Jodi Arias TAKES THE STAND #23 *may contain graphic and adult content*

[Sulamith]

I remember listening to Lisa testify. What I got out of it was she was very naïve. And she initiated the first kiss. I also remember her saying she wanted him to continue and he stopped.
I also remember her telling the defense attorney the answer is yes but its out of context.

I do not remember her in any way shape or from feeling like he pressured her or she felt like a victim.

I dont think she felt violated by travis.

I think she just did not like his erection...kissing was fine..touching her "hindquarters" (that is from Mr. Martinez) that was fine...just no grabbing in public. :moo:

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Caller on NG: Travis' murder was jealous rage.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I HAVE listened to her testimony. But I referring to her email to Travis. Which was written AT THE TIME she felt most ill at ease and compelled to address that discomfort.

Again I say, (again), my gut feeling on this is that she felt like she needed to restate and soften her stance on Travis' behavior in light of his murder and of the passing years.

She OBVIOUSLY had a bad feeling back then. And AGAIN (again) I tell my ELEVEN year old that she is not too young to be believed if she has a bad feeling about someone. I have taught her to get away ASAP from anyone who makes her feel uncomfortable.

It is obvious that she did not have bad feelings for Travis. She has written about how lucky she feels to have been able to talk to him shortly before he died. I am glad she has this wonderful memory.

Travis never abused Lisa. Imo she would never lie to the jury. She answered truthfully.

IMO

 

[TorisMom003]

That's right. I just find it ironic that the Hughes helped get the affair started and then tried to end it later.

To be fair to Skye and Chris, neither of them knew who Jodi was or what she was really like when Skye let Jodi borrow that dress or when Jodi was invited over to their home for the first few times. Jodi has a way of hiding her true self until you tick her off or someone "better" comes along. Once Skye and Chris understand the real Jodi, then yes, they wanted Travis to completely break it off with her and/or never bring her to their house again.

MOO

 

[gitana1]

Does anyone know if there are limitations as to how long Jean can have for his cross? Can he drag it out for several days?

None that I am aware of, but if he strays from what was testified to or repeats questions, they will stop that.

I think the potential for danger here, in this case, arises when we equate Jodi to a mentally healthy woman. It is extremely likely to me that she did use sex as a means of control and manipulation. That isn't a gender slam, fwiw, but a common tool of a disordered personality.

Likewise, my ex, also disordered, begged me to have sex with him on our first date but would also often withhold it as means of punishment further into our relationship. For disordereds it is as much a game for their amusement as a means to control or subjugate another human being.

So no, I don't believe Jodi is a but I do most certainly believe she is a depraved, soulless anomaly I fortunately cannot relate to on even the most basic of human levels - much less gender.

Bravo. Beautiful post.

If she were not a conniving psychopath, I'd just call her a bit wild. Fine by me! People who wait for marriage are fine by me, too.

Sex is so individual, I think. I do hate it when folks decide what is 'whorish' based on a woman's enjoyment of sex, etc, because we don't all have to agree about something so personal! But in this case, I think it's clear that Jodi used the sex for devious purposes.

I don't think she even likes sex, myself. But she'll use it incessantly, and that's where I think she's foul.

I think Travis may well have been having a great sexual time, but I do believe it also bothered his conscience at other times. He was a big boy, so that's all his choice. But I definitely think she tried her best to seduce him.

Precisely. Especially the BBM parts.

Caller on JVM finds Jodi is keeping her on the edge of her seat. Says Jodi is likable! Thinks Prosecution better be careful and not too aggressive because Jodi is going to give him a run for his money.

Whoa, my take is totally different.
Not only is she as shallow as a puddle, she's has no depth in feelings leading up to the loves of her life. She has clearly remarked several times that she knew these relationships were leading no where or she didn't have high expectations. It was purely a gamble to see if she could get any thing from them, hey yeah, maybe even get married if anyone ever asked. Travis lost his entire wonderful life because of her. I find her very unlikeable and so shallow it wouldn't bother me if she got DP.

This is what worries me. That caller is not unique. And that's a problem. Most of the posters on here are immersed in this case and have been. The jurors have never heard of this case before now, at least not in depth.

Okay, I'm posting this pic, but I had to take a pic of my screen, can't figure out how to take a screenshot of my phone (it's a windows phone). It's not the best photo, but this is when JA dropped her "bombshell" and the court reporter is deciding if it's too late to start a new career...
:floorlaugh:

At least he can go home and vent, unlike the jurors! (If his spouse will let him, that is).

I will still contend that Lisa put it out there because at some point his behavior made her feel "dirty" and uncomfortable.

Remember she sent the email while Travis was alive and as we know, people tend to soften their views on the transgressions of others after those transgressors have died.

There was obviously something there that upset her and God forbid some young man make MY daughter feel that way and she is then pressured into recanting, saying she was just being "immature".

