Glimpses into Casey's Frame of Mind During Solitude *REVISITED*

[Turnadot]

Don't forget the drugged up friends she allowed to tend to her toddler while she slept.

Plenty of good moms do that.

/Nancy Grace

HOLD ON! HOLD ON! HOLD ON!!

/Nancy

 

[LiveLaughLuv]

You're talking about a narcisist!

If Inmate Anthony has any remorse, it's due to her freedom being taken, IMO.

If she had any remorse, she would have directed LE to where Caylee was and not carry on with the nanny took Caylee or the nanny didn't return Caylee. She would not have given incredulous information not helping to find an allegedly abducted Caylee. She had every chance to tell LE the real truth, only that paints her in a depraved light. She can't have people talking bad about her or that she wasn't as good a mother as she believes.

Just because a woman gives birth, it doesn't automatically make her a mother, IMO...she doesn't have a nurturing bone in her body, since she's always comparing her beauty to Caylee's beauty. Who is in competition with their child???

Mothering is much more than just giving love. You must provide for your child in many ways, not just hugs and kisses..A parents priorities change when a child comes into your life. Your child is now #1 and your needs are secondary to your childs. Inmate Anthony loves herself the most and I truly do not feel she understands love, unconditional love herself. She is a spoiled brat who feels entitled. Instead of working her butt off to get out on her own, she mooches as much as she can from anyone she can, IMO..she latches on to young men as if this places a value on her as a young woman. She is far from independant since she relied on her mother for room and board.

Caylee became a liability to her especially since CA gave her an ultimatum to straighten up and fly right. She has been acting irresponsibly and her mother looked the other way far too often, never holding Inmate Anthony responsible for any wrong doings, this according to her own brother, LA. When CA took a stance, Inmate Anthony reacted in anger and rage. How dare she change her conditions. She told me if I had my baby, everything would be okay. JMHO

Inmate Anthony lives in a delusional fantasyland, is she that mentally screwed up that reality doesn't exist??? I do believe CA emotionally and mentally crippled Inmate Anthony. If she didn't like living under her mothers rule why didn't she get a full time job, put Caylee in daycare, get her own apartment and be her own woman? She is not unique in that aspect, there are many single woman raising children alone, yet they manage to juggle a full time job and being a parent. Again, it's about priorities. I did it when I was a single mom with 2 children at 22...it can be done, it depends on how badly you want independance and how much your children mean to you...JMHO

Justice for Caylee

 

[LambChop]

You're talking about a narcisist!

If Inmate Anthony has any remorse, it's due to her freedom being taken, IMO.

If she had any remorse, she would have directed LE to where Caylee was and not carry on with the nanny took Caylee or the nanny didn't return Caylee. She would not have given incredulous information not helping to find an allegedly abducted Caylee. She had every chance to tell LE the real truth, only that paints her in a depraved light. She can't have people talking bad about her or that she wasn't as good a mother as she believes.

Just because a woman gives birth, it doesn't automatically make her a mother, IMO...she doesn't have a nurturing bone in her body, since she's always comparing her beauty to Caylee's beauty. Who is in competition with their child???

Mothering is much more than just giving love. You must provide for your child in many ways, not just hugs and kisses..A parents priorities change when a child comes into your life. Your child is now #1 and your needs are secondary to your childs. Inmate Anthony loves herself the most and I truly do not feel she understands love, unconditional love herself. She is a spoiled brat who feels entitled. Instead of working her butt off to get out on her own, she mooches as much as she can from anyone she can, IMO..she latches on to young men as if this places a value on her as a young woman. She is far from independant since she relied on her mother for room and board.

