Found Deceased IA - Mollie Tibbetts, 20, Poweshiek County, 19 Jul 2018 *Arrest* #45

[Vedder]

Some people cannot accept that normal people with no criminal history whatsoever and living a relatively unremarkable existence can and do murder with no warning at all. It’s only going to make sense in their minds if they can tell themselves he must have been evil all along. I’m amazed at how such an imaginative backstory can be fabricated after the fact.

Yes. There's a first time for everything. I respect the right for everyone to post theories; however, the fan fiction gets a scroll and roll.

 

[feralwriter]

Oh lord, no you weren’t safe there! That’s really the only part of Iowa City I’d call a “bad part of town.” A few years ago they added a little police station in that plaza just west of there hoping to curb crime a bit but it’s still scary out there.

Yeah, on the corner of that shopping center; that police station is sort of a front. It didn't look walk in. But yeah, ICPD practically had their own- we called it Dolphin Pointe PD, or DPPD... I constantly called DPPD over neighbors. Saw outrageous gangups on people there, tons of drugs & theft. I'd be outside middle of night gardening by flashlight though. I wasn't gonna be cowed. But I did move as soon as I could (Alexis Park Inn, almost as bad). And still I felt safer there than San Fran.

I guess the point is to examine my safety worldview, assumptions I had my whole life about anywhere I am. Nowhere is safe. Nowhere. And to be vigilant but not paranoid, like living in a Stephen King novel. I won't think about a small town as being paradise again. Good for you moving out of IC. I found some genuine darkness there.

 

[Al Hoffman]

Good post much better written than mine. After learning to drive a large piece of machinery that size, the second most important aspect is to learn to protect
The Machinery. Breakage and repair is very expensive.

I distinctly remember learning to plow. The first day I broke every point in a six bottom plow. I thought my grandfather was going to end my farming career. While it was hard work and I enjoyed it and the increased allowance I received, that day I became a very expensive farm hand. My grandfather and I spent the next day and a half replacing those points. Until the day he died if I ever spoearedvto be arrogant he would gently remind me that no one before or since had broken 6 points. Had he not been so upset with me I might think it’s humorous today!!!


4-H is alive and well in the Midwest.

At fair time and especially a good share of exhibits are from youth 4-H programs.

4-H is a great teaching tool. I
learned to sew, paint and garden via that group, FAA ( future farmers of America) is another excellent group for learning.

Thanks!

You sound just like the Midwest farm boys I used to drink and swap stories with in the Student Union in Davenport, IA.

When I went to Farm & Fleet to shop (the Farmer's Home Depot, now Tractor Supply Co.) I used to marvel at the medieval look of things like the steel points you broke. Rows and rows, and stacks and stacks of agramachinery replacement parts. Oh, and $11 motorcycle tires when the Honda dealership I drove past charged $90. My Midwest Farm boy motorcycle wrench told me where to go buy parts. He first learned to wrench fixing Farm machinery, then in the Navy on warplanes, then on Bikes in a MC gang. He was the only one left alive from his club, raising a family, going to school, and supporting himself fixing Bikes in a $25/month garage in Moline, Ill.

Good times!

 

[Al Hoffman]

No.

"Would a corn harvester grind up a body?"

Not a harvester. That's what woodchippers were made for, to mince and spray bodies.

There was a case, a guy who killed his Air Stewardess wife, who used a woodchiper to dispose of her frozen body. This was in early or pre-DNA days, and they were only able to ID her body because of the single big toe LE found. Somebody had noticed the husband had been woodchipping, and thought this odd in the dead of winter.

 

[beebosox]

If you were his attorneys, how would you defend Rivera, given what we know and what we intuit at this moment of the proceedings?

 

[JenniD]

Those big tines in the front line up between the rows a couple feet above the ground. That directs the corn stalks in where the ears are stripped off. The kernels are stripped from the ears and the corn moves through the chute to the truck that’s following alongside. Stalks and cobs are discharged out the back. Nothing really gets ground up. And anything close to the ground goes under those tines, doesn’t get picked up at all.

Will LE be present when the field where MT was found is harvested? Wondering if they will look for further clues?

 

[SharonNeedles]

If you were his attorneys, how would you defend Rivera, given what we know and what we intuit at this moment of the proceedings?

While I would speculate that the only defense with even the slightest chance would be to argue for Second Degree, the one defense move you can surely count on is the change of venue motion and IMO it would inevitably be granted.

