was inhabiting Charles earthly form) had come looking for HIM.
Just a thought.

 

[wnk]

IMO, IF Lori mounts a defence, it will be on the basis that she suffered from DV at the hands of Charles and was fearful that he would kill her for the insurance money. In reality Lori is projecting (she killed Charles for the insurance money).

ETA - trial strategy changes throughout the trial based on many factors, including jury engagement. Perhaps the prosecutor thought that now was a good time to end their case. Also a minus factor is that Lori defended herself, perhaps this also impacted on how the prosection presented their case.

But would the jury take her word, without any evidence either of DV (no prior police involvement, no documentation of physical inquiry to her, no witnesses testifying she was afraid of him, no texts indicating that she was afraid of him, her instigative behavior that morning, etc) AND no evidence that her $2mil policy actually even existed?

 

[Izzylizzy]

this is what google AI says ( I have no idea what it means);
In the Book of Mormon, the number 24 is significant, particularly in relation to judgment and leadership. For example, King Noah's court had 24 judges, and 24 individuals survived the final destruction of the Nephites. Additionally, the number 24 is associated with the number of plates of Ether and the Nephite disciples who will judge the world in the final judgment.

Thanks for the information on "24".
I looked up Gadianton, LVD (?) mentioned them in a text and when asked about it Det Duncan said he looked it up but forgot its meaning.
Chad used it in a text to LVD.

11:25 a.m. Chad tells Lori that there should be a paper trail, and this is another step to bringing down the Gadiantons – “especially Brandon.” Lori responds that he (Charles) can change the life insurance at any time. Smith asks Hart what Gadiantons mean. “The Gadiantons were a group of people from the Book of Mormon – robbers and thieves.” When the phrase is used, it identifies someone as being a bad person.”

LIVE UPDATES | Steamy text messages revealed on day 7 of Chad Daybell trial - East Idaho News

LIVE UPDATES FROM THE CHAD DAYBELL TRIAL Excuse the typos – these are live updates from the courtroom CLICK HERE TO WATCH THE TRIAL LIVE 11:58 a.m. Boyce suggests we break for the day until Monday. Court is now adjourned. I’ll break it all down tonight on “Courtroom Insider.” Join me live at...

www.eastidahonews.com

Gadianton robbers - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org