Canadian hostage, wife & children freed from Afghanistan, husband arrested for abuse, Oct 2017 #3

[bears10]

Thank you! I meant to say this.

I’m staggered at the willful ignorance

misogyny, willful ignorance, potato, potahto

 

[otto]

lol I actually think the opposite. that there would be prosecutors in the USA that wouldn’t hesitate to try this case. Most people aren’t keen on taliban sympathizers here. That 9/11 thingy might have something to do with it. So the chance to prosecute a wannabe terrorist who manipulated one of our citizens into going to Afghanistan and then (“Allegedly“- eyeroll) abusing her and their children? Yeah. JB was too scared to come here for a reason. What that reason is, I think most of us here can make our own reasonable assumptions. (Most of us)

Also- you just said yourself that there may have been a lack of evidence. Which is what people have been trying to tell you for hours. That a not guilty verdict doesn’t necessarily mean innocent. It could mean they can’t prove guilt. If your wife beat you up tonight while you were home alone, and you called the cops, how would you prove she beat you if you didn’t have witnesses or cameras? I would hope the cops and the public wouldn’t adamantly accuse you of lying bc of lack of proof.

In the USA, prosecutors are elected. In Canada, they are civil servants on the path to becoming appointed judges. Are domestic "he said she said" cases commonly heard at trials in all states, some states, any states?

Coleman wasn't manipulated into going to Russia any more than she was manipulated into going to South America. She was in her mid to late twenties when she made her choices.

The judge said that there is a lack of evidence, that both parties were unable to convey the truth. Does that mean that Coleman is unable to speak factually, and that prosecutors had an unreliable witness prone to imaginings. Did prosecutors proceed to trial to keep everyone happy? Dismissed means "come back when you have more evidence." Surely prosecutors knew that would happen?

What everyone knows is that neither of them are normal after their 5 years of captivity. Their consensual S&M practices didn't help. A lot of what they did would be considered assault by normal standards, but they consented to that type of relationship except for something that Coleman can't describe without leaving doubt about fact.

 

[otto]

Other than death, which they both faced, Coleman had much more reason to be (or feel) terrorized than Boyle simply by virtue of being a woman vulnerable to sexual abuse (among other indignities.) Again, this is not a competition, but you seem unwilling to acknowledge that women are at a huge disadvantage in a male-dominated society or situation. I’m not sure why you won’t acknowledge that fact...and it is a fact.

Remember the stories about what backwoods men did with their sheep? I would not be surprised if Boyle was also raped, but I doubt he would ever admit to it.

It is a fact that men and women are victims of rape.

 

[otto]

If the charges were dismissed, were they dismissed with or without prejudice? Does it makes a difference as to whether additional charges can be brought?

 

[Lilibet]

Remember the stories about what backwoods men did with their sheep? I would not be surprised if Boyle was also raped, but I doubt he would ever admit to it.

It is a fact that men and women are victims of rape.

Why on earth are you bringing bestiality into this discussion?

Of course men are raped. Look, the difference between us is that I would be sorry to know if Boyle was raped even though I have a very poor opinion of him, but you have no empathy for CC whatsoever and look for equivalencies in every situation. My point has gone through your head and out the other side. I’m done.

 

[otto]

Golly, I never heard tell of what them backwoods men did with their sheep. Are you saying they raped them poor little sheep? Someone shoulda whupped their asses!

Why on earth are you bringing bestiality into this discussion. Filthy man.

Of course men are raped. Look, the difference between us is that I would be sorry to know if Boyle was raped even though I have a very poor opinion of him, but you have no empathy for CC whatsoever and look for equivalencies in every situation. My point has gone through your head and out the other side. I’m done.

If it is obvious that men can also be raped, why is the fact that Coleman could have been raped held as an example that women are more prone to harm as hostages than men?

I have no empathy for the timing of the abuse allegations and the children being whisked out of the country.

 

[Stunned]

Do you mean that Coleman and Boyle were denied contraception, or that Coleman was denied contraception but Boyle wasn't?

Like the Taliban was gonna give him condoms?

 

[Stunned]

James Foley was not opposing the regime. He was a journalist. He lost his head. Kayla Mueller did not convert, she was killed.

Peter Kassig, a 26-year-old from Indiana, started a non-profit organization called Special Emergency Response and Assistance (SERA). He converted and still he lost his head. That was ISIS, this was Taliban.

I think that Coleman and Boyle did what they had to do to stay alive. If Boyle said that his wife is a sympathizer, maybe they would go easy on her. I'm not buying the idea that he was buddies with the terrorists and his wife was their hostage.

I cannot imagine that either of them was fit to parent the children after the release.

James Foley was not opposing the regime. He was a journalist. He lost his head. Kayla Mueller did not convert, she was killed.

Peter Kassig, a 26-year-old from Indiana, started a non-profit organization called Special Emergency Response and Assistance (SERA). He converted and still he lost his head. That was ISIS, this was Taliban.

I think that Coleman and Boyle did what they had to do to stay alive. If Boyle said that his wife is a sympathizer, maybe they would go easy on her. I'm not buying the idea that he was buddies with the terrorists and his wife was their hostage.

I cannot imagine that either of them was fit to parent the children after the release.

