NOT GUILTY MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #38 Retrial

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  • #1,021

I saw an interview that Paul OKeefe was speaking of being at the hospital and going in to see John for the first time since he passed. He said the most obvious injury he noticed was his eyes. They were swollen 2x their normal size. Like ping pong balls he said.
(To me, this indicates he was in a fight, imo.) Even if you think KR was guilty wouldn’t you want to be open to possibilities he may have died another way? IF you want to get to the bottom of who killed JOK?

View attachment 597712
those "raccoon eyes" were testified to at length by the medical examiner and others. It is consistent with a blow to the head... and is known as ecchymosis. Can happen without any fight. Did Paul just discount all the medical testimony . It seems the family has blinders on to any other considerations.
 
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  • #1,022
Not looking to be launched into by anyone here... but is there any proof that John ever entered the house?
I didn't follow the first trial and only started taking an interest after the 2nd trial ended.
What we know is 3 people in a vehicle saw Karen and John in their vehicle on their way to the house. When the vehicle arrived they didn’t see any sign of John. When they left they saw Karen in the car and no John.

The people in the house who testified in both trials denied that he was in the house but they also denied making phone calls, deleting phone calls and butt dialling and butt answering each other. The number of lies in the face of evidence was disturbing. Brian Higgins did say he saw a tall man with dark hair approaching the house and Allie McCabe, daughter of Jenn, blurted out that Colin Albert and John weren’t at the house at the same time which implies John was there.

We also know there was more evidence that the defence wanted to bring in that the judge disallowed.
 
  • #1,023
There was enough reasonable doubt for me to vote NG for that reason alone. But I will say I am shocked that in all this time we don't have one person indicating he actually came IN the house. So I am left to think that something happened at that garage area but again the only evidence that he went there at least to the side door was Karen's words.
^^rsbm

Higgins testified in the first trial that he saw a man matching JOK's description enter but he could not identify the individual! Where was BH -- house or garage?

The cell phone experts testified the location data showed JOK's phone pointed in the direction of the residence/structure before dropping off (not unusual when entering a building). One of the last defense experts measured the distance from the garden to the house/garage entrance which was consistent with the "steps" counter on JOK's phone.

None prove JOK's location but also do not disprove JOK entered the dwelling.

The CW could not definitively prove JOK's location when he left KR's vehicle until his body recovered in the snow. More reasonable doubt...

MOO
 
  • #1,024
Not looking to be launched into by anyone here... but is there any proof that John ever entered the house?
I didn't follow the first trial and only started taking an interest after the 2nd trial ended.

"is there any proof that John ever entered the house?" ... Two points about your question itself to speak to what you probably want to know: (1) we should make it about "house and garage" which are in the same building with entrances in similar places, but which would offer different situations once inside, and (2) as for "proof," having something like that would require that LE went inside and looked for evidence, which they did not do (so obviously it's impossible to have proof if you don't look for anything) -- but we do have quite a bit of other evidence outside that was given in the trial (much of it from cw witnesses) that pointed in that direction. Let me quote from turaj's reply and then add to it.
A car did not kill him but what did is still a mystery.
"A car did not kill him but what did is still a mystery." --- That fact is a big part of what makes us look closer at the idea he went in the house. His injuries were NOT from a vehicle - every witness agreed in one way or another that how he was injured was NOT what a person looks like when hit by a vehicle. Nor was the "supposed" damage to the tail light supported by testimony and pictures of what her car looked like before Proctor took it. Nor was the claimed damage possible by hitting an arm or any other scenario the cw could conjure (they kept changing their story). Most importantly, the FBI/Feds had hired their own investigation to figure it out, using the best experts in the business, who said no way was he hit by her vehicle, it was impossible to have happened based on the injuries he had and the damage on the car.