 

[Al Hoffman]

Safety is not a guarantee anywhere we live there are risks; but packing a gun, or never leaving home .. I don’t like being a victim of anything or feeling like a sheep. I know as I age I will have to make some changes. Elderly can be targets. I’ve been researching senior services here and there is strength in numbers, a lot of activities and supportive groups/ services. “Everyone wants to grow old, but no one wants to be old.” Anonymous

I once worked in a very large, very old uptown Hospital in New Orleans. We had a very vigorous, 80+ year old British nurse on our Staff, in the Nursing Education Department. She could recall caring for British Army recruits during WWI. She always came and went with a very expensive British made umbrella.

One day, on the way home from work, she was "mugged" outside of the hospital. Security saw it going down on the cameras, and raced out to "save" her. When they got there, she had her young, muscular assailant on the ground, held with his arm in a joint lock, while thumping on him with the handle of her bumbershoot. The young man was screaming to Security: "Get this crazy b**** offa me!!!!" The next day, she was most upset that she had ruined her umbrella, and could not buy a suitable replacement here in the States!

Yeah, choose your retirement buddies well. I personally suggest ex-army nurses. There is safety in numbers, but always carry a big stick, or an expensive, solidly made British umbrella!

 

[MsBetsy]

Still a page or two behind, but interesting that you mentioned IK. Just wanted to add that his army friends said he had a quiet demeanor. When he was asked why he killed, his answer was, "Why not?" Scary stuff.

I couldn't stand his laugh. I don't know how investigators held back from leaping across the table and slapping his face every time they heard that goofy laugh as he was describing the details involved in stalking and brutally murdering all those people.

 

[Al Hoffman]

FWIW. I live on an acreage in Minnesota, I’ve been in all kinds of farm equipment and have helped in the fields. A body would most likely be seen when harvesting. However, it could go unseen as well. If the combine operator wasn’t paying attention as well as he/she should have been and unknowingly runs over the body the weight would bust up and push the decomposed body into the soil. Clothing might be exposed, but maybe not. JMO

Thanks farm person! Stay warm

Yeah, that is always a possibility. And after the snow falls, ain't nobody seeing nothing. Maybe a hunter and his dog in the fall. Is there any bird shooting in the spring before planting, after winter ground heave? Maybe at planting season, post winter ground heave? I'm just throwing stuff out here, but there is a chance that the body may have never been found, or not for a long time. Dogs will bring the damndest things home...

 

[MsBetsy]

Some people cannot accept that normal people with no criminal history whatsoever and living a relatively unremarkable existence can and do murder with no warning at all. It’s only going to make sense in their minds if they can tell themselves he must have been evil all along. I’m amazed at how such an imaginative backstory can be fabricated after the fact.

It wouldn't surprise me at all if he had no criminal history. I wouldn't go as far as calling him normal, but that's a vague and questionable term. It depends how you define normal. Usually when people brutally murder another human being there are underlying reasons that contribute to that action. Even people described as "explosive" have issues that probably were never addressed. Usually in cases where people snap and kill a partner, such as in intimate partner homicide, there is always some emotion such as jealousy or intense feeling of rejection that results in the person losing control and killing the person they loved. Often there is regret and remorse. Sometimes not. I don't feel that it is common for well adjusted, stable, confident, compassionate, or whatever is defined as " normal" people to suddenly decide to kill someone for no apparent reason. If this is the case then we need to fear everyone around us. Imo there has to be something going on in the persons head to begin with. Pent up anger, fear of rejection, anxiety, life history, no respect for life, or something has to be a factor in order to make one capable of taking a life in the first place. Jmo

 

[Al Hoffman]

If you were his attorneys, how would you defend Rivera, given what we know and what we intuit at this moment of the proceedings?

Try to get the best deal I can for him for his lifetime in prison. It is likely no one will have his back on the inside, and he will need Administrative Segregation or Protective Custody, but something better than 23 hours a day in a solo cell. Get him the best prison in the system possible, and enhanced family and friend visitation, make a deal of life with no parole, no trial, but try and limit CR's allocution in court.

If it went to trial, I would look to invalidate the Miranda on Cultural Milieu grounds, and throw out as much of the prosecution's case as possible. Fight the validity and constutionity of any electronic digital data, FitBit, OnStar, Google, cell phone carrier, all of it. Play up the Psyc Evals, and argue a diminished capacity on cultural grounds, play up any possible gang/narco terrorist influence on his world view growing up in Mexico. Try for a life of Psychiatric confinement, rather than Penitentiary. If not, shoot for second degree and 20 on the above.

 

[MsBetsy]

O/T it's not a flyby Hurricane; it's staying around for 3/4 days. That's the big difference with this one. Hope everyone stays safe.