Caylee became a liability to her especially since CA gave her an ultimatum to straighten up and fly right. She has been acting irresponsibly and her mother looked the other way far too often, never holding Inmate Anthony responsible for any wrong doings, this according to her own brother, LA. When CA took a stance, Inmate Anthony reacted in anger and rage. How dare she change her conditions. She told me if I had my baby, everything would be okay. JMHO

Inmate Anthony lives in a delusional fantasyland, is she that mentally screwed up that reality doesn't exist??? I do believe CA emotionally and mentally crippled Inmate Anthony. If she didn't like living under her mothers rule why didn't she get a full time job, put Caylee in daycare, get her own apartment and be her own woman? She is not unique in that aspect, there are many single woman raising children alone, yet they manage to juggle a full time job and being a parent. Again, it's about priorities. I did it when I was a single mom with 2 children at 22...it can be done, it depends on how badly you want independance and how much your children mean to you...JMHO

Justice for Caylee

Sounds like "Snow White" with the witch at the mirror. "Mirror, mirror on the wall. Whose the fairest of them all."

 

[Vegas Bride]

Why are people still saying Casey was a good mother even after finding out she didn't work, didn't buy grocery for Caylee. Probably no clothes (or with someone else's money ) Didn't put a roof over her head (Her parents did) and couldn't even purchase a birthday cake without stealing from her great grandma to get one?

A good mother isn't just about not spanking a child or just love. It is about providing for that child. Casey did none of that....

What made her a good mother?:banghead:

Charleyann

I couldn't agree more!
What did she do to provide for her child?
She whiled away her days making Pretend, she could have somewhere along the way actually start to work towards a goal of providing for her daughter. IMO she was so puffed up about herself that she believed it was everyone else's goal in life to provide her with what she wanted/needed. It was her right to steal what she wanted from friends and family, after all she is the important one.
I have heard of nothing to make me feel Caylee was ever the important one to her, she wasn't even in the running.
Her days should have been filled with looking for ways to build a future and provide for Caylee. Get some kind of training so she could get a good job, find good daycare, not an immaginary nanny.
How does tramping around in clubs and pinning your hopes on the newest dude fit into being a good mother?
I just can not believe that she ever felt love for Caylee, if she did then she would have done something/anything to try for a better life.
Parents understand the concept of doing whatever it takes to provide for their babies. You work at a job that isn't ideal, you do without so your child can have, you stay home rather than go out with bar buddies, you build friendships with other parents so your child spends time with peers, you look for ways to give them what They need, not what You need, you find that you get satisfaction from seeing your child is happy and safely tucked in at night.
Where are the writings about wanting a better life/a beautiful life for her child. No, before the killing and after the killing it's all been Me Me Me Me Me and she felt that no matter what she did, all she had to do to fix it was put a pretty sticker on it, use a few flowery words, smile big to show her bleached teeth, then walk away, all would be good in CaseyLand.

VB

 

[Chiquita71]

Hello WS

Just for further discussion.

Salome was the stepdaughter of Herod Antipas, danced before him and her mother Herodias at the occasion of his birthday, and in doing so gave her mother the opportunity to obtain the head of John the Baptist. According to Mark's gospel Herodias bore a grudge against John for stating that Herod's marriage to Herodias was unlawful; Herodias encouraged Salome to demand that John be executed.

And when a convenient day was come, that Herod on his birthday made a supper to his lords, high captains, and chief estates of Galilee; And when the daughter of the said Herodias came in, and danced, and pleased Herod and them that sat with him, the king said unto the damsel, Ask of me whatsoever thou wilt, and I will give it thee. And he sware unto her, Whatsoever thou shalt ask of me, I will give it thee, unto the half of my kingdom. And she went forth, and said unto her mother, What shall I ask? And she said, The head of John the Baptist.

