ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 24

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  • #1,001
I’m watching a true crime show right now about a serial killer. The cop just said “Every time he committed a murder, he felt like he was getting even.”

It made me think of this crime.
 
  • #1,002
I would think that car would have to get gas… how far back is cam footage stored from area gas stations within a tank’s worth radius?
 
  • #1,003
I'm not convinced that the killer didn't come home -with- E&X. Someone who claimed they needed a place to crash for the night. Maybe said they'd had an argument with their girlfriend, or had locked themself out, or perhaps got tossed out of the frat?

If E&X invited the person to sleep on the couch, they'd be in the house, know where everyone was sleeping, and know when things got quiet and everyone went to sleep. If they came in after the 1st floor roommates went to bed, they probably wouldn't even know anyone was down there.
My problem with this theory is: would they then be carrying the type of knife described in this situation? If it’s someone that came home with E&X, they would’ve had to bring a big knife with them. Would that mean they preplanned going home with E&X? If so, where would they put it or be carrying it (the knife?)
 
  • #1,004
This reminds me of today’s news regarding Apple encrypting stuff on the iCloud now as a measure of security protection, and LE’s concern about this. I wonder how this is going to play out going forward, and if it could potentially impact this case going forward...Supposedly even if LE has a warrant they won’t be able to get some of the information they were able to previously, as I understand it:



Apple Plans New Encryption System to Ward Off Hackers and Protect iCloud Data​

‘Advanced Data Protection’ will offer end-to-end encryption on iCloud backups, Notes, Photos and other services—a step that may draw ire from law enforcement”​


“An Apple spokesman declined to comment on the company’s handling of the encryption issue or any discussions it has had with the FBI. The FBI did not respond to requests for comment on any discussions with Apple.”

[...]

“More than two years ago, Apple told the FBI that it planned to offer users end-to-end encryption when storing their phone data on iCloud, according to one current and three former FBI officials and one current and one former Apple employee.

Under that plan, primarily designed to thwart hackers, Apple would no longer have a key to unlock the encrypted data, meaning it would not be able to turn material over to authorities in a readable form even under court order.”

—-


“New security features will keep more of your data safe from hackers and law enforcement.”

“It may be more difficult for hackers to grab your iCloud data — and even Apple is rethinking its access to sensitive content. The company is introducing a raft of security measures that run the gamut from expanded end-to-end encryption to a reversal of a controversial program intended to identify possible child sex offenders. The launch is headlined by Advanced Data Protection, an optional feature that applies end-to-end encryption to more iCloud data. While Apple was already protecting 14 data categories, the new offering protects 23 — including iCloud device backups, photos and notes. Your calendar, contacts and iCloud Mail are still unencrypted to support global systems.

[...]

“At the same time, Apple is backing away from its controversial efforts to screen for child sexual abuse material (CSAM). The company tells Wired it has shelved a technology that would have detected known CSAM photos in iCloud and flagged accounts for reviews if they held a certain number of the toxic images. The change of heart comes after "extensive consultation" with experts, according to Apple — the company has decided that it can protect children without searching this data. Instead, it's focusing on opt-in Communication Safety features that warn parents about nudity in iMessage photos as well as attempts to search for CSAM using Safari, Siri and Spotlight.”

[...]

The tech giant is pitching the new security features as useful tools for its most privacy- and security-conscious users, whether they're high-profile targets or simply people willing to trade some convenience for peace of mind. However, they could also set up further conflicts between Apple and law enforcement. The FBI and other agencies have frequently attacked Apple for making it difficult to crack suspects' iPhones through iOS' end-to-end encryption. Now, police might also be shut out of iCloud data they could previously obtain through official requests — Apple couldn't comply with orders even if it wanted to.”




“IN AUGUST 2021, Apple announced a plan to scan photos that users stored in iCloud for child sexual abuse material (CSAM). The tool was meant to be privacy-preserving and allow the company to flag potentially problematic and abusive content without revealing anything else. But the initiative was controversial, and it soon drew widespread criticismfrom privacy and security researchers and digital rights groups who were concerned that the surveillance capability itself could be abused to undermine the privacy and security of iCloud users around the world.”


—-

January 2020:
Wow. You are on the ball!

Re this part: Advanced Data Protection for iCloud is available in the US today for members of the Apple Beta Software Program, and will be available to US users by the end of the year.

I don’t understand the specifics on how encryption works. Do we know if “Advanced Data Protection” will be retroactive ( i.e. once a customer has the protection everything preciously saved in their iCloud will immediately be covered) or will it only appy to things uoloaded after the protection is in place?

I have to admit I didn’t understand every bit of the article so the answer may be in there somewhere, and if it is I apologize. Try as I might my tech fluency is broken at best.
 
  • #1,005
I'm not convinced that the killer didn't come home -with- E&X. Someone who claimed they needed a place to crash for the night. Maybe said they'd had an argument with their girlfriend, or had locked themself out, or perhaps got tossed out of the frat?

If E&X invited the person to sleep on the couch, they'd be in the house, know where everyone was sleeping, and know when things got quiet and everyone went to sleep. If they came in after the 1st floor roommates went to bed, they probably wouldn't even know anyone was down there.

Good thinking out of the box.

This actually happened to me in college. I let someone crash on the couch, and ended up being a victim of crime.
 
