Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #20

[Trooper]

I wonder why they chose Lucas and Chynna as their victims... one could say, their initiation rite. … They must have passed other people on the road, others stopped as well, what so enraged them about Miss Deese and Mr Fowler? …

and Prof Dyck. … what made him the target of Kam and Bryer?

 

[Runningforthewind]

He went from "they were nice kids, something else must have happened, I can't see them commiting the crime, they were nice and polite" to "Bryer looked like a psycho, I am sure that he had a gun in his trousers and Kam acted like a leader". Every time he said the story, he made his role more imprtant and the story more dramatic. I wouldn't call that side of his story credible. JMO

Whar has been consistent is that Kam and Bryer did nothing to him but being polite.

He can't just keep on putting thoughts in their heads and intentions in their heart. Especially after he dmitted he changed his idea of the encounter after reading about them. JMO

I think his first inteview/statement was the right one.

 

[Grouper]

Maybe Kam did act like a leader in the situation, because he was literally in the driver’s seat, but I don’t see that as any indication of anything. JMO.

 

[Grouper]

I think if Kam kept up with friendly appearances and manners as described he might think he's outsmarting everyone and relish in doing so even.

No one knows if his niceness was genuine or an act. Also, by fooling people he might think it makes people less suspicious of him (and/or Bryer). I'm surprised some take social niceties as reasons they wouldn't kill anyone... Nice, friendly people kill too!

I don’t think social niceties negate a person from killing. I also don’t think being socially awkward, weird, a loner, etc, is a good basis for assuming someone is a killer. MOO

 

[zinny77]

My whole point in all this is that, Bryer and Kam acted politely I’d anxiously joked around with him, and drove off after shaking his hand and giving their names. Those facts have never changed in his story and that, to me, makes a credible witness

I agree with you on that part.

I was definitely talking about the Facebook group posts. His imagination is running wild now and he milked the attention a bit JMO .

At the end of the day, he saw them 15 minutes and knows nothing about them. JMO

 

[Jan424]

Of course. I wouldn’t say anything other than that we are all knee-deep in speculation. I also am interested in the views of others, and in my responses I try to balance them. Maybe I play devils advocate here but it’s never to directly attack anyone. That’s not the name of my game, and I apologize if I came across that way.

In my previous post I was just pointing out that Kam made others feel at ease in his presence. I think that’s not easy to do even if you are a so-called “good person” in general.

That quote has really stayed with me.

MOO. I’m a cow.

No biggie. I actually have always suspected Kam was a genuinely nice person before all this. It wouldn’t surprise me in the least. But that other perspective sounded possible as well. We just don’t know. JMO

 

[Trooper]

I’m not quite sure what this is to prove? It’s not as if people who commit murder are always 100% downright mean and bad so that everyone around them is living in a constant state of fear. If you’ve followed any murder trials, very seldom is that so.

In fact it’s common for family member and friends to have no idea, to be absolutely shocked, sometimes to the point of totally denying the truth in the face of concrete proof beyond conviction of guilt.

If opinions of friends and relatives told the story, we wouldn’t require police to conduct murder investigations or collect evidence.

People refuse to believe they could be fooled. It is inconceivable that it would be so easy to portray themselves as something other than what they are, but their whole lives depended on them fooling everyone, all the time. Part of the game.

Whole libraries are full of books about people who cannot grasp that their loved ones were ordinary killers. I recall Sebastian Burn's sister, a news reader, her face was totally full of utter conviction, that Sebastian just wouldn't do such of a thing.. she probably still maintains that position, to this day. To live life, sometimes one has to maintain a perspective that absolutely refutes fact.

Not much can change that, really, as it is a choice to believe.

 

[Grouper]

I agree with you on that part.

I was definitely talking about the Facebook group posts. His imagination is running wild now and he milked the attention a bit JMO .

At the endnof the day, he saw them 15 minutes and knows nothing about them. JMO

Yeah.... I think his Facebook posts were mostly in response to people looking for certain kinds of answers. People would ask a question and he’d respond with “well, maybe....” but I don’t think he really felt threatened or uneasy in the moment. JMO.