And she came in straightway with haste unto the king, and asked, saying, I will that thou give me by and by in a charger the head of John the Baptist. And the king was exceeding sorry; yet for his oath's sake, and for their sakes which sat with him, he would not reject her. And immediately the king sent an executioner, and commanded his head to be brought: and he went and beheaded him in the prison, and brought his head in a charger, and gave it to the damsel: and the damsel gave it to her mother. And when his disciples heard of it, they came and took up his corpse, and laid it in a tomb. (Mark 6:21-29, KJV)

[ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salome[/ame]

I put that up just because the picture is about John the Baptist being beheaded. I have known some females to be drawn to the idea of the B*t(h as their personal archetype. I'm the angel type. Salome could be considered a "*****" from history. ETA: It was Salome's mother that really was the one who called for the beheading, though.

I don't enjoy spreading the idea that women are "*****es." So, I am only using this as an example while we are discussing the subject of Casey's psyche.

...js...

 

[Harmony 2]

Sounds like "Snow White" with the witch at the mirror. "Mirror, mirror on the wall. Whose the fairest of them all."

It does appear there was some hidden resentment that Caylee was everyone's ray of sunshine. Perhaps Casey felt that Caylee stole her thunder.

* Clint describes Caylee as the “Most precious little girl I have ever seen my entire life.” “She would be in a room –she lit the room up.”

The quote came from his appearance on Greta. The link may not work any longer.

http://www.foxnews.com/ontherecord/caylee/index.html#

** "They just want Caylee back. That is all they are worried about right now is getting Caylee back," Casey Anthony said. "And you know what, that is all I care about right now."
"Casey, your daughter, your flesh and blood and baby girl.." Kristina said.
"Kristina, please," Casey Anthony said. "Put my brother back on the phone, I don't want to get into this with you right now. I love you honey and I'm glad that you are there. Thank you for your help. I will let you know if there is anything that you can do."

http://www.clickorlando.com/news/16993169/detail.html


*Cindy’s post on Myspace
Thursday, July 03, 2008
my caylee is missing
She came into my life unexspectedly, just as she has left me. This precious little angel from above gave me strength and unconditional love. Now she is gone and I don't know why. All I am guilty of is loving her and providing her a safe home. Jealousy has taken her away. Jealousy from the one person that should be thankfull for all of the love and support given to her. A mother's love is deep, however there are limits when one is betrayed by the one she loved and trusted the most. A daughter comes to her mother for support when she is pregnant, the mother says without hesitation it will be ok. And it was. But then the lies and betrayal began. First it seemed harmless, ah, love is blind. A mother will look for the good in her child and give them a chance to change. This mother gave chance after chance for her daughter to change, but instead more lies more betrayal. What does the mother get for giving her daughter all of these chances? A broken heart. The daughter who stole money, lots of money, leaves without warning and does not let her mother now speak to the baby that her mother raised, fed, clothed, sheltered, paid her medical bills, etc. Instead tells her friends that her mother is controlling her life and she needs her space. No money, no future. Where did she go? Who is now watching out for the little angel?

** Jesse saying that Casey broke up with him because she thought he loved Caylee more than her.

** NL: “ With the nanny. Uhm, she said either they were, now Cameron and I had asked her before, you know, “Where’s Caylee? How come we haven’t seen Caylee around? Because we liked Caylee. We liked having her around. ‘How come we haven’t seen her around? You don’t bring her by anymore.’ ‘Oh, they’re at Disney World,’ or, ‘They’re over in Cocoa’ or ‘They’re here for the day,’ which it’s summer time. You know uh, she’s a supposedly working mother. That doesn’t strike me as odd for yur child to be off, you know, for the summer.”

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/5687695/Casey-Anthony-Nathan-Lezniewicz-transcript

 

[Pensfan]

Hello WS

Just for further discussion.

Salome was the stepdaughter of Herod Antipas, danced before him and her mother Herodias at the occasion of his birthday, and in doing so gave her mother the opportunity to obtain the head of John the Baptist. According to Mark's gospel Herodias bore a grudge against John for stating that Herod's marriage to Herodias was unlawful; Herodias encouraged Salome to demand that John be executed.

