MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #26 Retrial

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  • #241
Yes. Brennan's main thrust appears to be attempting to emotionally manipulate the jury into voting her guilty. Jmo
Exactly. The prosecution opened this trial by promising the jury a data-driven, scientific case. Physics, biomechanics, cold hard proof. We haven’t seen any of that. The “science” is like an afterthought, because the more you dig into it, the more it contradicts their case.

Brennan’s strategy is to lead with outrage, finish with fear, and hope the jury forgets that not one expert, not ONE, could definitively say Karen’s car killed him. When the facts don’t support your theory, you lean on appeal to emotion.

JMO.
 
  • #242
  • #243
I wonder if the cw will be calling Vallier to testify as well or maybe they aren't going to get into the reconstruction of the taillight this trial. I still haven't been able to get an accurate count of how many pieces of taillight were actually collected, logged and when sent to the lab. The sert team found six or seven different pieces of taillight according to O’Hara. So which is it? And why was I under the impression only 3 pieces were sent to the lab and of that only 2 pieces were supposedly used in the reconstruction if I followed the progression of the reconstruction correctly. I have linked an interesting article on the trial 1 jury requesting to see the the sert report and the judge denied it. It seems that original jury might have been trying to figure out the puzzle as well. I'm thinking the cw should just leave that topic alone as the chain of evidence for the taillight pieces is just a mess. JMOO

What is a SERT report, and why did the Karen Read jurors want to see it?​

 
  • #244

There are 9 people who will almost certainly testify before the prosecution rests:
John O’Keefe’s niece and nephew
Judson Welcher - Executive VP at Aperture, testifying for prosecution
Aizik Wolfe - neurosurgeon to testify on John’s head injury, prosecution expert witness
Daniel Wolfe and Andrew Rentschler - ARCCA experts testifying for the defense
Marie Russell - emergency room doctor, expected to testify on John’s arm wounds being consistent with a dog bite
Elizabeth Laposata - New defense witness. A former ME in Rhode Island, she is likely to testify that John’s body showed no signs of hypothermia, insidcating he died somewhere warmer.
Garrett Wing - another dog bite expert for the defense. Garrett has made a highly informative YouTube video on what he thinks happened with John’s arm injuries.

Crazy that neither the lead investigator nor the original ME is listed!
I think it's likely that the prosecution will call the ME, Dr Scordi-Bello, because she examined the body and found that there was evidence of hypothermia.

The article does state it's likely that there will be more than listed. Perhaps they will call her as a rebuttal witness, restricted to that issue, if the defense calls Dr Laposata.

IMO
 
  • #245
There is circumstantial evidence. The inverted video looked awfully suspect. The subsequent video provided had missing timeframes. Fnding of tail light pieces for weeks is at a minimum very sloppy. If I recall correctly the puzzle expert showed extra tail light pieces not belonging to the car. Missing videos along the car route to the sallyport. No video's obtained from a neighbors camera facing the location JOK was found. The appealing handling of evidence. And indirectly related, the bizzare death certificate. A Death certificate lists causes of death, never what did not cause the death. The preliminary one stated something like the 'death was not caused by a fight'! T
Yow!!!! I had never read this before. If this is a real death certificate then it is a real o.m.g!

First what a disturbing thing to put on a death certificate.

Second, well....when someone is asked, "What happened?" and goes on to explain what didn't happen, we better pay attention.

Back in high-school I took a class that I've never forgotten. Like yestetday, I remember the teacher saying "Any language including a negative (not, isn't, don't, doesn't, wasn't, won't, can't, never, etc.) is immediately elevated in importance above that which is in the positive." Meaning, expect the opposite of what their saying to be the actual truth.

Now look at @TIGER0822 sentence again: A Death certificate lists causes of death, never what did not cause the death. The preliminary one stated something like the 'death was not caused by a fight'! 🫨😡
 
  • #246
Now look at @TIGER0822 sentence again: A Death certificate lists causes of death, never what did not cause the death. The preliminary one stated something like the 'death was not caused by a fight'! 🫨😡
So he did not fly though the air and die. Nor did he fall off a witches broom.
 
  • #247
I think it's likely that the prosecution will call the ME, Dr Scordi-Bello, because she examined the body and found that there was evidence of hypothermia.

