France - Five shot, four dead in French Alps, may have int'l ramifications #1

[Skigh]

:notgoodarn it is so lonely here having a monologue with myself

I know how you feel .
At one time this forum was buzzing,but I think there must be very strong press restrictions on reporting so there is not much new to discuss.

We could discuss why the press restrictions are in place!!

 

[Skigh]

http://translate.google.com/transla...a=X&ei=HLxdUNjfNYa0igKRpIHIDQ&ved=0CCwQ7gEwAQ

According to The Herald, the two men knew each other and were fired from the same club bike, Ugine.

This page I translated french to english. Does it mean what it says?

Think this word could be a mistranslation-but not the fact they both were from they same club-so presumably knew each other.

 

[Elley Mae]

Was it ever said/reported whether or not the cyclist (SM) cycled from his home or drove to that area to ride his bike? I googled the distance, (23.3 km) 31 minute drive. Was it ever said if RAF cyclist rode from home or did he drive to park then ride?

 

[Peace777]

Was it ever said/reported whether or not the cyclist (SM) cycled from his home or drove to that area to ride his bike? I googled the distance, (23.3 km) 31 minute drive. Was it ever said if RAF cyclist rode from home or did he drive to park then ride?

It does seem quite away just for a biking tour, and what a coincidence Mr. Martin just happens along as well on the same lonely road/path too (An Ex-RAF guy) wow! If you look at the car in a close up there seems to be a tan colored cap on the front dash and a pic of Msr. Mollier that I seen from a hunting club I think it was from has the same colored hat on:what: Just makes you wonder IF he may have been in the car and was getting out etc but forgot his cap IF it is the same cap Hmmmmm

 

[Elley Mae]

It does seem quite away just for a biking tour, and what a coincidence Mr. Martin just happens along as well on the same lonely road/path too (An Ex-RAF guy) wow! If you look at the car in a close up there seems to be a tan colored cap on the front dash and a pic of Msr. Mollier that I seen from a hunting club I think it was from has the same colored hat on:what: Just makes you wonder IF he may have been in the car and was getting out etc but forgot his cap IF it is the same cap Hmmmmm

I have an unsettled feeling about this one. I wonder at times if the family was not "collateral damage". jmo

 

[Peace777]

Hmmm was 1 of these issued? [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatwas"]List of fatwas - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

 

[goldielox]

Latest

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/french-alps-shooting-police-investigate-1338671

 

[wfgodot]

Latest

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/french-alps-shooting-police-investigate-1338671

From the link:

---
The Sunday Mirror can reveal that the probe into the murders of British engineer Saad al-Hilli, his wife and mother-in-law, and a passing cyclist has now extended to Asia.

Detectives are trying to trace a mystery man from Pakistan who is believed to have been in touch with Muslim dad-of-two Saad, 50, in recent months.
---
A source said: “The police are trying to establish whether Saad had crossed the line, and one name has come up on the radar and this person is from Pakistan.

“It is the first time Pakistan has been brought up in relation to the investigation. Extremists from that country, where there are a number of terror cells, are regular visitors to these chatroom sites. Saad could have made himself a target.”
---

 

[Skigh]

It does seem quite away just for a biking tour, and what a coincidence Mr. Martin just happens along as well on the same lonely road/path too (An Ex-RAF guy) wow! If you look at the car in a close up there seems to be a tan colored cap on the front dash and a pic of Msr. Mollier that I seen from a hunting club I think it was from has the same colored hat on:what: Just makes you wonder IF he may have been in the car and was getting out etc but forgot his cap IF it is the same cap Hmmmmm

I have seen the close up and it does look very similar to the cap.

If he was cycling he surely would have been wearing a cycling helmet.

So did SAH pick him up and put his bike on the cycle rack on the car: if so where was SM's helmet?

 

[Skigh]

From the link:

I could be very wrong ,but I think this is just a smoke and mirror type of report to lead away from the link to the french cyclist and the work connection.

 

[goldielox]

Skigh, you just made me think of something re the helmet.

If he was wearing a helmet how easily could he be shot in the head?

Was he not wearing one, or was it removed to shoot him once he'd gone down from the other bullets, or would a bullet penetrate a bike helmet?

 

[rotterdam]

http://translate.google.com/transla...a=X&ei=HLxdUNjfNYa0igKRpIHIDQ&ved=0CCwQ7gEwAQ

According to The Herald, the two men knew each other and were fired from the same club bike, Ugine.

This page I translated french to english. Does it mean what it says?

That is a weird translation.
"étaient licenciés du même club de vélo", That basically means they're both license holders of that club, in other words members. If they knew each other is an assumption IMO. I do not know all the members of clubs I belong to unless they are very very tiny. BM did not identify SM at the crime scene. It would be a silly thing indeed. to lie about that since it could be easily debunked by other acquaintances/members of the bike club.
Also remember "dismiss" as used in other translations instead of fired, has a dual meaning. It can also mean "allow to leave" like dismissing your kid after a parental lecture.

 

[rotterdam]

I agree with the muddled sensationalized reporting, mostly British tabloids.
His family left UK on August 29 according to this article and that pretty well matches up ( no hiatus) with his arrival at the second campsite.

