Father says DNA could solve one of country’s biggest murder mysteries: Who killed JonBenét Ramsey

[Deleted member 187229]

Actually, Dr. Meyer was uncertain about the strangulation and head blow. After consulting several experts to examine the autopsy findings, most agreed that the blow to the head came first, followed by the strangulation which could have occurred 45 minutes (or even longer) later. Dr. Henry Lee's estimate was at least 15 minutes after the head blow.

Henry Lee never examined jonbenet’s brain. Can you show me the evidence dr meyer consulted with several experts about jonbenets autopsy findings? Because I believe that is a rumour. Why would Dr Myer consult with experts about a finished and concluded autopsy? He'd already given his professional findings.

 

[CloudedTruth]

I've read through the past several pages and felt the urge to chime in. One thing that has struck me is what more than one "police person" (IE: Police, Detective, Ex FBI) has said..... and it has stuck with me. One of those people is Jim Clemente on a podcast somewhere that I'll never find again but when pressed on "Who" - he would not even comment as the Ramseys have sued him once already.

The best the interviewer could get out of him was this: (Paraphrased) "It's the only crime before or since like this. Not another case in the world is like this."

I've heard that before and it was NOT Jim Clemente who said it - thus - "more than one" police person has said it. I can't cite that either. Sorry, but I'm not lying.

So..... I think that in itself is a big clue - without being a clue. It was said with a hint of "glee" - like "You've got to be kidding me..." type thing..... Never before or since.

Now, as I have stated elsewhere and someone else stated here: NOTHING MAKES SENSE!!! You go round and round in circles with the evidence. If you believe John did it - there is circumstantial evidence to point you in that direction.
If you think Patsy did it - there is circumstantial evidence to point you in that direction.
If you think Burke did it - there is circumstantial evidence to point you in that direction.
If you think an intruder did it it - you know the drill by now....

My firm belief is that while the Ramseys may not have actually killed her - they ABSOLUTELY WERE INVOLVED - the crime scene was ABSOLUTELY STAGED - and the fact that the "evidence" takes you wherever your mind wants to take you is ABSOLUTELY BY DESIGN..... exactly!! NOTHING MAKES SENSE - *THAT* is the clue.....

Now you can start asking yourself questions like: "How do you get away with the perfect murder from day 1" - "How do you have the perfect answer for every question from day 1 to avoid the words 'you're under arrest'...?"

How??? I believe the 911 call was NOT the first call made - and that, in fact, John called at least one, perhaps several extremely powerful people who all had a stake in seeing the Ramseys walk free.... Financial? Sure. Political? Almost certainly. (image)

As I stated elsewhere - the police must have eventually come to this same conclusion: They had help - who did they call before 911? Phone records were requested - The Ramseys fought it. Months and months later when the records were finally produced, Johns cell phone records for the month of December were completely blank. Not 1 call.

And that is why more than one police person has said "This is the only case like this in the world. Hasn't happened before or since." - And they say it with such a "wink , wink" voice that you are lead to believe - "Yeah, sure." I'm not buying it at all -- (the police) -- but at the same time, they have no case. Truly astonishing in a murder case. You can't pull that off without extremely powerful help from the outside. My opinion only - that's exactly what happened.

Gut feeling???? JonBenet was being paraded around in front of a bunch of pedos, the parents knew it, maybe even participated in SA but they absolutely "knew" who was doing what .... and someone wanted a "Christmas gift" so to speak and things got way out of hand. As sick and twisted as this will sound - I kinda secretly wonder if the oversized "size 12" panties was actually meant for Burke. Very sick. But the whole crime is.

Oh, yes. Spot on.

I have always said that John called someone that night, they got expert advice about what to do and the fix was in. Police were told right away to treat the Ramseys as victims. IMO anyone who thinks the investigation was botched by incompetent police is simply naive. It is much more than that, it goes far deeper than that. And it very well may involve a group who were into some very dark & disgusting extra curricular activities. There are some interesting clues that are still floating around and most often referred to as rumors. They persist. Could be coincidence, could be where there's smoke there's fire. There are certainly some interesting undercurrents that have to do with the Ramsey's church. I'd love to see someone do a deep dive there. And AH's history of how he handled cases involving the abuse of children is a red flag waving all over the place.

