CA - Rebecca Zahau Nalepa - suicide or murder? #11

[ehough22]

No, I don't believe it was specified, drip vs. smear. I guess I was thinking drip because it was found in places lower than where she'd be writing (like her nipple, sorry to be graphic). And also because the few spots we do see on the carpet appear to be drips. Food for thought.

 

[Quester]

Along with all of the other factors involved in binding and prepping for the swan dive, it just seem awfully convenient that next to the cryptic message in paint and block letters that RZ's fingerprint in paint is emblazoned like a signature. MOO

 

[Pach]

Rebecca's family is setting up a website seeking donations to pay for an independent investigation. I wonder if Mr. Shacknai will make a donation ????? By the way, did he rush to the mansion upon learning of Rebecca's death ?? If I was the boyfriend, heck yeah !, I would rush over, and I would hold a press conference and be indignant about her death.

Family dispute cause of drug company CEO girlfriend's death
By Marty Graham

SAN DIEGO | Fri Sep 9, 2011 9:40am EDT

SAN DIEGO (Reuters) - The ex-husband and relatives of the woman found hanged, bound and nude at the mansion of a wealthy pharmaceutical executive are seeking donations for a private investigation to challenge the official ruling of her death as a suicide.

A lawyer representing family members of Rebecca Zahau said on Thursday that a confidential coroner's report she obtained reveals several pieces of previously undisclosed evidence that cast doubt on conclusions reached by sheriff's investigators.

Relatives of Zahau have said since the official probe of her death concluded late last week that they did not believe the official finding that she had taken her own life at the estate of her boyfriend, Jonah Shacknai, founder and CEO of Medicis Pharmaceutical Corp.

The Arizona-based company is the maker of the popular wrinkle filler Restylane and the acne treatment Solodyn.

The bizarre death on July 13 came two days after Shacknai's 6-year-old son Max was critically injured in a fall from a staircase while being looked after by Zahau at the mansion near San Diego. The boy died six days later.

Last Friday, San Diego County Sheriff Bill Gore held a news conference to announce that foul play had been ruled out in both deaths. Investigators concluded that Zahau had committed suicide hours after learning in a late-night phone call that Max, then still hospitalized, had taken a turn for the worse.

They even released an unusual video demonstration of how investigators believed Zahau, 32, had managed to tie her own hands behind her back before binding her own legs, slipping a noose around her neck, and hurling herself off a second-story balcony.

Her lifeless, nude body was found suspended by the neck from a rope later that morning by Shacknai's brother, a guest at the estate at the time.

This week, relatives of Zahau and her former husband, Neil Nalepa, set up a website seeking donations "to help us fight to get justice for ... Rebecca."

"It was obvious that the sheriff's department had worked too hard to paint this picture of suicide, and they were not about to let the Zahaus ruin it," the website said. "Now the family is left to fight for justice themselves, and this fight is an expensive one."

Seattle-based lawyer Anne Bremner, who is representing Zahau's family, told Reuters on Thursday that she has retained "forensic and psychiatric experts to take another look at the findings and the underlying evidence."

She cited several bits of undisclosed evidence contained in the medical examiner's report, including that Zahau's body was found with a T-shirt stuffed into her mouth, residue of tape on her legs, signs of trauma to the top of her head and blood on her legs.

"Just on the facts, this doesn't pass the smell test," Bremner said of the suicide ruling.

Sheriff's investigators have said there were no signs of a struggle, sexual assault or drugs in her system and no indication that Zahau was incapacitated before she was hanged.

"Becky did not commit suicide. My sister was murdered," Zahau's sister, Snowem Horwath, said in an email from her home in Germany after the suicide ruling was announced. "We had a very normal conversation that evening ... I know my sister very well, and there is no way anyone can convince me that she did this to herself!"

 

[SunnieRN]

Oh I don't think the paint was dripping like melted butter but I do think as she put her hand up against the door to write she got some paint on her hands and may have even touched her chest not even realizing or caring that she had paint on her. Or she may have gotten it when she took the top off of the paint tube and it got transfered in different areas on her.

She may not have dripped any at all. I was just speculating if she used the tube directly on the door she may have.

IMO

If you look at the door, the placement of the door knob and the whited out area of the door, you will notice that the message was most likely written/block lettered, at least as high or higher than Rebecca's eye level.

