Deceased/Not Found CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #55 *ARREST*

[MassGuy]

They wouldn't? I would have thought first they would have caught PF in his lies and on video to KB's etc., and then got further video, etc. from the furniture store, warrants to search her or his home, found blood on the toilet and more, so much more, or for his phone and of course KB's... Etc., Etc.

In the spirit of debate of course.

Jmo.

ETA: And then KK's number, checking into that and her, and her lies and have taken a strong stance on a deal for maybe say 20 years...

Please read the arrest warrant, it will clear this up for you.

They had no murder without KK.

They merely had a bloody scene, one that they didn’t know they had until KK started talking.

 

[pcrum12]

Well, I do not believe KK learned a lesson or will never do something again, I see her as a certain type; how many times has her ex taken her back or helped her? She had several/many times to learn a lesson over almost day long trips to Colorado to kill and plot, etc. I do not think I know a person who would lie after all of that to LE and not be shaking in their cowgirl boots because it is LE. She was allegedly advised to go talk to her friend's attorneys.

This was a horse dung deal. Some go on about how they needed her so it is all cool or we have to accept it but then they go on about how much evidence the prosecution has.

Phone records, etc. and search warrants do not all need the Honey to obtain.

They did not even get the location of poor dead Kelsey Berreth out of the deal. Wow.

Not directed at you. I respect your opinion and no one will change mine. Evidence may do so. My mind is still partly open--this has not been to trial. I never close my mind the entire way because twists and surprises can come.

KK:

Does not have to report to court in person, just check in every so often.

Has no limits on travel or anything.

Insisted with her attorney that cameras cannot be pointed at her, etc.

By her own admission ran around with a metal rod, a baseball bat, coffee and played a fake meeting with KB and tried to set up a PLAY date and now she runs free.

I could go on.

Again, just saying and no offense. As I said, I respect other's opinions and I sure don't normally respond to all I disagree with, in fact I rarely post this much these days and certainly not here.

Jmvho.

bbm. Exactly what I was trying to say earlier.

 

[ilovechili]

bbm. Exactly what I was trying to say earlier.

You said it first though! Great realization!

 

[Kapua]

Yaaaas, ITA! Please pass the oyster stuffing while we're at it

I'll have seconds on the cranberry sauce. Bring on the trial!

 

[MsBetsy]

They wouldn't? I would have thought first they would have caught PF in his lies and on video to KB's etc., and then got further video, etc. from the furniture store, warrants to search her or his home, found blood on the toilet and more, so much more, or for his phone and of course KB's... Etc., Etc.

In the spirit of debate of course.

Jmo.

ETA: And then KK's number, checking into that and her, and her lies and have taken a strong stance on a deal for maybe say 20 years...

I don't think LE would have ripped up the floorboards, examining the crime scene more thoroughly, using different chemicals to look for blood evidence, or look in all the places that KK mentioned she left blood in, if it were not for her giving them all that information.

It was all the blood evidence found in the condo that led them to believe Kelsey was murdered.

IMO

 

[pcrum12]

I don't think LE would have ripped up the floorboards, examining the crime scene more thoroughly, using different chemicals to look for blood evidence, or look in all the places that KK mentioned she left blood in, if it were not for her giving them all that information.

It was all the blood evidence found in the condo that led them to believe Kelsey was murdered.

IMO

Didn’t the parents call police about blood they found in the bathroom? Was that before or after they got kk to talk?

 

[ilovechili]

I’ve never heard of a trial delayed because it might stretch into the holidays.

When a holiday occurs during a lengthy trial, the jury gets an extended break.

Kelsey was brutally murdered, and I’d be willing to bet that that her family wants justice sooner, rather than later.

Thanksgiving Turkey be damned. Please pass the gravy.

There are people and opinions one can find online and elsewhere that CA was allegedly found not guilty on all charges because the jury was sequestered and wanted to go home.