Whenever I go down this road I tell myself I'm mistaken. It's too dark to consider. It's the stuff of conspiracy theorists. But we do know that it happens, much more than we like to think. I have a personal experience and knowledge of something very dark and sinister that happened in my home town. It was also kept quiet. Not only because of who was involved, but because it was just too much for people to believe. So they hushed it up and for the most part made it go away. Exposing it would have harmed the reputation of the community. So much for having the right to know what's going on under your nose....

This is a controversial post, I know. I think your last comments say it well.....very sick. But the whole crime is. Indeed.

 

[Bekind89]

Oh, yes. Spot on.

I have always said that John called someone that night, they got expert advice about what to do and the fix was in. Police were told right away to treat the Ramseys as victims. IMO anyone who thinks the investigation was botched by incompetent police is simply naive. It is much more than that, it goes far deeper than that. And it very well may involve a group who were into some very dark & disgusting extra curricular activities. There are some interesting clues that are still floating around and most often referred to as rumors. They persist. Could be coincidence, could be where there's smoke there's fire. There are certainly some interesting undercurrents that have to do with the Ramsey's church. I'd love to see someone do a deep dive there. And AH's history of how he handled cases involving the abuse of children is a red flag waving all over the place.

Whenever I go down this road I tell myself I'm mistaken. It's too dark to consider. It's the stuff of conspiracy theorists. But we do know that it happens, much more than we like to think. I have a personal experience and knowledge of something very dark and sinister that happened in my home town. It was also kept quiet. Not only because of who was involved, but because it was just too much for people to believe. So they hushed it up and for the most part made it go away. Exposing it would have harmed the reputation of the community. So much for having the right to know what's going on under your nose....

This is a controversial post, I know. I think your last comments say it well.....very sick. But the whole crime is. Indeed.

I was sooooo wrong about everything that I believed. I have always believed that JR did this, however, I couldn't accept that PR could have as well. Not any longer.
After going back over the evidence after years of not following this case, there is not a doubt in my mind that she was involved, how involved we will probably never know.
There's too much evidence against both for anyone to know which parent actually harmed poor JB, but both are certainly involved. ( JMO).

It is very difficult for me to believe that a nine year old child was capable of such brutality. Anything is possible, but I just can't see it.
Yes, it does appear that very powerful people made sure the truth will never be known. They still are.
Frighteningly powerful people.
All of this is just my opinion, nothing more.

 

[CloudedTruth]

Henry Lee never examined jonbenet’s brain. Can you show me the evidence dr meyer consulted with several experts about jonbenets autopsy findings? Because I believe that is a rumour. Why would Dr Myer consult with experts about a finished and concluded autopsy? He'd already given his professional findings.

It is not uncommon for coroner's to seek expert opinions especially in murder cases. In this instance, Dr. Meyer asked Dr. Andrew Sirotnack, Assoc. Professor of Pediatrics at Colorado University and Director of Kempe Child Protection Team at the Kempe Children's Center and the Children's Hospital to examine the body to confirm the suspicion of SA.

Additional experts were called in by Boulder PD to weigh in on both the SA aspect as well as the head injury. Here's a list which includes their opinions:

MDs​

Vincent Di Maio, chief medical examiner, Bexar County, Texas

Michael Dobersen, Arapahoe County Medical Examiner

Robert H. Goldberg, forensic pathologist

Todd C. Grey, Utah state chief medical examiner

Tom Henry, Denver chief medical examiner

Leigh Hlavaty, Deputy Chief Medical Examiner, Wayne County Medical Examiner's Office

David Jones, Professor of Preventative Medicine and Biometrics at University of CO Health Sciences Center, former clinical director and associate professor at Kempe Children's Center

Robert Kirschner, retired deputy chief medical examiner of Cook County, Ill

Richard Krugman, Professor of Pediatrics and Dean of the University of Colorado School of Medicine, former director of the Kempe Children's Center.