I find it impossible to think this can be done without drops on the door its self/ Not only that, there are drips at the end of the bed, just from opening the tube of paint. There should have been a bigger mess, imho/

 

[jjenny]

I think the wrought iron railing with three iron supports bolted into the concrete wall was strong. Much stronger than 600 pounds.

But I do think with the force and energy plus the ME saying she went over in an angular position made the minor hemorrhages found as her head grazed the balcony as she was going over.

IMO

If it was so strong why didn't she just tie a rope to the railing? Why would she need to anchor it to the bed?

 

[oceanblueeyes]

If it was so strong why didn't she just tie a rope to the railing? Why would she need to anchor it to the bed?

I dont know. I wasn't the one planning this, jjenny.

IMO

 

[cluciano63]

So do both families believe LE is lying? R's family about her death, and M's mom, about his??

 

[SunnieRN]

I think the wrought iron railing with three iron supports bolted into the concrete wall was strong. Much stronger than 600 pounds.

But I do think with the force and energy plus the ME saying she went over in an angular position made the minor hemorrhages found as her head grazed the balcony as she was going over.

IMO

This has been bothering me. LE stated that in order for Rebecca to go over the railing at her height, she would have had to go over head first. They showed an 11" area, that according to them, is where Rebecca went over head first.

I am not sure where the sideways over the rail story started, except to try and explain injuries, but there would have had to be a wider area of disturbance on the banister for that to have been true.

If Rebecca did go over the bannister sideways, there would be even less of a chance of her injuring the TOP of her head. Front, back, the side closest to the bannister maybe, but the top of the head would have been much more protected than if she had done a swan dive.

Remember, tow ropes are not made to bounce. They are coated, causing them to float, not sink, while pulling objects in the water. She would not have 'bounced' back up and hit her head either.

The injuries to the left side of her neck, are consistent with strangulation wounds, along with the facial congestion and the petechiae.

In my mind, 1+1 is NOT coming together to indicate any chance of getting 4 head wounds on top of her head in this manner, nor does it explain obvious signs of strangulation.

 

[justice be served]

So do both families believe LE is lying? R's family about her death, and M's mom, about his??

I think lying, on a scale of 1 to 10, is a 10. I am in the range of a 6 on the scale. I believe the influences on LE were great and from both external and internal sources. The outcomes/rulings seemed to work toward a predetermined conclusion on both deaths IMO.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

If you look at the door, the placement of the door knob and the whited out area of the door, you will notice that the message was most likely written/block lettered, at least as high or higher than Rebecca's eye level.

I find it impossible to think this can be done without drops on the door its self/ Not only that, there are drips at the end of the bed, just from opening the tube of paint. There should have been a bigger mess, imho/

I am 5'4' (1 inch taller than RN) and I just checked to see if I had to write in the same area of the door could I easily write in that area. It wouldnt be hard to do at all. She could do it flat footed.

I think she wrote the message higher so it could be seen by maybe someone she knew was around that height and it would be eye level.

I really think she thought Jonah would be the one to find her. That is why she wrote the message on the outside of the guest room door in the mansion. She probably thought if he tried to call her again and couldnt get her he would come home to see where she was and why she wasnt answering the phone.

IMO

 

[jjenny]

I am 5'4' (1 inch taller than RN) and I just checked to see if I had to write in the same area of the door could I easily write in that area. It wouldnt be hard to do at all. She could do it flat footed.

I think she wrote the message higher so it could be seen by maybe someone she knew was around that height and it would be eye level.

I really think she thought Jonah would be the one to find her. That is why she wrote the message on the outside of the guest room door in the mansion. She probably thought if he tried to call her again and couldnt get her he would come home to see where she was and why she wasnt answering the phone.

IMO

If she actually killed herself, she would have to know AS was going to find her. AS was the one staying in the guest house, not JS. JS was in the hospital or the house across the street from the hospital. And frankly if she thought JS would care so much as to show up at his home to see why she was not answering the phone, why would she kill herself to begin with?

 

[SunnieRN]

I am 5'4' (1 inch taller than RN) and I just checked to see if I had to write in the same area of the door could I easily write in that area. It wouldnt be hard to do at all. She could do it flat footed.

