CO- Dylan Redwine, 13, Vallecito, 19 November 2012 - #27

[princessk]

they had:
1) a body
2) DNA linking Sigg to two different cases (re: direct knowledge that there was a predator on the loose)

(yes the fbi was brought in very early on)


(off topic: I just posted an update in the Jessica Ridgeway thread: the judge ruled to keep the preliminary hearing sealed from the media and the public to avoid tainting the future jury pool..)

They were warning the public before the body was found. I remember that case very well.

 

[Psychic Sleuth]

What are the alternatives?

He didn't run away.
I can't see him vanishing voluntarily (not running away but hanging out with family/friends and not telling anyone by now)
If he was murdered at or near MRs house, the police would almost certainly have found evidence.

He was either kidnapped or he fell into the lake.

BBM

Do you think it's possible that it was a pre-planned kidnapping by MR? Or are you saying kidnapped by a stranger?

IF he fell into the lake while fishing do you think there would be evidence around the lake? Like his backpack or fishing pole etc? Most people don't cast the line with a backpack on their backs. I guess it's possible he was walking along the lake and fell in with all of that but then he would be near the shore. And he did know how to swim.

 

[SCHMAE]

What are the alternatives?

He didn't run away.
I can't see him vanishing voluntarily (not running away but hanging out with family/friends and not telling anyone by now)
If he was murdered at or near MRs house, the police would almost certainly have found evidence.

He was either kidnapped or he fell into the lake.

Fell or otherwise came to rest in the lake..........

 

[PaulR]

BBM

Do you think it's possible that it was a pre-planned kidnapping by MR? Or are you saying kidnapped by a stranger?

IF he fell into the lake while fishing do you think there would be evidence around the lake? Like his backpack or fishing pole etc? Most people don't cast the line with a backpack on their backs. I guess it's possible he was walking along the lake and fell in with all of that but then he would be near the shore. And he did know how to swim.

I don't think MR kidnapped him. I've explained why before - obviously MR isn't with DR right now, and the only end-game for kidnapping will result in him going to prison. This holds even if some family members of his kidnapped Dylan. (All this assuming Dylan is alive of course.)

I agree that there probably would have been evidence around the lake if he was fishing; if he was fly-fishing then he probably would have brought a tackle box with him for the lures. It's possible that it all fell into the lake, or someone came by after Dylan fell in and took what looked like fishing gear someone abandoned, but I don't think that's likely either.

I think there are three possibilities:
- Dylan was kidnapped by someone (not MR) and is still alive
- Dylan was kidnapped by someone (not MR) and is dead
- MR killed Dylan

I think the kidnapping by someone other than MR makes the most sense with the evidence we have, as MR killing Dylan would almost certainly result in some kind of evidence left behind, and we haven't heard about it nor has MR been arrested.

EDIT: and I want to emphasize "with the evidence we have." If the police come out and say they found a few liters of DR's blood in MR's house, that will change my mind to say the least.

 

[Ten-96]

The longer Dylan is missing without any bad guy passing my own personal sniff tests the more I suspect that he was an accident victim. (I'm well aware that all noses work differently.) I wonder whether Dylan packed up his belongings and headed off to his friend's house and something happened. Maybe he was bushwhacking and got lost. Maybe a mountain lion got him... I researched the mountain lion attack angle a little bit and it is not outside the realm of possibility.

I realize that the lack of communication on Dylan's part after Sunday evening is a sticking point for many, but I'm not convinced we're really in a position to say "well, Dylan would have..." anything. Dylan is a 13 year old child and at any given time in any given circumstance 13 year olds don't behave as responsible adults would; they don't necessarily behave as their friends would. Shoot, they don't even necessarily behave as they would have the day before or the day after.

 

[Psychic Sleuth]

I don't think MR kidnapped him. I've explained why before - obviously MR isn't with DR right now, and the only end-game for kidnapping will result in him going to prison. This holds even if some family members of his kidnapped Dylan. (All this assuming Dylan is alive of course.)

I agree that there probably would have been evidence around the lake if he was fishing; if he was fly-fishing then he probably would have brought a tackle box with him for the lures. It's possible that it all fell into the lake, or someone came by after Dylan fell in and took what looked like fishing gear someone abandoned, but I don't think that's likely either.

I think there are three possibilities:
- Dylan was kidnapped by someone (not MR) and is still alive
- Dylan was kidnapped by someone (not MR) and is dead
- MR killed Dylan

I think the kidnapping by someone other than MR makes the most sense with the evidence we have, as MR killing Dylan would almost certainly result in some kind of evidence left behind, and we haven't heard about it nor has MR been arrested.

EDIT: and I want to emphasize "with the evidence we have." If the police come out and say they found a few liters of DR's blood in MR's house, that will change my mind to say the least.

So you really don't think he fell in the lake? Do you think it's possible that MR had Dylan taken out of the country and was planning on joining him at some point?

I'm not saying these are my opinions...just getting a feel for your thoughts.

I agree that we don't know much about any evidence LE may or may not have found. Do you think it's possible that they may have found some evidence but it's not enough for an arrest?

 

[Psychic Sleuth]

The longer Dylan is missing without any bad guy passing my own personal sniff tests the more I suspect that he was an accident victim. (I'm well aware that all noses work differently.) I wonder whether Dylan packed up his belongings and headed off to his friend's house and something happened. Maybe he was bushwhacking and got lost. Maybe a mountain lion got him... I researched the mountain lion attack angle a little bit and it is not outside the realm of possibility.