John McCann, Clinical Professor of Medicine, Dept of Pediatrics at University of California Davis

John E. Meyer, Boulder County Coroner

James Monteleone, Professor of Pediatrics and Gynecology, Saint Louis University School of Medicine

Valerie Rao [erroneously referred to as "Virginia Rau" in the Bonita Papers], Miami-Dade County Medical Examiner

Lucy B. Rorke, pediatric neuropathologist, The Children’s Hospital of Philadelphia

Andrew Sirotnak, associate professor of pediatrics at Colorado University and director of Kempe Child Protection Team at the Kempe Children's Center and The Children's Hospital.

Werner Spitz, Former Wayne County Chief Medical Examiner

Lokman Sung, Assistant Medical Examiner, Wayne County Medical Examiner's Office

Cyril Wecht, Allegheny County Coroner & Medical Examiner

Charles G. Wilber, retired director of the Forensic Science Laboratory at Colorado State University

Ronald Wright, Director of Forensic Pathology, University of Miami School of Medicine and Broward County Florida Medical Examiner

Di Maio

Dobersen *

Goldberg

Grey

Henry

Hlavaty

Jones *

Kirschner

Krugman **

McCann **

Meyer *

Monteleone **

Rao **

Rorke *

Sirotnak **

Spitz *

Sung

Wecht

Wilber

Wright

[th]

Acute Vaginal Trauma​

[/th][th]

Prior Vaginal Trauma​

[/th]​

[td]

Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td]​

[td]

Strangulation - craniocerebral trauma​

[/td][td]

Yes (?)​

[/td][td]

More information needed​

[/td]​

[td]

Yes​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td]​

[td]

Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation​

[/td]​

[td]

Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation 15+ minutes later​

[/td][td]

Yes (?)​

[/td][td]

Impossible to tell from just autopsy report​

[/td]​

[td]

Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation​

[/td]​

[td]

Yes​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td]​

[td]

Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation​

[/td][td]

Surface​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td]​

[td]

Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation (?)​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td]​

[td]

Yes​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td]​

[td]

Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation "Agreed with Rorke" on interval​

[/td][td]

Unknown/withheld for court​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td]​

[td]

Yes​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td]​

[td]

Yes​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td]​

[td]

Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation 45-120 minutes later​

[/td]​

[td]

Yes​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td]​

[td]

Strangulation (manual) - craniocerebral trauma - vaginal trauma - strangulation (ligature)​

[/td][td]

Maglite flashlight​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td][td]

No clear indication​

[/td]​

[td]

Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation​

[/td]​

[td]

Vaginal trauma/strangulation - craniocerebral trauma​

[/td][td]

Heavy flashlight or golf club​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td]​

[td]

Yes​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td]​

[td]

Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation 20-60 minutes later​

[/td][td]

Flashlight or baseball bat​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td][td]

Yes​

[/td]​

*: Officially consulted on case by Boulder Police Dept./Boulder District Attorney's Office/Boulder County Coroner's Office
**: Child sexual abuse expert consulted by BPD/Coroner

 

[Deleted member 187229]

It is not uncommon for coroner's to seek expert opinions especially in murder cases. In this instance, Dr. Meyer asked Dr. Andrew Sirotnack, Assoc. Professor of Pediatrics at Colorado University and Director of Kempe Child Protection Team at the Kempe Children's Center and the Children's Hospital to examine the body to confirm the suspicion of SA.

Additional experts were called in by Boulder PD to weigh in on both the SA aspect as well as the head injury. Here's a list which includes their opinions:

MDs​

Vincent Di Maio, chief medical examiner, Bexar County, Texas

Michael Dobersen, Arapahoe County Medical Examiner

Robert H. Goldberg, forensic pathologist

Todd C. Grey, Utah state chief medical examiner

Tom Henry, Denver chief medical examiner

Leigh Hlavaty, Deputy Chief Medical Examiner, Wayne County Medical Examiner's Office

David Jones, Professor of Preventative Medicine and Biometrics at University of CO Health Sciences Center, former clinical director and associate professor at Kempe Children's Center

Robert Kirschner, retired deputy chief medical examiner of Cook County, Ill

Richard Krugman, Professor of Pediatrics and Dean of the University of Colorado School of Medicine, former director of the Kempe Children's Center.