I think she wrote the message higher so it could be seen by maybe someone she knew was around that height and it would be eye level.

I really think she thought Jonah would be the one to find her. That is why she wrote the message on the outside of the guest room door in the mansion. She probably thought if he tried to call her again and couldnt get her he would come home to see where she was and why she wasnt answering the phone.

IMO

I'm sorry, I don't think I explained my thoughts well.:crazy:

I was trying to say, that painting it higher, should have been messier, as it would have been equal to or above her eye level. Meaning she would have to raise her arm to do so. imo only

 

[justice be served]

I am 5'4' (1 inch taller than RN) and I just checked to see if I had to write in the same area of the door could I easily write in that area. It wouldnt be hard to do at all. She could do it flat footed.

I think she wrote the message higher so it could be seen by maybe someone she knew was around that height and it would be eye level.

I really think she thought Jonah would be the one to find her. That is why she wrote the message on the outside of the guest room door in the mansion. She probably thought if he tried to call her again and couldnt get her he would come home to see where she was and why she wasnt answering the phone.

IMO

I highly doubt she had the critical thinking skills at that moment to think of writing at Jonah's height. But I also don't think she wrote it so it's a moot point for me.

 

[Aking]

All I can say is I'm truly confused as ever. I initially thought murder, but then after seeing all the findings (no specific sorce) I now tend to lean towards suicide. I know the bizarre knots and weird cryptic message don't help.......but I honestly think suicide is very plausible in this case. A lot of people keep referring to her mental health and well being months, days, and hours up to her death as reasons to why or why not she would have done this to herself. But I can honestly speak from experience....my father committed suicide and anyone that knew him would strongly disagree with the outcome of his demise had it not been clear cut that he did it to himself. I think us (rational human beings) can't fathom how someone would go to great lenths to do this, but trust me, they go beyond what most would suggest physically impossible. I'm not here to debate, but rather give my 2 cents. I don't open up much about my fathers suicide, but I feel my friends at websleuths can understand my point of view (atleast some). FWIW, my father shot himself with a 12 gauge shotgun, the way the corner explained the way he held the gun did not anotomically make sense to where the wounds were found, however we know he did take his own life. Point being.....even though some things seem impossible or hard to physically do, they are very possible. I'm saddened by Rebecca's death, still open minded, but everyone has a breaking point (no matter how much their immediate family knows or what the victim relays to their family). If I or more family had known what was going on in my fathers head completely, he might still be alive, and I believe the same for Rebecca's family......everyone puts on a show.....you don't come out waiving a flag that says "I'm about to kill myself", you act like everything's fine and then do the deed. Of couse, this is my personal opinion and experience. Again, I'm still open to Rebecca's death not being suicide, but I think I can picture it more eaily than others.

 

[SunnieRN]

So do both families believe LE is lying? R's family about her death, and M's mom, about his??

From various comments I have read on several sites, I think DS does not so much think LE lied, but that they made a grievous error, in not realizing that 'someone' smothered Max. I have not heard her say anything concerning the fall however and I think that would be very interesting.

Rebecca's family believes that LE came to the incorrect conclusion. I am not sure they said LR lied, but did say in no uncertain terms, that they got it wrong.

 

[justice be served]

Your post gave me pause - and a part of me really wants to believe it was suicide. Thank you SO much. It is greatly appreciated.

All I can say is I'm truly confused as ever. I initially thought murder, but then after seeing all the findings (no specific sorce) I now tend to lean towards suicide. I know the bizarre knots and weird cryptic message don't help.......but I honestly think suicide is very plausible in this case. A lot of people keep referring to her mental health and well being months, days, and hours up to her death as reasons to why or why not she would have done this to herself. But I can honestly speak from experience....my father committed suicide and anyone that knew him would strongly disagree with the outcome of his demise had it not been clear cut that he did it to himself. I think us (rational human beings) can't fathom how someone would go to great lenths to do this, but trust me, they go beyond what most would suggest physically impossible. I'm not here to debate, but rather give my 2 cents. I don't open up much about my fathers suicide, but I feel my friends at websleuths can understand my point of view (atleast some). FWIW, my father shot himself with a 12 gauge shotgun, the way the corner explained the way he held the gun did not anotomically make sense to where the wounds were found, however we know he did take his own life. Point being.....even though some things seem impossible or hard to physically do, they are very possible. I'm saddened by Rebecca's death, still open minded, but everyone has a breaking point (no matter how much their immediate family knows or what the victim relays to their family). If I or more family had known what was going on in my fathers head completely, he might still be alive, and I believe the same for Rebecca's family......everyone puts on a show.....you don't come out waiving a flag that says "I'm about to kill myskef", you act like everything's fine and then do the deed. Of couse, this is my personal opinion and experience. Again, I'm still open to Rebecca's death not being suicide, but I think I can picture it more eaily than others.

