Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #18

[CinNC]

I'm just sayin' that is a plausible story.

I laughed out loud at the part about pleasepleaseplease not talking about cardboard!
SBM but I think I snipped that part out.

 

[JoshuaTree]

Just out of curiosity – I am basing this question off of the original story of Kam and Bryer heading to Whitehorse .....

When I type into Google Maps, there are 3 routes from Port Alberni to Whitehorse. A trip through Liard Springs is not one of them, I had to physically move the cursor to change the route.

Furthest up I have been was as far as Terrace. So, for those of you who have travelled up through the far north, is there a vast difference of the 4 routes, other than time (single/divided highway, terrain, views, etc) to make one more preferable than the other?

I'm including 2 screen grabs of the route maps. The first one, the blue route is the quickest. The second one is through Liard (the one I actually had to move the cursor for) and is basically the same time (though more mileage). But if these 2 dudes, who apparently never travelled before, punched into Google or GPS, it should show the same as I got in pic 1, so how would they even know if there was a (possibly) better route?

What are your opinions or speculations on the route they chose?

 

[sandbar]

The game is called Rust and IIRC you put the sleeping bag in a location to respawn at that point after you die.

Thanks!

 

[CinNC]

To add in my two cents here.....I recently engaged a close friend of mine in discussion of this case, which she previously knew nothing about. She found it completely baffling, as many of us here. However, when I added in “oh and they were avid gamers”.... it was like a light bulb went on over her head. She wondered if they were living out a game. She also mentioned how violent and realistic they can be, so this theory seemed very plausible to her (she has a few nephews who are gamers). Anyway, maybe not so far fetched... when minds are steeped in these violent games, who knows what can take hold. MOO

That is disconcerting! I wonder if RCMP (for this case and others) have behavioral analysts who specifically understand the negative effects of gaming?

 

[Schmoosh]

That is disconcerting! I wonder if RCMP (for this case and others) have behavioral analysts who specifically understand the negative effects of gaming?

They publicly announced weeks ago that they had been working with their behavioural analysts.

"The RCMP has said its behavioural analysis unit is assisting investigators in the case of Bryer Schmegelsky and Kam McLeod, who were found dead from self-inflicted gunshot wounds in the northern Manitoba wilderness last week."

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/criminal-profile-death-1.5246192

 

[NJSleuth91]

That is disconcerting! I wonder if RCMP (for this case and others) have behavioral analysts who specifically understand the negative effects of gaming?

I know in one of the updates where the police were talking about possible motive, they said something about violent video games being looked at as a factor. And we know they have behavioral analysts.

I think it could have negative effects on brain development for some people, in combination with other factors like genetics and environment. I think people are way too quick to dismiss it, but just because most people who play video games are fine, doesn't mean it can't have a negative effect on some people. JMO.

 

[KR72]

Sheesh. Just watching the news, not really expecting updates from the RCMP on this case this weekend and now there's been another shooting in Texas.

Fingers crossed we hear something by the end of next week. The Mounties said their report would take a few weeks to complete, and they said that the day that the autopsy results came back, correct?

 

[sandbar]

Maybe your friend has read this -
This is Your Child's Brain on Video Games

Before anyone defends avid video game playing, I’m not saying it has a negative effect on everyone. But for some, gaming onself into a perpetual state of fight-or-flight can’t be a good thing.

And if a player gets "good" at it, and isn't successful in other developmental areas, it makes sense that they would want to keep playing. It's the one place they succeed

 

[sandbar]

Possibly but as recent as the last PC announcing the bodies were recovered the RCMP had not found a prior connection.

“However, according to Hackett, there is no evidence suggesting a link between the suspects and victims.”
B.C. murder suspects Bryer Schmegelsky, Kam McLeod believed to be dead

For sure.

 

[FactFinder3000]

For sure.

One thing I do wonder, though, is whether or not the perps could have seen Lucas and Chynna earlier in the day and went back later.

I still think an attempted sex crime is a very real possibility.

 

[sandbar]

Just out of curiosity – I am basing this question off of the original story of Kam and Bryer heading to Whitehorse .....

