General Discussion and Theories #3

[Alethea Dice]

I think that maybe if you happen to be a "car person" and contact the seller they might send you additional pictures that weren't on Kijiji. Ahem. Thus the FB pics.

The seller could potentially send other pictures if requested to do so, but there is no evidence that was done and the pictures did not come from the seller's facebook. Rather they came from AM's facebook, who has been cleared of any involvement and who is not selling the items. A quick google search will tell you that the body could cost in the area of $15,000 and the completely built kit can sell for around $80,000. So we really have no idea if the body of the car was even for sale IMO. Hence why I asked the question, which incidentally was ignored and, therefore, can only be taken as an assumption on the poster's part, not fact.

It is, however, an interesting way of getting around the rule of not linking to someone's personal facebook account.

JMO

 

[ArianeEmory]

Don't have a lot to add, but it seems kind of grotesque for them to use Kijiji for this.

 

[bessie]

Reminder for all: Theories should be based on facts, not rumors. If you can't link it up, then please don't post it.

:tyou:

 

[Arnie M]

The seller could potentially send other pictures if requested to do so, but there is no evidence that was done and the pictures did not come from the seller's facebook. Rather they came from AM's facebook, who has been cleared of any involvement and who is not selling the items. A quick google search will tell you that the body could cost in the area of $15,000 and the completely built kit can sell for around $80,000. So we really have no idea if the body of the car was even for sale IMO. Hence why I asked the question, which incidentally was ignored and, therefore, can only be taken as an assumption on the poster's part, not fact.

It is, however, an interesting way of getting around the rule of not linking to someone's personal facebook account.

JMO

Reluctantly , I feel I must correct some of your erroneous presumptions AD

First of all , I contacted the seller and made an offer on the Eldorado OK ?

At the same time I inquired about the Cobra Kit and what parts are included OK ?

Never once did I claim the Cobra body pics were from the kijiji seller

The Cobra body pictures are posted publicly other than FB

Most Carrol Shelby affectionados post their builds on Cobra Forums and share build tips.

Prior to May 5th 2013 I took interest in some items being liquidated at MA
One is pictured below and is still for sale
As of this date C-FKLK does not appear to be for sale

I have been aware of DM since 1999 , accomplishments such as his solo flight at age 14 do not go unnoticed in aviation circles.

I hope you find this educational and clarifies a few things

I enjoyed sharing the CM trivia during the slow news days
I hope I do not regret posting it.

Best wishes
AM

 

[Alethea Dice]

Reluctantly , I feel I must correct some of your erroneous presumptions AD

First of all , I contacted the seller and made an offer on the Eldorado OK ?

At the same time I inquired about the Cobra Kit and what parts are included OK ?

Never once did I claim the Cobra body pics were from the kijiji seller

The Cobra body pictures are posted publicly other than FB

Most Carrol Shelby affectionados post their builds on Cobra Forums and share build tips.

Prior to May 5th 2013 I took interest in some items being liquidated at MA
One is pictured below and is still for sale
As of this date C-FKLK does not appear to be for sale

I have been aware of DM since 1999 , accomplishments such as his solo flight at age 14 do not go unnoticed in aviation circles.

I hope you find this educational and clarifies a few things

I enjoyed sharing the CM trivia during the slow news days
I hope I do not regret posting it.

Best wishes
AM

Thank you for that. A response and a link to the publicly posted pictures could have answered my questions very quickly. When a request is ignored, we are only left with presumptions. However, I do apologize that my frustrations with numerous other ignored requests for links ended up being directed at your particular post.

There are many people who have been aware of DM since his first solo flight, myself included, who are not in aviation circles.

JMO

 

[swedie]

Actually most modern day state of the art aircraft maintenance facilities are neat as a pin , almost sterile like an operating room .... including the mechanics and their tools .... and they often get paid more than the pilots.

They should be able to lease or sell the hangar to a (smaller) airline and I expect that is what they are aiming for.

Van is a typical airport runabout .... parcels and parts etc ... it could tow a smaller trailer but the large black trailer it has to be a truck ("5th wheel" hitch is in the box)

Thanks Arnie for the information. So that white van would be able to tow an incinerator if need be and the proper hitch installed, is that correct?