I would get my kid in the car and leave. Too scary.

 

[SharonNeedles]

It wouldn't surprise me at all if he had no criminal history. I wouldn't go as far as calling him normal, but that's a vague and questionable term. It depends how you define normal. Usually when people brutally murder another human being there are underlying reasons that contribute to that action. Even people described as "explosive" have issues that probably were never addressed. Usually in cases where people snap and kill a partner, such as in intimate partner homicide, there is always some emotion such as jealousy or intense feeling of rejection that results in the person losing control and killing the person they loved. Often there is regret and remorse. Sometimes not. I don't feel that it is common for well adjusted, stable, confident, compassionate, or whatever is defined as " normal" people to suddenly decide to kill someone for no apparent reason. If this is the case then we need to fear everyone around us. Imo there has to be something going on in the persons head to begin with. Pent up anger, fear of rejection, anxiety, life history, no respect for life, or something has to be a factor in order to make one capable of taking a life in the first place. Jmo

Think of all the names, the potential suspects, that were tossed around before we knew of CR. Every one of them, though totally innocent, had something that drew attention for a reason someone interpreted as a potential violent warning sign. Even members of her own family. Are all of those people still dangerous potential murderers?

 

[MsBetsy]

Yes. There's a first time for everything. I respect the right for everyone to post theories; however, the fan fiction gets a scroll and roll.

I must say I have known many "normal" people throughout my life, in different places and times, and have seen people do some strange things, but have yet to meet someone or even one who knows someone who actually murdered someone. I hope it stays that way! Usually when people murder, outside of intimate partner homicide, there is always something not normal about that person that was not necessarily obvious to other people. It takes a unique individual to pull off a brutal taking of another's life, and then not be consumed by guilt and remorse, so much that they can just go on with their life like nothing happened! Even when questioned about the murder by a friend, Rivera was able to easily deceive by turning attention away from himself. It takes a certain type of person with not much emotion to be able to pull off such a thing. Imo. Any normal person would have a hard time concealing their guilt. It's easy if you don't feel the guilt in the first place. I sure hope that's not considered normal! Jmo

 

[MsBetsy]

Think of all the names, the potential suspects, that were tossed around before we knew of CR. Every one of them, though totally innocent, had something that drew attention for a reason someone interpreted as a potential violent warning sign. Even members of her own family. Are all of those people still dangerous potential murderers?

In my opinion, no, not at all. The majority of people with mental health disorders are not in the least dangerous. I don't want to imply that at all. I wouldn't even say those people are "abnormal" at all. It is probably the stereotype of being a "stalker" that led people to believe WC may be a suspect, and even more so the fact that they searched near where he lived. As far as her family, I don't know what warning sign there could have been, other than the idea of intimate partner homicide.

 

[Followfacts]

I couldn't stand his laugh. I don't know how investigators held back from leaping across the table and slapping his face every time they heard that goofy laugh as he was describing the details involved in stalking and brutally murdering all those people.

Incredible listening to his drabby and drawn out BS with those investigators and that laugh , on and on...
He said he wanted to protect his daughter from growing up and having to hear about all the things he did.
But he was a nice guy, quiet, dependable, great worker, loving father had a GF, wouldn’t hurt anyone... fan fiction? Right??

 

[MsBetsy]

Incredible listening to his drabby and drawn out BS with those investigators and that laugh , on and on...
He said he wanted to protect his daughter from growing up and having to hear about all the things he did.
But he was a nice guy, quiet, dependable, great worker, loving father had a GF, wouldn’t hurt anyone... fan fiction? Right??

Israel Keyes was a horrible person on the inside. He knew it, and didn't care. Others didn't notice a thing. I would think people like that practice all their life to appear normal, or at least like everyone else. Drive a few hundred miles, dig up your kill kit, stalk, attack, murder, than go back to being caring boyfriend and daddy!

 

[rebel123]

If you were his attorneys, how would you defend Rivera, given what we know and what we intuit at this moment of the proceedings?

If I could get something of substance; like independent medical records to show that he has a mental disorder that causes him to 'block his memory' when he gets angry. Also all sorts of reports from experts. Then a 'diminished capacity' defense.

 

[beebosox]

Think of all the names, the potential suspects, that were tossed around before we knew of CR. Every one of them, though totally innocent, had something that drew attention for a reason someone interpreted as a potential violent warning sign. Even members of her own family. Are all of those people still dangerous potential murderers?

It's usually members of our own family that do us in. Of course they'll be suspected.