 

[Grouper]

No biggie. I actually have always suspected Kam was a genuinely nice person before all this. It wouldn’t surprise me in the least. But that other perspective sounded possible as well. We just don’t know. JMO

Anything is possible and I won’t deny that I could be proven wrong at any given moment. JMO.

 

[Jan424]

Anything is possible and I won’t deny that I could be proven wrong at any given moment. JMO.

Same here, for sure.

 

[Sillybilly]

He went from "they were nice kids, something else must have happened, I can't see them commiting the crime, they were nice and polite" to "Bryer looked like a psycho, I am sure that he had a gun in his trousers and Kam acted like a leader". Every time he said the story, he made his role more important and the story more dramatic. I wouldn't call that side of his story credible. JMO

<rs&bbm>

I'm not finding those direct quotes anywhere but here at WS from your post. Do you have an MSM link please?

 

[zinny77]

For those who think Kam was a psychopath/sociopath/angry inside person but hid it (you might be right, as said above, we all speculate, your specualtion is as good as mine) , why do you think once he snapped and killed, he stopped after three murders?

Same for Bryer, if he was supposedly disturbed and fantasizing about murder for years why stop at 3 muders.

Do you think they got their need to kill out then they were good? They just wanted to kill once to know the feeling? (But then why kill again?). Kiling wasn't what they thought ot would be? (Same).

I know nobody was in their head but I'd be curious to get people's theory about it. Because if it was a long time in the making, two disturbed individuals with a urge to kill, they got over it fast. And you would have to be pretty comitted to decide to go kill some people randomly.

I have seen nothing that woild make me think that they were reckless, completely stupid and distanced from reality to the point of going to kill for fun without realising what killing is (JMO of course, I wasn't in their head)

 

[zinny77]

<rs&bbm>

I'm not finding those direct quotes anywhere but here at WS from your post. Do you have an MSM link please?

It's in a Facebook group, posted by Tommy, so direct quotes, without any editing from a journalist

Edit : sorry for my ignorance, what is MSM?

 

[Grouper]

It's in a Facebook group, posted by Tommy, so direct quotes, without any editing from a journalist

Edit : sorry for my ignorance, what is MSM?

Mainstream Media (so news sources like globe and mail, etc) we’re not really allowed to post “facts” without MSM to back them up (social media isn’t allowed at all)

 

[Trooper]

For those who think Kam was a psychopath/sociopath/angry inside person but hid it (you might be right, as said above, we all speculate, your specualtion is as good as mine) , why do you think once he snapped and killed, he stopped after three murders?

Same for Bryer, if he was supposedly disturbed and fantasizing about murder for years why stop at 3 muders.

Do you think they got their need to kill out then they were good? They just wanted to kill once to know the feeling? (But then why kill again?). Kiling wasn't what they thought ot would be? (Same).

I know nobody was in their head but I'd be curious to get people's theory about it. Because if it was a long time in the making, two disturbed individuals with a urge to kill, they got over it fast. And you would have to be pretty comitted to decide to go kill some people randomly.

I have seen nothing that woild make me think that they were reckless, completely stupid and distanced from reality to the point of going to kill for fun without realising what killing is (JMO of course, I wasn't in their head)

maybe they had to stop and count out their ammo. No where is it recorded that they stopped and bought ammunition at all. Not even after the shootings /violence of Lucas and Chynna and Prof Dyck.

But they had to hold onto some, keeping it dry , for their own exit.

Running out of ammunition is the hallmark of the unprepared ditzy killer and these two young men were not the sharpest knives in the drawer. A five week placement at Walmart stonkered them, and nowhere does it say they got even that job on merit, it may have been a placement from the alternative school they went to , Walmart taking them on as a community service.

Lucas Fowler, a stranger in Canada, a tourist on a working visa , got a job in BC, no problem, and earned enough to shout Chynna up to BC to meet him and go travelling, but not these two.

Heading 'north' without a job in view, rather reckless, considering one must eat, one must keep that fuel tank full.

I think they knew exactly what killing was. That was the point, after all.

But it seemed they balked at hand to hand combat, without the disabling advantage of gunshot. That may have been a step too far . Too risky.