I want her to follow her instincts and not let some backwards thinking mentality impress upon her that she "misremembered" things and that she never actually felt groped or pressured.

Women in general do not tend to follow the pattern of speaking well of exes, even if they died unless they died while they were still together. But, nothing in her e-mail showed she was pressured to have sex or that Travis tried to get her to have sex. And to me, that's the definition of "coming on strong".

I do not believe Lisa was a liar when she testified,. She seemed very insistent on clearing things up and her testimony indicated Travid was not abusive or pressured her sexually:

Here are the questions the jury asked..

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8784802&postcount=321

From your post:

Q: Did Travis ever call you names?
A: No


Q: Did you personally feel threatened by Travis
A: No


Q: Was Travis ever abusive to you?
A: No


Q: Did he ask you to have sex with him?
A: No


Q: Did you feel pressured to do anything?
A: No


Q: Did Travis ever make sexual advances to you, while you were dating?
A: No, just all it was was making out

Thank you. I am very sad about woman an deceiver and temptress.

I remember a few years ago, and not that many, a man was defending the sex abuse of a child because she was doing all kinds of sexual maneuvers.

The judge bought it. The girl was five years old. Yes, right here in the USA.

It is such a pervasive attitude that whole countries have women in the chador so they do not tempt men.

Think of all of the negative connotations of " single mother."

Is there a female equivalent on regular TV to Two and One Half Men?

I wonder how a female Charlie Sheen show would go over?

I agree with you but that is NOT what is going on here. This is not about jodi's gender or gender bashing or shaming. Once again: THE PEOPLE BRINGING UP SEX IN THIS CASE, OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN, ARE THE DEFENSE - JODI AND HER TEAM, NO ONE ELSE.

You just don't get to brutally murder an innocent guy who, it is clear from testimony, evidence and your past conduct, you used sex to dominate, and then cry rape or sex abuse or abuse, period.

And I think it is disingenuous and frankly, baffling that the subjugation of women would be used to explain or defend a violent murderer.

Gender bias goes both ways, friends. Travis was found naked, unarmed and piteously slaughtered in a shower stall, moments after his sexual partner was snapping repeated photos of his naked body. Yet it is inferred that jodi may have been the victim in some way, that Travis must have been aggressive in some way, probably sexually and that jodi, as a woman, could not have used sex to manipulate or control him. Why?

Women can commit domestic violence and sexual violence. And let me tell you, we would not hesitate to assume that Travis sexually dominated jodi if she was the one found naked and unarmed and very murdered, in her shower and if Travis was the one on trial. So the only reason it doesn't work the other way is due to a unfair gender bias, IMO, just not the one some are alleging.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I think she just did not like his erection...kissing was fine..touching her "hindquarters" (that is from Mr. Martinez) that was fine...just no grabbing in public. :moo:

Bless Lisa's heart ........she truly was so naive. She really thought Travis could control his erection when that is a biological event when a human kisses another human being romantically.

I just loved Lisa though. I know the guys on that jury had to be thinking she is so pretty.

 

[karengo]

I've been debating making this post and decided to share lol

As a victim of a sexual crime I find it offensive that Jodi is trying to imply Travis is a sexual deviant. Her testimony today of she didn't want to say no because she didn't want to spoil the chemistry they had is offensive. I don't remember her saying she said no and he insisted or forced her to do one thing EVER.

She, on more than one occasion drove to see him. IF she felt abused, intimidated, used or in any way like she was in danger all she had to do was turn her car around and go home.

She was a willing participant and I'm very tired of the victim being blamed for their own cold blooded murder.

 

[FrayedKnot]

Wasn't blaming her, just commenting on her helping hook them up

I think that in the beginning, the Hugheses were really taken with Jodi. They said she was the nicest person they ever met. AND...Travis was on "cloud nine" after meeting Jodi, too, and told Chris about her.

They probably thought they were helping along a budding romance. They had no idea what lurked beneath until MUCH later.

I do think it's odd, though, considering some other of TA's friends said JA was "off" immediately after meeting her.

 

[missy1974]

Oh no! The poor dog watched?

I don't know about the rest of you, but I can not be intimate with my pets in the room watching.


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rebuttal witness?

I have 2 miniature dachshunds, yep I agree with you lol

 

[panthera]

I thought that was a caller who called in and said she was on the edge of her seat watching Jodi.

I would have enjoyed watching paint dry more than the past two days of monotone and boring JA. She even makes sex boring.

IMO

I caught the tail end of JVM's show which blended into NG's show (sorry, doing dinner) and someone said the female jurors were on the edge of their seats during JA's testimony.

Just can't imagine why, from what I've seen and heard on these two shows.

MOO

 

[LambChop]

Lisa was uncomfortable and DID feel pressured and DID break up with him. But she got back together with him and even welcomed his affection including butt grabbing in private. What made her ultimately break up the second time is he wanted marriage and she said she was too young. Normal dating/relationship for someone who was 19 at the time.

