Gene Hackman dead at 95: Iconic actor and wife, 63, are found dead with their dog at Santa Fe home. #3

[NuttMegg]

I know, right? I worked as a caregiver for Alzheimer's (in-home care) patients - I *never* felt comfortable leaving them. and IIRC correctly, I never did.

however, family members were like, 'Hey, if you want to take a break, leave for an hour or two." Like, just leave the patient unattended with advanced Alzheimer's. NOT ON MY WATCH.

My SIL can't leave my brother. But there are medicare programs where a caregiver can get an hour each week with a psychologist to help deal with caregiving, and there are home PT programs free thru medicare. Well not free because we all pay for it our whole working lives and into retirement but at no additional cost.

 

[K9Enzo]

Incredibly heartbreaking for both of them.

He had to be scared. The thought of him wandering around maybe looking for her breaks my heart. He was at the end of his life, she had so many years ahead of her. Then the poor dog.

I watched Hoosiers the other night from ‘86 with Gene Hackman. Such a good movie and he was so handsome in it. imo

 

[SortaSleuthy]

Hopefully you have some help and also know just how important it is that your health isn't compromised by all you do for your wife.
And please don't be a martyr so reach out whenever needed.
There's much good to be said for those that can remain at home and their loved ones who care for them.

Thank you. We have a cleaner every two weeks. My son takes care of maintenance and yard work. I cook and do laundry. Money isn’t a problem. We’ve been together 24/7 for three years. Our love is even stronger. TV is on 12 hrs/day. We go through old photo albums and videos.

 

[Luna20]

sometimes they cant stay at home, if they are a risk to themselves or others, My dad would take off, and get lost. One time the RCMP found him about 3 hours a way and he had run out of gas, he got lost on a new ring road took the wrong exit and just kept driving. its not safe for them sometimes to be at home. when you have a caregiver at home, who does a lot for you, you may not see how bad it is. Remove that caregiver , or their routine, and you see it loud and clear.

Both of my parents remained at home, one with mild symptoms and the other with severe. There was never a time when they were left alone.

It’s too tempting for them to get in trouble. Trying to cook, drive and walk out of the house are some of the typical things that happen but there are things that seem harmless that they can also get into. As simple as dropping a can on weakened bones.

Drinking water from the toilet, eating uncooked food, taking too much medication, falling, opening the washing machine, trying to cut their hair, change a light bulb and more.

All of this while keeping them fed, bathed, medicated if necessary, up and walking as needed.

It’s an enormous task.

 

[#JUSTICE4WILDER]

According to the Huffington Post article the medical examiner is the person who spoke in the press conference regarding when or about when each death occurred and she also released the reason why each one passed.

 

[stargazer17]

What about the dog?

 

[Steelhead]

On the lifespan of Hantaviruses:​

Physical Properties of Hantaviruses​

Hantaviruses have lipid envelopes that are susceptible to most disinfectants (e.g., dilute chlorine solutions, detergents, or most general-purpose household disinfectants) (37). Depending on environmental conditions, these viruses probably survive <1 week in indoor environments and much shorter periods (perhaps hours) when exposed to sunlight outdoors (38).
CDC

 

[Izzylizzy]

The CDC (God Bless it) says hantavirus "usually starts to show 1 to 8 weeks after contact with an infected rodent.” And then "Four to 10 days after the initial phase of illness, the late symptoms of HPS [Hantavirus Pulmonary Syndrome] appear.” This would mean Betsy would have been infected in January. So she would have been carrying and dealing with symptoms for a while. Poor woman. So concerned about Gene and possibly dismissing her own illness...

I'm curious about the pest control appointment.
It had been posted that it was a routine visit which means there's a somewhat set schedule throughout the year for maintenance.
Was it routine or did BA call in the pest control guy and made the appointment for that day?
If so did she know there was a mouse problem in her home and when was the appointment made?
I know that Mandoza said there was no mouse evidence in her home but I have mixed feelings that if there was we would be told about it.
On top of everything else the synchronicity here of Leonard ,the pest control worker discovering BA's body and now finding out she passed from Hantavirus is more like a story line from a book then the unfolding of a real life event.
IMO:

 

[NuttMegg]

Thank you. We have a cleaner every two weeks. My son takes care of maintenance and yard work. I cook and do laundry. Money isn’t a problem. We’ve been together 24/7 for three years. Our love is even stronger. TV is on 12 hrs/day. We go through old photo albums and videos.

