CASO records

[MzOpinion8d]

Page 23:

Why in the world would Sheriff Pagel want an officer to interview high school seniors about TH whereabouts on 11/04?

I'm wondering if TH had been taking senior pics for some of them?

 

[BigCityAccountant]

The Zander road ......

Metz (heard and smelled something)... his property is at the corner of Jambo Creek and Zander Road

Hope this link will work, I googled it, I don't think it's the same location as the address we had though.

https://www.google.ca/maps/dir/Aver...db265990401675!2m2!1d-87.6745778!2d44.3129996


Here is another map, with the address on the back of the sign (3302 Zander Rd.), it shows about 3.9 miles east of this intersection (if it's the right one... wasn't there more than one 3302 Zander Rd's?)

https://www.google.ca/maps/dir/3302...db265990401675!2m2!1d-87.6745778!2d44.3129996

Thanks Missy!!! Yes, there were several addresses for 3302 Zander Rd. One I believe was closer to Denmark, one in Two Rivers and I believe (not 100%) one in Manitowoc. I wasn't familiar with that address personally. I think Zool had a post about the 3 different Zanders Road locations somewhere.

One think I would like to mention in regard to whether or not you could smell a terrible smell 5 miles away. It was late October or early November and you have to factor in the Lake Breeze. Avery's and even the 3302 Zanders Road that Missy got thru google maps is very close to the lake. I think with the wind coming off the lake it would in fact be possible to smell something 5 miles away. I guess kind of similar to Lake Effect Snow. When you are on the lake like that it tends to be more windy and colder than areas more inland. I know our cabin is much cooler in the summer than areas further inland.

 

[BigCityAccountant]

Missy~~ I hadn't googled that address. I think I googled the one in Denmark. But what is very very interesting is I think that might be the location on the picture from KZ's floor. I know you and Zerbert looked at it. The one that I thought might be the Tish Mills cell tower location. It actually might have been the 3302 Zander Road location that you have here. So, I think Dexter is right~~~there must be something significant about that location that we are not aware of.

 

[BigCityAccountant]

On Google maps what appears to be 3302 Zanders is not the little old residence that appears on the map. That is actually 3423. 3302 must be the farm/wooded area across the street. The North side of the street are even numbers while the South side are odd numbered addresses.

 

[missy1974]

I'm not sure if Zander Rd has any significance. It might just be where he bought that car from and he still had the sign and wrote TH's number down on it because it was handy at the time. It was never explained in the trial, I don't see it in the MTSO reports, and now I don't see it in the CASO reports (again, I used 'find', and it doesn't always work that great in these new docs lol)

JMO but I really doubt that the address has any significance and it was probably the handiest piece of paper he had when she gave him her cell number at some point. I am one of those that writes notes on the handiest piece of paper around lol And I grab the handiest pen/pencil/marker too.

 

[missy1974]

Thanks Missy!!! Yes, there were several addresses for 3302 Zander Rd. One I believe was closer to Denmark, one in Two Rivers and I believe (not 100%) one in Manitowoc. I wasn't familiar with that address personally. I think Zool had a post about the 3 different Zanders Road locations somewhere.

One think I would like to mention in regard to whether or not you could smell a terrible smell 5 miles away. It was late October or early November and you have to factor in the Lake Breeze. Avery's and even the 3302 Zanders Road that Missy got thru google maps is very close to the lake. I think with the wind coming off the lake it would in fact be possible to smell something 5 miles away. I guess kind of similar to Lake Effect Snow. When you are on the lake like that it tends to be more windy and colder than areas more inland. I know our cabin is much cooler in the summer than areas further inland.

I get that the wind can carry smells.... but it does look like there are other residences between his property and the Avery's, and we know the Avery's had neighbours too.... no one else reported this smell or "whoosh", that is why I think they should have looked closer to this guys property for a burn site, and maybe they did and we don't know it. He didn't testify, and actually, wasn't even on the State's witness list, maybe it was something that was later explained and we just don't know it?

http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-c...ondence-from-DA-Kratz-Re-States-Witnesses.pdf


Here is the historical weather data for Manitowoc County (I tried to look at Two Rivers but when I went to history, it shows Man. County) According to this, the wind was going west... and then it was calm around the time he said he heard/smelled something.

https://www.wunderground.com/histor...reqdb.zip=54241&reqdb.magic=1&reqdb.wmo=99999


h

 

[pcrum12]

where can i find the CASO doc all together?

 

[ZOOL]

where can i find the CASO doc all together?

http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/CASO-Investigative-Report.pdf

 

[BigCityAccountant]

I had noticed something funny. I'm not sure when these were requested, but there documentation in the reports about SA's lawyers gaining access to some evidence back in 2012. However, there is nothing from recently meaning 2015 or 2016. I wondered if that was on purpose or if the documents were not requested until a more current date. I would have suspected that it would contain some requests from KZ as well? I wonder if they held back releasing that part of these documents?

