GUILTY OH - Pike Co, 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #66

[RAISINISBACK]

@IType - from my notes - from each of their last meetings.

for GW4
10/25/21 Update: Have been talking about the motions in Chambers resolved some. Some are withdrawn some at future hearings. Motion will be filed requesting a Dalbert hearing re shoeprint evidence on 12/22/21 @ 9 am.


for GW3:
11/17/21 Update: Pretrial Motions hearing. State & defense are meeting in December to organize dates & times for Daubert hearings on shoe prints & ballistics; all transcripts of taped interviews have been provided to defense, all reports of evidence i.e. forensic testing & related data has been handed over to defense. Attorneys for Billy & George Wagner have said they're concerned their clients could still face the death penalty if the prosecution isn't satisfied with Jake's testimony. So, they have fought to get it officially removed. Judge Randy Deering has already denied that motion in Billy's case. His attorneys may still try to get some of the murder charges against him modified. Wagner will be going to trial. Next hearing on 2/1/22.

BBM
These are only my thoughts on this and worth only what the keyboard I wrote them on ( about ten dollars) is worth.

The defense and AC are both walking a tightrope here. It all hinges on Jake telling the truth. Everyone and their mother knows Jake is a liar.

AC knows Jake and Angie are both liars so she doesn't want to let go of her leverage of the DP for George or Billy until she can be sure Jake and Angie tell the truth on the stand. If she removes it before their testimony at the trials Jake and Angie can flip and claim they lied about George being there and his role in the murders. Ditto for Billy.

The defense also knows Jake is a liar. They also know there is a huge chance he won't tell the truth during the trials. So they want that DP off the table now so their client's lives don't hinge on Jake telling the truth on the stand.

Like I said both sides are walking a tightrope here. AC doesn't want to give up her leverage against George and Billy which would allow Jake and Angie to lie on the stand. George and Billy both know what a liar Jake (and Angie) are and have probably told their attorneys. Both know their lives hang in the balance on Jake telling the truth, so they want that DP off the table before Jake gets on the stand. It's the only way George or Billy can know for sure they won't be sitting on death row. They cannot and do not trust Jake to get them off death row because they know him too well.

After all George and Billy have known Jake since the day he was born. How well do you know your brother or son? Do you know if they are pathological liars or straight up honest about everything? Whether you want to admit it or not, you do. You grew up with your brother, you have known your son from birth. Billy and George know also, that's why they don't want to trust him and place their lives in his hands during their trials.

I have said on here before that Billy and George were close in that family and Jake and Angie were close. In other words George was a daddy's boy while Jake was a mama's boy. The way these confessions ect are playing out with Jake and Angie flipping for a sweet deal leaving George and Billy relying on a pathological liars ability to tell the truth proves the dynamics of that family. I could go on with Georges texts deriding Jake but I am tired so I will have to rely on CC or Betty to look them up about Jake getting them in trouble over a woman ect.

Thank you Betty and CC for always being there to give me a helping hand.

JMO

 

[altojack]

@RAISINISBACK. You've put that very well indeed and it's so true what you've said about knowing our sons. I've got 6 of them in total and I stand here and say I have a liar in the pack! Son No 2 is the biggest liar going, he tells lies, the most unbelievable lies just for the sake of the telling. Mostly the lies are the stupidest lies ever heard. Does he think I came down in the last shower? Most likely.

Seriously, we're now getting close to 'make your mind up time'. Which way is George (never killed anyone) and Billy going to jump. We're getting closer to a trial, are they both sweating yet? I'd bet they are.

I'm still of the opinion JMO, that George is going down. He may not have shot anyone but he's still got guilt on his hands and the jury IMOO will see that and lock him up.

Oh, I do hope George opts for a trial.

 

[Covert Operative]

I called the court house to find out if G4 will be in court tomorrow. I was told that it is something private that he will be brought to court for and it is not for a hearing that will be public, no media allowed. They said she did not even know what it was. Someone else may want to call to see what answer they get.