 

[swedie]

I haven't really followed anything else on websleuths before now. I am a virgin websleuth so I guess I am allowed to have a question. Is selling off all assets within months of incarceration with a non guilty plea normal? Selling the homes and now personal items so quickly, is this normal? Is anything about this case normal? Why is my head always spinning with the immediate liquidation of assets?
Does DM owe someone a lot of money?? Does he know he is guilty and is afraid of a civil suit? Weird.

Great questions Eldee. It does seem ironic his assets are being sold off doesn't it? No nothing about this case is normal in MOO. One reason could be DM sees no future need for anything which is being sold off. Maybe he knows the rest of his life will be spent behind prison walls therefore get rid of the assets. Also he has a defense lawyer who I'm sure is taking a big bite of money from DM's assets. Also DM still has properties in his name (that we know of) and someone, somehow has to continue to pay the bills such as the most simply ones such as hydro, sewage and taxes. Then there are other ones which need to be paid such as bank loans. WM did borrow money from a lending institution for tools and employees wages. He may have borrow more money for the construction of the hangar itself. We still do not know DM's financial status prior to or as of late so it's hard to determine why the reasons for the sales. MOO.

Not sure if you have read this article yet, but I'm certain DM's assets are being watched very closely and any funny business will be stopped dead in its tracks. I have faith in MB that she would not do anything underhanded but one may try to persuade and/or convince her on the sly to line their pockets. And that's all I'll say about that JMO and HTH.

Tim Bosma murder case: Dellen Millard land deals ‘beyond smelly,’ experts say. The lawyer for the man accused in Tim Bosma's murder dismisses allegations that Millard transferred property fraudulently.

http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2013/06/05/millard_land_deals_beyond_smelly_experts_say.html

Then Dellen began asking Mr. Sharif about the value of the company and why his 71-year-old father, Wayne Millard, should continue to fund a venture whose costs already far exceeded the original estimates. “He advised [me] that the family coffers were running low and that he was very apprehensive to keep pouring money into the facility,”

By 2012, Wayne had hired a team of Canadian aviation veterans, brought in Mr. Sharif to drum up international business, and signed a 50-year lease for the land on which the 50,000 square foot hangar now stands. Millardair won the support of the local airport authority and convinced the Waterloo regional council to invest in runway improvements to accommodate larger jets. When things went over budget, bank loans provided funding for the tools and staff needed to obtain key Transport Canada certification, which came through on November 1, 2012, just before Wayne’s death.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/0...bosma-murder-suspect-started-to-dismantle-it/

 

[Arnie M]

Great questions Eldee. It does seem ironic his assets are being sold off doesn't it? No nothing about this case is normal in MOO. One reason could be DM sees no future need for anything which is being sold off. Maybe he knows the rest of his life will be spent behind prison walls therefore get rid of the assets. ...... (snip) ...... WM did borrow money from a lending institution for tools and employees wages. He may have borrow more money for the construction of the hangar itself. We still do not know DM's financial status prior to or as of late so it's hard to determine why the reasons for the sales. MOO....... (snip) .....

hi swedie ... I agree , but would add the following in order to get the bigger picture

--a few months after WM passed .... a lot of "assets" were likely put up for sale ..... remember this is months before the TB situation ..... included would be a lot of very specialized tooling for the MRO .... one of a kind and very expensive ... just one tool to do one function on a Boeing 747 can cost thousands of dollars for example

Recently that has morphed into some of the car projects , and collector items .... which may have occurred anyway (regardless of the TB situation) .... because if the hangar was to be sold or leased they (DM or whoever) would be short of storage space. Grandpa's $15k Eldorado would then require a $20k private garage for storage .... maybe be better to sell it instead .

There have already been some of DM's other vehicles sold on kijiji (or were for sale) but those links come and go daily and I am not going to post any more about them .... they even had a $1500 gym mattress for sale ... probably for setting components on that require a cushioned surface

It has been reported that WM had some bank debt toward the end .... but in the corporate world there is normally life insurance covering any outstanding balances .... pretty routine in business .... and we must always keep in mind that "M.Air Ltd" is a corporate entity .... separate from the person or persons who own the shares .... the acronym "Ltd" denotes "limited liability"

 

[Arnie M]

Not sure if this has been discussed before , but there very well could be other issues in play regarding the MA hangar .... for example , WM owned the building , but the land is leased thru the airport authority and most likely contract wording would stipulate usage criteria .... ie: ... aviation related .... or of benefit to airport operations in general

In other words , running an auto wrecker or personal car shop may not comply , and that alone could have been causing some issues (irregardless of the TB situation).

