jury is out until Wednesday 21 March: general discussion thread

[mareseatoats]

The defense will want to see how the Crown plays out their part and learn what evidence the Crown has against the accused.

snipped for brevity - the defense knows NOW what "evidence" the crown has.

 

[matou]

Police investigators are also asking area property owners in within a 50 minute drive of Guelph City, to check their fields and report any suspicious or significant changes they notice to landscape or familiar landmarks.

http://www.ocpsaux.org/PRESS RELEASEFrame1Source1.htm

I'm still wondering about the 50 minute thing. I guess this was an approximation of time that TLM gave police as to how long it took to drive to the location at Mount Forest. It ended up being very accurate. JMO

 

[daisy.faithfull]

I'm not finding the tweets regarding their stay at the hotel, but I have to go. Does anyone know which day TLM talked about that? TIA

Have a good day everyone

 

[flipflop]

http://www.ocpsaux.org/PRESS RELEASEFrame1Source1.htm

I'm still wondering about the 50 minute thing. I guess this was an approximation of time that TLM gave police as to how long it took to drive to the location at Mount Forest. It ended up being very accurate. JMO

It is exactly 50min from MF to HD in guelph straight down highway 6!!!

 

[daisy.faithfull]

The defense will want to see how the Crown plays out their part and learn what evidence the Crown has against the accused.

snipped for brevity - the defense knows NOW what "evidence" the crown has.

The defence knew the evidence the Crown had against their client before the trial began.

 

[flipflop]

I'm not finding the tweets regarding their stay at the hotel, but I have to go. Does anyone know which day TLM talked about that? TIA

Have a good day everyone

I remember it stating that she paid as well, as I kind of chuckled at that one. Im thinking it was the first day.

 

[daisy.faithfull]

Thanks! I really have to go, but I'll go find the tweets when I get back, because there's the when was the picture taken issue too.

Okay, I'm really leaving now!

 

[matou]

Is the Super 8 motel supposed to be relevant again in the trial or only because they got a room when they started 'dating'? JMO

 

[BorgQueen]

I think this Super8 thing has to do with her credibility. Yes, she lies, but not all the time. It is also 'proof' that they did know each other and were in fact dating. As she claims. A lot of what has been shown so far, in my opinion, was to prove/disprove her credibility. I think they anticipated something going wrong, so they might have wanted to establish that some of what she says IS true. Just my opinion. :moo:

 

[matou]

HE paid for the motel:

It was not that he even wined her or dined her — during their two-month courtship, he took her to the movies once, to Winners and sprung for a night at a Super 8 motel.

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/ToriStafford/2012/03/14/19504061.html

 

[Flowercb]

Thank you for that article WG. As sickening as MR sexually assaulting Tori, what else did he do to Tori that TLM was not witness to, while he had Tori in the back seat of his car? He alone could have caused so many fatal injuries to poor Tori. If he was sick enough to do the act of sexual assault, he would be sick enough to inflict more suffering by beating her. I wonder where his blood comes into play which was found on his gym bag? I sure hope Tori put up one heck of a fight and wounded him good. Or could MR have injured himself using the hammer.:waitasec:

My question is why, if it's true, why did TLM kick Tori before she killed her. I know that violence from a person like her is hard to explain. It's almost like she had a bone to pick with her or something to do with her.:moo: Although we all know Tori is a victim only, this person, term used loosely (TLM) could have had other thoughts.:twocents::moo:

 

[mareseatoats]

The defence knew the evidence the Crown had against their client before the trial began.

exactly

 

[matou]

Why the continual need to attempt to paint one *** more evil than the other? They are both evil and they are both guilty just as the Crown stated they are in it together.. I don't give a damn who wielded the hammer In my book they're both *** but by and far a landslide Michael Rafferty's evil trumps TLM by miles... and while I honestly believe it most likely that TLM wielded the hammer.. atleast at this point I believe itlikely to be TLM..its no matter as it still pales in comparison to the sexual deviance and evil in the *** that multiple times brutally raped this tiny child.. he deserves zero flattery of being the lesser of the two evils..:moo:

And am awaiting the trial because I actually am for the first time of the frame of mind that its even possible that it could be Rafferty that not only lusted after babies.. lusted after defenseless helpless babies and followed thru with that Lust in multiple times raping this precious tiny girl.. but he just may be the <self induced modsnip> that wielded the hammer as well..