John McCann, Clinical Professor of Medicine, Dept of Pediatrics at University of California Davis

John E. Meyer, Boulder County Coroner

James Monteleone, Professor of Pediatrics and Gynecology, Saint Louis University School of Medicine

Valerie Rao [erroneously referred to as "Virginia Rau" in the Bonita Papers], Miami-Dade County Medical Examiner

Lucy B. Rorke, pediatric neuropathologist, The Children’s Hospital of Philadelphia

Andrew Sirotnak, associate professor of pediatrics at Colorado University and director of Kempe Child Protection Team at the Kempe Children's Center and The Children's Hospital.

Werner Spitz, Former Wayne County Chief Medical Examiner

Lokman Sung, Assistant Medical Examiner, Wayne County Medical Examiner's Office

Cyril Wecht, Allegheny County Coroner & Medical Examiner

Charles G. Wilber, retired director of the Forensic Science Laboratory at Colorado State University

Ronald Wright, Director of Forensic Pathology, University of Miami School of Medicine and Broward County Florida Medical Examiner

Di Maio

Dobersen *

Goldberg

Grey

Henry

Hlavaty

Jones *

Kirschner

Krugman **

McCann **

Meyer *

Monteleone **

Rao **

Rorke *

Sirotnak **

Spitz *

Sung

Wecht

Wilber

Wright

[th]
Acute Vaginal Trauma

[/th][th]
Prior Vaginal Trauma

[/th]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Strangulation - craniocerebral trauma

[/td][td]
Yes (?)

[/td][td]
More information needed

[/td]
[td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation

[/td]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation 15+ minutes later

[/td][td]
Yes (?)

[/td][td]
Impossible to tell from just autopsy report

[/td]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation

[/td]
[td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation

[/td][td]
Surface

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation (?)

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation "Agreed with Rorke" on interval

[/td][td]
Unknown/withheld for court

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation 45-120 minutes later

[/td]
[td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Strangulation (manual) - craniocerebral trauma - vaginal trauma - strangulation (ligature)

[/td][td]
Maglite flashlight

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td][td]
No clear indication

[/td]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation

[/td]
[td]
Vaginal trauma/strangulation - craniocerebral trauma

[/td][td]
Heavy flashlight or golf club

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation 20-60 minutes later

[/td][td]
Flashlight or baseball bat

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]​

*: Officially consulted on case by Boulder Police Dept./Boulder District Attorney's Office/Boulder County Coroner's Office
**: Child sexual abuse expert consulted by BPD/Coroner

You said dr Myer consulted experts about his autopsy findings. He did consult with experts during the autopsy and they examined jonbenets body. The autopsy findings are consistent with the findings of dr Myer and the consultant pathologists. The other experts you listed, did not view jonbenets body. They were hired by the boulder police after the autopsy was concluded and only had photographs and dr Myers findings to work with. The police didn’t like dr Myers findings that the blow to the head happened almost simultaneously with the strangulation because it threw their child abuse and cover up theory out the window that she was hit in the head first followed by a cover up. The evidence clearly states, in black and white, she was hit in the head and strangled at the same time, so close together that dr Myer couldn’t determine which one happened first. The proof being, the very small 7-8cc haemorrhage and no brain swelling. Dr Myer said the brain had an overall normal architecture.

 

[Deleted member 187229]

It is not uncommon for coroner's to seek expert opinions especially in murder cases. In this instance, Dr. Meyer asked Dr. Andrew Sirotnack, Assoc. Professor of Pediatrics at Colorado University and Director of Kempe Child Protection Team at the Kempe Children's Center and the Children's Hospital to examine the body to confirm the suspicion of SA.