I realize that the lack of communication on Dylan's part after Sunday evening is a sticking point for many, but I'm not convinced we're really in a position to say "well, Dylan would have..." anything. Dylan is a 13 year old child and at any given time in any given circumstance 13 year olds don't behave as responsible adults would; they don't necessarily behave as their friends would. Shoot, they don't even necessarily behave as they would have the day before or the day after.

Well if a mountain lion got him surely the lion wouldn't eat the backpack and fishing pole. So those are out there somewhere. I realize they haven't covered every inch of ground, but if that's the case eventually those things will surface.

 

[mmmagique]

No worries

Kidnapping is the only scenario I think they are looking at - whether Dylan is alive or not, he was still kidnapped.

What makes you believe the bolded?

 

[mmmagique]

What are the alternatives?

He didn't run away.
I can't see him vanishing voluntarily (not running away but hanging out with family/friends and not telling anyone by now)
If he was murdered at or near MRs house, the police would almost certainly have found evidence.

He was either kidnapped or he fell into the lake.

Those are not the only two possibilities. A person can put in a lot of distance and/or cover up with a 12 hour window.

 

[SCHMAE]

The longer Dylan is missing without any bad guy passing my own personal sniff tests the more I suspect that he was an accident victim. (I'm well aware that all noses work differently.) I wonder whether Dylan packed up his belongings and headed off to his friend's house and something happened. Maybe he was bushwhacking and got lost. Maybe a mountain lion got him... I researched the mountain lion attack angle a little bit and it is not outside the realm of possibility.

I realize that the lack of communication on Dylan's part after Sunday evening is a sticking point for many, but I'm not convinced we're really in a position to say "well, Dylan would have..." anything. Dylan is a 13 year old child and at any given time in any given circumstance 13 year olds don't behave as responsible adults would; they don't necessarily behave as their friends would. Shoot, they don't even necessarily behave as they would have the day before or the day after.

You raise some good points. As far as the phone....I'm not sure I've ever believed its' as 'telling' as all that that it went quiet. I've got a 14 yr daughter and if she and her friends get in a huff about something, she may very well set the phone down, turn it off, walk away and do anything else. It is curious the phone went quiet and could mean something but it could also mean he was super tired and had nothing to say and didnt' care to hear what his friends had to say and just wanted to ' veg out' the rest of the evening in peace.........get a good night of sleep because he had a long , funfilled day planned for Monday .

 

[azgrandma]

The longer Dylan is missing without any bad guy passing my own personal sniff tests the more I suspect that he was an accident victim. (I'm well aware that all noses work differently.) I wonder whether Dylan packed up his belongings and headed off to his friend's house and something happened. Maybe he was bushwhacking and got lost. Maybe a mountain lion got him... I researched the mountain lion attack angle a little bit and it is not outside the realm of possibility.

I realize that the lack of communication on Dylan's part after Sunday evening is a sticking point for many, but I'm not convinced we're really in a position to say "well, Dylan would have..." anything. Dylan is a 13 year old child and at any given time in any given circumstance 13 year olds don't behave as responsible adults would; they don't necessarily behave as their friends would. Shoot, they don't even necessarily behave as they would have the day before or the day after.

I would go with the mountain lion theory if there was something left behind. IF a mountain lion was on the loose, which in that neck of the woods there are, it would probably have left more evidence. They don't eat back packs and DR would have had to go pretty far off the trail for all evidence of an animal attack to not be noticed. IMO

 

[Tennlyn]

I would go with the mountain lion theory if there was something left behind. IF a mountain lion was on the loose, which in that neck of the woods there are, it would probably have left more evidence. They don't eat back packs and DR would have had to go pretty far off the trail for all evidence of an animal attack to not be noticed. IMO

And I think LE ruled out this scenario. They believe it was criminal: abduction/kidnapping or foul play. Numerous links to the articles previously, and all are in the media thread. :moo:

 

[mck16]

I cannot find the Walmart picture of Dylan. Can someone tell me if he had his backpack on in that picture? tia

 

[Ten-96]

And I think LE ruled out this scenario. They believe it was criminal: abduction/kidnapping or foul play. Numerous links to the articles previously, and all are in the media thread. :moo:

Yes, I know that that's what they believe, but to the best of my knowledge that plan doesn't seem to be working out so well for them at the moment. Of course, it MAY BE: don't know. Anyway, if they are running into brick walls I hope we can assume they'll revisit scenarios they have previously excluded.

 

[mmmagique]

I cannot find the Walmart picture of Dylan. Can someone tell me if he had his backpack on in that picture? tia

He didn't appear to. (imo)

ETA: Here's a LINK to a site that has both pics.

 

[Psychic Sleuth]

It is my understanding that they have searched around the lake pretty thoroughly.

 

[PaulR]

Those are not the only two possibilities. A person can put in a lot of distance and/or cover up with a 12 hour window.

If they went with Dylan involuntarily, it's kidnapping.

If Dylan went away voluntarily, I find it hard to believe that he wouldn't contact his mother or his brother.

 

[asyousay]

We don't know if evidence was left behind as they have not found a crime scene and from what I can gather its got miles of hills and land. And a window of 10 hours for a possible cover up .

MOO

 

[PaulR]

What makes you believe the bolded?

They found nothing at the lake. Subsequent searches were along the road leading to Durango. And they may have searched other areas (I think Ransom hinted at this.)

 

[mck16]

He didn't appear to. (imo)

ETA: Here's a LINK to a site that has both pics.

I can't really see the backkpack in the Walmart photo,but the way his arms are splayed I think he does. ty