In the end no matter they are both *** and to find a way to paint Rafferty in any other light than evil is a disgrace to Victoria Stafford and the pain and terror she suffered and endured.. moo.


You really think its ridiculous? Because IMO I guarantee-damn-tee you he was out there scouring for any evidence that would nail him when his juvie lover spilled the beans.. and I'd guarantee there was more than one trip made if necessary to attempt to move/destroy those pieces that were directly tied to him.. again I really don't get the MR is not as guilty as TLM declarations.. IMO its disgusting and IMO its irreverent to Tori and what that precious child suffered through multiple brutal rapes by *** Michael Rafferty! It is his blood that is mixed with Tori's and it is him alone who inflicted the brutal monstrous rapes! He is every bit just as guilty and EVEN MORE in my book!



IMO it sickens me to see how that she likely has a quite enjoyable life.. not only is she not in SOME type solitary confinement but obviously gets along quite fabulously with her prison mates.. you don't think she's doing all those cutesy hairdos and updos with her braided cornrows and such? :devil:

Thank you Smooth operator :clap::clap::clap: for this post. The "all talk and no action" is failing to see the obvious, THEY talked about it TOGETHER. He is a deviant and will be proven as such in this trial, I am sure. JMO She has ALREADY proven herself to be a deviant. He is pleading NOT GUILTY and said "I didn't do it". He got rid of the car seat, she was in jail. He tried to scrap his car, according to the info in the opening statement. WHY? If he is not guilty, why did he do this? If she isn't driving the car, who IS? HE IS. Whether he took the battery out of his phone DOES NOT MATTER. His phone pinged in several places that day and night and places him in those areas. JMO He bought percs in Guelph that day. That places him in Guelph right before the home depot purchase. At the minimum, HE WAS THERE through ALL OF IT and that will get him a verdict of GUILTY on ALL CHARGES. JMO MOO

 

[nursebeeme]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2012/03/16/tori-stafford-tim-danson.html

^new article from today

 

[~n/t~]

Outside court Friday, Rodney Stafford told reporters it is difficult to hear the brutal details, but people need to know what happened.

Tim Danson has represented victims' families in several high-profile cases. (Canadian Press)
&#8220;People have to know how horrifying it was,&#8221; he said. &#8220;This was an eight-year-old girl, totally defenseless against a 28-year-old male and an 18-year-old female. Two pit bulls after a Chihuahua is what it is. If both those pit bulls attack that Chihuahua they would be put down. Enough said.&#8221;

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2012/03/16/tori-stafford-tim-danson.html

Amen!!
:clap:

 

[ChaChaCha]

Originally Posted by SmoothOperator
Why the continual need to attempt to paint one *** more evil than the other? They are both evil and they are both guilty just as the Crown stated they are in it together.. I don't give a damn who wielded the hammer In my book they're both *** but by and far a landslide Michael Rafferty's evil trumps TLM by miles... and while I honestly believe it most likely that TLM wielded the hammer.. atleast at this point I believe itlikely to be TLM..its no matter as it still pales in comparison to the sexual deviance and evil in the *** that multiple times brutally raped this tiny child.. he deserves zero flattery of being the lesser of the two evils..

Respectfully snipped.

Well, this is likely the best and clearest post I have seen here in a while. That about sums it up, folks. We are having a trial. Yes, the Crown needs to prove that MR was there. TLM's testimony is suspect at times, but she readily admits that she committed the murder. Morally and legally, if it is proven that MR was there (and I believe that he was) then as SmoothOperator says:

In the end no matter they are both *** and to find a way to paint Rafferty in any other light than evil is a disgrace to Victoria Stafford and the pain and terror she suffered and endured.. moo.