And when a convenient day was come, that Herod on his birthday made a supper to his lords, high captains, and chief estates of Galilee; And when the daughter of the said Herodias came in, and danced, and pleased Herod and them that sat with him, the king said unto the damsel, Ask of me whatsoever thou wilt, and I will give it thee. And he sware unto her, Whatsoever thou shalt ask of me, I will give it thee, unto the half of my kingdom. And she went forth, and said unto her mother, What shall I ask? And she said, The head of John the Baptist.

And she came in straightway with haste unto the king, and asked, saying, I will that thou give me by and by in a charger the head of John the Baptist. And the king was exceeding sorry; yet for his oath's sake, and for their sakes which sat with him, he would not reject her. And immediately the king sent an executioner, and commanded his head to be brought: and he went and beheaded him in the prison, and brought his head in a charger, and gave it to the damsel: and the damsel gave it to her mother. And when his disciples heard of it, they came and took up his corpse, and laid it in a tomb. (Mark 6:21-29, KJV)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salome

I put that up just because the picture is about John the Baptist being beheaded. I have known some females to be drawn to the idea of the B*t(h as their personal archetype. I'm the angel type. Salome could be considered a "*****" from history. ETA: It was Salome's mother that really was the one who called for the beheading, though.

I don't enjoy spreading the idea that women are "*****es." So, I am only using this as an example while we are discussing the subject of Casey's psyche.

...js...

Salome was controlled by her mother (just like CA is a controlling [person]) and used seduction to "get what she wanted" (just like KC). She also gloated over her the result of her murderous actions. Her seduction abilities gave her power. This painting definitely depicts some of KC's disturbed thoughts.

 

[LambChop]

KC is the Nanny. That is why it is so easy to forgive the nanny. KC puts all the responsibility off on the nanny. Nanny was teaching her a lesson. So what was the lesson???

 

[Reagan]

Bella Vita, txting a friend ‘this is the happiest I’ve been in a long time’

Snipped.
I agree with your entire post, but I did want to address this.
The 'this is the happiest I've been in a long time' was not a text, but was written in the '03 diary.

Please correct me if I'm wrong. If there is a text like that from KC then that's a HUGE freaking nail in the coffin.

Good thread, btw.

ETA: Just about as bad as claiming your child was kidnapped with zanni, but during that time KC was telling Anthony R on AIMchat that she loves her nanny and trusts her so much. Ick

 

[Turnadot]

Snipped.
I agree with your entire post, but I did want to address this.
The 'this is the happiest I've been in a long time' was not a text, but was written in the '03 diary.

Please correct me if I'm wrong. If there is a text like that from KC then that's a HUGE freaking nail in the coffin.

Good thread, btw.

ETA: Just about as bad as claiming your child was kidnapped with zanni, but during that time KC was telling Anthony R on AIMchat that she loves her nanny and trusts her so much. Ick

You're absolutely right, and thanks for the correction.

*makes mental notation*

I retract my claim that KC txt'd that to a friend.

 

[Reagan]

Whew. I was hoping you were right!

Tis okay, she still sent the text to Amy about the smell and dead plastered animals. That was one of her first nails in the coffin.

 

[Turnadot]

Whew. I was hoping you were right!

Tis okay, she still sent the text to Amy about the smell and dead plastered animals. That was one of her first nails in the coffin.

Oh don't we both wish I had been!

I agree about the convo with Anthony R and the text with Amy.

 

[eaglemom]

Snipped.
I agree with your entire post, but I did want to address this.
The 'this is the happiest I've been in a long time' was not a text, but was written in the '03 diary.

Please correct me if I'm wrong. If there is a text like that from KC then that's a HUGE freaking nail in the coffin.

Good thread, btw.

