AZ - Timothy Romans, 39, & Vincent Romero, 29, slain, St Johns, 5 Nov 2008 - #2

[oceanblueeyes]

I am interested in what the grandmother said concerning the way he was treated. She might know a lot more and could possibly back him up on that front.

All she said was that she thought they were too hard on him. I highly doubt that she would have just sat idly by if they were abusing him. But I do wonder what kind of child he really is where his own grandmother would think him capable of doing something this horrible.

Being strict parents doesn't mean they are abusive to the child. Some children need more disciplining that others and even he admitted that he stayed in trouble for lying.

imoo

 

[oceanblueeyes]

QUOTE
How would he be able to be shot in the chest, twice? A car would have been behind him where the street was? He even gets out of the passenger side which would have obstructed anyone's view of him from the street. He got out on the side closest to the house.

From the house or around the house next to them.

I did not see any clothes found near this belt.

You don't see what is all around that entire area because they are taking a close up view of the casings there.

I still don't understand how he would have frontal shots to the chest if someone was behind him when he was going toward the shooter and bullet casings that were found on the front porch of the home?

 

[Ms Suzanne]

I think his grandmother might have had her suspicions.

What was to the right of this picture or near the pole?looking thing to the right?Was the house to the right or left of this picture?

http://www.kpho.com/slideshow/news/18019101/detail.html

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I do not think her statement was meant to incriminate him. I believe she knows a lot more and this statement was taken out of context.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I think his grandmother might have had her suspicions.

What was to the right of this picture or near the pole?looking thing to the right?Was the house to the right or left of this picture?

http://www.kpho.com/slideshow/news/18019101/detail.html

Looks like they used the pole to affix the crime scene tape the thing to the right may be just the end of the tape not attached.

The pole which looks sort of like a flag pole was to the right of the front of the home.

Why, what do you think it is?

 

[Ms Suzanne]

The neighbors house was not behind him or what was to the right side of the house he was found at.It really does not make sense to me why he would keep walking into the line of fire.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I do not think her statement was meant to incriminate him. I believe she knows a lot more and this statement was taken out of context.

The statement was given to LE and they took down exactly what she said.

imoo

 

[SeriouslySearching]

After seeing those photos of the crime scene, something is just "off".

Where exactly did they find the men?

 

[Ms Suzanne]

I am finding it very conveniet all the casing were found right there near this little boys gun.

 

[MeoW333]

I have to agree Linda and he never mentions that he was going to be spanked that day. That home is littered with all sorts of clothing and other items strewn everywhere. I wonder how long they had lived there. I did see some boxes in some of the photos. I did read that he and Tiffany had just recently built their home.

I think the 1,000! shows the active imagination of a child to make it BIG! No way would he patiently sit there waiting until his 1000th spanking if he had already compartmentalized so much rage imo.

imoo

Yes, he may have compartmentalized the rage after the first 50; maybe less depending how severe. I think it shows the child's ability to make a metaphor meaning he got beat a lot. Spanked; etc whatever you want to call it. ABUSE. Not to mention they need that 'Clean House' show to go to that home!

 

[Ms Suzanne]

Looks like they used the pole to affix the crime scene tape the thing to the right may be just the end of the tape not attached.

The pole which looks sort of like a flag pole was to the right of the front of the home.

Why, what do you think it is?

I'm thinking the shots were from that area or someone walking up to him from that area or from the side near there.Mr Romans is at an angle?

 

[oceanblueeyes]

The neighbors house was not behind him or what was to the right side of the house he was found at.It really does not make sense to me why he would keep walking into the line of fire.

Does it ever make sense when we weren't there when traumatic things happened? This man only had less than a minute imo to make life threatening decisions. I do think he tried to come up at an angle so he thought he would be out of the line of gun fire, that he may have very well thought was coming from inside of the home, not on the front porch. If he had reached the wall of the porch he would be concealed from the shooter's sight if they were still in the home. He was trapped once he started going to aide this boy, if he fled then he would have been shot in the back.

There is nothing that says that any of the neighbors did this. In fact the ones who have spoken out said the opposite and the Romeros were very well liked in the neighborhood. And if they were shot from a neighbor's place or a car then how does that explain VR being murdered within the home?

imoo

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I'm thinking the shots were from that area or someone walking up to him from that area or from the side near there.Mr Romans is at an angle?