Additional experts were called in by Boulder PD to weigh in on both the SA aspect as well as the head injury. Here's a list which includes their opinions:

MDs​

Vincent Di Maio, chief medical examiner, Bexar County, Texas

Michael Dobersen, Arapahoe County Medical Examiner

Robert H. Goldberg, forensic pathologist

Todd C. Grey, Utah state chief medical examiner

Tom Henry, Denver chief medical examiner

Leigh Hlavaty, Deputy Chief Medical Examiner, Wayne County Medical Examiner's Office

David Jones, Professor of Preventative Medicine and Biometrics at University of CO Health Sciences Center, former clinical director and associate professor at Kempe Children's Center

Robert Kirschner, retired deputy chief medical examiner of Cook County, Ill

Richard Krugman, Professor of Pediatrics and Dean of the University of Colorado School of Medicine, former director of the Kempe Children's Center.

John McCann, Clinical Professor of Medicine, Dept of Pediatrics at University of California Davis

John E. Meyer, Boulder County Coroner

James Monteleone, Professor of Pediatrics and Gynecology, Saint Louis University School of Medicine

Valerie Rao [erroneously referred to as "Virginia Rau" in the Bonita Papers], Miami-Dade County Medical Examiner

Lucy B. Rorke, pediatric neuropathologist, The Children’s Hospital of Philadelphia

Andrew Sirotnak, associate professor of pediatrics at Colorado University and director of Kempe Child Protection Team at the Kempe Children's Center and The Children's Hospital.

Werner Spitz, Former Wayne County Chief Medical Examiner

Lokman Sung, Assistant Medical Examiner, Wayne County Medical Examiner's Office

Cyril Wecht, Allegheny County Coroner & Medical Examiner

Charles G. Wilber, retired director of the Forensic Science Laboratory at Colorado State University

Ronald Wright, Director of Forensic Pathology, University of Miami School of Medicine and Broward County Florida Medical Examiner

Di Maio

Dobersen *

Goldberg

Grey

Henry

Hlavaty

Jones *

Kirschner

Krugman **

McCann **

Meyer *

Monteleone **

Rao **

Rorke *

Sirotnak **

Spitz *

Sung

Wecht

Wilber

Wright

[th]
Acute Vaginal Trauma

[/th][th]
Prior Vaginal Trauma

[/th]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Strangulation - craniocerebral trauma

[/td][td]
Yes (?)

[/td][td]
More information needed

[/td]
[td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation

[/td]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation 15+ minutes later

[/td][td]
Yes (?)

[/td][td]
Impossible to tell from just autopsy report

[/td]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation

[/td]
[td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation

[/td][td]
Surface

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation (?)

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation "Agreed with Rorke" on interval

[/td][td]
Unknown/withheld for court

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation 45-120 minutes later

[/td]
[td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Strangulation (manual) - craniocerebral trauma - vaginal trauma - strangulation (ligature)

[/td][td]
Maglite flashlight

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td][td]
No clear indication

[/td]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation

[/td]
[td]
Vaginal trauma/strangulation - craniocerebral trauma

[/td][td]
Heavy flashlight or golf club

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]
[td]
Craniocerebral trauma - strangulation 20-60 minutes later

[/td][td]
Flashlight or baseball bat

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td][td]
Yes

[/td]​

*: Officially consulted on case by Boulder Police Dept./Boulder District Attorney's Office/Boulder County Coroner's Office
**: Child sexual abuse expert consulted by BPD/Coroner

None of the links have information about jonbenets auropsy. And none of those consultants viewed jonbenets body.

 

[CloudedTruth]

You said dr Myer consulted experts about his autopsy findings. He did consult with experts during the autopsy and they examined jonbenets body. The autopsy findings are consistent with the findings of dr Myer and the consultant pathologists. The other experts you listed, did not view jonbenets body. They were hired by the boulder police after the autopsy was concluded and only had photographs and dr Myers findings to work with. The police didn’t like dr Myers findings that the blow to the head happened almost simultaneously with the strangulation because it threw their child abuse and cover up theory out the window that she was hit in the head first followed by a cover up. The evidence clearly states, in black and white, she was hit in the head and strangled at the same time, so close together that dr Myer couldn’t determine which one happened first. The proof being, the very small 7-8cc haemorrhage and no brain swelling. Dr Myer said the brain had an overall normal architecture.