People do not mind not being with their family on Thanksgiving or not having time to shop for Christmas for their kids, make cookies and so forth and have their lives disrupted?

I for one have not even seen the jury yet so I guess I can't hazard a guess as to whether any will be wearing holiday sweaters or not, etc.

Debates are fun. Keep in mind that is what it is, someone told me that

Jmo.

 

[MsBetsy]

Didn’t the parents call police about blood they found in the bathroom? Was that before or after they got kk to talk?

Yes, they did, and I'm not sure exactly when they first got the information from KK about where she left the blood, so maybe it's just that the spots she told them about matched the evidence that was found.

It's been so long I can't remember the dates when they interviewed her, and we didn't find out about her until further into the investigation.

Maybe it was the parents that led them to investigate further.

If someone knows for sure I will just delete or edit my post.

 

[MassGuy]

There are people and opinions one can find online and elsewhere that CA was allegedly found not guilty on all charges because the jury was sequestered and wanted to go home.

People do not mind not being with their family on Thanksgiving or not having time to shop for Christmas for their kids, make cookies and so forth and have their lives disrupted?

I for one have not even seen the jury yet so I guess I can't hazard a guess as to whether any will be wearing holiday sweaters or not, etc.

Debates are fun. Keep in mind that is what it is, someone told me that

Jmo.

My comment was that I’ve never seen a trial delayed because it might stretch into a holiday.

It’s not like they’re going to be in the courtroom on Thanksgiving Day.

If this trial is delayed, it won’t be because of the baking schedule of the jury.

 

[Dave F.]

Please read the arrest warrant, it will clear this up for you.

They had no murder without KK.

They merely had a bloody scene, one that they didn’t know they had until KK started talking.

I never thought I would say anything like this, but well played, MG. Well played. IMO

 

[GordianKnot]

And the consensus here is not the consensus everywhere or even overall imo, it is a big wide world/a big planet/and then there is the universe too and this is a mostly quiet case thread here with nothing much new.

I do not defend either PF or KK and truly do not see how people can defend either.

Jmo though

Snipped and bolded by me for focus:

We're currently on Thread #55 in a case that hasn't even gone to trial yet, that hardly qualifies as being a quiet case thread here.

In terms of there being not much new ground to cover, that's to be expected.

It's not like DA May or PF are going to be doing any Dateline or 20/20 interviews between now and the trial.

Fortunately, with PF's murder trial slated to begin next month, there's plenty of case material for all of us to review. e.g., search warrants, arrest affidavit, hearings, motions, etc. in advance.

I have not seen a single post or poster here defending either PF's or KK's actions. Ever.
<modsnip>

JMO.

 

[PommyMommy]

Didn’t the parents call police about blood they found in the bathroom? Was that before or after they got kk to talk?

CB found blood on the toilet Dec. 6 and sent a photo of it to CBI Agent Slater. She also told them a bath mat was missing. When they examined the bathroom, they found more blood (bathtub, towel rack, door knobs, etc. IIRC).

KK's interview in Colorado Springs was Dec. 20. PF was arrested the next morning.

Bathroom blood - information from CB.
Blood under floorboards, on fireplace, etc. (murder scene) - information from KK.

MOO

ETA: links

Accomplice: Kelsey Berreth was blindfolded, beaten, burned by fiancé

https://www.courts.state.co.us/user...ofinterest/2018CR330/002/18-106 Execution.pdf

 

[ilovechili]

I believe it was MyBelle who posted that if the trial starts October 28 it might wrap up by Thanksgiving anyway. That’s a good point.

I get your point too. If KB was here she could dress her little girl in a Halloween costume, make some favorite dishes for Thanksgiving and make a Christmas list but, as you said, KB isn’t here.

And PF is locked up and not going anywhere.