If the shots were fired at that angle over to the right they would not be frontal shots but shots that hit him at an angle, most likely piercing his rib cage area.

imoo

 

[Ms Suzanne]

Did they say the shots to Mr Romans chest were at close range or further away?

 

[MeoW333]

All she said was that she thought they were too hard on him. I highly doubt that she would have just sat idly by if they were abusing him. But I do wonder what kind of child he really is where his own grandmother would think him capable of doing something this horrible.

Being strict parents doesn't mean they are abusive to the child. Some children need more disciplining that others and even he admitted that he stayed in trouble for lying.

imoo

You'd be surprised how many people sit idly by when children are being abused; we read about it all the time. In fact there are 2 instances recently in this 'Crimes in the News' were people sat idly by and let it happen. It happens way too much.

We're not even sure of the child's mental compacity..

"Romero owned bows, arrows and other guns. He had bought his son hunting videos, Sauter said, in hopes that learning to handle a gun would teach the boy responsibility."

"Before the shootings, Sauter said, the boy had trouble with his homework. The Romeros had visited school and grounded him from watching television. Sauter wondered whether it was hard for the child to understand complex things."

"I don't think," Sauter said, "he has the ability to distinguish right from wrong."

http://www.latimes.com/news/printed...arizona-boy-killer23-2008nov23,0,243779.story

The father sure picked a helluva way to teach the boy responsibility. Give him some hunting videos to watch..

What happened to having chores? Maybe caring for his boxer puppy would have taught him some responsibility. According to his paternal grandparents and step mother the boy should have never been allowed a gun.

 

[Ms Suzanne]

Quote
If the shots were fired at that angle over to the right they would not be frontal shots but shots that hit him at an angle, most likely piercing his rib cage area.

It would have been if he turned to see where the shots were coming from and then tried to get to the house.

 

[MeoW333]

I do not think her statement was meant to incriminate him. I believe she knows a lot more and this statement was taken out of context.

SS, i agree completely. I think the grandmother's statements speak volumes. It's obvious the boy was a victim of abuse.

"According to the police records, family members were not surprised when told one day after the slayings that the boy had confessed to murder. Police Chief Roy Melnick says in his report, "I comforted them as best we could. After several minutes, (the boy's grandmother) shouted out in an angry and loud tone, 'I knew this would happen. They were too hard on (the boy). I knew (he) did it. He spent the night in my bed cuddling up to me. I had a feeling he did it. If any eight year old boy is capable of doing this, it's (him).'"

"She then started to tell me something and then stopped herself. She took several deep breaths, wanting to tell me more but stopped herself."

"The case file contains other revelations, including statements from friends that Romans and the boy's father had been involved in disputes with co-workers at the nearby power plant, and with men at a local bar."
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-11-27-st-johns-boy_N.htm

IMO i would bet the father was a drinker and took it out on the boy. Mr. Romans perhaps teamed up with dad when they drank too much.

Once the initial shock passes; and the funerals the truth starts to come out in the small town.

 

[SoobsinMI]

Belt?! I think this is huge clue as to what could have been going on in that house at the time.

1,000 spankings is abuse. I don't care how you look at it.

If the house had been extremely clean, and a belt was left out, one could make the argument. However, the house appears to have clothes strewn about, so it's difficult to say the belt was used in an abusive manner, IMO.

(ETA: Sorry, I should have read ahead, before posting.)

 

[Ms Suzanne]

If the house had been extremely clean, and a belt was left out, one could make the argument. However, the house appears to have clothes strewn about, so it's difficult to say the belt was used in an abusive manner, IMO.

what was a red flag to me was there was a casing (2 casings ?)found near this belt.

 

[MeoW333]

what was a red flag to me was there was a casing (2 casings ?)found near this belt.

Would it be possible the father was walking towards the boy with the belt in his hand and dropped it when he saw the boy with the gun?

ps- the stairs seem to be clean aside from the belt and shell casings; why not throw the belt in the rest of the clothes piles? Why leave it on the stairs for someone to trip over?