IL - Lt. Charles 'Joe' Gliniewicz, 52, found dead, Fox Lake, 1 Sep 2015 - #4

[vestigare]

Well then what are you worried about. Looks like your tax dollars are not being wasted on the needless worthless funerals of dead officers. I am sure you are relieved.

Lucky you I think globally. I also am not so naive to believe that I don't pay taxes federally that go to local PD which they then spend on pet projects. I also do not want other PDs sending people to some local officer funeral in my town.

 

[katydid23]

Well.... common sense would say that the probability of those perfect circumstances lining up at just the right time in the right town during the right year that particular cop was having a funeral in that town when those other people would be present also to attend the meeting and with no forewarning that the cold cases were about to be discussed in a meeting would be well.... astronomical.

I suppose they could tell you they were doing other business. But how exactly would they have planned ahead for some cold case to be reopened in that particular town that also just happened to involve them when usually you don't even know more than a few days in advance of when or where a funeral will take place?

Our PD requires the officers to drive to the location if it is in the same state. I personally know of one example, where two officers were sent to the funeral of an officer in Hayward, Cal. last July. So our officers were driving past another city where they had an ongoing case that involved both cities. So they made a business trip out of it by stopping in the nearby city the next day and interviewing witnesses and other detectives. It was not that difficult or complex. They had been communicating for months already so it was nice to have the chance to meet up in person to discuss the case.

 

[katydid23]

Lucky you I think globally. I also am not so naive to believe that I don't pay taxes federally that go to local PD which they then spend on pet projects. I also do not want other PDs sending people to some local officer funeral in my town.

Really? That bothers you that officers from another town would come pay respects to a fallen officer in your town?

 

[vestigare]

Not to mention I have no idea what sort of business would require face to face discussions, extra days in hotels, per diem expenses, time away from their local jobs (and possibly OT pay for those who are covering their shifts). It sounds like something drawn out of thin air to justify non-essential travel expenses.

And I don't think it's appropriate to compare public servants like LEOs to "business leaders", for what it's worth.

THANK YOU!
If they are claiming they do this in her district then they are blowing smoke. I would have been madly sending in FOI requests to get to the bottom of that nonsense as soon as I heard them say it if I lived there. But Skype or FaceTime would never be used by business leaders either. LOL

I wouldn't even equate many Chiefs of police with a business leader but I am surely not going to equate some random officer who usually attends these funerals.

 

[katydid23]

Not to mention I have no idea what sort of business would require face to face discussions, extra days in hotels, per diem expenses, time away from their local jobs (and possibly OT pay for those who are covering their shifts). It sounds like something drawn out of thin air to justify non-essential travel expenses.

And I don't think it's appropriate to compare public servants like LEOs to "business leaders", for what it's worth.

You can't imagine what kind of police business would require face to face discussions between two departments? I can think of dozens of examples.

You don't think a police chief is a business leader?

 

[vestigare]

Really? That bothers you that officers from another town would come pay respects to a fallen officer in your town?

Yes, I do not need some funeral spectacle rolling through my town. It is a waste of money from the other districts and would be a drain on my districts already dire financial situation.
Want to pay your respects you can do it on some odd day while you are here for the local festival. Why do you have to do it with another 300 people?

 

[night train]

I keep trying to figure out how three people were running into the swamp away from him but he managed to somehow get ambushed or catch up to at least one of them? But he was there for 20 minutes which means they either were sneaking around for 20 minutes prior to him seeing them or they had just showed up. So where does the task force think they showed up from that they just were visible to glinieiwicz and then saw him and started running away instantly?

And am I the only ones who have a problem with even if there were 3 people there that is nothing "suspicious" about being there that would require you to chase them down even if they ran. At least nothing that he himself didn't specify on the radio call.

Outstanding questions,how about Vestigare as devil's advocate, how would you answer your own questions to support homicide?

 

[katydid23]

THANK YOU!
If they are claiming they do this in her district then they are blowing smoke. I would have been madly sending in FOI requests to get to the bottom of that nonsense as soon as I heard them say it if I lived there. But Skype or FaceTime would never be used by business leaders either. LOL

I wouldn't even equate many Chiefs of police with a business leader but I am surely not going to equate some random officer who usually attends these funerals.

Can I use that quote when a family of a crime victim wants to know why there is no money for their investigation? Can I say it's because some one was 'madly sending in' FOI requests and causing the employees to waste time and energy answering the flurry? :wink:

It is not always some random officer that attends the funerals.

 

[vestigare]

You can't imagine what kind of police business would require face to face discussions between two departments? I can think of dozens of examples.

You don't think a police chief is a business leader?

Most Police Chiefs don't even submit their own department budgets nor write policy. They outsource it. Not very business like IMO.
They might be a leader but not necessarily a business leader.

Face to face is old school. Most fortune 500 companies spend more time in online meetings than in face to face. Everything moves too quickly to fly people in from all over the world for a chat.