So if he was NOT hit, by a vehicle, then how did he die? What we do know...
1 He was going to a party, and driven there by KR.
2 She said he exited the car and went inside, and she waited a while for him to come back out but he never did. We can minimize that since it's from the defendant, of course, but that's her story.
3 Others who pulled up behind KR saw her alone in her car, no JOK in it, no JOK anywhere in sight, just like she said.
[On following items, I think I'm keeping straight which device told which, but it was confusing]
4 His phone seems to indicate he generally went towards the house when he exited the vehicle. Then at 12:24 the signal location was lost, for 12 minutes, most common reason for that is entering a building.
5 His watch data at about the same time showed that he exited the vehicle, then took 36 steps, which happens to be the approx distance from the road to the house.
6 When he was found in the morning on the lawn, he had major dog bites on his arm (testified by several who would know, contradicted by none, more evidence of it prevented by JudgeB from being given) and there was a dog with a history of attacking people inside the house -- but again, no LE cared to look inside, so we have no way of knowing what the dog and dog area might have looked like.
7 Medical testimony said his head wound would have incapacitated him almost immediately (so he didn't go anywhere and wasn't mobile on his own after it happened) and he would have died soon thereafter, but the dog wounds happened BEFORE he died (which made sense, as by appearance they would seem to have happened with him trying to defend himself and having his arm out trying to fend off a dog attack). No way that sort of stuff can happen in that sequence on the lawn.
8 There's evidence that he had loss of blood and lots of vomit, and perhaps was in a sitting position as he bled before he died, but the lawn site doesn't show any of that. The lawn also doesn't have a way for him to have sustained the irregular head wound as it was on his head (although the garage apparently does - testimony JudgeB prevented from being given and shown).
9 There was a lot of really weird, inconsistent, lies and irrational explanations, from those in the house, with activities that don't fit their story. Odd calls and actions and "butt dials." Something happened, and they are hiding a lot.

I'm sure there's even more.

But the BEST explanation of what happened, imo, in light of the fact that he was definitely NOT hit by a vehicle, and with what else we have heard (despite the LE failure to even look) is that something bad happened inside the house or garage that night, with the dog involved.

Edited for typos
 
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  • #1,025
Just gonna to say here that it really irks me every time I hear someone state that we forget that JOK lost his life and there is a grieving family. As if that justifies a wrongful conviction. As if Karen and the rest of us don't also feel horrible about JOKs death and do have sympathy for the family.

That said, I really wish some of these crazies would back off of the family. I mean what the heck? That doesn't help us at all!
 
  • #1,026
"is there any proof that John ever entered the house?" ... Two points about your question itself to speak to what you probably want to know: (1) we should make it about "house and garage" which are in the same building with entrances in similar places, but which would offer different situations once inside, and (2) as for "proof," having something like that would require that LE went inside and looked for evidence, which they did not do (so obviously it's impossible to have proof if you don't look for anything) -- but we do have quite a bit of other evidence outside that was given in the trial (much of it from cw witnesses) that pointed in that direction. Let me quote from turaj's reply and then add to it.

"A car did not kill him but what did is still a mystery." --- That fact is a big part of what makes us look closer at the idea he went in the house. His injuries were NOT from a vehicle - every witness agreed in one way or another that how he was injured was NOT what a person looks like when hit by a vehicle. Nor was the "supposed" damage to the tail light supported by testimony and pictures of what her car looked like before Proctor took it. Nor was the claimed damage possible by hitting an arm or any other scenario the cw could conjure (they kept changing their story). Most importantly, the FBI/Feds had hired their own investigation to figure it out, using the best experts in the business, who said no way was he hit by her vehicle, it was impossible to have happened based on the injuries he had and the damage on the car.

