GUILTY NY - Vincent Viafore, 46, Newburgh, 19 April 2015 - #1

[silly1]

The couple had been drinking before setting off back to New Windsor from the island, he said....

Portale said the defense team has grown, with another lawyer as well as Brosnan Risk Consultants and its managing director, retired NYPD homicide detective John Fleming, joining the effort.
Portale said Graswald’s team is getting support and positive feedback from the community, including from kayakers.
"We're confident that when all is said and done, Ms. Graswald will be exonerated," Portale said.

http://www.recordonline.com/article/20150529/NEWS/150529347/101294

 

[silly1]

She is due back in court on June 22.

http://www.poughkeepsiejournal.com/...pleads-guilty-kayaker-fiancs-murder/28181813/

 

[borndem]

I'm sure this has been asked several times, but I want to ask again...

Why is she only charged with 2nd degree murder? If the following is what happened, that is clearly 1st degree since, IMO, it was planned and premeditated. She did not fly into a rage and strike him in the head with an oar, etc. She allegedly tampered with his kayak and paddle, as put forth in the Poughkeepsie Journal article brought to us by silly1 (thanks, silly1 !).

Graswald is charged with second-degree murder and second-degree manslaughter in the death of Viafore, whom she allegedly killed by tampering with his kayak and paddle on April 19, according to authorities.

http://www.poughkeepsiejournal.com/...pleads-guilty-kayaker-fiancs-murder/28181813/

Just wondering.

 

[BunnyHop]

The couple had been drinking before setting off back to New Windsor from the island, he said....

Portale said the defense team has grown, with another lawyer as well as Brosnan Risk Consultants and its managing director, retired NYPD homicide detective John Fleming, joining the effort.
Portale said Graswald’s team is getting support and positive feedback from the community, including from kayakers.
"We're confident that when all is said and done, Ms. Graswald will be exonerated," Portale said.

http://www.recordonline.com/article/20150529/NEWS/150529347/101294

Of course they went out drinking that Sunday. Brunch? Bars?
I said from day one there was no reason to cross to the west side, when they could have easily accessed Bannerman's from Cold Spring. BTW, there are many bars in Cold Spring, I think she worked at a few.

Portale is a slickster. This will be interesting. I think Prosecutors have a good case. JHMOO

 

[TripleA]

My prediction is that when all is said and done she will walk free on a hung jury and the prosecution won't retry the case. I think that given the circumstances - recklessness on the part of VV including drinking, no life jacket, time of day, etc, plus the appearance and size of AG - that at least one, maybe more, juror will not be able to find her guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.

 

[BunnyHop]

My prediction is that when all is said and done she will walk free on a hung jury and the prosecution won't retry the case. I think that given the circumstances - recklessness on the part of VV including drinking, no life jacket, time of day, etc, plus the appearance and size of AG - that at least one, maybe more, juror will not be able to find her guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.

She's not as tiny as they make her out to be.

 

[BunnyHop]

‘Kayak killer’ says fiancé was wasted when he capsized

http://nypost.com/2015/05/29/kayak-killer-says-fiance-was-wasted-when-he-capsized/

As investigators await autopsy results, they now confront another challenge: a paucity of physical evidence. The Orange County district attorney’s office charged Mr. Viafore’s fiancée, Angelika Graswald, with second-degree murder and manslaughter, saying she intentionally caused his death while the two kayaked in mid-April.

But so far, the strongest evidence seems to be the incriminating oral and written statements that the police say Ms. Graswald made after Mr. Viafore disappeared.

Legal experts, including law professors and former prosecutors, say those statements are both the case’s greatest strength and its weakness.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/30/n...ayak-case-a-focus-on-suspects-statements.html

 

[Inthedetails]

I'm sure this has been asked several times, but I want to ask again...

Why is she only charged with 2nd degree murder? If the following is what happened, that is clearly 1st degree since, IMO, it was planned and premeditated. She did not fly into a rage and strike him in the head with an oar, etc. She allegedly tampered with his kayak and paddle, as put forth in the Poughkeepsie Journal article brought to us by silly1 (thanks, silly1 !).



http://www.poughkeepsiejournal.com/...pleads-guilty-kayaker-fiancs-murder/28181813/

Just wondering.

