Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #104

[tmar]

I'm done. Deleting the site. Thanks

Hi Imvp2.
Please don't leave.

 

[Jabarn]

After, long after. I've heard nothing questionable in terms of why it burnt. If it WAS arson then it didn't make the headlines. My

I think that many of us at one point in time or another have experienced a 'tunnel vision' (for lack of a better phrase) of sorts on this case.

When a person is laser-focused on a specific detail (ie: gun in the right pocket, blue-eyed puppy or a two-headed goat inside the jacket etc.) you cannot 'unsee' what you are convinced is there and you may not wish to see what others think is there as well.

I know am guilty of it!

I cannot 'unsee' what I believe he has in his right pocket, down his left pant leg, and inside his right leg and what I 'think' must be in his coat. The guy surely must have weighed 300 pounds with all that!

I am convinced I am right. Chances are, I am not.

The important thing I have learned is not to discount what others suggest as possibilities because you may miss something that may be important along the way.

JMO

Yes... I see the outline of a gun on the right side, and understand that is only my perspective.

What the white dangle is under the neck area does seem pronounced. I too, thought it could be vape smoke, but don’t think so anymore after watching the video of BG walking and the white dangle is steady and doesn’t drift away, and is clearly stuffed down his jacket.

It’s possibly rope or a part of his attire.

 

[sumzero]

I found it. MP actually said it was 60 plus degrees out. At right around the 4 minute mark.

Families of murdered Indiana teens open up about still-unsolved case

He's mistaken.

Weather in February 2017 in Delphi, Indiana, USA

In fact, the average high temp in Delphi in Feb is 39 degrees. So, it was a bit warmer than normal. It did get "unseasonably warm" later in the week, however.

 

[Boxer]

I see references to the footprints, and remember footprints being mentioned early on. I never heard if searchers were coming up from the creek, going down from the cemetery or walking across the flat.

 

[Jabarn]

I see references to the footprints, and remember footprints being mentioned early on. I never heard if searchers were coming up from the creek, going down from the cemetery or walking across the flat.

You know, I haven’t heard mention of where the footprints were spotted, but assumed they were coming up from Deer Creek to the kill spot. But you know what assuming does.

 

[thx4_medic_Babby]

The cemetery, was/is there a groundskeeper or company that maintained the property?

 

[fred&edna]

No matter what the thermometer nor the thermostat readings.... half the people I work with are chilly, the other half are unseasonably warm. This occurs almost daily.

 

[crhedBngr]

IIRC, various MSM articles told us, "buildings were searched" on various properties (R.L's property, M**r's property), but I never saw an exact list. So, it's possible the CP building was searched, but LE didn't release this info, possibly deeming it important to the investigation.

As to temps, 39 degrees seemed to be right balmy to us, after weeks of zero and subzero temps in North Central Wisconsin. Some people would think this was cold, some not.

JMVHO.

ETA: Found this timeline published in MSM: DELPHI TIMELINE: The search for Libby & Abby's killer

From above link (snipped for brevity):

February 16, 2017
A search warrant was issued at a home on Bicycle Bridge Road . Police spent at least two hours taking photos and collecting evidence from the scene. No arrests were made.

March 16, 2017
State and federal authorities execute a search warrant at the home of the Carroll County man who owns the property where two teenage girls were found murdered. The property owner, Ron Logan, was never named a suspect in the girls’ murders. They called the search a “normal part of the investigation.”

No specific buildings were mentioned in the above article, nor in the links to other articles. Just the info. that the "homes" were searched. One might assume (incorrectly?) that this includes all buildings on the properties searched.

 

[katydid23]

Which is why I think it was around his neck until he thought he needed it

It seems like a very unnecessary risk for a killer to take.

If someone had seen him walking with 2 girls, they may not have paid any attention. But if they saw a skull mask, they would possibly follow or intervene, imo.

 

[tresir2012]

Cigarette either pitched off the bridge, and then he exhaled; or, he had it clamped between his teeth.

I am always amazed (and amused) by smokers who can talk well as they hold a cigarette between their lips, or dangling from one corner of their mouth.

IMVHO.

My fathers cigarette used to stay firmly stuck to his lip, so much so he would have trouble flicking it off as it burnt his lip.

 

[Backstroke10]

Lots of great discussion going on with everyone's different viewpoints!

I think that many of us at one point in time or another have experienced a 'tunnel vision' (for lack of a better phrase) of sorts on this case.

When a person is laser-focused on a specific detail (ie: gun in the right pocket, blue-eyed puppy or a two-headed goat inside the jacket etc.) you cannot 'unsee' what you are convinced is there and you may not wish to see what others think is there as well.

I know am guilty of it!

I cannot 'unsee' what I believe he has in his right pocket, down his left pant leg, and inside his right leg and what I 'think' must be in his coat. The guy surely must have weighed 300 pounds with all that!

I am convinced I am right. Chances are, I am not.

The important thing I have learned is not to discount what others suggest as possibilities because you may miss something that may be important along the way.

JMO

Well said.

 

[tresir2012]

IIRC, various MSM articles told us, "buildings were searched" on various properties (R.L's property, M**r's property), but I never saw an exact list. So, it's possible the CP building was searched, but LE didn't release this info, possibly deeming it important to the investigation.