 

[IType]

@IType - from my notes - from each of their last meetings.

for GW4
10/25/21 Update: Have been talking about the motions in Chambers resolved some. Some are withdrawn some at future hearings. Motion will be filed requesting a Dalbert hearing re shoeprint evidence on 12/22/21 @ 9 am.


for GW3:
11/17/21 Update: Pretrial Motions hearing. State & defense are meeting in December to organize dates & times for Daubert hearings on shoe prints & ballistics; all transcripts of taped interviews have been provided to defense, all reports of evidence i.e. forensic testing & related data has been handed over to defense. Attorneys for Billy & George Wagner have said they're concerned their clients could still face the death penalty if the prosecution isn't satisfied with Jake's testimony. So, they have fought to get it officially removed. Judge Randy Deering has already denied that motion in Billy's case. His attorneys may still try to get some of the murder charges against him modified. Wagner will be going to trial. Next hearing on 2/1/22.

Thanks!

 

[IType]

I found the complete video from BW last hearing and I think the judge says formal pretrial and not final pretrial maybe? That is how it seems with Closed caption.

Thanks!

 

[IType]

Could it have been fractured from a gun shot wound?

IMO, absolutely. Any solid object passing through a vertebra (vertebral body) would likely cause the bone to break and/or crack.

 

[IType]

G4

11/30/2021 SHERIFFS RETURN ON SUBPOENAS SERVED ON SHERIFF, TRACY EVANS, ON 11-24-2021 FILED

11/30/2021 WARRANT FOR REMOVAL FROM ROSS COUNTY JAIL ON DECEMBER 2, 2021 AT 10:00AM
A plea deal?

BBM, I certainly hope so!

 

[IType]

11/30/2021
WARRANT FOR REMOVAL FROM ROSS COUNTY JAIL ON DECEMBER 2, 2021 AT 10:00AM

This is day after tomorrow, wonder if he is going to court?

Need to watch the news and docket.

The only way I see a plea is if Jake and Angela have said enough to solidly implicate him in the murders. His attorneys say he didn't shoot or kill anyone but still, J & A could explain his involvement in helping that night to the point he knows he will lose at trial.

And can do better with a plea.....What is better?

Angie's sentence rather than LWOP.

Just thinking out loud.

BBM #1, My thoughts exactly.

BBM #2, I could see this as a definite possibility, but I really hope GW4 would get more than 30 years since he was actually present at the murder scenes.
JMO

 

[IType]

I called the court house to find out if G4 will be in court tomorrow. I was told that it is something private that he will be brought to court for and it is not for a hearing that will be public, no media allowed. They said she did not even know what it was. Someone else may want to call to see what answer they get.

Giving his own proffer tomorrow, hearing on 12/22/21 will be for a plea change? Wouldn't that be a great Christmas gift! BettyP could have that Christmas party she mentioned several weeks ago! LOL, JMO

 

[Cool Cats]

BBM #1, My thoughts exactly.

BBM #2, I could see this as a definite possibility, but I really hope GW4 would get more than 30 years since he was actually present at the murder scenes.
JMO

I agree, I hope George gets more than 30 years, I was hoping that all 4 would get LWOP. Was a shock to see Angela get 30 but Junk says she has to serve all 30, no parole.

Deering will sentence her and I am counting on him to sentence her that way, no parole, must serve all 30. Nothing is written in stone until the actual sentencing.

If it turns out that George is not going to court to plea tomorrow, then I will see it as "that ship has sailed" and he will definitely chance a trial which I think will land him with LWOP.

Imagine being on the jury and seeing the evidence and photos and listening to his threats and incriminating statements etc... He would be convicted for sure in my opinion.

 

[Covert Operative]

Giving his own proffer tomorrow, hearing on 12/22/21 will be for a plea change? Wouldn't that be a great Christmas gift! BettyP could have that Christmas party she mentioned several weeks ago! LOL, JMO

Could be that they are meeting at the court house to go over a plea deal. Maybe due to logistics they needed to meet there.

 

[joe jones]

the family so far appear to be in agreement with the plea deals already made, so I have everything crossed that GW may have also made a plea the family have agreed with (even though they may not like it the prospect of sitting through trial after trail and hearing all the horrible details means they will let the state get as long of a sentence as they can to save them more pain)

then we only have one left, and I don't know if even he would consider going to trial when 3 of his co conspirators will be testifying against him (if there is a plea deal in the works)

 

[IType]

I agree, I hope George gets more than 30 years, I was hoping that all 4 would get LWOP. Was a shock to see Angela get 30 but Junk says she has to serve all 30, no parole.

