IL - Lt. Charles 'Joe' Gliniewicz, 52, found dead, Fox Lake, 1 Sep 2015 - #3

[Hatfield]

I would think that getting knocked down as if hit by a sledge hammer would at least result in some sort of visual mark on the skin where the impact happened on the vest, if not, bruising. The Coroner said there were no physical signs of struggle, so if there were signs of struggle, where were they? On clothing? On the ground? Who removed the clothing? I wonder how anyone knows that he was ON FOOT for 20 minutes before the report. That is a very long time. If he only called in the report when the two white guys and one black
guy were leaving his sight, were they nearby and in sight for 20 minutes prior? My doubt of homicide remains....for all the same reasons as before. Evidence of struggle would have been noticed immediately. JMO

I agree that there should be brusing marks if a direct impact to the bullet proof vest.

I don't know if the full coroners report is released or not. It seems very little details have actually been released.

I am not outruling that 3 guys got away on foot. It seems there is enough area around there for 3 people to get away on foot.

The part that is hard to understand is the first shot happening so far away and then the next shot happening that killed him. Because the only way I can see that happening is if the officer was trying to get away and the criminal chased him down. Which I suppose could have happened. I doubt 2 out of the 3 guys would stick around while 1 of them is chasing the officer down. So 2 of the guys would have had much more time to run off. The 3rd guy had less time.

It seems they found 2 shell casings and the gun was near the body. I would be curious to know the exact placement of that gun.

 

[i.b.nora]

“It seems they found 2 shell casings and the gun was near the body. I would be curious to know the exact placement of that gun.”

So would everyone else. However because of their 'dynamic looking' they cannot release that info. Hope that helps.

 

[looking4OPH]

Just talked to my new neighbors who moved here from three miles of the area where this happened. They said no one bow hunts at that location. They also said this area is very small and not what I think of as a swamp. They said it is a bog. Also many businesses nearby.

Agreed. While there may be waterfowl in that area, it is close to residential and commercial and would not be a very safe place to hunt with any weapons (although I am not a hunter). It is thick, tall weeds and cattails (seen from Google Map street views I posted upthread). There can be standing water after rain, but also can be dry ground. Seems to me it had been dry around that time. It is not like a Florida swamp, but not technically a bog either (being familiar with Volo Bog just down the road). It struck me funny when Filenko brought that up.

 

[cady]

“It seems they found 2 shell casings and the gun was near the body. I would be curious to know the exact placement of that gun.”

So would everyone else. However because of their 'dynamic looking' they cannot release that info. Hope that helps.

Did not mention anything about a struggle for a month, either.........JMO......that tidbit did not require weeks-long technical lab work. It may have even held onto some homicide defectors for a while.

 

[TheDuchess]

FYI - I am somewhat local and just wanted to let you know that my FB feed is lighting up with stories very positive toward this being a murder. Every story states - "signs of a struggle," "shot twice," and 'suspects possibly got away." Just saying.

 

[Elley Mae]

I would think that getting knocked down as if hit by a sledge hammer would at least result in some sort of visual mark on the skin where the impact happened on the vest, if not, bruising. The Coroner said there were no physical signs of struggle, so if there were signs of struggle, where were they? On clothing? On the ground? Who removed the clothing? I wonder how anyone knows that he was ON FOOT for 20 minutes before the report. That is a very long time. If he only called in the report when the two white guys and one black
guy were leaving his sight, were they nearby and in sight for 20 minutes prior? My doubt of homicide remains....for all the same reasons as before. Evidence of struggle would have been noticed immediately. JMO

bbm, Now I wonder. Do people bruise once they are dead? jmo idk.

 

[cady]

bbm, Now I wonder. Do people bruise once they are dead? jmo idk.

Not sure. That's why I said at least some kind of mark, but a bruise is broken blood vessels, so wouldn't the force of the impact at least cause discoloration? Plus,if he was knocked down, wouldn't he have had to get back up to be shot in the chest and then fall FACE DOWN? Just curious, trying to picture this. JMO

 

[Elley Mae]

“It seems they found 2 shell casings and the gun was near the body. I would be curious to know the exact placement of that gun.”

So would everyone else. However because of their 'dynamic looking' they cannot release that info. Hope that helps.

If I am reading right what was printed 6 days ago as possible is now true about the 20 minutes.

Fox News has learned that the police car Gliniewicz was in on the morning of Sept. 1 did have a GPS tracking system in it, which will indicate when he arrived to the crime scene. So far that information has not been released. Two sources close to the investigation tells Fox news it’s possible Gliniewicz arrived up to 20 minutes before he radioed in about three suspects, raising more questions about what happened that day.

bbm,

Fox News first reported weeks ago that sources close to the case say evidence suggests Gliniewicz might have killed himself. Lake County Coroner Dr. Thomas Rudd and other sources have told Fox News Gliniewicz died of a single devastating gunshot wound that struck him underneath his bullet proof vest. The gun was “dropped at his body.” Sources say there was no sign of a struggle or defensive wounds on Gliniewicz—especially one to save his own life.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/09/2...und-death-illinois-cop-despite-lengthy-probe/

bbm That makes it sound like someone else to me.