New York State has specific criteria for 1st degree and it looks like AG didn't meet them:

"The aforementioned aggravating factors focus on the identity of the intended victim (police officers, certain peace officers, correctional employees, judges, witnesses), the circumstances in which the murder was committed (while the defendant was serving a life sentence, during the commission of a specified felony ("felony murder"), for hire, accompanied by torture, in furtherance of a terrorist act), or the nature of the killing(s). - "

See more at: http://statelaws.findlaw.com/new-yo...-degree-murder-laws.html#sthash.K0WzHtKN.dpuf

 

[BunnyHop]

'We were drunk, it was an accident', claims woman accused of killing her fiancé on Hudson River kayaking trip as she denies his murder

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...lawyer-insists-victim-case.html#ixzz3bdCmXY9W
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

 

[Inthedetails]

'We were drunk, it was an accident', claims woman accused of killing her fiancé on Hudson River kayaking trip as she denies his murder

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...lawyer-insists-victim-case.html#ixzz3bdCmXY9W
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

Did I miss this in her previous interviews? I'm not recalling her saying they were drunk.

So she was happy when he drowned because she was buzzed?

 

[Hoosgirl]

‘Kayak killer’ says fiancé was wasted when he capsized

http://nypost.com/2015/05/29/kayak-killer-says-fiance-was-wasted-when-he-capsized/

As investigators await autopsy results, they now confront another challenge: a paucity of physical evidence. The Orange County district attorney’s office charged Mr. Viafore’s fiancée, Angelika Graswald, with second-degree murder and manslaughter, saying she intentionally caused his death while the two kayaked in mid-April.

But so far, the strongest evidence seems to be the incriminating oral and written statements that the police say Ms. Graswald made after Mr. Viafore disappeared.

Legal experts, including law professors and former prosecutors, say those statements are both the case’s greatest strength and its weakness.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/30/n...ayak-case-a-focus-on-suspects-statements.html

Her lawyer goes from him having a few beers to thinking they will find acute alcohol poisoning. That's quite a range there! The drinking aspect sure seems to be growing and growing in his statements.

Will they be able to reliably assess his BAC in the tox tests?

 

[OldSteve]

'We were drunk, it was an accident', claims woman accused of killing her fiancé on Hudson River kayaking trip as she denies his murder

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...lawyer-insists-victim-case.html#ixzz3bdCmXY9W
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

Got to hope LE has on tape her saying things about pushing his paddle away and tampering with his boat, also delay in calling 911... Her confession seems to be key.... haven't heard any recent mention of witnesses (telescope watchers).

 

[silly1]

Of course they went out drinking that Sunday. Brunch? Bars?
I said from day one there was no reason to cross to the west side, when they could have easily accessed Bannerman's from Cold Spring. BTW, there are many bars in Cold Spring, I think she worked at a few.

Portale is a slickster. This will be interesting. I think Prosecutors have a good case. JHMOO

I was reading it as--they were drinking on the island BEFORE they headed back. Not at a brunch beforehand. Would like to see that eventually verified as it can be interpreted two different ways. I think that the way I interpret it lends itself more to premeditation as it goes with the possibility of spiking his drink with some substance to make him get disoriented/pass out on the way back. JMHO.

 

[silly1]

Did I miss this in her previous interviews? I'm not recalling her saying they were drunk.

So she was happy when he drowned because she was buzzed?

I don't think we missed it. I think it's only being mentioned now.

 

[epiphany]

<snip>

Meanwhile, Graswald appeared in court armed with new recruits on her defense team. The experts hired to prove her innocence now include co-counsel Jeffrey Chartier, who successfully represented two MTA train engineers involved in fatal crashes; John Fleming, a retired NYPD homicide detective; and forensic scientist Michael Archer.

Portale refused to say how Graswald, who used to work as a waitress and bartender, would pay for their services, calling the question inappropriate.

BBM

http://nypost.com/2015/05/29/kayak-killer-says-fiance-was-wasted-when-he-capsized/

So who's paying for this defense?

I'm speculating that perhaps one or more accounts were joint, and she had and maybe still has access to the account/s...but wouldn't his half share have been frozen as soon as she was ??--unsure at what point this may have occurred, if at all.

Or is it similar to an impending divorce situation, where one party can empty the joint bank account prior to submitting papers, etc and the other must then proceed through the legal system to poss regain his/her portion?

My other thought is perhaps an interested party is funding her defense.

Gitana or anyone else: When would her defense have to state how they are being paid?

They certainly are working hard for AG at this point imo. Two recent NYT articles illustrate defense is savvy and smart: no apples please.

 

[kimi_SFC]

I'm sure this has been asked several times, but I want to ask again...

Why is she only charged with 2nd degree murder? If the following is what happened, that is clearly 1st degree since, IMO, it was planned and premeditated. She did not fly into a rage and strike him in the head with an oar, etc. She allegedly tampered with his kayak and paddle, as put forth in the Poughkeepsie Journal article brought to us by silly1 (thanks, silly1 !).



http://www.poughkeepsiejournal.com/...pleads-guilty-kayaker-fiancs-murder/28181813/

Just wondering.