Deering will sentence her and I am counting on him to sentence her that way, no parole, must serve all 30. Nothing is written in stone until the actual sentencing.

If it turns out that George is not going to court to plea tomorrow, then I will see it as "that ship has sailed" and he will definitely chance a trial which I think will land him with LWOP.

Imagine being on the jury and seeing the evidence and photos and listening to his threats and incriminating statements etc... He would be convicted for sure in my opinion.

I couldn't imagine being a juror on any murder case, let alone this one. Keeping my fingers crossed for a plea change in the near future, at least before April 2022

 

[Cool Cats]

Throwback:

Looks like the Wagners got their lies mixed up in their interviews shortly before the searches and this helped give the probable cause for the Search Warrants:

April 13, 2017---Jake audio interview
May 3, 2017---Jake and Angie audio interview
May 8, 2017---GW3 audio interview
May 12, 2017---LE conducts searches on Peterson Rd., car lot, vehicles, and FWF.

There have been discussions as to BCI did know/should have known that it was the Wagner's from day one. I think it gets forgotten that to even get to the evidence that points to the Wagners BCI had to get multiple Probable Cause Search Warrants with a Judge's signature. Expiring in 30 days they then had to do it all over again.

Remember it was with Search Warrants for property and vehicals that BCI was able to obtain:

1.) Faulty burned silencer in well - Consistent with suppressor parts they bought.
2.) Bullet casings buried in the ground - Matched casings at crime scenes.

3.) Fraudulent custody documents - Showed motive for murder and also exposed Angie's lie telling her mom to lie and say she forged the documents. I believe Angie copied her mom's signature and used her rotary stamp.

4.) Angie's infamous shoe receipt - Linked BCI to the Waverly Walmart showing Angie (in early April) on video buying the brand of shoes that were consistent with the bloody footprints at Dana's and Chris's including having new tread.

Also it was Search Warrants for phones and hidden listening devices - like in their truck - that BCI was able to overhear 8,000 remarks of interest.

1.) I bought a night scope.
2.) I bought a Captain America mask.
3.) (Scheiderer sends George a photo of a 22 gun) If they have the gun they have the silencer.
4.) (Photo of 22 gun) We have a family emergency.

5.) (BCI is on Peterson Rd. property, George calls Billy) Don't come down here we have company.

6.) (A gun list and gun photo are found on Jake's phone) I told you to get rid of your phone.

7.) (The Wagners abused George's ex wife, Jake's wife, and HR) Your always getting us into trouble over some woman.

 

[StrangeOne]

Could J and A be lying to get BW out? Maybe they see him as being able to get his son back and living a life when the others can't. A sort of throwing themselves under the bus? I mean if I was an evil person like the two of them and my brother/son could get a chance to be free I would do it.

 

[Cool Cats]

Could J and A be lying to get BW out? Maybe they see him as being able to get his son back and living a life when the others can't. A sort of throwing themselves under the bus? I mean if I was an evil person like the two of them and my brother/son could get a chance to be free I would do it.

What your saying reminds me of what @RAISINISBACK said a few pages back:

"...They had their story together long before they were arrested. And that story is that George didn't kill anyone. They need one of them to go free to get those 2 kids back.

It's always possible they are saying George didn't kill anyone because they planned back in 2016-2017 to say that. But if George really did kill someone they are risking the DP to be lying about it.

The DP seems to be the dividing factor here, it's what caused Jake to turn State's evidence. Because getting rid of the DP means telling the truth, I don't think it is worth it for Jake to lie.

Whatever Jake is saying is probably the truth and whatever Angela is saying corroborates what Jake is saying, thus she too is telling the truth.

If Jake said George participated in the murders but Angela said he didn't, you know what?

Angela would not have gotten her fancy 30 year deal. She only gets it for being honest and her story dovetails into Jake's.

If one of them is lying it will be noticeable.

If they were really trying to protect George, they would not place him at the crime scenes.

Both placed him at the crime scenes. Angie said all 3 guys went out that night and Canepa says that her story corroborates Jake's. Thus, both J & A are pinning George to the crime scenes.

 

[joe jones]

What your saying reminds me of what @RAISINISBACK said a few pages back:

"...They had their story together long before they were arrested. And that story is that George didn't kill anyone. They need one of them to go free to get those 2 kids back.

