GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam County, 2 May 2014 - # 4

[tomkat]

I've been wondering the same thing. . .

"Eliza In Spain! In Spain! The three
The rain in Spain stays mainly in the plain!
The rain in Spain stays mainly in the plain!"

That was just in the news, oh wait, not the sing sing, haha, but about disclosing murders in homes

I THINK they DON"T, but I remember it was in the news not too long ago

http://www.grec.state.ga.us/articles/stigmatized.html

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I agree, death by BFT does not HAVE to involve a bloody scene. Many times the bleeding is going on inside the skull and its not necessarily true that a killing blow to the head causes gushing of blood outside of the skull to the degree where it would create a messy difficult to manage or clean up scene.

I do understand what you are saying, but I don't think I have ever kept up with one bludgeoning murder that did not leave a horrific bloody murder scene. To get to the skull in order to cause massive bleeding/fractures to the skull cavity a person has to be hit very hard first tearing into the soft scalp area which does bleed profusely even with a minor cut much less a life threatening forceful blow or blows to the head. These weren't just blows they were murderous blows which had a lot of force behind them.

A crowbar was mentioned by a reporter when she said that is the type of bludgeoning weapon the police is looking for. No way is that kind of weapon not going to cause blood flow when the head is struck possibly repeatedly, imo.

Imo, LE hasn't located the actual murder scene. I think it was done inside a dwelling but not in the Dermonds home. Maybe in someone's basement. And I do think there was plenty of blood. Most of the blood from the decapitation was left at the murder scene wherever that is too, imo. Imo,when they brought Russ's torso back to the garage most of his blood had already seeped out at another location.

IMO

 

[Bootsctr]

I think that Mrs. D. heard the commotion of Mr. being killed and came out to see what was going on. She found his body and was bent over it trying to either comfort him or help him. The perp came up and hit her from behind. I am thinking maybe a hammer or a bat. I also think it happened very close to the dock. jmo

Yes, a hammer or bat or baton. I'm thinking Mrs. D might not have gone to the dock as much since she had knee surgery. Mr. D was the walker and what happened to him might have happened at the dock. It was stated in MSM that Mrs. D was wearing her every day clothes, but we don't know what Mr. D was wearing, if anything? Maybe the perp carried Mr. D back up from the dock, but that would have to be one big dude to carry Mr. D up that hill, or two smaller perps?

Mrs. D then heard the commotion in the garage and came out and then was hit from behind. She never knew what hit her. I tend to think they suffered blunt force trauma by the same object, be it hammer or bat.

 

[Cardinal47]

Kind of interesting. If you want to know if a murder was committed you have to ask!!!!! So I have to ask. How many people would even think to ask that question???


http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclope...gia-disclosures-required-under-state-law.html

What a Georgia Seller Does Not Need to Disclose

Even though, as a Georgia seller, you generally must disclose known problems with the condition of your home, there are certain specific exceptions under the Georgia statutes. These relate to things that occurred in the home, not the home’s physical condition.

A Georgia seller does not need to inform a buyer if any diseased person ever lived in the home, or if a homicide, felony, suicide, or any other death occurred there (Georgia Official Code Annotated §44-1-16(a)(1)). Additionally, it is up to the buyer to investigate certain information about the neighborhood where the home is located. Georgia statutes specifically state that a seller is not required to inform the buyer if a registered sex offender lives in the area (Georgia Official Code Annotated §44-1-16 (b)). (However, to help the buyer, most form real estate contracts used in Georgia direct a buyer where to look online for information about the location of registered sex offenders.)

Even if the seller is not required to disclose an event on the property such as a murder, a seller still must answer any direct question from a buyer honestly (Georgia Official Code Annotated §44-1-16(a)(1)). So, if the buyer (who may very well do a Google search on your home's address) asks you whether your home was where the gang member was murdered last summer, you do need to answer honestly.

The only time you do not need to answer a buyer’s question completely and honestly is if it is a question relating to information protected under the Federal Fair Housing Act or Georgia’s fair housing laws (Georgia Official Code Annotated §44-1-16 (a)(2)).