So if he was NOT hit, by a vehicle, then how did he die? What we do know...
1 He was going to a party, and driven there by KR.
2 She said he exited the car and went inside, and she waited a while for him to come back out but he never did. We can minimize that since it's from the defendant, of course, but that's her story.
3 Others who pulled up behind KR saw her alone in her car, no JOK in it, no JOK anywhere in sight, just like she said.
[On following items, I think I'm keeping straight which device told which, but it was confusing]
4 His phone seems to indicate he generally went towards the house when he exited the vehicle. Then at 12:24 the signal location was lost, for 12 minutes, most common reason for that is entering a building.
5 His watch data at about the same time showed that he exited the vehicle, then took 36 steps, which happens to be the approx distance from the road to the house.
6 When he was found in the morning on the lawn, he had major dog bites on his arm (testified by several who would know, contradicted by none, more evidence of it prevented by JudgeB from being given) and there was a dog with a history of attacking people inside the house -- but again, no LE cared to look inside, so we have no way of knowing what the dog and dog area might have looked like.
7 Medical testimony said his head wound would have incapacitated him almost immediately (so he didn't go anywhere and wasn't mobile on his own after it happened) and he would have died soon thereafter, but the dog wounds happened BEFORE he died (which made sense, as by appearance they would seem to have happened with him trying to defend himself and having his arm out trying to fend off a dog attack). No way that sort of stuff can happen in that sequence on the lawn.
8 There's evidence that he had loss of blood and lots of vomit, and perhaps was in a sitting position as he bled before he died, but the lawn site doesn't show any of that. The lawn also doesn't have a way for him to have sustained the irregular head wound as it was on his head (although the garage apparently does - testimony JudgeB prevented from being given and shown).
9 There was a lot of really weird, inconsistent, lies and irrational explanations, from those in the house, with activities that don't fit their story. Odd calls and actions and "butt dials." Something happened, and they are hiding a lot.

I'm sure there's even more.

But the BEST explanation of what happened, imo, in light of the fact that he was definitely NOT hit by a vehicle, and with what else we have heard (despite the LE failure to even look) is that something bad happened inside the house or garage that night, with the dog involved.

Edited for typos
And there is something else that seals the deal for me and that is the collusion with McCabes and Alberts...."tell them the guy never came in the house" which I think implies that not to be the case but the need to get everyone on the same page.
 
  • #1,027
And there is something else that seals the deal for me and that is the collusion with McCabes and Alberts...."tell them the guy never came in the house" which I think implies that not to be the case but the need to get everyone on the same page.

And then there is this text from Kevin Albert (the Albert brother who lost his badge and gun while out drinking with Michael Proctor) to Brian Higgins which was part of the FBI disclosures. It doesn't get talked about enough.

Boston Globe today:

In March 2024, Read’s lawyers said that the federal data dump revealed that Kevin Albert, a Canton police detective and brother to Brian Albert, who owned the Fairview Road home at the time of O’Keefe’s death, had texted Higgins during the federal probe, “Look, you went off the grid and Brian [Albert] doesn’t understand. You haven’t called him. You haven’t checked in on him since these subpoenas go out. Everyone got a subpoena but you.

Hmmm....Brian sure sounded worried about what Higgins was up to.
 
  • #1,028
And then there is this text from Kevin Albert (the Albert brother who lost his badge and gun while out drinking with Michael Proctor) to Brian Higgins which was part of the FBI disclosures. It doesn't get talked about enough.

Boston Globe today:

In March 2024, Read’s lawyers said that the federal data dump revealed that Kevin Albert, a Canton police detective and brother to Brian Albert, who owned the Fairview Road home at the time of O’Keefe’s death, had texted Higgins during the federal probe, “Look, you went off the grid and Brian [Albert] doesn’t understand. You haven’t called him. You haven’t checked in on him since these subpoenas go out. Everyone got a subpoena but you.

Hmmm....Brian sure sounded worried about what Higgins was up to.

Was this brought up during a hearing before Trial 1? I don't recall mention of it in either trial, but yeah, it surely deserves more notice.
 
  • #1,029

How friends and family are handling this NG verdict.

John's friend John Jackson lays right into Vinnie at the beginning!
I can’t help but think John wouldn’t be proud of his friend
 
  • #1,030
He will be fine,I dont wanna risk him being emotional I already seen him cry once this week .
Didn't you see the onion in his shirt? LOL
 
  • #1,031
Was this brought up during a hearing before Trial 1? I don't recall mention of it in either trial, but yeah, it surely deserves more notice.