Since KB isn’t here, I am not sure the DA would want to put the good people who elected him through a gory trial and point out that KB isn’t there to enjoy those things. Maybe it would make the citizenry feel guilty that they can enjoy their children and relatives during the holidays. Maybe keep them from being able to eat a good Thanksgiving meal or shop for their own little ones all in the name of the DA winning a case.

After all, PF is locked up and not going anywhere.

And since PF will be locked up throughout the holidays and if the case against him is solid, there are no worries.

And of course judges and court personnel have families and need their holidays too. As to defense attorneys, public defenders, witnesses and you name it, they do as well.

I do not think that long is blocked for court but who knows...

I see it also as more likely next year but I am not going to cry if it goes on in October, I will be thrilled in fact.

Jmo.

 

[Seattle1]

CB found blood on the toilet Dec. 6 and sent a photo of it to CBI Agent Slater. She also told them a bath mat was missing. When they examined the bathroom, they found more blood (bathtub, towel rack, door knobs, etc. IIRC).

KK's interview in Colorado Springs was Dec. 20. PF was arrested the next morning.

Bathroom blood - information from CB.
Blood under floorboards, on fireplace, etc. (murder scene) - information from KK.

MOO

ETA: links

Accomplice: Kelsey Berreth was blindfolded, beaten, burned by fiancé

https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/04th_Judicial_District/Teller/caseofinterest/2018CR330/002/18-106 Execution.pdf

Yes @PommyMommy -- that's how I remember it.

CB got Investigators to come back to check out the bathroom.

KK gave them the narrative of where PF beat KB to death, and told them where to look for blood splatter including the fireplace rock wall, window smear, ceiling, etc. When Investigators located this evidence that corroborated KK's story, they knew she'd been there cleaning up for PF.

MOO

ETA: IMO, WPPD released the crime scene without discovering any of the blood evidence because they were not looking for it. They bought PF's lies that KB was not missing involuntarily -- that she was unstable, and took off.

 

[ilovechili]

KK not only allowed the murder of Kelsey to take place, but by her own admission, made three separate attempts on Kelsey’s life.

Also by her own admission, she helped clean up the crime scene, destroyed evidence, misled an investigation, and was complicit in a coverup.

The argument that she should be not be on the streets, is based on a false premise:

That someone said she should be on the streets in the first place.

Not a single person here has ever expressed the opinion that KK is being sentenced to an adequate prison term for her involvement.

What is being expressed, is that this deal is worth it if it puts Kelsey’s killer away.

Yah, I agree, there are negotiators and then there are negotiators...

I have yet to see a trial.

KK names PF as the killer. Don't make me stick up for him--if that was your intent--it is what you are causing. The prosecution can really thank you.... I have yet to even see one video or pic of either of them with KB since what month...

A couple of hour body burning fire give me a break.

And a horrendous bat beating death. I guess clean-up teams way overcharge then if KK could do all that by HERSELF in that time.

Logic--she is not believable with much.

And I seriously doubt more than a few on the pros and LE team believe everything. Nor do some of us.

Lock em up together and give them a couple of bales of hay--that is justice.

As for debate...

Jmo. Lol.

 

[MassGuy]

Yah, I agree, there are negotiators and then there are negotiators...

I have yet to see a trial.

KK names PF as the killer. Don't make me stick up for him--if that was your intent--it is what you are causing. The prosecution can really thank you.... I have yet to even see one video or pic of either of them with KB since what month...

A couple of hour body burning fire give me a break.

And a horrendous bat beating death. I guess clean-up teams way overcharge then if KK could do all that by HERSELF in that time.

Logic--she is not believable with much.

And I seriously doubt more than a few on the pros and LE team believe everything. Nor do some of us.

Lock em up together and give them a couple of bales of hay--that is justice.

As for debate...

Jmo. Lol.

You have yet to see a trial, because there hasn’t been one yet.

In the Mackenzie Lueck case, the killer burned her body, and ultimately deposited it in another location.