 

[missy1974]

I know that whoever requested them waited for quite awhile before getting them BCA (at least 3 or more weeks), some of the FOIA requests for exhibits were denied ( I would have to go back and find what exactly was denied). Zellner didn't technically start working on this case until mid-January, so I'm not sure if they would only release whatever was there as of the date the request was made or if it would be current. I know it doesn't answer your question lol but that's all I know LOL

 

[BigCityAccountant]

Another question comes to mind. Wouldn't there be blood on the hammer and rake if those items were used the might of the murder? I mean if blood was in the vehicle it should have also been on the items around the car and then also on the hammer and rake as well. I wonder if those items were tested for blood?

 

[missy1974]

Hi BCA Blood on the hammer and rake.... I think that could easily be explained by saying he washed up/covered his cut, or whatever before he touched it. I don't recall ever coming across them being tested. I mean, c'mon, they didn't even test the bedding LOL

 

[BigCityAccountant]

Hi BCA Blood on the hammer and rake.... I think that could easily be explained by saying he washed up/covered his cut, or whatever before he touched it. I don't recall ever coming across them being tested. I mean, c'mon, they didn't even test the bedding LOL

HI!
Well, unless he used those tools the next morning or something that doesn't make logical sense. I doubt in the midst of committing murder, he stopped to practice good hygiene. I read the ice shack was on the property. I'm still going back to that ice shack. It had a lock on it and he lived in it when he met Jodi, so there had to be a bed in there or some type of sleeping arrangement. I wonder if they even checked it for any type of evidence.

 

[Limaes]

Not shocked to read that a "Kathy" who also once worked at AT, went to SA's to also photograph a vehicle and was creeped out by him.

Sent from my SM-N910G using Tapatalk

 

[ZOOL]

Not shocked to read that a "Kathy" who also once worked at AT, went to SA's to also photograph a vehicle and was creeped out by him.

Sent from my SM-N910G using Tapatalk

I chuckled when I read that too. But what creeps me out more than anything else are Zellner's ethics: If she manages to vacate Avery's conviction and walks out of the prison hand-holding that murderer, she will be responsible for unleashing a monstrous ghoul on more women. I have no respect for Zellner or her team.

 

[Hippiemomof5]

I chuckled when I read that too. But what creeps me out more than anything else are Zellner's ethics: If she manages to vacate Avery's conviction and walks out of the prison hand-holding that murderer, she will be responsible for unleashing a monstrous ghoul on more women. I have no respect for Zellner or her team.

This is what frustrates me the most about reading here or elsewhere... If she gets SA freed and proves he didn't kill TH (and likely points to or proves another person did it), there are going to be so many people who still believe he's a monster and he deserves to be in jail. That's not fair to SA at all!! We all encounter "creepy" people and know men who are abusive to the woman in their lives but most of them don't deserve the treatment SA has been given nearly his entire adult life!!!

 

[ZOOL]

This is what frustrates me the most about reading here or elsewhere... If she gets SA freed and proves he didn't kill TH (and likely points to or proves another person did it), there are going to be so many people who still believe he's a monster and he deserves to be in jail. That's not fair to SA at all!! We all encounter "creepy" people and know men who are abusive to the woman in their lives but most of them don't deserve the treatment SA has been given nearly his entire adult life!!!

So you do not believe that he has been abusive to the women mentioned throughout the CSAO file, that he has not violated some of them, and that he will be able to restrain himself in the future? You and I strongly disagree. In my opinion he is a career criminal and belongs behind bars until death. If my remarks frustrate you, or upset you, then please ignore me from now until the Earth freezes over.

 

[Hippiemomof5]

So you do not believe that he has been abusive to the women mentioned throughout the CSAO file, that he has not violated some of them, and that he will be able to restrain himself in the future? You and I strongly disagree. In my opinion he is a career criminal and belongs behind bars until death. If my remarks frustrate you, or upset you, then please ignore me from now until the Earth freezes over.

He's in jail on a MURDER charge. If zellner finds him innocent, then NO, he should not be in jail. He's not there for abusing Jodi, or the possible sexual relations with his niece, he's there for MURDER. That also means if he's innocent, someone else who IS A MURDERER is walking free!

 

[Hippiemomof5]

I have to add... I have an abusive father. He beat my mother their entire six years together, while cheating on her. He beat us kids and used us as pawns to upset my mother, even refusing to return me after a weekend visit when I was three, for several weeks. I have memories of him abusing girlfriends, and my brothers and me as we got older. I barely have a relationship with him now and get worked up when I need to see him, and really the only reason I continue to see him (1-2x a year) is because I don't want to feel guilty when he dies. He's not a good person, he's intimidating and mean and still verbally abusive. He's never served any time for any of the evil things he's done, never been arrested and never spent a day in jail. And as much as I struggle with hating him, if he were charged with murder in a situation like this, I just could not say, "well he deserves to be in jail anyway." It's not the way our justice system is supposed to work and it's definitely not how my heart works. I find it pure evil that someone could say someone should rot in jail for something they did not do (if zellner gets him exonerated).

 

[missy1974]

I don't have a lot of time to post.... but just want to say I'm sorry for what you had to go through Hippiemom. I was lucky and my parents and family are great (of course we always have some sort of drama lol but nothing abusive)

:hug:

And I also agree, if he is innocent of murder, he shouldn't be in jail for murder. Just because he's a terrible person, IF he is innocent of this murder, then he shouldn't be there FOR the murder. Period. No matter how terrible of a person he is or might be.