AZ Nancy Guthrie, 84, (mother of TODAY Show host Savannah Guthrie) missing - last seen in the Catalina foothills area on Jan 31, 2026

  • #23,461
I am beginning to think this was never a kidnapping. The person on camera was hired to clean up the crime scene and perhaps dispose of the body, and Nancy was murdered before his arrival. I won’t speculate on the murderer, though. I think we all have our thoughts, and that is enough. Still doesn’t explain the Apple Watch sync, if it happened earlier in the night, though. The kidnapping theory has just gotten weird and is going in too many insane directions.
 
  • #23,462
That's how it looks to me, too. I am baffled by his approach to the camera. The plant, the lack of having some duct tape, but mostly when he covered it he used the side of his hand.

I've tried it myself, as if I was going to cover the camera and it's a very unnatural movement. You naturally want to use the palm of your hand. The way he did that was so awkward. I'm sure it means nothing but it's just bugging me as I can't even come up with a theory why he wouldn't cover palm first.
me too. all this 100%

the least bad theory I can come up with is that he was worried the camera would somehow see his fingerprints through the gloves.
 
  • #23,463
  • #23,464
They don't send a SWAT team or get a warrant to search a house because of a tip of the person apprehended last night looking similar to this person. IMO LE had to have had other convincing concerns and information about this person (e.g. their movements, their vehicles, their cell phone activity, pings by NG's house while delivering packages, relative saying they were acting suspicious, etc) for a judge to okay the warrant and for the SWAT team to be deployed. JMHO
I thought he actually did work as a delivery person in Tucson. He had delivered to NG, or her neighbor before. Perhaps his phone, vehicle, lined up as clues, so they surveilled him.
After the video came out, they thought he looked similar. Judge gave a warrant.

I think the amount of coverage has LE, media, even judges jumping on anything that could help to solve the crime.
JMO
 
  • #23,465
Also, where is the footage of Nancy arriving to her home from earlier in the evening???
 
  • #23,466
This is why I'm also skeptical of the ransom angle... $6m in crypto from one wallet is going to be difficult to launder around without attracting attention to it. There's next to no chance you get that liquid without setting off all sorts of flags quickly. It's almost like an afterthought that seems superficially plausible, but is fraught with issues when you dive into how this would actually be accomplished.

JMO
Well, if I may put on my bad guy hat for a second. I'd still rather have $6m sitting in a crypto wallet than not. Laundering it slowly over the course of your life is doable and won't raise any flags if you are okay with doing it in small chunks. You won't be living in a mansion or driving a lambo next week, but you won't ever need to work again.
 
  • #23,467
I thought he actually did work as a delivery person in Tucson. He had delivered to NG, or her neighbor before. Perhaps his phone, vehicle, lined up as clues, so they surveilled him.
After the video came out, they thought he looked similar. Judge gave a warrant.

I think the amount of coverage has LE, media, even judges jumping on anything that could help to solve the crime.
JMO
His MIL said he worked for a Fed-Ex type place and someone upthread someone mentioned the actual company.
 
  • #23,468
Also, where is the footage of Nancy arriving to her home from earlier in the evening???
even if it exists, they are only releasing footage that they think will be useful in finding the person(s) who did this. No one needs to see the victim.
 
  • #23,469
Also, where is the footage of Nancy arriving to her home from earlier in the evening???
LE said the original timeline is she went in through the garage when her SIL dropped her off. They have not mentioned footage of that area so many pundits speculate it's not in the line of the camera.
 
  • #23,470
Lauren Matthais from Hidden True Crime is my guest tonight.
We go live at 10:30 PM Eastern
 
  • #23,471
If the backpack is truly from Walmart, that would be something. How many times have we seen footage of criminals buying their gear at Walmart?
I buy their stuff. I recently bought a cross body water bottle holder for about the same price.

The backpack looks good enough for casual use, which is quite a few people. (Beach goers, hikers etc) Probably not durable enough for serious backwoods campers.

He may have purchased the backpack just for this specific purpose.
 
  • #23,472
Also, where is the footage of Nancy arriving to her home from earlier in the evening???
I’ve been wondering that same thing for a while.
 
  • #23,473
Well, if I may put on my bad guy hat for a second. I'd still rather have $6m sitting in a crypto wallet than not. Laundering it slowly over the course of your life is doable and won't raise any flags if you are okay with doing it in small chunks. You won't be living in a mansion or driving a lambo next week, but you won't ever need to work again.
Also, IMO, even if the perp doesn't have a good plan for cashing it out, I don't think this definitively means it's not real. I am sure there have been criminals who have used bitcoin without a complete understanding of how to launder it. Being bad at cryptocurrency does not immediately imply hoax to me, IMHO.
 