IIRC the laws in NY state reserve 1D for only select cases, and this meets their criteria for 2D. They've also charged her with the lesser included offense of manslaughter. I recall a post upthread that states the max for 1D is 25-life and manslaughter is 15 years, but I could be wrong about the latter.

HTH.

ETA:
Tweet via @IBTimes:

Kayak murder: Did Angelika Graswald kill fiancé Vincent Viafore for his life insurance? http://ibt.uk/A006J0g via @IBTimesUK #kayakmurder
(snip)

[...]
Prosecutors formally indicted Graswald with second-degree murder and second degree manslaughter, according to CBS New York.
[...]
If convicted, Graswald faces a maximum penalty of 25 years to life in prison.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[geevee]

<snip>

Meanwhile, Graswald appeared in court armed with new recruits on her defense team. The experts hired to prove her innocence now include co-counsel Jeffrey Chartier, who successfully represented two MTA train engineers involved in fatal crashes; John Fleming, a retired NYPD homicide detective; and forensic scientist Michael Archer.

Portale refused to say how Graswald, who used to work as a waitress and bartender, would pay for their services, calling the question inappropriate.

BBM

http://nypost.com/2015/05/29/kayak-killer-says-fiance-was-wasted-when-he-capsized/

So who's paying for this defense?

I'm speculating that perhaps one or more accounts were joint, and she had and maybe still has access to the account/s...but wouldn't his half share have been frozen as soon as she was ??--unsure at what point this may have occurred, if at all.

Or is it similar to an impending divorce situation, where one party can empty the joint bank account prior to submitting papers, etc and the other must then proceed through the legal system to poss regain his/her portion?

My other thought is perhaps an interested party is funding her defense.

Gitana or anyone else: When would her defense have to state how they are being paid?

They certainly are working hard for AG at this point imo. Two recent NYT articles illustrate defense is savvy and smart: no apples please.

BBM

If she isn't convicted and the M.E. simply states drowning on the death certificate, won't she be able to collect on the quarter million in insurance policies?

 

[borndem]

IIRC the laws in NY state reserve 1D for only select cases, and this meets their criteria for 2D. They've also charged her with the lesser included offense of manslaughter. I recall a post upthread that states the max for 1D is 25-life and manslaughter is 15 years, but I could be wrong about the latter.

HTH.

ETA:
Tweet via @IBTimes:

Kayak murder: Did Angelika Graswald kill fiancé Vincent Viafore for his life insurance? http://ibt.uk/A006J0g via @IBTimesUK #kayakmurder
(snip)

[...]
Prosecutors formally indicted Graswald with second-degree murder and second degree manslaughter, according to CBS New York.
[...]
If convicted, Graswald faces a maximum penalty of 25 years to life in prison.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks, kimi!

You answered my question about 1D, and then you answered my next question, which was in my head only -- what's the penalty for 2D? Thanks for that, too.

Ahhhh, yes, the insurance money... I don't think we have a declared "manner" of death do we? We just know what it's not, I guess. Seems to me the insurance company would want a completed certificate, if at all possible. Certainly there are some deaths, I guess, that remain "could not be determined." Hmmmm. This little part is interesting to me...

On another note, we all know how much difference a crack defensive team can be.... Worrisome.

And is the source of payment for the defense team a question that must be answered? I'm thinking it's a MYOB type of thing.

 

[sunflowerchick]

I must admit I am really :fence: with this one. If she did do something to cause this, I hope they have more than what has been released because with what we have so far, it could easily be chalked up to accident and poor communication and a lack of judgment on her part. That doesn't equal murder IMO.

 

[gitana1]

I'm sure this has been asked several times, but I want to ask again...

Why is she only charged with 2nd degree murder? If the following is what happened, that is clearly 1st degree since, IMO, it was planned and premeditated. She did not fly into a rage and strike him in the head with an oar, etc. She allegedly tampered with his kayak and paddle, as put forth in the Poughkeepsie Journal article brought to us by silly1 (thanks, silly1 !).



http://www.poughkeepsiejournal.com/...pleads-guilty-kayaker-fiancs-murder/28181813/

Just wondering.

1st degree murder is the hardest to prove. If they aren't sure they can definitively prove all of the elements, or if they have a defendant who they feel may be sympathetic, and thus a jury may want badly to find an alternate explanation, they might go for a lesser charge that is easier to prove and has lesser penalties. Because that may be easier for a jury to swallow.

Anyhow, in this case there is nothing that has been disclosed that suggests this was planned before the island, and so if she flew into rage and decided to tamper with his kayak, it may be hard to prove that she wanted him dead at that moment, instead of just wanting to make things difficult for him, and then if her rage didn't turn murderous until in the river when she moved his paddle away, it's second degree more than first.