I was reading an article which suggested compiling a file or thumb drive with your partner's favorite old tunes from teen years. I watched youtube videos I can't post here but we all have that music embedded in our minds.

 

[Luna20]

Thank you. We have a cleaner every two weeks. My son takes care of maintenance and yard work. I cook and do laundry. Money isn’t a problem. We’ve been together 24/7 for three years. Our love is even stronger. TV is on 12 hrs/day. We go through old photo albums and videos.

That is so beautiful! You have a positive outlook and sounds like you have found a routine that is good for both of you. Bless you!

There is a caregiver who takes a patient to the grocery. Just enough to stimulate their attention and for an outing. But I noticed that they always recite things to the patient. She said if you assume that they can’t mentally grasp things then you don’t invite the opportunity to have dialogue. They may not recognize soup but they can recognize some other things. Even if they don’t grasp things, it’s still nice for them to be involved in conversations.

 

[airportwoman]

What about the dog?

I don't think the necropsy results are fully in yet.

I was surprised about it being Sin Nombre Disease ("the disease without a name", chosen to avoid stigmatizing the Four Corners region) because that's usually a summertime disease.

 

[SophieRose]

I keep thinking a similar thought as you..."something knocked her out"--figuratively but...
Even if she was the sole caregiver all this time, she would still be SO extremely concerned about Gene. If she was getting sicker and sicker gradually---I just think she would have been frantic to get care in there for him.

I clearly no nothing about this disease, but something just must have stopped her

From a 1993 article about the Mammoth victim. Article says her cabin was infested with rodents, but other articles said it wasn't.

Four Corners Virus Confirmed in 2 Calif. Deaths

A graduate student who died last week in Mammoth Lakes and a Santa Barbara County ranch hand were infected with the deadly hantavirus--the same virus that caused a fatal outbreak in the Four Corners area of the Southwest earlier this year, state health officials announced late Monday.

www.latimes.com

Messier’s case illustrates how rapidly the disease, which often begins with fever, headache and breathing difficulty, can quickly escalate into a life-threatening illness

Messier, who was studying birds at the Valentine Ecological Reserve, sought treatment for flu-like symptoms last Wednesday. Rutherford said that after being seen at a hospital she went back to her research station.

She returned to the hospital the next day and was flown to a Reno hospital, where she died Friday. Rutherford said that the cabin she lived in was infested with rodents.

 

[Izzylizzy]

Thank you. We have a cleaner every two weeks. My son takes care of maintenance and yard work. I cook and do laundry. Money isn’t a problem. We’ve been together 24/7 for three years. Our love is even stronger. TV is on 12 hrs/day. We go through old photo albums and videos.

Ahh, you made me smile so thank you for the heartwarming news.
It's a true blessing for everyone when families want to keep their loved one at home and everyone helps.

 

[Friday Fan]

I'm curious about the pest control appointment.
It had been posted that it was a routine visit which means there's a somewhat set schedule throughout the year for maintenance.
Was it routine or did BA call in the pest control guy and made the appointment for that day?
If so did she know there was a mouse problem in her home and when was the appointment made?
I know that Mandoza said there was no mouse evidence in her home but I have mixed feelings that if there was we would be told about it.
On top of everything else the synchronicity here of Leonard ,the pest control worker discovering BA's body and now finding out she passed from Hantavirus is more like a story line from a book then the unfolding of a real life event.
IMO:

Rodent problems are extremely common and they had a ginormous house. This means that there are probably at least one hundred potential entrance points. Routine maintenance of all homes should inspect potential entrance points even if you have rodents or not. The average ranch house has probably a dozen. Entrance points occur wherever two roofs meet. Gutters. Chimneys. Any rotten wood. Shingle issues, water damage etc etc etc.

It's a constant battle for us. Hubby spends lots of time on the roof. I'm sure that particular home had numerous vulnerabilities. Generally custom built homes have numerous roof levels. A major problem for us is an addition to the home. There is a gable of one roof that meets with a flatter roof and it sits back about a foot from the edge of the roof. This area is a huge sore spot for us.

I really can't imagine them not having a critter problem. That was the first thing I thought when I heard that a pest control person was at their place. Rodents tend to be more of an indoor issue in the winter.

You can see here all the possible vulnerable spots on a typical roof.