It's always possible they are saying George didn't kill anyone because they planned back in 2016-2017 to say that. But if George really did kill someone they are risking the DP to be lying about it.

The DP seems to be the dividing factor here, it's what caused Jake to turn State's evidence. Because getting rid of the DP means telling the truth, I don't think it is worth it for Jake to lie.

Whatever Jake is saying is probably the truth and whatever Angela is saying corroborates what Jake is saying, thus she too is telling the truth.

If Jake said George participated in the murders but Angela said he didn't, you know what?

Angela would not have gotten her fancy 30 year deal. She only gets it for being honest and her story dovetails into Jake's.

If one of them is lying it will be noticeable.

If they were really trying to protect George, they would not place him at the crime scenes.

Both placed him at the crime scenes. Angie said all 3 guys went out that night and Canepa says that her story corroborates Jake's. Thus, both J & A are pinning George to the crime scenes.

I agree whatever they have told the state matches to all the evidence found, they would not have taken DP off for them all if what JW first confessed to was not totally corroborated by what their investigations and evidence showed, I think JW confession is as close to what exactly happened that night, as the state dropped the DP against all 4 of them and this is a case of 8 murders from JW confession alone, everything he said tallied with what they knew, and then AW had to have had to have told a similar version (hers may vary is some ways as she was not their).

 

[RAISINISBACK]

What your saying reminds me of what @RAISINISBACK said a few pages back:

"...They had their story together long before they were arrested. And that story is that George didn't kill anyone. They need one of them to go free to get those 2 kids back.

It's always possible they are saying George didn't kill anyone because they planned back in 2016-2017 to say that. But if George really did kill someone they are risking the DP to be lying about it.

The DP seems to be the dividing factor here, it's what caused Jake to turn State's evidence. Because getting rid of the DP means telling the truth, I don't think it is worth it for Jake to lie.

Whatever Jake is saying is probably the truth and whatever Angela is saying corroborates what Jake is saying, thus she too is telling the truth.

If Jake said George participated in the murders but Angela said he didn't, you know what?

Angela would not have gotten her fancy 30 year deal. She only gets it for being honest and her story dovetails into Jake's.

If one of them is lying it will be noticeable.

If they were really trying to protect George, they would not place him at the crime scenes.

Both placed him at the crime scenes. Angie said all 3 guys went out that night and Canepa says that her story corroborates Jake's. Thus, both J & A are pinning George to the crime scenes.

I would agree with you except for one thing. Ever took statements from 2 or 3 people at a crime scene? How about 2 or 3 kids? Do you know how I could tell if my son was lying about something when he was in school?

Because him and his friends all had the EXACT same version of an event.

I am not saying this well so let me give an example.

How many of you on here have 1 or more kids? especially teenagers? I had 1 child but he had friends. Ride or die type friends. lol

When my son turned 16 like an idiot I bought him new car for his birthday. First weekend after his b day he and two other boys went out on Friday night. Supposed to be home by midnight. Midnight came and went, still not home. 1 AM hubby and I went looking. Found them at a 4th friends house with a wrecked car. Now hubby was LE (retired now) so he did interrogations for a living. Sat all 3 boys down and asked them what happened. Said a deer ran out in front of them and our son swerved to miss it and hit the ditch. Well we were pretty cool parents, kids didn't have any visible injuries so we took all three back to our house to stay the night. Hubby took 1 in the kitchen to help him fix a snack. Talked to him about the wreck. Took a second one in the den to shoot a game of pool. 3 AM by this time. I finally sat down with a cup of hot chocolate with my son and talked to him about what happened. Long story short, all three told the EXACT same story right down to how many antlers the deer had on him, same color, same direction he came from ect.

It was then we sat all three down and asked them what really happened. Know why? No 3 witness stories EXACTLY match if they are telling the truth. No 2 stories EXACTLY match if they are telling the truth. Finally got the truth. They were horsing around, driving too fast, and the kid in the back seat put his hands over my sons eyes, causing him to swerve and hit the ditch.