Something like that probably took place here. There simply wasn’t the time to burn her to an extent that she would be effectively cremated.

That doesn’t change the fact that an accelerant and burned plastic was found. That fire happened.

Clean up teams don’t overcharge if they effectively clean up crime scenes. KK didn’t do it effectively, not according to Slater’s court testimony.

Clearly her nursing skills helped her with this, as the cleanup was effective enough in the sense that the CBI missed it at first.

They found that blood though, exactly where she said it would be.

The justice system is based on a system of laws. Hate for a vile person doesn’t mean they are a killer. Evidence and facts do that.

The evidence and facts point to PF, and not KK as the one who swung the bat.

If she wasn’t there, she wasn’t there.

He’s on trial for murder, not her.

 

[ilovechili]

Exactly.

To me, it is the question of their little girl. If the police had not arrested him so quickly, she would have been a hostage on that Franch. If his mother had gotten custody, it would have spelled doom for that poor child.

That^^ is what makes me 'okay' with this sweet deal for KK. It is a trade off.

If they had not accepted that deal with her, it would have taken much longer for them to get probable cause for warrants and they may not have ever found the evidence needed. He would have had more time to scramble around and cover.

PF lied.
PF was the significant other.
PF was seen on video at KB's.
In their own records as far as they know PF was the last to see her or have contact.
PF and his ma had the baby from then forward.
I do not think getting a warrant would be all that difficult...
It might have helped if they noticed any blood or issues first...

KB's date of death allegedly 11/22
PF's arrest 12/21.
The little girl was present allegedly when her mother died and was in the hands of Ma, PF, and who knows, etc. for at least a month.
And the Defense is trying to put quite a record for appeal out there.
I do not favor them, I am just saying of course that is what they are doing.

I do NOT want this case wrecked, that is where most agree... PF needs to go away and I can worry about KK after as can we all...

Jmo.

 

[MyBelle]

Well, I do not believe KK learned a lesson or will never do something again, I see her as a certain type; how many times has her ex taken her back or helped her? She had several/many times to learn a lesson over almost day long trips to Colorado to kill and plot, etc. I do not think I know a person who would lie after all of that to LE and not be shaking in their cowgirl boots because it is LE. She was allegedly advised to go talk to her friend's attorneys.

This was a horse dung deal. Some go on about how they needed her so it is all cool or we have to accept it but then they go on about how much evidence the prosecution has.

Phone records, etc. and search warrants do not all need the Honey to obtain.

They did not even get the location of poor dead Kelsey Berreth out of the deal. Wow.

Not directed at you. I respect your opinion and no one will change mine. Evidence may do so. My mind is still partly open--this has not been to trial. I never close my mind the entire way because twists and surprises can come.

KK:

Does not have to report to court in person, just check in every so often.

Has no limits on travel or anything.

Insisted with her attorney that cameras cannot be pointed at her, etc.

By her own admission ran around with a metal rod, a baseball bat, coffee and played a fake meeting with KB and tried to set up a PLAY date and now she runs free.

I could go on.

Again, just saying and no offense. As I said, I respect other's opinions and I sure don't normally respond to all I disagree with, in fact I rarely post this much these days and certainly not here.

Jmvho.

BBM. And let's not forget the drugs KK said she had with her. Where are those drugs today?

JMO

 

[MassGuy]

BBM. And let's not forget the drugs KK said she had with her. Where are those drugs today?

JMO

KK never said she had drugs with her. What she did say, was that PF instructed her to put Valium and Ambien in her coffee.

ETA: Link
https://www.courts.state.co.us/user...lication and Affidavit for Arrest Warrant.pdf

 

[Seattle1]

And the Defense is trying to put quite a record for appeal out there.
I do not favor them, I am just saying of course that is what they are doing.

^^SBM

Trying to figure out what I've missed.

I read your timeline.

What exactly is the defense currently recording that's going to pave their way to an appeal?

You lost me! TIA