Didn't Lisa say she felt pressured because he wanted to get married and she was not ready. She also said part of her conversation was about the fact that she wanted to be a teacher and he did not want that for her and she felt unsupported by him because that is what she wanted to do. So the email based on it's content alone is misleading and Lisa did clarify what she meant by some of her comments. As you say, normal dating/relationships that was exposed to the public for no apparent reason other than to discredit Travis and embarrassed Lisa. It backfired on defense. jmo

 

[Sulamith]

What made me laugh was the comment Jodi said Travis made about Darryl, calling him Grandpa. Travis was 30, still older than Jodi but far closer in age to Darryl than Jodi was. I don't believe he made that remark. What purpose would it have served? Many of Travis' friends were older than he was. jmo

I can believe he said that. I read one of his friend's blogs and it was mentioned (in a nice, fun way) that he would make inappropriate jokes in public and embarass those with him and he was always putting his foot in his mouth.

Travis thought highly of himself...maybe he was a bit jealous of Darryl.

 

[norest4thewicked]

I'm sorry but I still think that even an inexperienced 19 year old is still entitled to her "gut" feelings. If whatever is happening is making her uneasy, then she has EVERY right to say so. Just because she is inexperienced doesn't mean she isn't entitled to feel uncomfortable with a sexually charged situation.

My gut is that Lisa was pressured to soften the sentiments in her email out of respect for Travis.


MOO

I think that you might be reading way too much into this.

 

[Wishbone]

To be fair to Skye and Chris, neither of them knew who Jodi was or what she was really like when Skye let Jodi borrow that dress or when Jodi was invited over to their home for the first few times. Jodi has a way of hiding her true self until you tick her off or someone "better" comes along. Once Skye and Chris understand the real Jodi, then yes, they wanted Travis to completely break it off with her and/or never bring her to their house again.

MOO

I would like to know just what that letter said, I don't believe its been released to us yet. It will be interesting to hear Sky's testimony and see if that comes up.

 

[Linda7NJ]

did you see the way he shot out of court today??? he has got something planned - i wouldn't be surprised to see fake bobby and vincent and a vampire slayer on his rebuttal defense witness list - you can tell its personal for him - thank god for civil servants like juan martinez!!!!!!!!

And Juan adds 25 other guys to the witness list to testify she was sexually aggressive and gave them oral in Starbucks parking lots all over the state. Lol


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[CuriousGuy]

I think she just did not like his erection...kissing was fine..touching her "hindquarters" (that is from Mr. Martinez) that was fine...just no grabbing in public. :moo:

"hindquarters" :floorlaugh:

Thanks for the levity Sula

 

[BritsKate]

Reading all the posts and realizing that there are so many different views and bantering back and forth among viewers truly worries me. If we viewers have such polarizing views, imagine what will go on during deliberations.....and all it takes is 1 out of 12 and a mistrial is declared. True, she has yet to be subject to cross, but "there's one in every crowd." You can convince some of the people some of the time.........etc.

It's very different when you're in a jury room though. We all tend to be able to find like-minded posters and people in our real lives that agree as well. When you're dependent on 11 other people agreeing with your perspective in a closed room and the stakes are so high it's a much different atmosphere.

The jury only has to be unanimous on guilt not on the charges. I don't think that'll be any problem at all once jury instructions are read.

 

[polleypockets]

From what I remember from an interview Sky did not like the fact that Jodi was all over him. jmo

IIRC on 48 hrs she said that jodi was very inappropriate w/ TA in their presence - when he moved she moved, and would suck on his ear in front of them - thats when they had the long talk and told TA he coul no longer bring jodi to their house - which she said jodi was listening too and walked in the room and it was very strange - they thought TA would be done w/ her after that, but then realized TA just took their relationship underground - at least to them - and this is why i think if what jodi said happened the very first night she spent at the hughes house really happened - ms hughes would know - even if it was just by jodi's and JA's actions the next day - i hope she gets to testify for TA lease:

 

[Rileyanne]

I don't know that I've seen anyone state that she's innocent of murder, but I could have missed alot.

Nor have I. I simply mean that putting 12 people in a room who (hopefully) do not have all the back story and access to some of the sordid details that are not allowed in court, and maybe, just maybe somebody will be sucked into her "poor me" tale of woe.

If you have callers to some of these shows offering support and belief, I only worry about the possibilities.

Let's wait for cross and, hopefully, she will reveal her true self.

 

[sourgrapes]

This was very atypical behavior for TA, according to the testimony of the (credible) two women who dated him.

I don't buy it at ALL.

You make an interesting point. I think JM should point this out.

The guys that Jodi dated, that testified, both described her as being sexually aggressive.

The girls that Travis dated, that testified, both described him being sexually respectful. Neither stated anything that would be considered aggressive, or deviant. (the swollen member during kissing is normal and not aggressive)

Therefore, I believe her testimony about her 'love'-life can be seen as delusional.