So I don't buy that because Jake and Angie's stories match exactly that they are telling the truth. They had over 2 years to rehearse their stories. My son and his buddies had theirs down in two hours. Even Billy could get it right in 2 years. Sorry just don't buy it. I am betting a jury won't either, especially if any one on that jury has kids. George didn't just go along to put his hands over Jake or Billy's eyes while they were driving too fast and horsing around. He went to kill. He did kill. And Jake and Angie's perfectly matching stories (proffers) tells the truth of that. <modsnip>

JMO

 

[Cool Cats]

I would agree with you except for one thing. Ever took statements from 2 or 3 people at a crime scene? How about 2 or 3 kids? Do you know how I could tell if my son was lying about something when he was in school?

Because him and his friends all had the EXACT same version of an event.

I am not saying this well so let me give an example.

How many of you on here have 1 or more kids? especially teenagers? I had 1 child but he had friends. Ride or die type friends. lol

When my son turned 16 like an idiot I bought him new car for his birthday. First weekend after his b day he and two other boys went out on Friday night. Supposed to be home by midnight. Midnight came and went, still not home. 1 AM hubby and I went looking. Found them at a 4th friends house with a wrecked car. Now hubby was LE (retired now) so he did interrogations for a living. Sat all 3 boys down and asked them what happened. Said a deer ran out in front of them and our son swerved to miss it and hit the ditch. Well we were pretty cool parents, kids didn't have any visible injuries so we took all three back to our house to stay the night. Hubby took 1 in the kitchen to help him fix a snack. Talked to him about the wreck. Took a second one in the den to shoot a game of pool. 3 AM by this time. I finally sat down with a cup of hot chocolate with my son and talked to him about what happened. Long story short, all three told the EXACT same story right down to how many antlers the deer had on him, same color, same direction he came from ect.

It was then we sat all three down and asked them what really happened. Know why? No 3 witness stories EXACTLY match if they are telling the truth. No 2 stories EXACTLY match if they are telling the truth. Finally got the truth. They were horsing around, driving too fast, and the kid in the back seat put his hands over my sons eyes, causing him to swerve and hit the ditch.

So I don't buy that because Jake and Angie's stories match exactly that they are telling the truth. They had over 2 years to rehearse their stories. My son and his buddies had theirs down in two hours. Even Billy could get it right in 2 years. Sorry just don't buy it. I am betting a jury won't either, especially if any one on that jury has kids. George didn't just go along to put his hands over Jake or Billy's eyes while they were driving too fast and horsing around. He went to kill. He did kill. And Jake and Angie's perfectly matching stories (proffers) tells the truth of that. <modsnip>

JMO

Wow, kid really did that.

If they were sticking to a story to say George wasn't involved they would not have him at the crime scenes, it would be to say he stayed home.

Makes no sense to say:

"Ok now, if we get arrested let's say George went along to the crime scenes but tell them he didn't shoot or kill anyone. He was just there for no reason."

Makes zero sense to place George at the crime scenes, it guarantees he won't be raising his kid.

For the innocent George story to stick he has to be home that night.

It's possible they both tried to stick to a story of George being home but then the prosecution put the petal to the metal with the DP and threat of a trial and they came clean.

I think now they just want to save themselves so they are getting away from any preconceived stories. <modsnip>

A death sentence trumps what George wants.

 

[Niner]

I "think" this is happening.... at least I can shorten this up a bit.