 

[MistyWaters]

I wonder why they chose Lucas and Chynna as their victims... one could say, their initiation rite. … They must have passed other people on the road, others stopped as well, what so enraged them about Miss Deese and Mr Fowler? …

and Prof Dyck. … what made him the target of Kam and Bryer?

Just my opinion, they sought out victims when they were the most vulnerable, during the middle of the night sound asleep, in a remote area where nobody would overhear or witness sounds of violence including screams or gunfire. LD may’ve also pulled over at the rest stop during the night, in his single vehicle much the same as L&C’s van was parked alone on the side of the road. It wouldn’t surprise me if both times they drove back and forth at least once, ensuring there were no other occupied vehicles or properties nearby.

Robbery may well have been a motive in both instances, a diabolical intent to pilfer through and steal personal possessions belonging to strangers which would’ve been off limits in the normal course of events. Armed robbery or murder, each involves exerting power and control over the victim, robbery taking (winning) whatever they wanted with nobody to stop them or question them “where did you get that”.

I don’t think the two were mastermind criminals at all but instead were motivated by greed, entitlement, and self-pity possibly due to anger involving their lives in PA. Their decision-making skills were sorrowfully lacking while experiencing life for very first time with nobody looking over their shoulder or critiquing their decisions. JMO

 

[zinny77]

Mainstream Media (so news sources like globe and mail, etc) we’re not really allowed to post “facts” without MSM to back them up (social media isn’t allowed at all)

Sorry, my bad, I dodn't know (you'd think that someone publicly sharing an information from their own social media account could be trusted as a credible source though? JMO)

 

[srper2]

I t

For those who think Kam was a psychopath/sociopath/angry inside person but hid it (you might be right, as said above, we all speculate, your specualtion is as good as mine) , why do you think once he snapped and killed, he stopped after three murders?

Same for Bryer, if he was supposedly disturbed and fantasizing about murder for years why stop at 3 muders.

Do you think they got their need to kill out then they were good? They just wanted to kill once to know the feeling? (But then why kill again?). Kiling wasn't what they thought ot would be? (Same).

I know nobody was in their head but I'd be curious to get people's theory about it. Because if it was a long time in the making, two disturbed individuals with a urge to kill, they got over it fast. And you would have to be pretty comitted to decide to go kill some people randomly.

I have seen nothing that woild make me think that they were reckless, completely stupid and distanced from reality to the point of going to kill for fun without realising what killing is (JMO of course, I wasn't in their head)

I think that if someone "snaps" and commits a murder, it doesn't usually involve seeking out and murdering strangers on the side of the road in the middle of the night. It is a spur of the moment reaction. It is not a spur of the moment reaction to choose to go and kill a stranger on the side of the road who has nothing whatsoever to do with you.

 

[Trooper]

Just my opinion, they sought out victims when they were the most vulnerable, during the middle of the night sound asleep, in a remote area where nobody would overhear or witness sounds of violence including screams or gunfire. LD may’ve also pulled over at the rest stop during the night, in his single vehicle much the same as L&C’s van was parked alone on the side of the road. It wouldn’t surprise me if both times they drove back and forth at least once, ensuring there were no other occupied vehicles or properties nearby.

Robbery may well have been a motive in both instances, a diabolical intent to pilfer through and steal personal possessions belonging to strangers which would’ve been off limits in the normal course of events. Armed robbery or murder, each involves exerting power and control over the victim, robbery taking (winning) whatever they wanted with nobody to stop them or question them “where did you get that”.

I don’t think the two were mastermind criminals at all but instead were motivated by greed, entitlement, and self-pity possibly due to anger involving their lives in PA. Their decision-making skills were sorrowfully lacking while experiencing life for very first time with nobody looking over their shoulder or critiquing their decisions. JMO

Nailed it. Totally.

 

[Trooper]

I t

I think that if someone "snaps" and commits a murder, it doesn't usually involve seeking out and murdering strangers on the side of the road in the middle of the night. It is a spur of the moment reaction. It is not a spur of the moment reaction to choose to go and kill a stranger on the side of the road who has nothing whatsoever to do with you.

No one snaps and kills. This is entirely the prerogative of the shifty defence lawyer. People choose to snap. It may take a nano second, it may take hours, but it's a choice.

<modsnip: Unnecessary graphic speculation>