A $6 million dollar can of worms .... hopefully the trustees can work it out. Certainly is a nice building , kudos to WM for that.

"The Donald" should buy it to park his 757 , he claims it is worth $100 million ... doesn't he have some developments in Toronto?

 

[Snoofo]

Not sure if this has been discussed before , but there very well could be other issues in play regarding the MA hangar .... for example , WM owned the building , but the land is leased thru the airport authority and most likely contract wording would stipulate usage criteria .... ie: ... aviation related .... or of benefit to airport operations in general

In other words , running an auto wrecker or personal car shop may not comply , and that alone could have been causing some issues (irregardless of the TB situation).

A $6 million dollar can of worms .... hopefully the trustees can work it out. Certainly is a nice building , kudos to WM for that.

"The Donald" should buy it to park his 757 , he claims it is worth $100 million ... doesn't he have some developments in Toronto?

Yes he does but I doubt he'd enjoy schlepping in from Waterloo. Unless he flew in to the island airport and had his pilot go "park the car" in Waterloo. Ahhhh the lives of the rich and famous. Honestly I dont think the Donald spends much time here.

I do think if the Millards were as into the cars dating back to CM who used to fly in car parts and store his collectibles there (both facts which have been supported by links here on many occasions - please advise if I must dig up), and if the MdAir lease in Waterloo was so favourable in its terms (as was also mentioned in MSM and support ed by that email by WM that you were kind enough to share), then it is possible car dealings were a permitted use under the lease, specifically id WM was so frugal he may have negotiated that if it was a source of income for the family in the past. (Totally moo!).

Also consider when DM cancelled the mro cert, he contemplated leasing part of the hangar for uses within the parameters of MdAirs lease from the Airport Authority. Which leads me to believe automotive maintenance and repair was also a permiitted use OR it is possible that was something he was now trying to avoid, perhaps to get certain people out? Won't get into that any further.

 

[Eldee]

All of these scenarios listed above, require the thought processes of a clear minded, normal and rational individual. If, in fact DM is guilty of cold blooded murder, in my opinion, some one else is in charge of liquidating the assets in such a succinct, efficient and timely matter. Could that someone ultimately be MB?
If you know your son is guilty of a horrendous murder would you not ultimately want to wash your hands of him? The quicker .... the better. Eventually, you come to terms with the fact that he isn't the son you raised, you get enough money together to pay the legal fees and then be done with him. The banks will have to figure out a way to get the MdAir loans paid, or written off, because I don't think MB or DM have any liability to the banks.
Or, maybe she was raising bail money.
It would be interesting to know who gets the money from the MdAir asset sale and who gets the money, for lets say CM's Eldorado. Where is all this money going?

<modsnip>

 

[SnooperDuper]

All of these scenarios listed above, require the thought processes of a clear minded, normal and rational individual. If, in fact DM is guilty of cold blooded murder, in my opinion, some one else is in charge of liquidating the assets in such a succinct, efficient and timely matter. Could that someone ultimately be MB?
If you know your son is guilty of a horrendous murder would you not ultimately want to wash your hands of him? The quicker .... the better. Eventually, you come to terms with the fact that he isn't the son you raised, you get enough money together to pay the legal fees and then be done with him. The banks will have to figure out a way to get the MdAir loans paid, or written off, because I don't think MB or DM have any liability to the banks.
Or, maybe she was raising bail money.
It would be interesting to know who gets the money from the MdAir asset sale and who gets the money, for lets say CM's Eldorado. Where is all this money going?

<modsnip>

Well start with:

DP said DM has been visited by friends and family while in custody.

&#8220;His mother is very supportive,&#8221; he added.

http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2013/06/13/tim_bosma_murder_trial_could_be_held_in_late_2014.html

It would be hard to sell a bachelor pad contents included (because the next owner would want to rent a few dumpsters) and somebody had to pack up DM's personal effects from 5 Maplegate Ct.