The dormer area looks particularly vulnerable, although anywhere could be.

Roofing 101: The Anatomy of a Pitched Roof - Lyons Roofing

Roofing is a complicated trade full of confusing terms. To help you better understand the […]

lyonsroofing.com

Additionally almost every large residence around here has outdoor bait boxes. These require routine inspection by pest control. I can imagine their house required frequent inspection of potential entrance points.

 

[Quill]

I doubt it.
Crate-trained dogs generally regard them as their safe space and go in them to sleep, so their crates were almost certainly kept in the house. It was a big house so plenty of room.

Not that it matters at this point, but I have a crate trained dog. He doesn't go in his crate anymore and we finally folded it up and put it away. We only get it out once in awhile to keep his training up in case it's needed. We keep it in our garage. That's why I wondered about Betsy getting it out of storage.

 

[Auntie Cipation]

I rarely have mice inside my tightly-sealed house. It's happened, though, and not just the time I didn't look carefully enough at my cat's face before letting them back inside.

But even if the presence of cats doesn't stop the mice, the cats will definitely let me know the mice are there. However, under the house and in the attic are different stories, I often hear mice sounds above or below. I'm not sure how they get in, but it could be as crazy as following along the plumbing as it goes under the foundation (three feet down!).

I'm still less worried about fresh droppings and dead mice than I would be about older, dessicated ones. But a problem either way.

 

[NuttMegg]

Rodent problems are extremely common and they had a ginormous house. This means that there are probably at least one hundred potential entrance points. Routine maintenance of all homes should inspect potential entrance points even if you have rodents or not. The average ranch house has probably a dozen. Entrance points occur wherever two roofs meet. Gutters. Chimneys. Any rotten wood. Shingle issues, water damage etc etc etc.

It's a constant battle for us. Hubby spends lots of time on the roof. I'm sure that particular home had numerous vulnerabilities. Generally custom built homes have numerous roof levels. A major problem for us is an addition to the home. There is a gable of one roof that meets with a flatter roof and it sits back about a foot from the edge of the roof. This area is a huge sore spot for us.

I really can't imagine them not having a critter problem. That was the first thing I thought when I heard that a pest control person was at their place. Rodents tend to be more of an indoor issue in the winter.

You can see here all the possible vulnerable spots on a typical roof.


The dormer area looks particularly vulnerable, although anywhere could be.

Roofing 101: The Anatomy of a Pitched Roof - Lyons Roofing

Roofing is a complicated trade full of confusing terms. To help you better understand the […]

lyonsroofing.com

Additionally almost every large residence around here has outdoor bait boxes. These require routine inspection by pest control. I can imagine their house required frequent inspection of potential entrance points.

They can flatten their thorax to squeeze in wherever. One thing they can't do is chew through steel wool pads.

 

[slowpoke]

What I find puzzling is that BA's loving mission for years was to protect GH from contacting Covid or any contagious disease yet if she had warnings she was sick and getting worse why didn't she call a doctor not only for herself but to keep monitoring Gene?
IMO: This is an end of life tragedy especially for Gene that very well may have been avoided.

If she made a mistake, as you say it wasn’t for lack of love.

I said this recently on another thread, where a wife of a husband who had dementia took him on a cruise along with other family members. He still managed to wander off on one of the stops, and so far has not been seen again. I said hindsight is 20/20. And another poster agreed and said she deserves our grace. I think the same for Betsy.

MOO

 

[Cherwell]

It seems to be set in stone per the media that Betsy died on the 11th leaving Gene alone for a week. Of course the media have run with this to be sensational.

It makes no sense to me. It was made clear in the press conference that they did not have a definite date of death for her. She was out and about and apparently well on the 11th.

We were told that typically people are ill with flu-like symptoms for three to six days before hantovirus turns fatal. The medical examiner said that there was no way of knowing when she first started to feel ill, but if she was about to die there's no way she would have been able to go out shopping.

It seems to me that Betsy could have survived for up to a week after 11 Feb. Just because she didn't send any texts or emails doesn't mean she was dead! She just wasn't well. She probably thought she had flu which is why she didn't seek medical help.

I do not believe that she was dead a week before Gene died.

 

[Friday Fan]

They can flatten their thorax to squeeze in wherever. One thing they can't do is chew through steel wool pads.

They are able to move the pads however!