As to temps, 39 degrees seemed to be right balmy to us, after weeks of zero and subzero temps in North Central Wisconsin. Some people would think this was cold, some not.

JMVHO.

The ones that were searched are on the case map in post 1 on each thread. I don't think it is on there though. I also think it would have made the media if searched. MOO

 

[crhedBngr]

The ones that were searched are on the case map in post 1 on each thread. I don't think it is on there though. I also think it would have made the media if searched. MOO

Great, thanks! I'll check that out.

 

[tresir2012]

Well said.

It's like brainstorming, if you dismiss others ideas, it can dissuade them from suggesting things ever again, and then good ideas get lost.

 

[MDATCA]

It had been cold and overcast for a few days so what was nice about the 13th was that the sun was out and it was pretty. I feel that MSM's reporting of it, however, has been confusing. Sure it was nice-for a winter day in February.

That and Becky Patty saying Libby did not want to take a jacket. The jacket Abby has on in the pic is just a light spring jacket so I think people think it was a lot warmer.

 

[Backstroke10]

It's like brainstorming, if you dismiss others ideas, it can dissuade them from suggesting things ever again, and then good ideas get lost.

Exactly! I agree. I’ve thrown out ideas about BG from trucker to Fed worker to LE related. Of course people disagree and that’s normal but if someone said something like “that’s impossible” or “stupid”, etc. I’d probably be hesitant to post again. Thankfully, that’s not the case and everyone has been awesome!

 

[sunshineray]

He's mistaken.

Weather in February 2017 in Delphi, Indiana, USA

In fact, the average high temp in Delphi in Feb is 39 degrees. So, it was a bit warmer than normal. It did get "unseasonably warm" later in the week, however.

I just knew I'd seen him say it somewhere. I'm sure the poor man's days and night have just ran together since that tragic day.

 

[crhedBngr]

The ones that were searched are on the case map in post 1 on each thread. I don't think it is on there though. I also think it would have made the media if searched. MOO

I'll see if I can find anything about the CP building being searched.

 

[Charlot123]

Hey guys. Been lurking for a month. Became aware of the case after the April, 2019 press conference. I’m now an obsessive reader of these forums. I’m from Indiana but not close to Delphi and have some limited experience dealing with the communications end of the ISP.

I’ve read the threads and opinions and keep coming back to The Shack reference. Only an opinion obviously, but I believe the PC was 100% scripted. I think, contrary to what I’ve read here, that even the emotion was not impromptu. (I do think that he lost his place a few times and clearly screwed up the date, but that every word and nuance was calculated.) I wonder if that during the investigation, a POI or someone who might know BG, has mentioned The Shack or the plot line. I think this reference was hyper targeted at one person or group of people in hopes of getting a reaction and showing ISP’s change in strategy.

The other (completely out there) thought: the younger suspect may be a bit of a deviant with extreme sexual fantasies and urges. I’ve read on one of the threads that there has been activity at all times of the day/night at the cemetery near the park. Is this a place where people meet for untoward, intimate and secret activities? Did BG frequently go here to meet up and act out his non violent fantasies? Did OBG encounter NBG and hope for an encounter? Was NBG frustrated and needing to act out? Is the car they were inquiring about OBG? Was it some kind of company car? Was it where NBG would sit and watch people thinking of his fantasies? Did BG see these two young girls and act on the opportunity? (Trying not to be graphic, but I think you get where I’m going.)

I’ve read so much here about organized/disorganized killers, BG planning this out, wearing protective clothing, etc. Could it be that this is a frustrated, confused, hyper sexual, preditorial type of personality that couldn’t feed his desires. He sees these two and tries something, but these youth fight back and it escalates to the tragedy that we now know.

Thanks for letting me get this stream of consciousness out. It’s infuriating. This person is a monster. I want him caught before his itch needs scratched again.

Welcome.

Very interesting.

I was surprised to meet LE's key phrases in mainstream articles, but his presentation matters less and what potentially might have been missed, more. This being said, in all such cases, it seems the police is initially somewhat perplexed, so I assume, dealing with SA-motivated slayings is very difficult.

But - I think “hypersexed” is an overkill. My gut feeling is, he probably either has limited sexual experience, or failed miserably when he tried with adults. (Or else, he never tried). So the idea of a rendezvous between an OBG and YBG doesn’t fly with me. But maybe YBG feels turned on by teenagers?

My feeling - he probably targets very young women, as well as teenagers, but he gets turned on by some kind of passivity. He probably started younger and might have been sort of a voyeur (maybe observing women on the bridge?). He is progressing now, and progressing into an organized killer, but he is new, and hence, a disorganized one. I don’t know the details, but I understand he made few attempts to hide the victims, meaning, still disorganized.

 

[mtnlites]

No matter what the thermometer nor the thermostat readings.... half the people I work with are chilly, the other half are unseasonably warm. This occurs almost daily.

Thank you. That was my point all along-not to start back and forth as to what the thermometer read but to say that it can be subjective. My family says it was cold that day, others didn't think so. Neither one is right nor wrong.