There was quite a lot of chatter about it around the time of the last trial but I don't remember if it came in during Higgins' testimony. It wouldn't have been introduced in the recent trial due to third party culprit limitations and neither Brian Higgins nor Kevin Albert were called.

But it gives some insight into the dynamics going on. Why would Brian A. be worried that Higgins may have struck a deal with the Feds? I mean, the girl did it, right?
 
  • #1,032
And then there is this text from Kevin Albert (the Albert brother who lost his badge and gun while out drinking with Michael Proctor) to Brian Higgins which was part of the FBI disclosures. It doesn't get talked about enough.

Boston Globe today:

In March 2024, Read’s lawyers said that the federal data dump revealed that Kevin Albert, a Canton police detective and brother to Brian Albert, who owned the Fairview Road home at the time of O’Keefe’s death, had texted Higgins during the federal probe, “Look, you went off the grid and Brian [Albert] doesn’t understand. You haven’t called him. You haven’t checked in on him since these subpoenas go out. Everyone got a subpoena but you.

Hmmm....Brian sure sounded worried about what Higgins was up to.
Can you share the link? I would love to read the rest.
 
  • #1,033
And then there is this text from Kevin Albert (the Albert brother who lost his badge and gun while out drinking with Michael Proctor) to Brian Higgins which was part of the FBI disclosures. It doesn't get talked about enough.

Boston Globe today:

In March 2024, Read’s lawyers said that the federal data dump revealed that Kevin Albert, a Canton police detective and brother to Brian Albert, who owned the Fairview Road home at the time of O’Keefe’s death, had texted Higgins during the federal probe, “Look, you went off the grid and Brian [Albert] doesn’t understand. You haven’t called him. You haven’t checked in on him since these subpoenas go out. Everyone got a subpoena but you.

Hmmm....Brian sure sounded worried about what Higgins was up to.
Whoa! Now note that there after verdict public message it DID NOT have Higgins name on it.
 
  • #1,034
And then there is this text from Kevin Albert (the Albert brother who lost his badge and gun while out drinking with Michael Proctor) to Brian Higgins which was part of the FBI disclosures. It doesn't get talked about enough.

Boston Globe today:

In March 2024, Read’s lawyers said that the federal data dump revealed that Kevin Albert, a Canton police detective and brother to Brian Albert, who owned the Fairview Road home at the time of O’Keefe’s death, had texted Higgins during the federal probe, “Look, you went off the grid and Brian [Albert] doesn’t understand. You haven’t called him. You haven’t checked in on him since these subpoenas go out. Everyone got a subpoena but you.

Hmmm....Brian sure sounded worried about what Higgins was up to.
I hate to ask but do you have a link to the Boston Globe article today
 
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  • #1,037
"Mr. Brennan claims that his investigation was “thorough.” If that were true, the Commonwealth would have uncovered what we, the defense, uncovered: hidden exculpatory evidence; lies and perjury by the Commonwealth’s own witnesses; cops covering for other cops; a biased and corrupt lead investigator with personal ties to witnesses; and inculpatory and suspicious conduct by myriad witnesses."

And there's MORE!

 
  • #1,038
"Mr. Brennan claims that his investigation was “thorough.” If that were true, the Commonwealth would have uncovered what we, the defense, uncovered: hidden exculpatory evidence; lies and perjury by the Commonwealth’s own witnesses; cops covering for other cops; a biased and corrupt lead investigator with personal ties to witnesses; and inculpatory and suspicious conduct by myriad witnesses."

And there's MORE!

Doing my best Ashton Kutcher impersonation:

Bbbbbuuuurrrrrnnnn
 
  • #1,039
Go AJ!!! He can say things that the other two can’t because he’s in another state, far away.
 
  • #1,040
 
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