  • #1,006
Many fraternity houses have surveillance cameras— externally and sometimes internally. Can anyone confirm if the Sigma Chi house did?
I recall from an interview with the fraternity President he said there were “no cameras on property”. Sorry I can’t remember which video, maybe someone knows which video. Jmo
 
  • #1,007
I would think that car would have to get gas… how far back is cam footage stored from area gas stations within a tank’s worth radius?
Pretty sure that LE would have collected all of that footage straight away??? Wouldn’t they???
The local footage, I would hope that footage was collected anyway …. There is a servo very close to the house ..

But if we imagine the car‘s fuel tank was full at the time (thinking planned) of the murders ….. then how far could it go on a full tank …. About 600kms??? Or is that being too generous ??? But that would be any town in a 5hour radius maybe???

Would also be worthwhile looking to see if anyone with a white Elantra that model filled up that day, or the day before?? At the local servos ….

Excellent thought Deep ….
 
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  • #1,008
Wow. You are on the ball!

Re this part: Advanced Data Protection for iCloud is available in the US today for members of the Apple Beta Software Program, and will be available to US users by the end of the year.

I don’t understand the specifics on how encryption works. Do we know if “Advanced Data Protection” will be retroactive ( i.e. once a customer has the protection everything preciously saved in their iCloud will immediately be covered) or will it only appy to things uoloaded after the protection is in place?

I have to admit I didn’t understand every bit of the article so the answer may be in there somewhere, and if it is I apologize. Try as I might my tech fluency is broken at best.

Hey @Colorado303 , Great to see you here.

Thanks, and I think your mention of the Apple AirTag is a good one. I’ve actually been following these stalking incidents since they first started being reported. Believe me when I tell you the cases are endless. In fact, this is the other big Apple story:

Two women sue Apple, saying stalkers used AirTags to track them​

The $29 tracking device ‘has become the weapon of choice of stalkers and abusers,’ the lawsuit asserts​

12/7/22

When I first started seeing these AirTag stalking cases pop up, not a lot of people knew about it (I know because I referred to it in another case and everyone was like, “whaaaat?” It seems it has really escalated since then. Several months back I read Apple was responding to the situation, so I had hoped it would’ve been nipped in the bud. I’m not sure what the current status is.
 
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  • #1,009
I would think that car would have to get gas… how far back is cam footage stored from area gas stations within a tank’s worth radius?

I’ve seen lengths of time on gas station surveillance cam footages vary widely. I know a lot of them will record over the original after some time. This is a challenge for law enforcement sometimes, imo, getting to these locations in time before the footage is erased or recorded over. And sometimes even if they get to a gas station promptly, sometimes it’ll turn out the cameras weren’t even working. So sadly, these can sometimes turn out to be dead ends.
 
  • #1,010
Not sure if I'm totally following the screenshots thread, but is it possible LE asked for it to be blurred? So the perp wouldn't know that LE has their license plate number? Maybe the announcement was, like someone suggested, to rattle the perp and get them to slip up or get rid of the car, etc.

Also thought it was interesting the announcement said if anyone knew of anyone driving this car on the day of the murder AND the days before (notice "after" not in there). So the perp, if the driver of this car, left town afterwards likely

Overall though this announcement seems hopeful to me that they have more leads than they are letting on!
MOO
Or perhaps the car was abandoned right after the murders and LE already has it.
 
  • #1,011
But if we imagine the car‘s fuel tank was full at the time (thinking planned) of the murders ….. then how far could it go on a full tank …. About 600kms??? Or is that being too generous ??? But that would be any town in a 5hour radius maybe???
An Elantra from that era has a max highway range of ~486 miles. Even assuming you don't get max efficiency out of it, that would get you to Seattle, or Portland, or Boise, or Missoula.
 
  • #1,012
DELAYED RELEASE of CRIME SCENE?

@CSIDreamer Thanks for recalling this, a case I have not followed.
So multiple trailers have been held as a crime scene for several years, not released since 2016?
Then I wonder who has paid rent or mortgage payments (assuming applicable)? And even if vic's owned trailers and land free and clear, what about payments for prop taxes? Utilities?
I am going to guess that those 2 trailer homes that the investigators stored in the Rhoden cases are probably tax exempted ,both were paid off . They removed them ,and put them in storage so utilities are were not an issue, I have not seen another like it ,even the Heinz family murder in GA did not do that and 8 people were killed in one trailer.
 
  • #1,013
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  • #1,015
  • #1,016
Where did you see pics of the car? The pics in the press release are stock photos, and not actual photos.
Oops, pics of a car that is an example of the one they are requesting information about….sorry!
 
  • #1,017
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  • #1,018
If the perp(s) is actually on the body cam footage as some are suspecting this means the murders were completed and he/ she/ they were leaving the scene a little after 3? This means K &M were attacked while they were making their late night phone calls.
My thought was he (yes, I’m aware it’s presumptuous) could be lurking around & caught on cam walking towards, around or near the house before the crime. MOO
 
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  • #1,019
My problem with this theory is: would they then be carrying the type of knife described in this situation? If it’s someone that came home with E&X, they would’ve had to bring a big knife with them. Would that mean they preplanned going home with E&X? If so, where would they put it or be carrying it (the knife?)

Could the knife have been in a backpack? A lot of people carry one, so it wouldn’t arouse suspicion, would it? If someone I knew was going to crash on my couch for some reason, I would expect them to have some items with them in a backpack.
JMO
 
  • #1,020
Wasn't that K's new car?
Yes, from what I have seen reported she had already moved quite a bit if stuff out. She had come back to stay a few days with Maddie to show her new car to everyone. What if she hadn't come back to visit? Would the other murders still have happened?
 
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