 

[katydid23]

Yes, I do not need some funeral spectacle rolling through my town. It is a waste of money from the other districts and would be a drain on my districts already dire financial situation.
Want to pay your respects you can do it on some odd day while you are here for the local festival. Why do you have to do it with another 300 people?

Because if you have an officer that was shot in the head in an ambush, then there are 300 brother officers that want to come together to show a united front and reassure the surviving officers they have their backs. It helps officer morale and it helps bring the community together

 

[katydid23]

Actually we were discussing all cop funerals being a drain on the locals and on tax payers. So it applies.
But they did shut down businesses/streets for hours for Gliniewicz's funeral and the town was also on lock down for days which also hurt local business which is another avenue touched upon by the Daily Herald Article.

So you think 'all cop funerals' are a drain on the locals and the tax payers? Are you advocating they stop having funerals for cops?

 

[Montjoy]

You don't think a police chief is a business leader?

rsbm

Of course not. Sure, a chief is a leader, but a police department is not a business, in the proper sense; predatory fines and tickets aside, a police department is not a commercial entity.

 

[vestigare]

Outstanding questions,how about Vestigare as devil's advocate, how would you answer your own questions to support homicide?

I can't. Well I could but it would require explaining away more problems which just lead to more.
I can't understand why he was there for 20 minutes and only just found three suspicious people.
They could say they were tagging or squatting but there would have been evidence of that recent activity which I am not privy to.
I also would assume it wouldn't take anyone 20 minutes to find three people doing either of those in that area since they would not have been tagging or squatting out in the swamp.
If they came out of the swamp at the end of the 20 mintues then what was suspicious about that? Clearly that area is used for hunting, walking, etc.... So why call that in and then get all hopped up when they ran. There is nothing wrong with running from police. Sorry but I tend to not want to have cozy little chats with police in vacant lots if I don't have to either but I am not doing anything illegal.
So he was pursuing them. Why? What was so suspicious you were pursuing them and yet you didn't radio that in? Or is it standard FLPD to just chase down anyone who doesn't want to talk to you?
And if they came from the swamp then they had to have left evidence of that. Broken veg etc....
If they came from the street then why were they suspicious? why did they run to the swamp?

It requires a lot of mental gymnastics for it to fit nicely without an entire new set of problems.

 

[katydid23]

rsbm

Of course not. Sure, a chief is a leader, but a police department is not a business, in the proper sense; predatory fines and tickets aside, a police department is not a commercial entity.

I don't mean in a commercial sense. I mean it terms of running a department, leading a team, and having a successful organization. The Chief of Police is very much like a CEO, imo.

 

[Montjoy]

I don't mean in a commercial sense. I mean it terms of running a department, leading a team, and having a successful organization. The Chief of Police is very much like a CEO, imo.

Be that as it may, they have an entirely different set of priorities when it comes to justifying expenses.

eta -- if you consider a police chief a 'business leader', do you consider a police officer as a businessman?

 

[vestigare]

I don't mean in a commercial sense. I mean it terms of running a department, leading a team, and having a successful organization. The Chief of Police is very much like a CEO, imo.

Maybe you have no familiarity with the C-Suite in major companies and obviously aren't familiar with how cities are managed but Chiefs of Police are not like CEO's.
They could maybe in large cities be considered similar to a Security Director. I couldn't even say they were the Chief Security Officer of a Company like structure because they don't even control their own budgets like a CSO pf a company does. But they certainly are not Chief Executives of anything. They don't have control over budgets or laws or really much of anything they actually do.

 

[looking4OPH]

...the income from a big holiday weekend-which people rely on for their livelyhood was basically nil.

This was MSM overhype. I am part of that and was out in the community and on the lakes. Traffic was down, but not nil.

 

[Cubby]

Agree my friend. Maybe they should do a civil suit to force open the books to see where all the money is going to. Especially if they are saying that they don't have the money or manpower to test old rape kits or dna testing for murder victims.

You may be right. I would hate to hear that there is no money to test 1000 rape kits. Due to the fact that the money was spent on a funeral and it's out of town attendees.

Or to disprove what is most likely a suicide.

 

[vestigare]

If anyone is interested in Fox Lake Budget. http://www.foxlake.org/285/Budget

http://www.foxlake.org/DocumentCenter/View/1986 page 55 starts the Police portion

Also interesting because it contains the names of all officers and the org charts.
Side note Chief of Police org chart is on earlier pages in the budget.
He answers to the Village Adminstator who in turn reports to the Board and Mayor who reports to the Citizens of the Village of Fox Lake.

http://www.foxlake.org/DocumentCenter/View/1979 This years budget. Police starts on page 72 of the PDF.

 

[vestigare]

This was MSM overhype. I am part of that and was out in the community and on the lakes. Traffic was down, but not nil.

So it was less though? Wasn't it a nice weekend too?
I just knew when the Feds pulled out that we would come on Friday and they would do a press conf to try to appease the local businesses because they couldn't let them suffer.
And sure enough they had one saying everything was fine enjoy your holiday. LOL