Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #11

[copkid]

No bodies so they may still be bivouacking?

"The RCMP have found several items on the shore of the Nelson River “directly linked” to two men wanted in three deaths in Northern B.C., but the discovery hasn’t led police any closer to finding the fugitives"​

Belongings of B.C. fugitives found on Manitoba shore; RCMP Superintendent says latest search coming to an end

Bivouaking, great word that I have not heard in awhile.

 

[otto]

Sounds a lot like they are dead. Hopefully we will know more in the morning. I assume rcmp will give more of an update

If the delay is pending notification of next of kin, then it will be announced in the morning. If the evidence is sketchy, like a water container and an oar, people will want more.

 

[NJSleuth91]

I think BS was always in danger of some hypothermia because he is (or was?) so thin. I think that the reported low temps were around 50F- you can die of hypothermia in that temperature, but they were young and if they had any food or propane left, or if they found some sort of shelter, they could have possibly survived, IMO. We still do not know if they actually tried going on the river in the boat.

I doubt he was as thin as reported by his dad (6'4" and 125 lbs) but he did look to be slightly underweight. 50 degrees F and pouring rain like it was on the 24th or 25th could give anyone hypothermia after enough time, even if they hadn't been in the river.

 

[otto]

Bivouaking, great word that I have not heard in awhile.

Off Topic : Might be related to the Napoleon's French Revolution and the Prussian Army.

 

[Seattle1]

the spotting of a wrecked rowboat below the Lower Limestone Rapids on the Nelson River on Friday.

@otto - FYI.

I believe the last map I saw had the boat marker above the Lower Limestone Rapids?

 

[NJSleuth91]

Kind of gross, but I was just reading that in cold water, a body can take weeks before it floats to the surface.

In New Jersey there was a guy who was missing in the Passaic River for over a year.
Body found in Long Hill ID'd as David Bird, reporter missing for 14 months - nj.com

 

[aphoto]

If the delay is pending notification of next of kin, then it will be announced in the morning. If the evidence is sketchy, like a water container and an oar, people will want more.

That’s the evidence as we know it. If the police are going to declare them dead I would expect much more solid information. I doubt they would announce it before telling next of kin and without having a carefully worded statement ready to deliver in either Vancouver or Winnipeg.

 

[Moonlitnight]

Agreed--but what got to me was the LE use of the word "directly." Any possession such as a shoe, cell phone or piece of clothing could have parted ways with them days ago and no longer be "directly" tied to them. To take it to a far-fetched extreme, even hair could have been cut off and handed off to someone willing to assist them by leaving it in a totally different area than their actual destination...So, what would be directly tied? That is how I came to my conclusion, strictly my own theory. Body recovery in the backcountry is not pretty--if they are dead, if they did die days ago--such as on July 22nd, two weeks ago, their bodies would have been decomposing all this time--whether on land or in water.

Jewellery? The RCMP may have found a chain or something similar and checked with the families.

 

[MistyWaters]

SBM

This comment leads me to believe that the RCMP has not concluded that they are dead.

Without finding dead bodies or vital body parts thereof, I don’t believe they can draw that conclusion. But they may offer a probability based on analysis of the items found to yield further answers. Such as were the items simply abandoned near the shoreline or is there indications of water and damage relative to that of being tossed about in the rapids as well, depending on what was found.

 

[dameagatha]

August 2 is added to the map

View attachment 197239

Really nice visual display of information.

 

[acutename]

We haven't heard anything about oars, and most people put oars in a different place. Pretty sure this boat was going downstream from the dam.

would anyone knowledgeable about boats get in one without any oar(s)?

 

[otto]

@otto - FYI.

I believe the last map I saw had the boat marker above the Lower Limestone Rapids?

Above the Sundance Creek tributary? There is another rapids, but it is East of Sundance Creek.

Reports are that the boat was found near the Lower Limestone Rapids, guessing downstream.

 

[MistyWaters]

Kind of gross, but I was just reading that in cold water, a body can take weeks before it floats to the surface.

Yes that’s true but in a river the strong current would carry the body downstream as well so where it floats up can be a very long way from the site of the drowning. If drowned, before they’re ever found, good chance they’d probably become part of the food chain in Hudson’s Bay (just to make it clear, I’m referring to the body of water, not the department store!).

 

[acutename]

As far as them leaving a trail for the RCMP - given the fact that they are in the wilderness and undoubtedly struggling to find food and shelter, it's hard to wrap my head around the idea that they think they're going to stay ahead of the game and taunt LE along the way.

I'm sure that when they set out on the run that the last thing they imagined was that they were going to have to work to avoid getting eaten, as well as avoiding LE. I just think that their mental state has to be focused on staying alive more than anything else.

They may very well be scratching their heads and wondering how they have managed to avoid capture at this point.

somebody should have left a pie on their window sill on day one after the RAV was burned.... right after the bears arrived, KM and BS....

 

[ladysamurai]

In New Jersey there was a guy who was missing in the Passaic River for over a year.
Body found in Long Hill ID'd as David Bird, reporter missing for 14 months - nj.com

What a sad case--but yes, you make a very good point. Reminds me of a couple of lines from Gordon Lightfoot's "The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald":

The lake, it is said, never gives up her dead
When the skies of November turn gloomy...
That good ship and crew was a bone to be chewed
When the gales of November came early

--And wasn't the weather stormy for days after the RAV4 burning?

 

[Xyzzia]

Bivouaking, great word that I have not heard in awhile.

Have to subscribe and use your email account to get in and read the article.
And I certainly am not interested in giving my email address to the Globe and Mail.

 

[Massasauga Rattler]

I'm not sure if this has been brought up yet, but if the items belonging to the suspects near the damaged boat were firmly on shore or dry land and not washed up, they 99% they are alive. In otherwords, if the boat and items washed up, then they likely met the grim reaper in the rapids. If the boat and items were placed on shore, they they were already downstream of the rapids and somehow made safe passage either by boat or portage.

So my question...have the police commented on whether the items found were washed up, or intentionally placed as if part of a camp site?

 

[Satchie]

If the delay is pending notification of next of kin, then it will be announced in the morning. If the evidence is sketchy, like a water container and an oar, people will want more.

I'm wondering, there could be privacy issues in what they reveal.

Although they were suspects, they hadn't been tried, so in many ways they're still private citizens. Even if they'd been found, police wouldn't publicly reveal details of how they were located until the trial. They'd only announce they'd been taken into custody.

Similarly, I don't think police will come out and directly say they believe them to be dead, they never say that about anyone until the body is found. But if they stop looking for them, then that's probably what they think.

Since, in this scenario, this would be accidental death, not a result of a crime, I think they'd share all the details with the family and leave it up to them to decide, and if they wish, to announce whether they believe them to still be alive. Families normally keep hope alive long after police and searchers give up.

All in all, I'm not sure we'll get too many details. AS seems to have learned not to talk to reporters, they may regret not staying on his good side.

 

[otto]

Have to subscribe and use your email account to get in and read the article.
And I certainly am not interested in giving my email address to the Globe and Mail.

Globe and Mail - Mop and Pail
RMPC - Royal Canadian Mounted Police

 

[MistyWaters]

would anyone knowledgeable about boats get in one without any oar(s)?

Surely not although I suppose if they thought they were as clever as Robinson Crusoe they might cut down a couple small trees to use as poles to navigate, meanwhile totally misjudging the force of the current.