CA CA - Bob Harrod, 81, Orange County, 27 July 2009 - #10

[believe09]

zwiebel, this might help you understand the pressure it is likely that CA Exile/PE felt while posting on the www:

ShowMe
Banned

Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 81
IMHO: I keep wondering about a couple of additional theories, never addressed by the media or discussed by armchair sleuths. Blogging neighbor moved near time of disappearance, and family of wife are said to live out-of-state, beyond local city, county, or state lines. It seems police could utilize county sheriff or federal resources to investigate any out of jurisdiction connections, but it is doubtful media would ever hear about enlistment of additional resources until after a case is closed.

IIRC, the disgusting allegation posted on his visitor page was made by a WS member who was actually one of Bob's daughters


I think many of CA Exile's posts are worth reviewing...he shared information on possible financial issues dogging PB and indicated that he couldnt confirm or deny any information about RB-he states he didnt know her at all. He did get their birth order wrong-I am not sure whether or not that is indicative of how well he knew them or how much Bob spoke or didnt speak about them. He believed RB was the oldest.

A few links:

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - CA CA - Bob Harrod, 81, Orange County, 27 July 2009 - #2

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - CA CA - Bob Harrod, 81, Orange County, 27 July 2009 - #2

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - CA CA - Bob Harrod, 81, Orange County, 27 July 2009 - #2

 

[zwiebel]

Moved 'near time of disappearance' - as in before Bob disappeared!
Thank you believe09, CA Exile seemed simply nice, straightforward and wanting very much to help Bob.

And that former WS member seemed none of the above.

 

[zwiebel]

Thinking about it -
'utilize county sheriff'
'enlistement of additional resources'
'jurisdiction connections'

- are unusual turns of phrase. Almost as unusual as 'positive response' instead of 'okay' or 'yes'.

 

[shana]

I struggled with this area before, but just to say the privacy theory doesn't sit right with me either really. I can understand if a family had no money, they might not want the world to know, but then they wouldn't be in a financial position to create a trust. So, that indicates to me, if there's a trust, there is money. And a motive?

The privacy theory?

I posted about the privacy of trusts, for informational purposes.

Also to add: Not only are they not typically recorded, it is not mandatory to record such trusts either.

Referencing again: Trust Beneficiaries’ Bill of Rights, which states in its introduction:

One of the advantages of trusts is privacy. Unlike the probate of a will, there is no legal requirement that the trustee file the trust with the local court. However, privacy is also one of the disadvantages of trusts. Unless the Trustee provides information about the trust and trust assets to the trust beneficiaries, the beneficiaries will have no idea whether or not they have received all that they are entitled to, or whether the trustee has properly done his or her job. As a trust beneficiary, you have the right to know!

As beneficiaries, Mr. Harrod's daughters had the right to know the terms of their Mother's trust and more. The so-called "poison pen letter" was a notice to Mr. Harrod's lawyer concerning the benes' rights and the legal responsibilities of the Trustee, and further clarified the history of their having tried to obtain the docs from said Trustee (their Father).

As for a "money motive", it could certainly be applied to persons other than family.

~jmo~

 

[zwiebel]

Shana, you seem quite cross, as though you're trying to tell me something and I'm not getting it? I'm not saying I know for sure who disappeared Mr Harrod, but I am trying to work out who might have done this.
I honestly just can't see the money motive for the persons other than the family, so you're going to have to help me out here.
<mod snip>

 

[zwiebel]

Oh, okay, I posted my answer before I saw your last post.

 

[believe09]

More Comments from the blogger quoted above, dated July 28, 2010:

As far as Bob's family goes, I do not think any of them had anything to do with his disappearance.
...
I knew his daughter and son-in-law as neighbors. They were and are good people.
...
As far as the barber goes, I met her. I did not like her. I felt she was taking advantage of Bob as a lonely widower with a lot of money.
...

Read much more at link provided above.

~jmo~

Yeah, he also agreed that it wasnt a stranger, which would put it back to Bob's circle. And he referred to Fontelle as Bob's widow, poor man. Clearly he believes his friend met with foul play. I wonder how he would feel about the pursuit of Bob's wife for rent in the marital residence? He knew that she brought his friend such joy.

So if BL and her family didnt do it, Bob's children didnt do it, Fontelle didnt do it...that leaves us AH and SIL?

Process of elimination I guess....

I am not sure how I feel about the AH as a suspect, but I suppose we can explore it if we choose to eliminate every one else. I think SIL has been well covered.

Anyone want to go down the path of the grandson?

Maybe we should cast the net to ex spouses of the children?

 

[believe09]

Also, did you make a post that sort of suggested I go away earlier? I am really uncertain but I thought I saw something and then a mod called imamaze appeared and I couldn't find it to answer. Apologies if I'm just getting confused again.

Respectfully snipped. Surely not, zwiebel. I love the energy you have brought to a tired, frustrated pile of Websleuthers. Many of these folks have been here from shortly after Bob's disappearance. I came late to the party but the story broke my heart and I cant let it go until there is an answer for Fontelle and those who love Mr Harrod.

 

[zwiebel]

Well, anyway, I'm not going away. I've only just got here. I'm English, it wouldn't be polite.

 

[believe09]

Well, anyway, I'm not going away. I've only just got here. I'm English, it wouldn't be polite.

:blowkiss:

:gthanks:

 

[shana]

bbm

Shana, you seem quite cross, as though you're trying to tell me something and I'm not getting it? I'm not saying I know for sure who disappeared Mr Harrod, but I am trying to work out who might have done this.
I honestly just can't see the money motive for the persons other than the family, so you're going to have to help me out here.
Also, did you make a post that sort of suggested I go away earlier? I am really uncertain but I thought I saw something and then a mod called imamaze appeared and I couldn't find it to answer. Apologies if I'm just getting confused again.