When I type into Google Maps, there are 3 routes from Port Alberni to Whitehorse. A trip through Liard Springs is not one of them, I had to physically move the cursor to change the route.

Furthest up I have been was as far as Terrace. So, for those of you who have travelled up through the far north, is there a vast difference of the 4 routes, other than time (single/divided highway, terrain, views, etc) to make one more preferable than the other?

I'm including 2 screen grabs of the route maps. The first one, the blue route is the quickest. The second one is through Liard (the one I actually had to move the cursor for) and is basically the same time (though more mileage). But if these 2 dudes, who apparently never travelled before, punched into Google or GPS, it should show the same as I got in pic 1, so how would they even know if there was a (possibly) better route?

What are your opinions or speculations on the route they chose?

I LOVE MAPS! So thank you for posting!
I'd guess they took the more interior of the the two routes.

 

[FactFinder3000]

I LOVE MAPS! So thank you for posting!
I'd guess they took the more interior of the the two routes.

It's quite possible, since they apparently did not have a firm destination, that they went to site C first (Fort St John), stayed there a bit, and were then headed up to Whitehorse.

 

[Kubirai]

Would it be too far fetched of a theory to speculate that Leonard actually met Kam and Bryer whilst also camping next to them and they spent a couple days together?

There is a chance that Prof. Dyck camped at Stikine River Provincial Park during the night of July 18/19, but he probably didn't go further north on Highway 37.

Kam/Bryer drove south on Highway 37 and was seen at Dease Lake on July 18. So if they camped together at all, it could only have been on July 18/19 night at Stikine River.

CTV and CBC showed the original Leonard Dyck murder site videos. Check the earliest threads for links, or search for "UBC Leonard Dyck" in YouTube.

Based on the murder site, it is much more likely that Prof. Dyck had pulled over and may have been resting or enjoying the view of the Stikine Forest below.

 

[Gina20]

Just out of curiosity – I am basing this question off of the original story of Kam and Bryer heading to Whitehorse .....

When I type into Google Maps, there are 3 routes from Port Alberni to Whitehorse. A trip through Liard Springs is not one of them, I had to physically move the cursor to change the route.

Furthest up I have been was as far as Terrace. So, for those of you who have travelled up through the far north, is there a vast difference of the 4 routes, other than time (single/divided highway, terrain, views, etc) to make one more preferable than the other?

I'm including 2 screen grabs of the route maps. The first one, the blue route is the quickest. The second one is through Liard (the one I actually had to move the cursor for) and is basically the same time (though more mileage). But if these 2 dudes, who apparently never travelled before, punched into Google or GPS, it should show the same as I got in pic 1, so how would they even know if there was a (possibly) better route?

What are your opinions or speculations on the route they chose?

The route they took is essential to understanding this story. Some things must be ruled out and others ruled in by that route. Some things among the many that we've already discussed:

Did they take a route to pass all three of the dams in the Hudson's Hope area? This could have meant a chance encounter with Lucas Fowler and Chynna Deese. AKA "dam-gate" and discussion of a specific video game with dams.

Did LF and CD stop to look at a herd of wild bison along their route? LF lived on a buffalo ranch and was known to appreciate these animals. Did that mean a stop in the place where rare Arctic butterflies live, a place with pink in the name? We know KM and LF had a photo enhanced with pink butterflies. IIRC, the place with the color in the name is banned from further discussion.

Was this a copycat of some other crime(s) from the past?

I don't want to go down the rabbit hole again myself until information is forthcoming, but we do know they stopped at a gas station in Fairview, AB, after they left B.C. It was right across the street from a place with excellent reviews for its bird cuisine. That's b*****-ch***** -gate, and it is banned to discuss that dish.

 

[CinNC]

They publicly announced weeks ago that they had been working with their behavioural analysts.

"The RCMP has said its behavioural analysis unit is assisting investigators in the case of Bryer Schmegelsky and Kam McLeod, who were found dead from self-inflicted gunshot wounds in the northern Manitoba wilderness last week."