The Federal Fair Housing Act (found at 42 United States Code, Sections 3601-3619 and 363), and the Georgia’s fair housing laws (found in the Georgia Official Code Annotated, Sections 8-3-200 through 8-3-223), protect people from housing discrimination based on race, color, religion, sex, national origin, familial status, and handicap. If, for example, a buyer asks about the previous occupant’s religion, or whether a person with AIDS (considered a handicap under the Fair Housing Act) ever lived in the home, this is protected information you should not give out. You should instead reply that you are not legally allowed to answer.

 

[Foxfire]

Due to Sheriff Sills quickly reaching out to the FBI, specifically the Behavioral Analysis Unit,
the timing of the horrific crime, the personal COD, the decapitation of RD and the placing of SD's body in the lake.
Imo, all indicators and actions by the perp/s point to the motive being primarily sexual in nature. These indicators are not meant to reflect conventional sex, but deviant sadistic sex fueled by drugs, likely meth/molly..imo..

Sexual predators that prey on the elderly are very rare, and imo, we are treading on some extremely evil and murky psychological waters...jmo

 

[tomkat]

:seeya: I agree with the young people today and no feelings. They think they are 10 feet tall and bullet proof.

I don't think it was a drug deal either. It was somebody who perceived the Dermonds as a threat or some kind of grudge which the perp took too seriously. I've even thought the house itself was maybe the reason for the murders. Somebody wants that house. Do realtors have to disclose a murder happened at the house when it goes on the market?

You know, if it was......... a threat, a grudge.........why,? I mean that seems to point to something more organzed, wuold you think?

ANother thing I was pondering today, if it WAS a message to someone and that someone was family, they sure aint gonna talk, do you think?? Or if this was to shut them up or SOMEONE up


The Messenger said Sills was talking to the family further to the Dermonds children to get to know more about them.

That's interesting, so they must DIG DEEPER?

I still think it was interesting that the son said they were thinking more towards a "cult" and they had some really weird phone calls..............I question that, who would be calling the family with weird phone calls about their murdered parents, AND WHO pray tell would have their number, surely it's unlisted and was it to a cell or landline and do they even HAVE a landline......

just pondering things, just thinking it sounded like someone trying to lead the investigation, that just sounded really ODD, to me, WHO would make weird phone calls after someones parents are murdered and decapitated? This whole thing is so crazy!


bring on the backlash :floorlaugh:

 

[Canaille]

:seeya: I agree with the young people today and no feelings. They think they are 10 feet tall and bullet proof.

I don't think it was a drug deal either. It was somebody who perceived the Dermonds as a threat or some kind of grudge which the perp took too seriously. I've even thought the house itself was maybe the reason for the murders. Somebody wants that house. Do realtors have to disclose a murder happened at the house when it goes on the market?

Oh...

No...

Found this site when I was looking up disclosure requirements...

http://www.diedinhouse.com

 

[tomkat]

Due to Sheriff Sills quickly reaching out to the FBI, specifically the Behavioral Analysis Unit,
the timing of the horrific crime, the personal COD, the decapitation of RD and the placing of SD's body in the lake.
Imo, all indicators and actions by the perp/s point to the motive being primarily sexual in nature. These indicators are not meant to reflect conventional sex, but deviant sadistic sex fueled by drugs, likely meth/molly..imo..

Sexual predators that prey on the elderly are very rare, and imo, we are treading on some extremely evil and murky psychological waters...jmo

AND POSSIBLY Very very very cleeean,

stabbing is synonymous to penetration

what is beheading synonomous too?

 

[Nuvolari]

WHAT???? What am I missing!?

A little looking and you'll find the answer about the name mystery.

I'm thinking of Hemingway's "The Killers"...

(At the counter)

"Know a guy named Dermond?"

"Yeah, over in..."

(At the driveway)

"You Dermond?"

"Yes I am my dear fellow, care for some tea?"

 

[mck16]

You know, if it was......... a threat, a grudge.........why,? I mean that seems to point to something more organzed, wuold you think?

ANother thing I was pondering today, if it WAS a message to someone and that someone was family, they sure aint gonna talk, do you think?? Or if this was to shut them up or SOMEONE up


The Messenger said Sills was talking to the family further to the Dermonds children to get to know more about them.

That's interesting, so they must DIG DEEPER?