ETA: Just about as bad as claiming your child was kidnapped with zanni, but during that time KC was telling Anthony R on AIMchat that she loves her nanny and trusts her so much. Ick

Actually this conversation was in an IM chat with Iassin or however you spell his name - ID [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=77596"]Casey's IM's with Iassen & Tony R (in entirety) - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

on Sunday July 13th -
they also on this date discuss the nanny caring for Caylee

ID: Wheres the other guy. the spanish guy?
KC (11.41AM) Ricardo and i arent really even friends anymore
ID Sucks doesnt it....
KC We stopped dating in march, right around my birthday. yeah, seriously.
ID Still have feelings for him?
KC Ha definitely not . the other way around actually
ID: Oh. how did you get over him so quickly?
KC: (11.42AM ) I didnt have the same feelings, he said i led him on. i never really ever saw him as more than a friend. it sucks, but i was honest
ID: ( 11.43AM) I thought you were the one who wanted a relationship
KC: I did for a little bit, but he wanted to wait.
ID And it bit him i the . are you happy now?
KC (11.44AM) I am very happy now
ID Thats good
KC Thanks
ID I dont remember what that feels like
KC I'm sorry hun :-(
ID Thats life i guess
KC This is the first time i've felt this way in along time....yeah. it is, seriously.
ID You like this kid a lot?
KC (11.45AM ) I care about him an extreme amt...lets just leave it at that. haha
ID Uhhhh, dont say love haha
KC I'm avoiding saying it, but i do. haha
ID (11.46AM) Wow. but you've known him for a lot longer than 7 wks, right?
KC Well, i'm selective on who i tell, just because we havent been together that long.
KC Yeah. we've been friends for almost a year

 

[MD MOMMY]

The one that has just struck me as odd on the icons is this one..

"I'm not the ***** next door, I'm the ***** down the street"

Kind of iconic considering Caylee's body was "down the street".

 

[Reagan]

Actually this conversation was in an IM chat with Iassin or however you spell his name - ID Casey's IM's with Iassen & Tony R (in entirety) - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

Thanks, you're right!

KC: I have a nanny. i love her
ID Nice. how much do they charge?
KC: We've been friends for over 6 years. definitely someone i trust.

 

[Eidetic]

Sounds like "Snow White" with the witch at the mirror. "Mirror, mirror on the wall. Whose the fairest of them all."

One of the icons she collected did say; "*****, in order for me to hate on you, you'd have to be pretty."

 

[Eidetic]

KC is the Nanny. That is why it is so easy to forgive the nanny. KC puts all the responsibility off on the nanny. Nanny was teaching her a lesson. So what was the lesson???

"You won't have my child if you won't have me." multiplied several times over to include SP, LA, CA, GA and probably MP.
But mostly meant for mom because she went back and forth with the possibility of raising Caylee, in my opinion.

 

[newsaddict]

The flipside is, if you were the murderer, why in the world would you post this image on your computer or page?

I have always found the images interesting, too. Wonder who may have seen these images with her, discussed them, or even pointed her to them? Had them on their own webpage, etc. Who knows? Who knows what she knew at that time, how much she or others knew that they haven't divulged, or why she downloaded it or from whom? I mean, we download a lot of stuff trying to get to the truth, maybe she was doing the same? I don't know.
Her downloading this or "posting it" (she posted it on a page?) (if she's the one who did) could seem to me to be communicating with friends regarding something about Caylee, could indicate some knowledge on her part or others', and trying to explain away something that had happened, rationalize it, more like it was an accident. But on the other hand, if she were actually the murderer, why on earth would she collect such an image on her own computer or post such an image? (Not to mention, why would she have left the tape on the body when disposing of it and many other things, if she were the murderer.)

Perhaps because as throughout her whole life she was too arrogant to believe she'd GET CAUGHT!

 

[NocturnalLady]

I always suspected that Casey was attracted to that pic for several reasons. I think most of us agree that it looks like the remains site. The word love is intriguing, because the dark background and the brightness of the word love stand in stark contrast.

At first I thought the word "love" was a sign of remorse. Sort of an "I miss you and I'm sorry" to Caylee.