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Gliniewicz, 52, who was a police officer for more than 30 years, was shot twice, once on his right side, in the front of his bulletproof vest, and again in the upper left chest area. The first shot was “severe enough to incapacitate” Gliniewicz and was “similar to that of a sledgehammer hitting him in the side,” according to Filenko. The second shot was the devastating shot that killed him.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/10/0...here-illinois-officer-died/?intcmp=latestnews

Nine unknown samples of DNA were recovered from the crime scene, three of which were acceptable by the DNA-matching system and one of which was confirmed to be from a male.

The results of gun residue testing also proved inconclusive.

“In layman’s terms, the weapon could have been fired by Lt. Gliniewicz or he could have been in close proximity of the weapon being fired,” Filenko said.

bbm This is the shot (jmo) that came from above, hit and entered him from the top of his vest and continued into his body and caused the devastating wound, (organs), jmo.

 

[Japple]

I just drove by the FL police station. There are 5-6 news vans in the parking lot. And a huge CNN news truck that I followed up rt. 12 from Volo, so he was not in the area prior. I wouldn't think the vans would still be there from the 10:00 am presser. And with CNN just getting there...Do they know something we don't?

 

[Elley Mae]

Not sure. That's why I said at least some kind of mark, but a bruise is broken blood vessels, so wouldn't the force of the impact at least cause discoloration? Plus,if he was knocked down, wouldn't he have had to get back up to be shot in the chest and then fall FACE DOWN? Just curious, trying to picture this. JMO

I think the first shot knocked him to the ground, and the shooter then fired again while he was still down from the gun and that would allow for the bullet to enter him in the neck area.top of chest, then they dropped the gun and ran. jmo idk

 

[i.b.nora]

Gliniewicz killed with own gun, authorities say
The Daily Herald
Thursday October 1, 2015
By Lee Filas

"Filenko said during the news conference in front of the Fox Lake police department that police believe Gliniewicz was hit by the first bullet in the lower right side of his bulletproof vest. The impact was "like a sledgehammer," Filenko said, and officials believe the shot likely incapacitated the veteran officer.

The second shot hit Gliniewicz in the upper right chest and caused his death, Filenko said. He would not say whether the fatal shot went through or over the vest, or specifically how many shots were fired from the weapon.

Filenko also did not specifically identify the signs of struggle in the marsh area, or how far away the gun was from Gliniewicz when the weapon was found by police.

After the news conference, Filenko said Gliniewicz's glasses were recovered intact at the scene, but he refused to say if they were recovered on his body or on the ground."​

Regarding the second shot, this news report is WRONG! Filenko actually said the shot was to the upper left chest region.

The comment about after the conference is interesting. I am wondering IF the glasses were recovered from the ground, if that is what Filenko believes is indicative of a struggle???

 

[cady]

I just drove by the FL police station. There are 5-6 news vans in the parking lot. And a huge CNN news truck that I followed up rt. 12 from Volo, so he was not in the area prior. I wouldn't think the vans would still be there from the 10:00 am presser. And with CNN just getting there...Do they know something we don't?

I'm not on twitter, but someone who is could tweet a semi-local reporter and ask....which news vans did you see besides CNN?

 

[Tillicum]

I just drove by the FL police station. There are 5-6 news vans in the parking lot. And a huge CNN news truck that I followed up rt. 12 from Volo, so he was not in the area prior. I wouldn't think the vans would still be there from the 10:00 am presser. And with CNN just getting there...Do they know something we don't?

Go back Japple

 

[cady]

Geeze....was it not reported that he was found FACE DOWN? These conflicting reports are driving me nuts. If he was incapacitated by the vest shot and fell forward, how was he then shot in the chest? If he fell backward, he had to get up from being incapacitated to be shot in the chest, underneath the vest, in order to fall forward and be found that way. JMO

 

[TheDuchess]

Go back Japple

I'm going that direction in a little bit - I can do a drive by...

 

[i.b.nora]

"At the news conference, Covelli said it was an "extraordinarily complex" investigation and authorities continue "working very diligently," though evidence found thus far has not taken any theories off the table."

There you go, perhaps they have been unable to determine if he fell forward or if he fell backward. It's complex.

 

[cady]

Also, he must have been "incapacitated" BEFORE the vest shot, if the struggle for his gun had already occurred, such that, he was not in control of his own weapon,and AGAIN incapacitated when the gun thief shot him in the vest. JMO

 

[tcer114]

Geeze....was it not reported that he was found FACE DOWN? These conflicting reports are driving me nuts. If he was incapacitated by the vest shot and fell forward, how was he then shot in the chest? If he fell backward, he had to get up from being incapacitated to be shot in the chest, underneath the vest, in order to fall forward and be found that way. JMO

What if he did go face down after the first shot and started to stand/crouch to charge at the gunman? When they shot again (maybe aiming for the head) it went lower and managed to go under the vest And went face down again?

 

[cady]

What if he did go face down after the first shot and started to stand/crouch to charge at the gunman? When they shot again (maybe aiming for the head) it went lower and managed to go under the vest And went face down again?

DUNNO. How did he lose control of his weapon in the first place? If he had been there, suspicious for 20 minutes, he probably had his gun drawn, so why didn't he shoot whoever was coming at him? This is just so convoluted! LOL JMO

 

[Japple]

Go back Japple

It just so happens I'm out of smokes. BRB