 

[Brit]

I have been following this case from the beginning because of the bazaar circumstances surrounding it. I have been reading many of the posts since the beginning, and this is my first post.

In my opinion, I don't think that it is odd that RZ went shopping on the way to the airport to drop of the younger sister/ pick up AS. She was having an out of town guest who, considering the circumstances for his arrival, probably wouldn't have the time to go on his own to get essentials like O.J. or milk. On top of that, she was dropping off her younger sister, who is only 13 years old and just experianced a very traumatic event. Maybe she wanted to find something to calm this little girl down. In my experiance, when you have the responsibility for the care of a child, even if she is 13...that child's well being comes ahead of your own needs, even in times of hardship. You put that child's needs ahead of your own emotional needs because that is just the right thing to do. In my open, this does not show that RZ had mental problems....it might show that she had ALOT on her plate at that time, and in my opinion even show her strength in a time of tragedy. Seems to me that between the statements thru the media about her taking food and change of clothes up to the hospital, drop off's and pick ups at the airport, and taking care of boarding the dog, that she was the one that was trying to take care of the little details so that no one else had to worry or focus on anything other than MS. This, to me, shows a strength of character not "mental issues".

 

[oceanblueeyes]

This has been bothering me. LE stated that in order for Rebecca to go over the railing at her height, she would have had to go over head first. They showed an 11" area, that according to them, is where Rebecca went over head first.

I am not sure where the sideways over the rail story started, except to try and explain injuries, but there would have had to be a wider area of disturbance on the banister for that to have been true.

If Rebecca did go over the bannister sideways, there would be even less of a chance of her injuring the TOP of her head. Front, back, the side closest to the bannister maybe, but the top of the head would have been much more protected than if she had done a swan dive.

Remember, tow ropes are not made to bounce. They are coated, causing them to float, not sink, while pulling objects in the water. She would not have 'bounced' back up and hit her head either.

The injuries to the left side of her neck, are consistent with strangulation wounds, along with the facial congestion and the petechiae.

In my mind, 1+1 is NOT coming together to indicate any chance of getting 4 head wounds on top of her head in this manner, nor does it explain obvious signs of strangulation.

Gosh I will have to read the autopsy report again......I am missing things I guess.

I thought the ME said he thought she went over at an angular position..not a head dive. That means to me she rested one hip up on the railing and that is why only 11 inches? of dust was disturbed and then swung her legs and feet over and propelled off. If she did not push off far enough then one side on the top of her head could have grazed the scroll work which is not solid but open in areas. We do not know if she twisted from the force when she jumped off or she may have had her head arched way back when she jumped.

Tow ropes are flexible though. They aren't ridgid like a steel rod that has no play in it. The energy amassed and the force of her fall would make the rope swing like a pendulum. A thin rope cannot steady and control a hundred pound body where it will drop straight down and never swing imo. We also don't know if the rope may have been twisted when she repelled off. If so the body would spin until the rope was no longer twisted.


IMO

 

[cluciano63]

From various comments I have read on several sites, I think DS does not so much think LE lied, but that they made a grievous error, in not realizing that 'someone' smothered Max. I have not heard her say anything concerning the fall however and I think that would be very interesting.

Rebecca's family believes that LE came to the incorrect conclusion. I am not sure they said LR lied, but did say in no uncertain terms, that they got it wrong.

I thought R's family believed that the S's family inflence affected the outcome...also, isn't is strictly up to the ME to determine manner of death? Rather than LE? Or are we supposed to believe that the ME's office too is in on whatever cover-up is happening? I am confused...

 

[deanna82437]

I have a question. Why was the dog boarded? Who requested it? Anyone seen anything about it? Is he/she still alive?