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/criminal-profile-death-1.5246192

I have read they have behavioral analysts. It just makes me curious whether such experts are well versed in the psychological impact of gaming.

 

[Schmoosh]

Since it’s been said TSC has embellished his original description of the mud encounter, the sleeping bag portion could have been part of his new, improved story. JMO

Let's not bash someone the RCMP considers a credible witnesses. Just because TSC didn't mention the sleeping bag to the media in his initial interview doesn't mean he didn't mention it to the RCMP. In the media interview, it was about the personal interaction, not what he may or may not have seen in the surrounding area. His RCMP interview would have been much more in-depth about what he and his relatives saw around that time, and around the site.

 

[Schmoosh]

I have read they have behavioral analysts. It just makes me curious whether such experts are well versed in the psychological impact of gaming.

I sure hope so. There's another serious case the RCMP is currently handling that I won't get into for fear of being off-topic, but which shows they've dropped the ball on social media/gaming psychology before it was too late.

 

[OldFarmer]

This cases are getting me worried, so out of curiosity I took a quick look and without any effort at all immediately found three studies that say there’s no correlation between violent video games and aggression. Two I ignored, since I’ve never heard of the universities those studies are associated with - but one was from Oxford Internet Institute - associated with Oxford University - and that one I took a look at, because Oxford. It’s been many a long decade since I studied statistics, so I skimmed through the methodology section and I can’t say much about it one way or another, my brain is has turned to mush. But from what I read, the researchers did seem to go into that study with a fairly strong pro-video game bias, imo. Nonetheless: Oxford. Can’t deny the validity of that.

Then there’s the over 400 studies mentioned by the American Academy of Pediatrics that demonstrate a significant link between exposure to violent media and aggressive behaviour and thoughts. I didn’t read them and can’t comment on their methodology/validity at all.

I did read the American Psychological Association’s Resolution on Violent Video Games and to quote: “WHEREAS scientific research has demonstrated an association between violent video game use and both increases in aggressive behavior, aggressive affect, aggressive cognitions and decreases in prosocial behavior, empathy, and moral engagement” ….

And, more relevant to this discussion: “WHEREAS many factors are known to be risk factors for increased aggressive behavior, aggressive cognition and aggressive affect, and reduced prosocial behavior, empathy and moral engagement, and violent video game use is one such risk factor” (my bold)

I also read the American Academy of Pediatrics Guideline on Media Violence which asserts more or less the same thing and, interestingly, discusses why people tend to deny any correlation.

So do violent video games contribute to aggressive behaviour or is there no correlation? There are studies that support both hypotheses, which is super-duper common in such a soft science as psychology. You can find studies to support anything at all really. I remember, back in the day when I was a smoker, finding a study from UGA that demonstrated that nicotine improves cognitive function. I had that study pretty much memorized because it supported my smoking addiction; in between puffing and hacking I could almost quote that study verbatim.

IMO, studies can be manipulated - and they sure can be used to manipulate us.

But statistical correlation between violent video games and aggression or not, at this point I think it’s important to try (and I am trying) to keep an open mind either way regarding this issue. And I think it’s even more important to apply that rarest of things: a little common sense.


MOO (and sorry for the essay)

 

[Gina20]

Let's not bash someone the RCMP considers a credible witnesses. Just because TSC didn't mention the sleeping bag to the media in his initial interview doesn't mean he didn't mention it to the RCMP. In the media interview, it was about the personal interaction, not what he may or may not have seen in the surrounding area. His RCMP interview would have been much more in-depth about what he and his relatives saw around that time, and around the site.

The whole point is that the media have interpreted this story for us, just like they said a sleeping bag was seen in a torched vehicle, as if all the upholstery was incinerated, yet a sleeping bag remained intact, as if by magic. The sleeping bag seems to be where things get bent out of shape in what has been reported. Not sure why.

 

[Jan424]

That is disconcerting! I wonder if RCMP (for this case and others) have behavioral analysts who specifically understand the negative effects of gaming?

I don’t have any experience with gaming but she apparently knew way more than me thru her teen nephews, and her quick response was surprising. Very disconcerting, yes!