"Yesterday Jack Saltman, another neighbour, said Mr Al-Hilli had told how he was grappling with a 'personal problem' on August 29, the day the family left for France."

But from the report from his accountant it was a Friday evening they left and the 29th August was a Wednesday.

This is from another report:

Neighbour Lorna Davey said her daughter attended Claygate Primary School with Zainab, while Zeena was due to start at the school this year.

She said: "They were very pretty, smiley little girls and a very nice, happy family.

"I'm shocked. They've obviously been extremely unlucky."

Ms Davey said the family would often go on holiday in their caravan and had been away on their latest trip for at least three weeks.

Ms Davey could have been referring to a previous trip as opposed to the open ended current disastrous trip.

 

[tarabull]

Just throwing this out there...in reviewing details of this case, I see there is what some might call a similiar and unsolved contract style killing of a tourist in front of his children in the east of France last year:

Belgian tourist murdered in front of his children
July 21, 2011

http://www.thelocal.fr/page/view/612

His body was found lying in front of the toilets in the lay-by. According to TV channel M6, he had been shot a total of five times, once in the head.

I first read about it here - if you scroll down it's under UPDATE Friday September 21:

http://www.marilynztomlins.com/articles/chevaline-the-forgotten-victim-sylvain-mollier/

An autopsy showed that Mr. Baligant had four bullets in him: one bullet had been fired into the back of his head.

Today, some 14 months later, this is a murder which remains unsolved.

 

[rotterdam]

Strange there is no pic of the wife online anywhere Hmmmm Did I read somewhere that Mr. Al-Hilli met her in Bahrain? I found the name of al-saffar in Bahrain news from last year maybe some relative of Mrs. A's?? Maybe this might be some resemblance to what Mrs. A looked like?? http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/oct/21/bahraini-medic-save-lives-danger
This lady was 49 in 2011 Mrs.A I think I read was born in 1962 so the ages would be similar. But it is a fairly common last name over there I guess. Adds to the plot anyways

It was Dubai(UAE) IIRC. BTW, that is a popular spot for vacation for many Europeans/non Arabs too. My non religious brother went their last year for vacation.

 

[rotterdam]

I could be very wrong ,but I think this is just a smoke and mirror type of report to lead away from the link to the french cyclist and the work connection.

Smoke and mirrors galore.
France pointing at UK, stating the answer lies there.
UK pointing at France , double life of Mollier.
Cousin Ali in Baghdad pointing at Saad's work, away from Baghdad.
Now they are all going to descend on that glorified chicken coop in Gironde although the locals have not seen Saad in a coon's age.
The Mirror, now pointing at some Pakistani connection which must be a Mirror exclusive because nobody else is reporting that (yet)
And I am getting dizzy from all that jerking to different directions.
And if I was brother Zaid and had absolutely nothing to do with it, I would be in hiding, just like his two nieces.
Mum is the word here apparently.

The WIKI French article has even disappeared since yesterday.
[ame]http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discussion:Tuerie_de_Chevaline[/ame].
Removing processed by Hercules (d) September 21, 2012 at 15: 32 (CEST)
Reason: in summary of discussions, some people think that the extensive media coverage (and therefore the primary sources available) make the qualifying event, and others consider that the relevance to an article is not established because the event is too recent. These same people believe that it will be possible without worries later create an article if the case continues to make an article that is not a news article.

In Figure: 23 for conservation, 37 for deletion to be a little more than 60% for deletion.

Due to the equivalence of the arguments (relevance and verifiability) I closed on the numeric criteria: deletion

The British one is still up.
[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annecy_shootings"]Annecy shootings - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

 

[Peace777]

murder/assassination in Dubai in 2010, some linked to the UK and France...http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/02/16/mahmoud-al-mabhouh-murder_n_463667.html
I'm wondering is anywhere safe anymore??

 

[Peace777]

Ok been looking into where the EX-RAF man's rental home is and it's Lathuile Fr. Here's the first map and how far it is from Chavaline (Murder spot) http://maps.google.ca/maps?hl=en&su...f.&biw=1092&bih=504&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wl A is ExRAF home location Now link to BBC where car was found http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-19499157 Quite away for a bike ride I'd say But... This case is driving me crazy so gonna take a break :banghead:

 

[Peace777]

I know I can't stop this Miss Marpling lol If Mr. Al-Hilli was online so much and getting involved in chat rooms and broadcasting his believes could it be because he might be related to this man, (he's a very controversial speaker) http://www.qul.org.au/audio-library/lectures-majalis/1388-sheikh-mohammed-al-hilli Has this man spoke up or been looked into?? Same last name Hmmmmm JMO

 

[rotterdam]

Well, hunting for any news is pretty well futile.
This is a press release from Eurojust. It is kind of unusual for them to get involved in ordinary murder cases, assuming it was just a nutter or a family feud , so there must be a lot more to this case..
If you click on the other press releases for 2012, it gives you kind of an idea what they usually are involved in.
http://eurojust.europa.eu/press/PressReleases/Pages/2012/2012-09-21.aspx