We can assume MB, and the person who is selling the vehicles are on DM's side? Or the person selling the vehicles is suddenly out of a good job and is just stringing along as long as he can do something and be paid for it, that is, until the ride is over?

 

[swedie]

All of these scenarios listed above, require the thought processes of a clear minded, normal and rational individual. If, in fact DM is guilty of cold blooded murder, in my opinion, some one else is in charge of liquidating the assets in such a succinct, efficient and timely matter. Could that someone ultimately be MB?
If you know your son is guilty of a horrendous murder would you not ultimately want to wash your hands of him? The quicker .... the better. Eventually, you come to terms with the fact that he isn't the son you raised, you get enough money together to pay the legal fees and then be done with him. The banks will have to figure out a way to get the MdAir loans paid, or written off, because I don't think MB or DM have any liability to the banks.
Or, maybe she was raising bail money.
It would be interesting to know who gets the money from the MdAir asset sale and who gets the money, for lets say CM's Eldorado. Where is all this money going?
<modsnip>

I would think MB is the one who has been appointed responsible to clean house for DM. She may have called upon an acquintance or two of DM's to assist her in liquidating items she has little or no knowledge of such as vehicles and tools housed in the hangar. Possibly DM has requested a friend give his mother a hand. Surely she would have a lawyer working with her to make certain she is doing everything according to the book.

IMHO I can see it as just that; the sooner she can be rid of DM's possessions, they better off she will be. She probably has so many legal loopholes and red tape to cut through before she can rid herself of this mess which seems to me has been thrusted upon the poor woman. How devastated she must be; as you said above, BBM.

I could see her renting a couple of dumpster and a crew once she got the green light to sell the Maplegate house or any other properties owned by DM which contained his personal possessions. I don't think she would want to dirty her hands (no insult intended) anymore than necessary to clean up after DM, having to go through his stuff, causing her more grief. It would be similar to a parent sorting through a deceased child's belonging and maybe worse knowing what she knows to date. Certainly she must know the truth by now and it must be absolutely devastating for her to have to deal with all she knows. Here's hoping she has the support she needs and is coping as well as can be expected now that the dust has settled somewhat.

I would think DM is still liable to Millardair and could be one of the reasons for liquidating his other properties. As long as there is money to be made from assets or potential investments are depleted, DM cannot claim bankruptcy on Millardair. It is unclear whether the business was free and clear but I assume it wasn't for the fact WM had to loan money to pay for tools and employees and who knows how much money he may have borrowed for the initial construction of the hangar. It's been stated WM invested some of his own money, but it's not clear as to how much. A huge chunk, maybe more than WM invested could have very well came from the bank. It will be interesting to see the final tally sheet when all is said and done. Then again, we may never know. All of it is :moo:

 

[swedie]

hi swedie ... I agree , but would add the following in order to get the bigger picture

--a few months after WM passed .... a lot of "assets" were likely put up for sale ..... remember this is months before the TB situation ..... included would be a lot of very specialized tooling for the MRO .... one of a kind and very expensive ... just one tool to do one function on a Boeing 747 can cost thousands of dollars for example

Recently that has morphed into some of the car projects , and collector items .... which may have occurred anyway (regardless of the TB situation) .... because if the hangar was to be sold or leased they (DM or whoever) would be short of storage space. Grandpa's $15k Eldorado would then require a $20k private garage for storage .... maybe be better to sell it instead .

There have already been some of DM's other vehicles sold on kijiji (or were for sale) but those links come and go daily and I am not going to post any more about them .... they even had a $1500 gym mattress for sale ... probably for setting components on that require a cushioned surface

It has been reported that WM had some bank debt toward the end .... but in the corporate world there is normally life insurance covering any outstanding balances .... pretty routine in business .... and we must always keep in mind that "M.Air Ltd" is a corporate entity .... separate from the person or persons who own the shares .... the acronym "Ltd" denotes "limited liability"

BBM But we know WM referred to the business as being DM's project. So with that, was the company in DM's name as owner or part owner? I don't recall at this time. If DM was listed as part owner, would he still be liable to pay off any debts/loans? Isn't he still liable for paying taxes, interest charges and other expenses arising on a regular basis? TIA. :moo:

 

[swedie]

Still waiting on a bail hearing. :sweep: JMO but I don't think it's gonna happen.