The article does state it's likely that there will be more than listed. Perhaps they will call her as a rebuttal witness, restricted to that issue, if the defense calls Dr Laposata.

IMO
Interesting that the cw tried to exclude manner of death on the death certificate from the trial.

Ted Daniel
@TedDanielnews
Prosecution now arguing to keep manner of death on death certificate out of the trial. JO's says it could not be determined.
 
  • #248
Yow!!!! I had never read this before. If this is a real death certificate then it is a real o.m.g!

First what a disturbing thing to put on a death certificate.

Second, well....when someone is asked, "What happened?" and goes on to explain what didn't happen, we better pay attention.

Back in high-school I took a class that I've never forgotten. Like yestetday, I remember the teacher saying "Any language including a negative (not, isn't, don't, doesn't, wasn't, won't, can't, never, etc.) is immediately elevated in importance above that which is in the positive." Meaning, expect the opposite of what their saying to be the actual truth.

Now look at @TIGER0822 sentence again: A Death certificate lists causes of death, never what did not cause the death. The preliminary one stated something like the 'death was not caused by a fight'! 🫨😡

The 'death was not caused by a fight' statement from the ME surely sounds similar to "Look the Other Way"...Alan Jackson's closing from Trial 1. Exactly who was directing who to "look the other way"?
 
  • #249
The 'death was not caused by a fight' statement from the ME surely sounds similar to "Look the Other Way"...Alan Jackson's closing from Trial 1. Exactly who was directing who to "look the other way"?
The ME might have been trying to let make them aware ,he was not hit by a car without actually saying it maybe?
 
  • #250
Could you link to that testimony please.

I've already posted the testimony from trial 1 (in this thread) and there is no reference anywhere to extra pieces that could not be matched to Karen's Lexus.
FROM ASHLEY VALLIER TESTIMONY
other sets of plastic did not have matches.

Vallier said each item she analyzed was documented separately.

”I look at the photos to see if there are any similarities, dissimilarities,” Vallier said, adding that she also checks to see if any pieces match together. She said she analyzed the plastic pieces from the crime scene with a microscope.

Vallier also identified a separate batch of photos she took of pieces of plastic that appeared to fit together. She compared one larger piece of the taillight, identified as piece A, with other smaller ones. She said piece A fit together with two other smaller pieces.

In another set of colorless pieces of plastic, she said, several “fit together.” Another set of red and colorless apparent plastic pieces included two that “were found to fit together,” Vallier said.

Three pieces in another set also fit together, she testified.

In other sets of apparent plastic, Vallier testified, there were no matches.

 
  • #251

‘Court is expected to resume Wednesday after an unexpected day off, marking the official 15th day of testimony in Karen Read's retrial.

Sgt. Yuri Bukhenik was last on the stand and ended his testimony Monday, making way for a new witness to be called this morning.’
 
  • #252
The gracious and courage Ms. Grant shows victim John O'Keefe and his loved ones is refreshing, its nice to see someone in media keeping it real. jmo

Opening Statement for those who may be interested:

Timestamp 1:41 to 4:55

 
  • #253
FROM ASHLEY VALLIER TESTIMONY
other sets of plastic did not have matches.

Vallier said each item she analyzed was documented separately.

”I look at the photos to see if there are any similarities, dissimilarities,” Vallier said, adding that she also checks to see if any pieces match together. She said she analyzed the plastic pieces from the crime scene with a microscope.

Vallier also identified a separate batch of photos she took of pieces of plastic that appeared to fit together. She compared one larger piece of the taillight, identified as piece A, with other smaller ones. She said piece A fit together with two other smaller pieces.

In another set of colorless pieces of plastic, she said, several “fit together.” Another set of red and colorless apparent plastic pieces included two that “were found to fit together,” Vallier said.

Three pieces in another set also fit together, she testified.

In other sets of apparent plastic, Vallier testified, there were no matches.

Wow!!!
 
  • #254
@DrLauraPettler


Where there’s smoke there’s fire. Eyes open wide. Mind open wider. The behavioral evidence in this case gives context to the physical evidence.

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  • #255
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  • #256
*Buckles up*
 
  • #257
@DrLauraPettler


Where there’s smoke there’s fire. Eyes open wide. Mind open wider. The behavioral evidence in this case gives context to the physical evidence.