I have been steadily reading here, but haven't the heart to post much. There is so much about this case that rips my heart out. What really bothers me though are the graphic theories in these threads of how TS suffered at the hands of her murderers, and queries regarding the forensic biology ... The trial has not yet addressed those aspects ... can we not just leave that be until the time comes? I can't help but think that the family of TS or people that knew her may read here from time to time, and I would like for all of us to be considerate by not theorizing before the actual evidence is presented in court.

Thanks!

JMO

 

[nursebeeme]

Originally Posted by SmoothOperator
Why the continual need to attempt to paint one *** more evil than the other? They are both evil and they are both guilty just as the Crown stated they are in it together.. I don't give a damn who wielded the hammer In my book they're both *** but by and far a landslide Michael Rafferty's evil trumps TLM by miles... and while I honestly believe it most likely that TLM wielded the hammer.. atleast at this point I believe itlikely to be TLM..its no matter as it still pales in comparison to the sexual deviance and evil in the *** that multiple times brutally raped this tiny child.. he deserves zero flattery of being the lesser of the two evils..

Respectfully snipped.

Well, this is likely the best and clearest post I have seen here in a while. That about sums it up, folks. We are having a trial. Yes, the Crown needs to prove that MR was there. TLM's testimony is suspect at times, but she readily admits that she committed the murder. Morally and legally, if it is proven that MR was there (and I believe that he was) then as SmoothOperator says:

In the end no matter they are both *** and to find a way to paint Rafferty in any other light than evil is a disgrace to Victoria Stafford and the pain and terror she suffered and endured.. moo.

I have been steadily reading here, but haven't the heart to post much. There is so much about this case that rips my heart out. What really bothers me though are the graphic theories in these threads of how TS suffered at the hands of her murderers, and queries regarding the forensic biology ... The trial has not yet addressed those aspects ... can we not just leave that be until the time comes? I can't help but think that the family of TS or people that knew her may read here from time to time, and I would like for all of us to be considerate by not theorizing before the actual evidence is presented in court.

Thanks!

JMO

bbm: the opening statements as well as testimony can be discussed. Here is a link to the opening statement thread:
[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=164825"]Opening Statements 03/05/2012 in MRT's Trial - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[Wondergirl]

Why the continual need to attempt to paint one *** more evil than the other? They are both evil and they are both guilty just as the Crown stated they are in it together.. I don't give a damn who wielded the hammer In my book they're both *** but by and far a landslide Michael Rafferty's evil trumps TLM by miles... and while I honestly believe it most likely that TLM wielded the hammer.. atleast at this point I believe itlikely to be TLM..its no matter as it still pales in comparison to the sexual deviance and evil in the *** that multiple times brutally raped this tiny child.. he deserves zero flattery of being the lesser of the two evils..:moo:

And am awaiting the trial because I actually am for the first time of the frame of mind that its even possible that it could be Rafferty that not only lusted after babies.. lusted after defenseless helpless babies and followed thru with that Lust in multiple times raping this precious tiny girl.. but he just may be the <self induced modsnip> that wielded the hammer as well..

In the end no matter they are both *** and to find a way to paint Rafferty in any other light than evil is a disgrace to Victoria Stafford and the pain and terror she suffered and endured.. moo.


You really think its ridiculous? Because IMO I guarantee-damn-tee you he was out there scouring for any evidence that would nail him when his juvie lover spilled the beans.. and I'd guarantee there was more than one trip made if necessary to attempt to move/destroy those pieces that were directly tied to him.. again I really don't get the MR is not as guilty as TLM declarations.. IMO its disgusting and IMO its irreverent to Tori and what that precious child suffered through multiple brutal rapes by *** Michael Rafferty! It is his blood that is mixed with Tori's and it is him alone who inflicted the brutal monstrous rapes! He is every bit just as guilty and EVEN MORE in my book!