Thursday, December 2nd:
*Private Hearing (@ 10am ET) - OH - Pike County 8 people dead: Christopher Rhoden, Sr. (40), his ex-wife, Dana Manley Rhoden (37), their three children, Clarence "Frankie" Rhoden (20), Christopher Jr. (16), Hanna Mae (19); Frankie's fiancée, Hannah Hazel Gilley (20), Christopher Rhoden Sr.'s brother, Kenneth Rhoden (44), & a cousin, Gary Rhoden (37). Hanna Rhoden's baby girl (5 days old), another baby (6 mos.) and a young child (3) were unharmed. (April 21-22, 2016, Pebbles) – for *George Washington Wagner IV (27/now 30) (Jakes’ bro) indicted (11/12/18), arrested (11/13/18), charged (11/15/18) & arraigned (11/28/18) with 8 counts aggravated murder, (plus gun specifications on each), 1 count of 1st degree conspiracy, 4 counts of 1st degree aggravated burglary, 1 count of 5th degree unlawful possession of dangerous ordnance, 3 counts of 3rd degree evidence tampering, 1 count of 5th degree forgery, 1 count of 5th degree unauthorized use of computer or telecommunications, 1 count of 4th degree interception of wire, oral or electronic communication, 1 count of 5th degree obstructing justice, 1 count of 1st degree engaging in a pattern of corrupt activity. (Det. Scheiderer: We know the three calibers of firearms that were used to commit these murders. a 22 caliber long rifle, a 40 caliber, and a 30 caliber). Plead not guilty. Held without bond. DA will seek the DP. Per Jake’s plea agreement, DP is off the table.
Trial set to begin on 4/4/22. (3 month trial).
Crime info & court hearings from 11/28/18 thru 9/24/21 reference post #461 here:
GUILTY - OH - Pike Co, 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #66
10/22/21: Motion #74: Defendant's Motion to Compel discovery filed. Defendant's notice of reciprocal Discovery filed by John Parker. Motions hearing on 10/25/21.
10/25/21 Update: 10/25/21 Update: Have been talking about the motions in Chambers resolved some. Some are withdrawn some at future hearings. Motion will be filed requesting a Dalbert hearing re shoe print evidence on 12/22/21 @ 9 am.
#61 (filed Jan 22) Motion to exclude photos of shell casings-will be set for hearing on 12/22/21. Maybe able to resolve with stipulations.
#62 motion re appointment of Wilson as prosecuting attorney-did not hear.
#63 Motion granted-complied with state? Continuing duty to provide defense with.
#64 Compel transcripts of audio - withdrawn on April 28 will reflect in record today.
#65 compel production of Other Acts - set motion to hear on 12/22. Parties may refine their argument, possibly some items may not be pursing all. May not be objections to some of the OA.
#66 Motion to set pretrial schedule - has been withdrawn.
#67 Withdrawn
#68 Defense depose critical witness - withdrawn.
#69 - Withdrawn
#70 Set trial date, has already been granted.
#71 Quash subpoena - ruled on previously.
#72 Withdrawn - State provided.
#73 Set for argument on next hearing 12/22/21.
Compel discovery filed Oct. & state's reciprocal Motions are each granted. (These were motions filed last week or so. Motions #74 & #75).
State given until 12/21/21 to provide supplemental, Defense given until 12/31/21 to provide reciprocal. If any party thinks he hasn't recited properly state it now. Junk says they're ok, Nash says it's accurate. Counsel should work to schedule more hearings each month. Asking defense counsel if having access to defendant, complaints-no. George is happy with attorneys, no complaints. From court site: 10/25/21: State's Motion to Compel reciprocal discovery filed by Robert Junk, Angela Canepa & Andrew Wilson. State's memorandum contra defendant's Motion to Dismiss aggravated murder counts and/or death specifications & State's Motion to Strike filed by Junk, Canepa & Wilson. State's supplement discovery filed. 10/26/21: Motion, entry & certification for appointed counsel fees filed. Judge will make a ruling on the 8 murder charges on 12/22/21.
11/19/21: Motion #75: Motion to Order the Pike County sheriff, Tracy D. Evans, to transport Edward J. Wagner to this court for a motion hearing set at 9am on 12/22/21 filed by attorney John P. Parker & Richard M. Nash, Jr. Subpoena issued PCSO for transport of inmate Wagner to hearing on 12/22/21.
11/30/21: Sheriff's return on subpoenas served on Sheriff Tracy Evans on 11/24/21 filed. Warrant for removal from Ross County jail on 12/2/21 @ 10am. Private hearing with no public & no media allowed.
*Edward Jacob “Jake” Wagner (26/now 29) – Plead guilty (4/22/21) to all charges & will testify in the trials. No sentencing date set as of 12/2/21.
*George Washington Wagner III (47/now 50) – Motions hearing on 2/1/22.
*Angela Jo Wagner (48/now 50) – 9/10/21: Plead guilty to a plea deal to Counts 9 thru 22, Counts 1-8 were dismissed. Sentenced to 30 years in prison with no early release & has to testify against others at trial.
*Rita Jo Newcomb (65/now 68) – Last Motions hearing on 12/2/19 entered a plea of guilty. Expected to testify in the trials.
*Fredericka Carol Wagner (76/now 79) – 6/26/19 Charges were dismissed without prejudice.