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Or the physical evidence gives context to the behavioral evidence?

Let's see how we can explain "this"?
 
  • #258
On what grounds is that likely?

Thanks for the considered reply.

(I note you snipped the first line of my post and other content in your reply without noting that you did so. I would kindly ask you not to do that and note snips.)

To recap - I also said this.

"While I agree they could have dismissed M2, I think it's understandable why the top brass did not want to do so. "

The CW has assembled at least a case to answer. Certainly the Judge found no grounds to dismiss, and I doubt it will be dismissed at half time. So unless you think the DA has decided to corruptly prosecute someone they actually know is innocent, I don't see my opinion as controversial. The DA likely believes the defendant guilty based on the case before the Court. Whether we think the DA should have retried and the relative strength of the case is a different question.

Please provide a link to support this given of " the scorched earth tactics of the defense and it's surrogates...'.
Your use of emotive and obscuring language doesn't assist in understanding what is actually meant here. IMO

Similarly, please provide an approved source to support your contention that Karen Read's defense has attacked witnesses and other officers, assuming you are not referring to the correct and proper cross examinations of officers and witnesses during trial x1.

The defence has not merely accused law enforcement of an incompetent investigation. I assume I don't need to post links to the fact that on cross this week, and in pretrial motions and in trial one, AJ openly accused a retired police officer and an ATF officer of murder, based on what the Judge recently characterised as barely sufficient grounds.

In addition AJ claims that two witnesses, Kerrie and Jen, have conspired to fit up the defendant, and that at least two officers, MP and YB, conspired to frame the defendant. This is before we get to the insinuations against various other officers and first responders.

Further to these in court allegations, the attacks were further made by the defendant in multiple briefed interviews including recently in Vanity Fair. So while she is constitutionally entitled to make such allegations, it can't come as a great shock that her trial strategy combined with efforts at publicity have led to a re-trial rather than the dropping of Murder 2.

Although your contention is obscuring, if you are referring to TB please provide an approved source to show that Karen Read's defense was/is involved in any of the charges/ civil suits he currently faces.

I won't go in to that as it is off topic on the thread. However on topic I will note that Hank Brennan successfully obtained communications between the defendant and TB for this trial, and that there were also communications between Yannetti and AJ and TB which he did not obtain. I don't know why they were communicating, but Prosecutor Cosgrove and the DA do know that, and I don't think it is a leap to say it is an aggravating factor.

I'll just speak for myself here, rather than make an unsupported statement about how supporters of Karen Read feel.

Personally, it's a no brainer to me that that the "DA and other key leadership are convinced of her guilt" and therefore they find the decision "supportable". That's not difficult for me to hear at all and you aren't telling me anything new here. Jmo

I'll only note that the above is speculation on your part and I don't see anything here supporting these assumptions about what was and is going on in the mind of the DA.

Other than that, IMO the CW saw ARCCA's independent findings and ignored them. Personally, I find asking why that was so, to be the salient and pertinent question. However, everyone to their own. Jmo

I doubt the CW ignored ARCCA's findings as you say. They would have needed to consider whether the report fatally undermined their case when the Touhy dump dropped for starters.

And personally i think it highly unlikely the DA would move to a re-trial if he thought there was any real possibility the FBI might step in and arrest the lead investigators. It's hard to read the tea leaves on anything DOJ due to their policies, but it is also pretty clear there have been no signs of life since the grand jury days. One can usually rely on suspects/witnesses to leak something if there were action.

All the above is my opinion only.
 
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  • #259
Where there's smoke there's fire.Yes that sounds like a great basis for convicting someone!
 
  • #260
I wonder if the cw will be calling Vallier to testify as well or maybe they aren't going to get into the reconstruction of the taillight this trial. I still haven't been able to get an accurate count of how many pieces of taillight were actually collected, logged and when sent to the lab. The sert team found six or seven different pieces of taillight according to O’Hara. So which is it?

RSBM

If you go back and watch O'Hara from trial 1, you'll see he is examined and cross examined without being able to reference his reports and notes. The actual answer is in the reports and in the evidence bags. This was highlighted when IIRC Yannetti was testing him about some measurements, but he can't answer exactly because he isn't allowed to look at his reports.

This is just one of these procedural quirks IMO.
 
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