Even Dr. Meyer admitted he wasn’t sure, so he put “almost simultaneously” as what he thought was the best option in the face of not being confident. If you look at the list, it’s impressive. And the majority were in agreement. They did not examine the body but most (except Wecht and Spitzer) had access to all forensic autopsy materials. The findings speak for themselves and Dr. Meyer has not disputed. It’s clearly listed that Boulder County Coroner’s Office was involved in the consultations.

 

[CloudedTruth]

None of the links have information about jonbenets auropsy. And none of those consultants viewed jonbenets body.

Sirotnick did, he was local and available at the time. It’s common practice to provide forensic materials for further consultation. It’s unrealistic to think experts from across the country could be immediately available to be present at an autopsy. In this case, the Ramseys were accusing BPD of holding the body hostage. Meyer expedited release of the body as a result.

 

[Chypre]

I was sooooo wrong about everything that I believed. I have always believed that JR did this, however, I couldn't accept that PR could have as well. Not any longer.
After going back over the evidence after years of not following this case, there is not a doubt in my mind that she was involved, how involved we will probably never know.
There's too much evidence against both for anyone to know which parent actually harmed poor JB, but both are certainly involved. ( JMO).

It is very difficult for me to believe that a nine year old child was capable of such brutality. Anything is possible, but I just can't see it.
Yes, it does appear that very powerful people made sure the truth will never be known. They still are.
Frighteningly powerful people.
All of this is just my opinion, nothing more.

I am currently considering, in my mind
IF the adult Ramseys did it together with no Burke. . . edit to add: or even after Burke,
when, how, does a conversation start about the need to stage it like that.
A generous view is JR decides to do the staging and Patsy writes the note. The note is so long, so very long because JR takes so long, so very long to stage the scene. Is it possible Patsy really had no knowledge of SA or exactly JR's staging atrocity. That would be the most generous in this option. Edit to add: Would he have surprised her like that?

 

[Deleted member 187229]

Even Dr. Meyer admitted he wasn’t sure, so he put “almost simultaneously” as what he thought was the best option in the face of not being confident. If you look at the list, it’s impressive. And the majority were in agreement. They did not examine the body but most (except Wecht and Spitzer) had access to all forensic autopsy materials. The findings speak for themselves and Dr. Meyer has not disputed. It’s clearly listed that Boulder County Coroner’s Office was involved in the consultations.

He wasn’t sure which came first because they happened so close together. The list of names you mentioned didn’t look at the report until years after the murder. Dr Myer has never doubted his findings.

 

[CloudedTruth]

I am currently considering, in my mind
IF the adult Ramseys did it together with no Burke. . . edit to add: or even after Burke,
when, how, does a conversation start about the need to stage it like that.
A generous view is JR decides to do the staging and Patsy writes the note. The note is so long, so very long because JR takes so long, so very long to stage the scene. Is it possible Patsy really had no knowledge of SA or exactly JR's staging atrocity. That would be the most generous in this option. Edit to add: Would he have surprised her like that?

The only scenario that makes sense to me is guilty knowledge on the part of both parents. They covered to protect each other and their reputations and business.

 

[CloudedTruth]

He wasn’t sure which came first because they happened so close together. The list of names you mentioned didn’t look at the report until years after the murder. Dr Myer has never doubted his findings.

Nope. Not years later. And Meyer could not conclude how far apart they occurred. How did we go from it was all just rumor that experts were consulted to they weren’t consulted until years later?

You’re also not correctly accounting for the other bleeding that was noted. The amount you are recounting was from one area, there was additional bleeding noted in other areas.

 

[Deleted member 187229]

Nope. Not years later. And Meyer could not conclude how far apart they occurred. How did we go from it was all just rumor that experts were consulted to they weren’t consulted until years later?

You’re also not correctly accounting for the other bleeding that was noted. The amount you are recounting was from one area, there was additional bleeding noted in other areas.

Because you said Dr Myer consulted with experts about his autopsy findings. He consulted with pathologists during the autopsy. Not about his findings but during the autopsy. The rest were hired by the boulder police years after the autopsy.