I am not cross. I posted some information with references to support. I do not know who 'disappeared' Mr. Harrod and like you, I am exploring all possibilities.

I did not suggest or sort of suggest that you go away.

Apologies accepted.

Now, let's get back to case! ;->

~jmo~

 

[believe09]

Just to close the loop on CA Exile being threatened by one of Bob's daughters:

One of Bob’s daughters was watching also. She sent me a threatening message to stop posting. I continued to post anyway. Most of what I said was public knowledge. Sometimes I would correct what I perceived as errors in some of the articles. I was not saying anything about the case, itself. For one thing, I do not know much since the police never contacted me. Second, things that I do know, I was asked not to tell. So, I don’t.

shana's link

 

[believe09]

It was refreshing to spend part of the day re reading some of the older threads of Bob's here, and it was heartening to re-read PE's blog.

There are at least two people who are pushing and trying to make sure that Bob is not forgotten. They are willing to put themselves out there-media and interviews and the like. Note that many of Paul's contacts with people investigating Bob's disappearance came by way of Mrs. Harrod.

Time to come home Bob. PE misses his friend terribly and Mrs Harrod misses her husband.

 

[zwiebel]

believe09, you may be a cynic but you are just so sweet!

 

[zwiebel]

The privacy theory?

I posted about the privacy of trusts, for informational purposes.

Also to add: Not only are they not typically recorded, it is not mandatory to record such trusts either.

Referencing again: Trust Beneficiaries’ Bill of Rights, which states in its introduction:

One of the advantages of trusts is privacy. Unlike the probate of a will, there is no legal requirement that the trustee file the trust with the local court. However, privacy is also one of the disadvantages of trusts. Unless the Trustee provides information about the trust and trust assets to the trust beneficiaries, the beneficiaries will have no idea whether or not they have received all that they are entitled to, or whether the trustee has properly done his or her job. As a trust beneficiary, you have the right to know!

As beneficiaries, Mr. Harrod's daughters had the right to know the terms of their Mother's trust and more. The so-called "poison pen letter" was a notice to Mr. Harrod's lawyer concerning the benes' rights and the legal responsibilities of the Trustee, and further clarified the history of their having tried to obtain the docs from said Trustee (their Father).

As for a "money motive", it could certainly be applied to persons other than family.

~jmo~

BBM

'I did not like her. I felt she was taking advantage of Bob as a lonely widower with a lot of money'

I worked my way through college caring for people with alzheimers and dementia. I'd run out to the store to buy them a pack of candy for a few cents - that they hadn't tasted in years because their family had abandoned them. I was offered their jewellry, paintings or mansions in return. Luckily, I just wanted their stories (history come to life!) and they were happy to give them.

I do not like the idea of taking money from an elderly person in exchange for friendship. So, I don't approve of the BL. PE's opinion about her makes me like her even less. But, I respect the fact Bob was in possession of all his faculties and was free to give his money to whoever he pleased. I do not respect the BL for taking it. Actually, it makes me a little sick.

But...I cannot see how she could have gained in any way from disappearing Bob. And, in the very beginning, with all the accusations and the case against her initially seeming so clear cut....if she was not arrested, could it be that her alibi did indeed check out?

I know LE also said JeM was 'where he said he was' but that's at a store at 3.04pm, and at the victim's house before that - so I guess that's why I have been concentrating on that area.

 

[believe09]

shana, who would have money motives outside of the family? I dont see it, but maybe there is something there I havent considered so far.

I am not feelin the BL as a suspect, even if she hadnt been cleared by PPD.

Bob's doctor made a firm statement regarding his mental acuity, Bob shut down the first APS visit requested by his children, and those same children were completely unsuccessful in trying to prove BL was loaned money instead of given it outright. In the eyes of the court, at least, she was given whatever money that came her way from Bob. The money was his, and he was free to give it as he chose.

Maybe there were some sour grapes because BL received money free and clear, yet he set up loans for family? I am speculating only. I feel pretty certain Bob was open handed with his family as well, in spite being accused of being parsimonious.

 

[Angelo]

Moved 'near time of disappearance' - as in before Bob disappeared!
Thank you believe09, CA Exile seemed simply nice, straightforward and wanting very much to help Bob.

And that former WS member seemed none of the above.

Another post from that same former WS member:

ShowMe

I agree wholeheartedly with one exception -- that I think Bob is out there somewhere and thinking "I'll show them!"

I think he ran off overwhelmed over his recent hasty decisions and, like most seniors, is unable to confront things head on.

He was caught being scammed big time by the barber lady and making his middle age daughters wait more than a year to see their own mother's final wishes, and then getting married to a woman he essentially just met, less than a week prior.

I think, when he had a chance to think things over in his current state of mind, Bob was most likely going to "take it out on the world" but his tantrum backfired horribly somewhere along the way and is not getting the result he desired.

He's probably still too proud to admit what he has done to everyone.

IMHO, based on all that I have read. Unfortunately, there is no win-win either way this story unfolds.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - CA CA - Bob Harrod, 81, Orange County, 27 July 2009 - #1

 

[zwiebel]

There is obviously something I have not considered so far, or completely missed. Why on earth would one of Bob's daughters threaten PE the former neighbour? All he said was nice or fair things about everyone! I must have missed something. He must have said something that made someone really angry. I bet everyone on this thread already knows the answers and this stupid newbie is still huffing and puffing trying to catch up..........

 

[believe09]

I am definitely not feelin CAExile as a suspect-wow that would be surreal.

I dont think Bob ran away either-that cold feet theory was put to bed pretty quickly.

 

[zwiebel]

Good heavens, this thread is moving fast today. Everytime I post, something else amazing has gone up. I'm not used to this!