However, the more I thought about it, I think it's meant to be ironic. The word "love" is plastered over this dark, almost evil haunting picture. I think she is telling us that love -- at least hers -- is dark, sick and twisted and she knows it. She doesn't understand what love really is. The child she is supposed to "love" she murders. The mother she is supposed to "love" she punishes.

I'm probably not explaining this well. Hopefully, someone can put together a coherent thought from my ramblings.

The word love obscuring the face of the girl reminded me instantly of the heart sticker that Casey placed over Caylee's mouth.

Also the darkness obscuring the face (and thus personality/individuality) of the girl also reminded me of the duct tape.

I think Casey used the duct tape to kill Caylee but also as a means of "blotting her out". Covering the face of the victim is almost always a sign that the killer knew the victim and was close to them and had rage towards that person. I think Casey hadn't ever really wanted Caylee to exist in the first place so the duct tape played out as a way of erasing her - literally and figuratively. As for the heart sticker, there is some seriously deep psychological stuff going on in Casey's mind with that sticker! Almost like after she robbed Caylee of her identity by covering her with duct tape, she is reducing the reality of mothering Caylee to a cartoony final statement...like putting a stamp on a letter, it was like a finishing touch before she sealed her up and "sent her away", hopefully never to bother Casey again.

I'm having a hard time totally putting these thoughts into words but I hope you can see what I'm getting at...

This picture is almost an artistic representation of what Casey had done. She must have had a deep response of recognition when she saw this picture.

 

[NocturnalLady]

I have been contemplating why and where KC came across The Apparition by Gustave Moreau. Clearly, KC wasn’t a painter and I can’t imagine her touring art galleries (unless they passed out lots of free wine). I have to believe that she was studied this during some art appreciation class in her high school. Read what the painter wanted his painting to depict. It is just creepy! KC must have believed her activities emulated this painting.

{If you look closely at this painting it depicts an executioner with a blood-stained sword, an almost nude looking woman, and the head of a dead person (St. John the Baptist).}

This is an art critics description of the painting:
The beautiful, nude princess becomes Woman while watching the execution and seeing the severed head. She becomes more refined, savage and exquisite. She was awakened from the dulled senses of man. She was bewitched and subdueded with her charm that was cultivated in sacrilegious beds and impious hothouses.

If KC believed this painting was relevant to her “activities/murder” at this time, consider the following.
The beautiful, nude KC becomes Woman while watching the death of Caylee and seeing her dead body. KC becomes more refined, savage and exquisite. KC was awakened from the dulled senses of man. KC was bewitched and subdued with her charm that was cultivated in sacrilegious beds and impious hothouses.

Other art critics have stated this r/t this painting:
The woman's gaze (the woman staring at the dead head) has been described as a combination of success at what she has just accomplished, and fear of what she has just done.

Very disturbing, eh?

That last critical quote is very apt in this context. Also I think it's possible that Casey was being haunted by her own apparitions of Caylee. Caylee's face looking at her...hence the nightmares at Tony's? I think that Casey would have responded to this picture for exactly the reasons the critic pointed out. The woman (isn't it Salome?) uses her upraised arm to simultaneously hail her achievement and bring attention to it while also pushing it away and distancing herself from it.

I saw a great operatic production of the story of Salome and John the Baptist that was based on Oscar Wilde's version of the story. His version is that Salome fell in love with him because of his beauty but was rejected because John the Baptist can love no one but God and scorns the sexual love of a woman. As revenge Salome has her father execute him and bring him John's head on a plate. She dances the dance of the seven veils to glory in her revenge. In this dance she slowly disrobes until she is naked and then kisses John's severed head. Oscar Wilde's version of the tale emphasizes the dark and twisted nature of both Salome and John the Baptists idea of love. It was a really moving opera!

Salome is also considered one of histories greatest sort of evil seductresses. This particular painting is featured on the Wikipedia page about Salome so I wonder if Casey ran across it that way??