 

[Deleted member 187229]

The boulder police a

Sirotnick did, he was local and available at the time. It’s common practice to provide forensic materials for further consultation. It’s unrealistic to think experts from across the country could be immediately available to be present at an autopsy. In this case, the Ramseys were accusing BPD of holding the body hostage. Meyer expedited release of the body as a result.

the boulder police told Dr Myer to hold the body to pressure the Ramseys into giving interviews. I assume the police informed the Ramsey’s they were going to hold the body. The Ramseys were correct . Dr Myer refused to hold the body and he released her for burial after the autopsy was concluded.

 

[CloudedTruth]

Because you said Dr Myer consulted with experts about his autopsy findings. He consulted with pathologists during the autopsy. Not about his findings but during the autopsy. The rest were hired by the boulder police years after the autopsy.

Surotnak was not a pathologist. He was called in to consult on the SA. The coroner’s office was involved in the consultations as noted in the material I provided above per your request. Believe what you like, but it’s all laid out in black and white.

 

[Deleted member 187229]

Surotnak was not a pathologist. He was called in to consult on the SA. The coroner’s office was involved in the consultations as noted in the material I provided above per your request. Believe what you like, but it’s all laid out in black and white.

I accept dr Myers autopsy report as accurate. Unless there are forensic reports from other doctors who personally examined jonbenets body, I will continue to only accept Dr Myers report.

 

[Deleted member 187229]

I accept dr Myers autopsy report as accurate. Unless there are forensic reports from other doctors who personally examined jonbenets body, I will continue to only accept Dr Myers report. The rest were brought in, in my opinion, because Dr Myers findings didn’t coincide with the boulder police theory of jonbenet being murdered following an accidental blow to the head because of bed wetting.dr Myers autopsy finds were that the blow to the head and strangulation happened so close together, he couldn’t determine which one happened first. In all theory, you could say based on that, the murder was planned.

 

[Chypre]

The only scenario that makes sense to me is guilty knowledge on the part of both parents. They covered to protect each other and their reputations and business.

Guilty knowledge covering any/and/or knowledge of sexual abuse, staging, aftermath.
At what point on the timeline do you think JR and PR had the first bit of collusion?
That's where I'm stu0ck in this option.

 

[GothamStraights]

The killer was not an intruder. Don't believe the spin. I have no idea who killed JonBenet but there was no intruder and Patsy wrote the note in my opinion.
This case is literally why I got into true crime. December 1996.
I have watched some of the documentary and it's so slanted with the intruder spin it makes me angry.
Please look through our JBR forum and see the evidence presented so well here.
If you have proof of an intruder please present it. Until then we need to clear the people in the house and that has yet to happen. Feel free to ask any questions on this thread.
What is truly sad is people like me can show you the spin and the lies yet mainstream media ignores it all.

I thought Patsy and her husband had lie detector tests they both passed. Also, the son was interrogated and he also got off without suspicion.
Can you explain more in detail for us, why you feel under all circumstances that there was no intruder. I am not of one or another opinion. Yet.

 

[Zodiac_Speaking]

I am currently considering, in my mind
IF the adult Ramseys did it together with no Burke. . . edit to add: or even after Burke,
when, how, does a conversation start about the need to stage it like that.
A generous view is JR decides to do the staging and Patsy writes the note. The note is so long, so very long because JR takes so long, so very long to stage the scene. Is it possible Patsy really had no knowledge of SA or exactly JR's staging atrocity. That would be the most generous in this option. Edit to add: Would he have surprised her like that?

The one question I keep going back to - How does one person, let alone 3 people always have the perfect answer for everything all these years?

It simply doesn't happen without extreme coaching and extreme help. Anybody can come up with any theory or scenario they want but often times the police will let a person go on and on and on and do interviews, etc....just waiting for them to slip up just enough to actually arrest them. (Ala the Dwayne Keffee D - Tupac murder back in Vegas)

To this day, every single Ramsey has the perfect answer to any question or any scenario..... "Hasn't happened before or since."