  • #23,474
That's how it looks to me, too. I am baffled by his approach to the camera. The plant, the lack of having some duct tape, but mostly when he covered it he used the side of his hand.

I've tried it myself, as if I was going to cover the camera and it's a very unnatural movement. You naturally want to use the palm of your hand. The way he did that was so awkward. I'm sure it means nothing but it's just bugging me as I can't even come up with a theory why he wouldn't cover palm first.
Bear with me on this…

I am in a habit now of not using the actual “pads” of my fingers to touch communal buttons because of germs and behaviors learned during COVID times. Instead, I’ll use a knuckle to hit an elevator button or whatever it is.

The way this looks to me is like the person is absentmindedly going to hit the doorbell with the side of their hand like they maybe are accustomed to doing and then the lightbulb clicked that the doorbell is also a camera recording what he’s doing… and he basically short-circuited for a minute while trying to walk through the next steps. And lantana is what they came up with…

JMO
 
  • #23,475
LE said the original timeline is she went in through the garage when her SIL dropped her off. The garage entry is out of the camera line.
Seems very convenient.
 
  • #23,476
Yes to inexpensive but Ozark Trail gear isn’t particularly high quality or technical. So doesn’t scream someone experienced with particularly complex stealth missions, but may indicate something you’d be willing to toss in the first dumpster you see after fleeing.


Yes, to further expand, the entire get up he had was cheap and thrown-together.

Mismatched pistol holster, looked like $5 bin special or yard sale. Ozark Trail gear is cheap Wal Mart stuff, disposable, not dependable. People who use real gear invest in it. I use custom kydex holsters and have Camelbak and Maxpendition packs, cause I rely on their quality, and need them to perform. Zero tolerance knives, even stuff like Spyderco won't cut it now, I've set a higher standard.

I would not ever rely on a mis-profiled cheap holster if my life depended on my draw.

Now the cliche is pros are all in black, tactical equipment. Well, cliches are there for a reason. All black works better. You want to be "high speed, low drag" as they say in the military. Those bulky gloves were another indicator. It seemed like he looked at things through a skewed filter. Those are horrible for actual usage and absolutely a liability when handling a firearm (couldn't even fit a finger through the trigger guard). And poor for B&E.

So the gear/get up can be indicative of a mindset, an experience level, budgetary constraints.

Now some wannabes are try-hards (Kohberger's KA-BAR knife comes to mind) and may get all "mall-ninja'd" up as we say, where they are style-over-substance interpretation of a cool tactical outfit by an outsider, and there too you can see the tells. But this outfit was neither stealthy, nor practical or efficient, while in some misconstrued way aiming at that? Honestly, you know where I've see this kind of stuff; third world countries/war zones where they throw together whatever they can and you see a rag tag of sporty stuff along with military issue and other random accents. Think most places in the sandbox, W. Africa, S. and Central America.
 
  • #23,477
they may have some type of mental health disorder but I don’t think this is all the result of active psychosis, if that’s what you mean. It’s too well thought out and not erratic enough.
True. But, IMO there are cases where the perp was deemed mentally ill/psychotic, but still carried out a planned a targeted attack (like Holmes, the theater killer, for instance).
 
  • #23,478
Well, if I may put on my bad guy hat for a second. I'd still rather have $6m sitting in a crypto wallet than not. Laundering it slowly over the course of your life is doable and won't raise any flags if you are okay with doing it in small chunks. You won't be living in a mansion or driving a lambo next week, but you won't ever need to work again.
I did think about this, but the issue is that wallet is now forever tainted. It will be monitored and each withdrawal/transfer will be closely scrutinized for the rest of your life.

One would theoretically want to move everything out of the wallet as quickly as possible to somewhere as secure and anonymous as possible. That’s where the big issues come in.
 
  • #23,479
What does this have to do with the topic in hand?

Bear with me on this…

I am in a habit now of not using the actual “pads” of my fingers to touch communal buttons because of germs and behaviors learned during COVID times. Instead, I’ll use a knuckle to hit an elevator button or whatever it is.

The way this looks to me is like the person is absentmindedly going to hit the doorbell with the side of their hand like they maybe are accustomed to doing and then the lightbulb clicked that the doorbell is also a camera recording what he’s doing… and he basically short-circuited for a minute while trying to walk through the next steps. And lantana is what they came up with…

JMO
Im just not getting meticulous vibe.
 
  • #23,480
My maybe silly idea (I posted this before) was that a bug like a black widow spider was there, so he needed something to brush it away. 🤷‍♀️
Nope. And yes that's a silly idea because he never brushed anything away. He literally placed and held his hand directly over the lens with the lantana while trying to remove the camera with his other hand. Common sense / Occam's razor says he was simply trying to hide himself from being recorded while directly facing the camera that he could no longer look away from.
 

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