I have to admit I agree with your last paragraph. But then when
I saw her away from him, being a mom. I felt good. I felt she'd make it.

 

[Stunned]

Yet you have extreme empathy for a man who begged internet strangers for pictures of murdered and sexually abused children. That is very concerning to me.

What?

 

[otto]

Yet you have extreme empathy for a man who begged internet strangers for pictures of murdered and sexually abused children. That is very concerning to me.

Would it feel different if this was a debate?

 

[bears10]

Would it feel different if this was a debate?

I’m not grasping. Sorry, it’s late here. But no, I don’t think I’d feel any different if I read your posts in any other situation. Joshua Boyle said himself he would be forever indebted to anyone who could provide him the photos he so badly wanted of murderer and sexually abused children. Combined with all of his other glaringly obvious issues, I find it concerning when people on the internet who don’t even know him can support this behavior. It is not normal to be infatuated with visuals of children murdered and raped by nazis. But he def deserves custody of his young kids fosho.

 

[bears10]

What?

?? I find it troubling that anyone can be so supportive of Joshua boyle for multiple reasons, but especially because of his document Wikipedia activity.

 

[MyBelle]

I’m not grasping. Sorry, it’s late here. But no, I don’t think I’d feel any different if I read your posts in any other situation. Joshua Boyle said himself he would be forever indebted to anyone who could provide him the photos he so badly wanted of murderer and sexually abused children. Combined with all of his other glaringly obvious issues, I find it concerning when people on the internet who don’t even know him can support this behavior. It is not normal to be infatuated with visuals of children murdered and raped by nazis. But he def deserves custody of his young kids fosho.

BBM. Where on earth are you finding even a hint of that here? Maybe it is time to take a break because nobody here is "infatuated with visuals of children murdered." We're not just "people on the internet." We're on a forum that has TOS.

Both parents in this case have experienced an incredible physical and emotional ordeal and I have no doubt that in their upcoming child custody case--no matter where it takes place--the Judge will order psychological evaluations of both parents and will search for the best parenting arrangement possible because the goal is to act in the best interest of the children.

JMO

 

[bears10]

BBM. Where on earth are you finding even a hint of that here? Maybe it is time to take a break because nobody here is "infatuated with visuals of children murdered." We're not just "people on the internet." We're on a forum that has TOS.

Both parents in this case have experienced an incredible physical and emotional ordeal and I have no doubt that in their upcoming child custody case--no matter where it takes place--the Judge will order psychological evaluations of both parents and will search for the best parenting arrangement possible because the goal is to act in the best interest of the children.

JMO

I was referring to JB being infatuated with those pictures.

 

[Lilibet]

I was referring to JB being infatuated with those pictures.

I think it was quite clear what you meant.

 

[nuff]

Canadian law is the same for everyone across the country regardless of wealth. Of note, the law doesn't change from Province to Province as it does from State to State.

Having an experienced lawyer helps, and that can cost more, but that is true everywhere.

If it were in any way true that Cdn. justice (as distinct from the law) were the same regardless of wealth, explain the incarceration rates for our Indigenous people and people of colour. And the numbers of children taken from their parents. What struck me most in Doody's decision was his statement that (on the night in question, which is the only period relevant to the charges), he did not see proof that CC was in fear. She ran away into a freezing winter night with no shoes. That was evidence of criminal harassment at the least, but he didn't see it that way.

 

[Intermezzo]

Boyle found not guilty on all counts.

"A judge has dismissed charges against former Afghanistan hostage Joshua Boyle, who had been accused of assaulting his wife Caitlan Coleman.

Ontario Court Judge Peter Doody says the Crown failed to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Boyle, 36, committed multiple offences against Coleman, including assault, sexual assault and unlawful confinement."​

Former Afghanistan hostage Joshua Boyle found not guilty on all 19 charges
Former Afghanistan hostage Joshua Boyle found not guilty on all counts

This doesn't surprise me. I have wondered if these accusations were related to the goal to remove his children from Canada without a proper custody hearing.

 

[Intermezzo]

What a shame. Very disappointing.

Are the kids currently in the US? What if CB doesn’t return to canada for the custody case, or if she doesn’t return with the kids in general? My only experience with custody is one with both parties within the same state, actually, even the same county, and even that was complicated.

Kids are in the US with CC.
There are treaties in place between both countries
The Family Law case was started in Ontario so as of now Ontario has jurisdiction.

International custody disputes should consider children’s interests, according to new Supreme court guidelines
2018
International custody disputes should consider children's interests, according to new Supreme court guidelines

To date, judgements in Canada have been based mainly on what a parent's circumstances and 'intentions' were

 

[Intermezzo]

Ex-Taliban hostage cleared of all charges in sexual assault trial

The best synopsis of the case, the verdict and the issues I've found.

So the Judge did not believe either one of them
He found the list of Rules as circumstantial evidence?????? really????
He didn't think JB was credible and didn't think CC was reliable
Judge believed JB was controlling and JB admitted to hitting CC, reason being was because she asked for it. Did that not mean anything considering the Judge did not believe him.

Stunned

 

[Stunned]

So they are in a war zone being held captive under deplorable conditions, and one of their captors tells a fellow terrorist to run to CVS and pick up some more condoms please! He should have shown some self restraint and respect for his wife by keeping her safe from pregnancy.