GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam County, 2 May 2014 - #12

[dancinunderthemoon]

Last seen by me in the Chad Haufler thread...I still think these 2 cases are connected. I've written the screenplay in my head.

JMO

Tarheel, I WONDER too!! Did yo see that guardianship links I posted over there? I couldnt tell what was happening. COmment over there if you know

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Guessing they come in various sizes? Was there a clip mentioned? I dont recall off the top of my head......this one held 2 30lb cinder blocks, i posted an approx size up thread for that size, RED< usually those are landscape timbers but im not masonry expert

THanks for sharing

JMO[/QUOTE]
I just sort of learned after investigating it..........c5 is the smallest section of the neck to cut and its above the thyroid, since i have thyroid issues, I know where mine is! ha......somebody is sick anyway to do this, you cant say cops are exempt......I think I would figure

This is similar to the mesh bag I use on my boat

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

good image diagrams, thanks

Anyone can *learn* to behead someone, however, it's not like one would be able to get a lot of practice at beheading a human being. I was looking a bit at some anatomy pics in conjunction with the autopsy report of RD, and it seems like the cut line would have had to have been quite precise for it to have been said to have been a clean cut line, etc. Very bizarre. Is there anyone close to the Ds whose education, knowledge, experience, or occupation might enlighten them about this type of thing? (I'm assuming animals that one might hunt would be vastly different from beheading a human!)

Autopsy report for RD:
PATHOLOGIC DIAGNOSES:
A. Postmortem decapitation:
...
3. Transection of the pharnyx with absence of the epiglottis and hyoid bone. The thyroid cartilage is intact.
4. Transection of the vertebral body of C5
5. Transection of the spinal cord
....
EXTERNAL EXAMINATION:
....
Postmortem decapitation occurred at the base of the neck. In this cross-section of the neck, subcutaneous adipose tissue and muscle are visible as well as the superior edge of the thyroid cartilage, the trachea, a clean cut through the C-5 vertebral body, and the spinal cord.
-----
View attachment 172288

View attachment 172289

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

close, said 30 but who knows, however i would guess it had no holes since they bagged them in mesh........no holes may be some landscape timbers, I dont think I found a 30lb one tho, but there are so many!
thanks

I did find this red cinder block at HD. It is 38 pounds

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

and it was referred to as concrete block..

This is what I consider to be a cinder block

This is what I'm thinking is the type of concrete block used

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

ME TOO, with bright colored paracord, who buys rainbow pretty for murders?

With mesh bags.......who stores blocks in mesh???

landscape concrete blocks....who uses those on a planned murder to put inside a mesh bag instead of cinder blocks with holes to tie the cord through

And the D's towels to clean up and towels to staunch the flow...........they didnt expect that much blood or would have had a tarp maybe

THe knife likely came out of the D's kitchen as its right there by the bathroom where they got the towels and by the entry door to screen porch that was unlocked when the friends arrived and found him.

They didnt have to go far into the home to leave evidence

I am baffled how they didnt have blood on themselves all over the walk and house and driveway, atelast a toe print from the shoe

UNLESS there is, we do know SS is holding back info still

BUT

This is all the stuff they'd have on the boat except the red concrete block, maybe it was indeed found on the D's property as suggested waaay back in the thread

I do believe after finally seeing the autopsy of SD, they Did NOT intend for her to be found because of how many times they wrapped her ankles with cord, like 10 or something........they forgot to cut a gas escape or didnt know about it .........and so I think were amateurs of sorts, maybe knew about taxidermy or slaughter. There are a lot of goat farms in eatonton too, thinking of the slaughter

I'm starting to think this was not as organized as I formally believed. I've read that the red concrete blocks were placed in a mesh bag, a little smaller than a laundry bag and tied to SDs bound legs with some sort of Para cord or rope.

The red concrete blocks as I am understanding is more of a landscaping type of block rather than a building type of block. Probably the same red concrete block I used for my fire pit. They are about 20-30 pounds each. And from reading some recent post they are ample in the Ds neighborhood.

Here's the thing. I myself use a mesh bag, probably about 24x24 inches to store my anchor and anchor rope in for my boat. When I get to my location on the water it is nice to have it all contained and ready to pull out of the bag to anchor into position. When I'm done in that spot I pull up the anchor line and nicely wrap it into the bag as the anchor is coming up. The anchor and the line area able to drain and not get mildew because it is within a mesh bag.

Now I like to think I'm clever but I bet I'm not the only one who operates this way with their anchor....

So these items are already readily available on the boat that was used and the red landscaping block is readily available within the confines the Ds neighborhood. The only thing left now is the knife.

Does anyone on here know of a link or a interview, anything which talks about the knife other than it was large? Has there been any discussion on whether any large knifes were missing from say a butchers block in the house. I can tell you that I would not know if a knife was missing from my elderly mothers home. I don't keep track of her knifes and would only be able to tell if one was missing if there was an empty spot in a butchers block.