IMO it sickens me to see how that she likely has a quite enjoyable life.. not only is she not in SOME type solitary confinement but obviously gets along quite fabulously with her prison mates.. you don't think she's doing all those cutesy hairdos and updos with her braided cornrows and such? :devil:

:clap::clap::clap:

Thank-you for your post, Smooth Operator. Well said.

I totally agree, it is a complete disgrace to the memory of the child victim, Victoria Stafford. JMO


Rest in Peace, Victoria

 

[antiquegirl]

Why the continual need to attempt to paint one *** more evil than the other? They are both evil and they are both guilty just as the Crown stated they are in it together.. I don't give a damn who wielded the hammer In my book they're both *** but by and far a landslide Michael Rafferty's evil trumps TLM by miles... and while I honestly believe it most likely that TLM wielded the hammer.. atleast at this point I believe itlikely to be TLM..its no matter as it still pales in comparison to the sexual deviance and evil in the *** that multiple times brutally raped this tiny child.. he deserves zero flattery of being the lesser of the two evils..:moo:

And am awaiting the trial because I actually am for the first time of the frame of mind that its even possible that it could be Rafferty that not only lusted after babies.. lusted after defenseless helpless babies and followed thru with that Lust in multiple times raping this precious tiny girl.. but he just may be the <self induced modsnip> that wielded the hammer as well..

In the end no matter they are both *** and to find a way to paint Rafferty in any other light than evil is a disgrace to Victoria Stafford and the pain and terror she suffered and endured.. moo.


You really think its ridiculous? Because IMO I guarantee-damn-tee you he was out there scouring for any evidence that would nail him when his juvie lover spilled the beans.. and I'd guarantee there was more than one trip made if necessary to attempt to move/destroy those pieces that were directly tied to him.. again I really don't get the MR is not as guilty as TLM declarations.. IMO its disgusting and IMO its irreverent to Tori and what that precious child suffered through multiple brutal rapes by *** Michael Rafferty! It is his blood that is mixed with Tori's and it is him alone who inflicted the brutal monstrous rapes! He is every bit just as guilty and EVEN MORE in my book!

IMO it sickens me to see how that she likely has a quite enjoyable life.. not only is she not in SOME type solitary confinement but obviously gets along quite fabulously with her prison mates.. you don't think she's doing all those cutesy hairdos and updos with her braided cornrows and such? :devil:

<modsnip>
But the fact is that TLM's involvement has already been proven by her testimony. MTR's has not ... yet! So, at this point, according to testimony and evidence presented, plus her conviction, there is little question of her guilt. All I'm saying is that based so far in the trial proceedings, the finger pointing more at TLM is a fair assessment. MTR's guilt has yet to be established.

And another discrepancy that confuses me.

I don't give a damn who wielded the hammer

I honestly believe it most likely that TLM wielded the hammer

but he just may be the <self induced modsnip> that wielded the hammer as well..

:waitasec::waitasec::waitasec:

JMO

 

[robynhood]

the post above is well spoken and I Agree totally with ChaChaCHa post !....I DO NOT feel it is needed all this THEORIZING as the Crown stated CLEARLY ....it is not need to convict Both of them as to who did what ....all that is needed is that they both acted together ! ...if one looks at the chapters the CROWN will present they intend to provide EVIDENCE in several WAYS that MR was with Terri Lynn and lets pray he is found GUILTY and gets locked a way for LIFE! ..People should be PATIENT and let the Crown do their JOB and present all of there CHAPTERS and their evidence ....


I agree with showing RESPECT for Tori's FAMILY and the possibilty they may READ this should be CONSIDERED ! I feel let the Crown show the EVIDENCE as we should all STAND UNITED and support TORI"S family ! That is why I feel people SHOULD be here as it has toren AT OUR Hearts that this happened to a sweet beautiful 8 year old.... Tori in Ontario !.........united we Shall STAND for Tori & Her FAmily .....R.I.P our sweet angel ...robynhood !