I still think it was interesting that the son said they were thinking more towards a "cult" and they had some really weird phone calls..............I question that, who would be calling the family with weird phone calls about their murdered parents, AND WHO pray tell would have their number, surely it's unlisted and was it to a cell or landline and do they even HAVE a landline......

just pondering things, just thinking it sounded like someone trying to lead the investigation, that just sounded really ODD, to me, WHO would make weird phone calls after someones parents are murdered and decapitated? This whole thing is so crazy!


bring on the backlash :floorlaugh:

I don't believe this statement is a quote from the family. I believe it was in a quote with other things mentioned as a possibility. And it was very early in this event. They did say they had some weird phone calls. If they did say definitelly they thought it was a cult I would like to see that link. ty

 

[tomkat]

I think that Mrs. D. heard the commotion of Mr. being killed and came out to see what was going on. She found his body and was bent over it trying to either comfort him or help him. The perp came up and hit her from behind. I am thinking maybe a hammer or a bat. I also think it happened very close to the dock. jmo

Yeah I think something along those lines too

Sills mentioning that the body may have been moved there, at first report it was reported Sills said the body had been moved a few feet

I posted something on beheading and it was gruesome but mentions positioning the body to get a clean cut

So I wondered if that was what happened, The "unknown" in the garage with the machete

don't know about how much blood there would be, but tarps do wonders to prevent a mess, anyway seems there was conflicting reports on how much blood was actually in the garage????

 

[tomkat]

I don't believe this statement is a quote from the family. I believe it was in a quote with other things mentioned as a possibility. And it was very early in this event. They did say they had some weird phone calls. If they did say definitelly they thought it was a cult I would like to see that link. ty

Yes it was VERY early in the investigation, there is a link page for the dermonds

 

[Nuvolari]

I do understand what you are saying, but I don't think I have ever kept up with one bludgeoning murder that did not leave a horrific bloody murder scene. To get to the skull in order to cause massive bleeding/fractures to the skull cavity a person has to be hit very hard first tearing into the soft scalp area which does bleed profusely even with a minor cut much less a life threatening forceful blow or blows to the head. These weren't just really blows they were murderous blows which had a lot of force behind them.

A crowbar was mentioned by a reporter when she said that is the type of bludgeoning weapon the police is looking for. No way is that kind of weapon not going to cause blood flow when the head is struck possibly repeatedly, imo.

Imo, LE hasn't located the actual murder scene. I think it was done inside a dwelling but not in the Dermonds home. Maybe in someone's basement. And I do think there was plenty of blood. Most of the blood from the decapitation was left at the murder scene wherever that is too, imo. Imo,when they brought Russ's torso back to the garage most of his blood had already seeped out at another location.

IMO

OBE, you're obviously a very good thinker, but how would you explain Mrs. Dermond's corpse being found without "glaring" signs of trauma yet the coroner determined cause of death was blunt force trauma? Did the sheriff say either had been hit with a crowbar or was that conjecture?

 

[tomkat]

I don't believe this statement is a quote from the family. I believe it was in a quote with other things mentioned as a possibility. And it was very early in this event. They did say they had some weird phone calls. If they did say definitelly they thought it was a cult I would like to see that link. ty

well that was easy

http://m.chronicle.augusta.com/news...n-mystery-security-camera-wasnt-son-tells-ajc

 

[mck16]

Yeah I think something along those lines too

Sills mentioning that the body may have been moved there, at first report it was reported Sills said the body had been moved a few feet

I posted something on beheading and it was gruesome but mentions positioning the body to get a clean cut

So I wondered if that was what happened, The "unknown" in the garage with the machete

don't know about how much blood there would be, but tarps do wonders to prevent a mess, anyway seems there was conflicting reports on how much blood was actually in the garage????

Seems to me the dock would be a perfect place to clean up any type of evidence. Most docks have access to water other than the lake. jmo

 

[Bootsctr]

That was just in the news, oh wait, not the sing sing, haha, but about disclosing murders in homes

I THINK they DON"T, but I remember it was in the news not too long ago

http://www.grec.state.ga.us/articles/stigmatized.html

Aha! Don't ask. Don't tell. In Georgia, if you specifically ask the realtor if a murder or suicide or other felony, they must answer as honestly as they can. So, as long as MSM doesn't report that the murders happened in the house, the realtor can honestly say no because no one really knows for sure.