What I'm saying is that the knife could have easily been from the Ds home or was already on the boat. As someone who has had several boats I can tell you that there is always a large knife on my boat in case we had to cut loose a stuck anchor or whatever. A knife on a boat is a must to me.

If someone was to plan this out wouldn't they have used heavier cinder blocks or concrete blocks? There would be no need to utilize a mesh bag to contain 2 lighter red landscaping blocks? Sounds like a rig to me.

They utilized what was available to them.....

All of he necessary items were already easily available to the killer. The boat is is were the answers are...The boat carried the mesh bag, rope and possibly the knife. The boat carried SD body. Who has access to a boat and knows that particular lake that knows the Ds?

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Anyone can learn to behead someone but knowing how to cover your tracks at a crime scene as well as these killers did tells me 1 of them was either military or police at 1 point. I have a few friends who are police and they said the same thing. To answer your question do I like police? Some police I like and some I don't some I trust and some I don't. DNR are considered police FYI they just work for the state .

Some are the most kind and caring and some are not to be trusted. I dont think it was totally planned out, I think the beheading was an afterthought, thats where Im at for now atleast according to my latest revelations and research.........but very well had to be someone the D's KNEW WELL or atleast TRUSTED, and someone in uniform I think most elderly would trust but thats speculation.

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Ok great, now I see what you are talking about. Both sites are close to the dam. Is it the thinking she was dumped more in the middle where it is deeper and floated closer to shore to the location you have marked?

Wasnt she found further up river, closer to the bend or alteast halfway? Ive been talking about that boat launch LS for 4 years LOL....there was a dumpster up ther etoo on the way out that I have never forgotten when i went there to investigate several years ago.........made me wonder if they exited there and dumped it on the way out........but..no the dam wont pull that hard from the distance she was found from it

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

I'm not saying it's illegal, and i'm sure you don't go looking out the window when a car drives by... however.. like others have mentioned, at the time of year when this happened, the lake is not yet busy with boaters (and I am not sure about fishing seasons?), so it *may* have been more unusual to hear/see a boat at that particular time? Plus if it was at night, which one might presume it would have been, considering the cargo, that makes it even more unusual. I would have thought someone might have noticed, even if it was after the fact.

NO, its never unusual to hear a boat. The only time you might take notice is if it's an air boat, LOL, we had one that started going up and down our river on SInclair adn I always had to go look, you know, loud as they are. IVe said time and time and time again, no one notices boats unless you just happen to be where it is at the time and if at night, people are sleeping or night fishing too and so thats what they assume is going on if they do see them at night

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Why does a boat need to be launched? What if one already on the lake was used?
There are boat ramps all over the lake that wouldn't need gated access to get to the lake.
look at the lake on Goggle maps. It's huge.

It doesnt if they live on the lake and have boat storage or docks/ lifts but where they took her, if they didnt live there, they were a hop and a skip from Lawrence shoals and one just above it, jeesh, the guys named it in the 911 call, both right near where she was found

YOu can live in the community and not have lake access and there are plenty of launches free and dont need access to GW to use the lake

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

@TJtennispro
Are there any unsolved murders in Putnam County or Greene County from say 1970- 2014 that involve a gunshot wound and LE has a bullet from that murder in evidence?

JMO and wondering

SS has no unsolved murders in his district, Im sure if surrounding counties do, theyve likely discussed it,

Also, there was once, before the D's murder, a man impersonating an officer in greene and/or putnam, dont think he was ever caught

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

I found it by chance on a different forum, but I haven't had a chance yet to look into it to verify, etc. I wonder if the Ds even knew it was not functioning??
And even if it *was* operational, if the couple were home at the time, wouldn't it have been unarmed anyway, so kind of useless, if you're up and about and letting people into your house? Wouldn't it only be useful in the event someone entered their home while they were out, or perhaps asleep (if they armed their system while sleeping)?

The security cameras at the entrance had been struck 2 weeks earlier and were not working but it has been reported by many they never worked right or were always out

way back, it was reported that the D's security system had been tampered with during the time the daughter was visiting prior to the murders, that article has never been relocated, but there was talk that it was turned off, and I believe it was the one time as memory serves me, I could be wrong and was under the impression the system was working and KD said they were religious about their system and didnt say it was not in working order

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Regarding type of boat they may have used...I was thinking along the lines of a pontoon type boat. They come in all shapes and sizes with and without privacy. My brother's family owned one for years. They can run rather quietly on the water as well (depending on the type of motor). Just throwing that out there.

easy to load something onto and roll something off of, ive rolled my own body off of one to go swimming basically lol

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Sheriff Sills has cleared this person. I am still shaking my head. What was that person doing in the Dermond's yard on Saturday? Who was this person? Maybe this is the same guy who went to the Hardee House and asked about the security videos over that weekend? In all seriousness....the mystery person on the lawn was cleared early on. Why was he there on Saturday, when they were most likely deceased? Why so quick to clear this person? I have so many questions.