Wondering if LE were able to find any video surveillance from MB's neighbourhood. Obviously the neighbour looked out the window. Here's hoping they got a good description of the people or person dropping off the trailer. They obviously saw it was a truck. Too bad they couldn't read the license plate though. :moo:

Paradkar said Millard is staying silent until the police complete their investigation. Millard is set to attend a bail hearing Wednesday, but Paradkar said they will hold off on requesting bail until the Crown can provide them with more information on the case.

Neighbours told CBC News they were awakened late Thursday night by the bright lights and noise of a truck backing up. It dropped off the trailer in Millard's mother's driveway and left.

On Sunday, around noon, police descended on the property. By that night, as police towed away the trailer, Hamilton police confirmed there was a truck inside the trailer they believe belongs to Tim Bosma. Now, police tell CBC News they are looking for video surveillance from homes on Tinsmith Court, the street where the trailer was found.

Neighbours told CBC News the lights of the truck were so bright, they couldn't make out a licence plate. They also noted they hadn't seen Millard's mother all week.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamil...pearance-staying-silent-lawyer-says-1.1330722

 

[cansleuther]

And, the other thing that bothers me is in DM's camp they seem to be so very very concerned about the liquidation of assets and the scrambling and scurrying that entails, the fact that a good family man is dead, leaving a wife and young child without a father and a husband seems to be on the back burner while they scramble for signatures and cheques. Bit of a joke, in my very own humble opinion.

For all we know MS's family could be selling off their houses, vehicles, etc. to pay for his defense as well. The only difference in DM's case is that every move his family makes is being reported in MSM, blogged about, sleuthed, etc. How an accused is able to fund their legal bills isn't usually public knowledge.

 

[Sillybilly]

For all we know MS's family could be selling off their houses, vehicles, etc. to pay for his defense as well. The only difference in DM's case is that every move his family makes is being reported in MSM, blogged about, sleuthed, etc. How an accused is able to fund their legal bills isn't usually public knowledge.

Highly unlikely MS' family would be liquidating assets to fund his defence. As an adult, if MS doesn't have assets of his own, he is entitled to legal aid. With DM having assets in his own name, he most likely wouldn't qualify for legal aid (thus the liquidation factor wrt DM).

 

[Snoofo]

Highly unlikely MS' family would be liquidating assets to fund his defence. As an adult, if MS doesn't have assets of his own, he is entitled to legal aid. With DM having assets in his own name, he most likely wouldn't qualify for legal aid (thus the liquidation factor wrt DM).

Good point.
Will legal aid pay for the whole bill if MS is using a lawyer of his choosing? Dungey may not come cheap - is the public made to pay for any lawyer an accused person wants? If a dollar amount is allotted, who pays the rest if it exceeds that amount?

 

[Arnie M]

Wondering if LE were able to find any video surveillance from MB's neighbourhood. Obviously the neighbour looked out the window. Here's hoping they got a good description of the people or person dropping off the trailer. They obviously saw it was a truck. Too bad they couldn't read the license plate though.
<snip>

.... it was mentioned on one of the news videos when they talked to a neighbor , they even showed his camera hanging under his eaves-trough ... I am pretty sure it was at MB's .... because neighbor also mentioned how quiet and private they were (MB household)

I could be wrong ... maybe was MS or DM house .... but pretty sure it was MB

I didnt save the video link .

 

[Alethea Dice]

Good point.
Will legal aid pay for the whole bill if MS is using a lawyer of his choosing? Dungey may not come cheap - is the public made to pay for any lawyer an accused person wants? If a dollar amount is allotted, who pays the rest if it exceeds that amount?

I believe, as long as the lawyer is willing to take the case on legal aid fee scales, they can choose whatever lawyer they want. If the lawyer thinks the case will be more complicated and require a larger amount of funds, they can make an application for more and it can be either accepted or refused by legal aid. And that's all there is. He cannot bill someone else to recoup what his normal fees would have produced.

JMO