Watched a recent episode of House Hunters. The woman commented about something looking like blood splatter on the wall and the realtor laughingly said don't focus on that and let's look at the rest of the house. The couple ended up buying the house with splatter on the wall.

There was a case in the news of a family who bought a house in California and then claimed it was haunted. Wanted out of the deal because they weren't told the house was haunted. Not sure how that sale ended.

Also watched an episode of Ghost Adventures and they were investigating Fox Hollow Farm formerly owned by serial killer Herbert Robert Baumeister. They specifically asked the current owners if they knew the history of Fox Hollow Farm and they said they were very well aware of the history and the former owner. The wife is a pathologist. Fox Hollow Farm - YouTube

This is interesting. . .

"Therefore, the Commission sought the advice of the Attorney General's office on the impact of the federal law on Georgia's "Stigmatized Property" law. The advice that it received indicates that there is a conflict between the law as it relates to diseases such as AIDS. If asked about such diseases as AIDS, a licensee "should respond by stating that he or she is unable to answer such an inquiry." Such a response is consistent with how licensees have traditionally responded to questions related to fair housing issues."

Thank you tomkat!

 

[Foxfire]

AND POSSIBLY Very very very cleeean,

stabbing is synonymous to penetration

what is beheading synonymous too?

<BBM for Focus>

Beheading or cutting of the throat can be interpreted as sexual, as is strangulation, imo. Imo, the decapitation of RD and removal of his head from the crime scene was primarily for the removal of forensics evidence..

 

[mck16]

well that was easy

http://m.chronicle.augusta.com/news...n-mystery-security-camera-wasnt-son-tells-ajc

Thanks. Just confirms what I was trying to say, albeit not very well. It was just a list of things that could have come to their mind. Certainly a decapitation is weird and your thoughts would go to the most gruesome reason. And I am sure I would consider a cult. I am not familiar with cult killings so has this played out to be a cult killing? I just don't know. And as I mentioned it was a reason in a list of reasons. I think the LE has ruled that out, have they or no? Who knows what can be ruled out since at this point there are still no motives or reasons mentioned. jmo

 

[Bootsctr]

You know, if it was......... a threat, a grudge.........why,? I mean that seems to point to something more organzed, wuold you think?

ANother thing I was pondering today, if it WAS a message to someone and that someone was family, they sure aint gonna talk, do you think?? Or if this was to shut them up or SOMEONE up


The Messenger said Sills was talking to the family further to the Dermonds children to get to know more about them.

That's interesting, so they must DIG DEEPER?

I still think it was interesting that the son said they were thinking more towards a "cult" and they had some really weird phone calls..............I question that, who would be calling the family with weird phone calls about their murdered parents, AND WHO pray tell would have their number, surely it's unlisted and was it to a cell or landline and do they even HAVE a landline......

just pondering things, just thinking it sounded like someone trying to lead the investigation, that just sounded really ODD, to me, WHO would make weird phone calls after someones parents are murdered and decapitated? This whole thing is so crazy!


bring on the backlash :floorlaugh:

No backlash here! :whip:

Anytime someone mentions "cult" or "devil-worship", it reminds me of Scott Peterson uke: and how his lawyer was trying to deflect guilt away from his client. Pardon me while I uke: again. To me, it's definitely trying to lead the investigation in a certain direction - clearly the opposite direction of whom the focus is obviously on said deflector. Only a CRACKPOT would make weird phone calls to someone whose parents were murdered and decapitated. It's so frustrating to me that these people never made one public plea for the safe return of their mother and put up no money for the reward leading to the the arrest or information of the person or persons who committed the crime. They didn't even attend the vigil.

If the killer really did call the family it would mean one thing to me, they indeed were inside the house and went through things to find family phone #'s, names and addresses. So I'm with you - this is FREAKING crazy! :shocked2::bud::lamb::sponge::bananalama:verreaction:hone::hills:

 

[Hickory Born]

OBE, you're obviously a very good thinker, but how would you explain Mrs. Dermond's corpse being found without "glaring" signs of trauma yet the coroner determined cause of death was blunt force trauma? Did the sheriff say either had been hit with a crowbar or was that conjecture?

I think if one is hit just right in he temple it can easily cause death.