THIS..........during the first podcast by Philip Holloway and Payne Lindsey. I mentinoed this then..........when PH said "so he's considered a suspect"..........SS replied "I DOOO".........WTH..........he had already cleared this guy but was talking on the podcast as if he had NOT and was still at large and THEN, did NOT answer the question by only said "I DOOO" in a southern drawl.............what was the point here?

I DONT THINK THERE WAS A MAN ON THE LAWN, it was a DECOY, to lure someone out of hiding, a FEAR TACTIC.

thats my opinion today and has been for a while since there was never ANY description yet it was known to be a MAN.........so it's a uselss piece of NON EVIDENCE at this point for us or investigators

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

So...
Who knows how to navigate Lake Oconee, who knows how to leave no known evidence at 1 or 2 crime scenes, who knows how to decapitate a man and take that man's head, sink a woman's body several miles away and arouse no suspicion while doing these things?

JMO

someone who knows them and knows the area........................???

This was not like the Robert Hollis case where he doestn appear to have wealth and lived in an apartment with very easy access.........meaning curbside

unlike the D's location

no neighbors and the ONE was in asia...........vacation homes in the cove, no permanent residents

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Guns are so easy to come by, be it legally or illegally. It would be so much easier to get a rid of a gun.

No need to cut off someone’s head to hide evidence.

how does one explain the GSR on his collar as I first heard it put............and very little

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

This is what I have insinuated all along. Now, did SS interview ALL the grandkids?! Maybe there was one sleeping over.

it's probalby another fear tactic decoy, proably doest have anyone in his sights

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

We have to narrow the timeline.
Did USA Today get delivered by the mailperson on Friday? Saturdays delivers fri and crossword was worked

And when was the last time...
1. their computer was logged on? Last email sent? Last email answered? FRIDAY IIRC
2. Cellphone called made by Mr. D/ Mrs. D...unknown
3. Last time alarm system armed/ unarmed? unknown
4. Last time anyone spoke to either one? Thursday BD last spoke to RD
5. Who was the last known person to speak to them? Brad D
6. Last credit/ debit card transaction- when/ where? unknown

JMO

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

hmm, people keep saying family wouldnt behead but I want to know what planet they live on, cuz they are few but it happens and dismemberments

anyway......I dont thnk he has a person in mind, its another scare tactic or decoy IMO

but now that we are pretty certain, well I AM, that the beheading was NOT PLANNED..........then it could be family or anyone

it came down to it HAD to be done and family may not have been the actual one/s committing this act anyway if hired out but for some reason it came to it needed to be done

If you dont think a bullet would require beheading someone in order to hide evidence,

what about BITING............HOW.........HOW are you going to get al YOUR BLOOD and DNA OUT OF HIS MOUTH without beheading him?

jsut some thoughts

Good night all!! Glad everyone is jumping on board!

So we’ve heard SS say he is suspect of someone or some people. This means he must have already interviewed this person or these people and feel their stories don’t add up.

To me it is looking like a issue of money or inheritance. I know the 3 living children were the benificaries of the Ds estate, equally divided. But what about grand children?

We see pictures of the Ds touting over them but those photos have to be quite old and seeing that the Ds children are in their late 50s to early 60s this would make the grandchildren grown adults. I hope SS looked into grandchildren and their spouses.

We know the Ds had a son Mark who had a drug addiction pretty much his entire adult life and I’m sure they indured quite a lot as I’ve heard SS say he would steal from his parents at times to get drug money.

Could the Ds have been dealing with a younger generation in their family with a similar addiction but because of their experience with their own son would not facilitate or enable that person no mater how much they may have pleaded for financial help thus anger was built up? Maybe SD was the one most firm on not repeating past mistakes.

 

[deugirtni]

Guessing they come in various sizes? Was there a clip mentioned? I dont recall off the top of my head......this one held 2 30lb cinder blocks, i posted an approx size up thread for that size, RED< usually those are landscape timbers but im not masonry expert

THanks for sharing

JMO
I just sort of learned after investigating it..........c5 is the smallest section of the neck to cut and its above the thyroid, since i have thyroid issues, I know where mine is! ha......somebody is sick anyway to do this, you cant say cops are exempt......I think I would figure

Yes, it seems to me (from reading) that it was quite precise, because on RD's autopsy report it says: "3. Transection of the pharnyx with absence of the epiglottis and hyoid bone. The thyroid cartilage is intact."

That seems to leave a very small window, jmo.

https://slideplayer.com/slide/4569082/15/images/70/Anterior+Pharyngeal+Wall+from+Behind.jpg

https://www.therespiratorysystem.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/Epiglottis-Anatomy-Diagram.jpg