GUILTY OH - Pike Co, 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #66

[Johnny B Bad]

If George Wagner iv is innocent of the killing of the 8 victims, than why did he get into a vehicle the night of the murders and go with the Shooters, knowing what was going to happen? now anyone out there can tell me this man is innocent, then convince me?

 

[Covert Operative]

If George Wagner iv is innocent of the killing of the 8 victims, than why did he get into a vehicle the night of the murders and go with the Shooters, knowing what was going to happen? now anyone out there can tell me this man is innocent, then convince me?

I have never seen anyone post that he was innocent, I could have missed some post I guess. He may not have killed anyone but I certainly believe the intent was there. It seems to me bringing JW into testify that G4 did not shoot/kill anyone might not go well for them. I would think he will testify that G4 was involved in some way and how. They must think JW testimony that G4 did not kill anyone outweighs other things he will say. I do not see how. It was stated in G4 motion (75) that the thrust of G4 motion (73) came from a statement JW made to the state.
09/24/2021 MOTION #73--MOTION TO DISMISS AGGRAVATED MURDER COUNTS AND/OR DEATH SPECIFICATIONS FILED Attorney: NASH, JR, RICHARD M AND Attorney: PARKER, JOHN PATRICK
11/19/2021 MOTION NO. 75 MOTION TO ORDER THE PIKE COUNTY SHERIFF, TRACY D EVANS, TO TRANSPORT EDWARD JACOB WAGNER TO THIS COURT FOR A MOTION HEARING SET AT 9:00AM ON DECEMBER 22, 2021 FILED Attorney: PARKER, JOHN PATRICK Attorney: NASH, JR, RICHARD M

 

[Covert Operative]

1. What was purpose of knife? Who's dna is on it? What is the source of dna(touch,fluids,blood) What neccesitated it being intricately hidden with the other weapons?

2.how do you explain crsr autopsy taking 2 days? How was crsr back fractured? Why is crsr the only autopsy extremity completely redacted? Why is crsr the only one who has additional injury section, once again completely redacted?

3 Why is extent of injury section exponentially disproportionate compared to other victims if bullet count is all that seperates them? Nearly 3 pages of fully redacted compared to victims with 5 shots who do not have a full page? Where did the soft tissue bruising come from?

4. Why did the state fight so hard to keep autopsies away from everyone, not only significantly stricter then normal procedure and fought all the way to supreme court. Families wishes are listened to but not authoritative. Everyone had already been told victims were shot, what does "the way they died" mean exactly why do you consider a stab wound as taboo.

5. Given that b3 has a history established of robbery/larceny and crsr had a giant safe. Do you think b3 tried to extract the combination? What sense does it make to limit parameters to guns only?

I was truly extending an olive branch in my last post because we're all here for the victims and see wags punished. However it's apparent you like to debate. So I'm curious if you have insite in these matters

I am not sure if the knives were physically used to inflict injury but I do not dismiss it, it seems possible. It was kept with the other weapons, it seems to have its own bucket along with the guns, so it is very suspicious. It could have just been thrown away as could the guns, but they were kept along with the knife.

The knife certainly would be a horrifying threat to a person if they were being taunted with it or comments made to them of what they would do to them.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

IMO (no proof) CRsr's fractured back may have been from someone stomping him when he was down. Does anyone recall steel-toed boots being mentioned? MOO.

 

[Dudly]

IMO (no proof) CRsr's fractured back may have been from someone stomping him when he was down. Does anyone recall steel-toed boots being mentioned? MOO.

It doesn’t say if it was a new fracture, ether, I believe, or the type of fracture. He could have hurt it doing the work he normally does…

 

[Cool Cats]

IMO (no proof) CRsr's fractured back may have been from someone stomping him when he was down. Does anyone recall steel-toed boots being mentioned? MOO.

Not sure if these are steel-toed.

I think the 2 pairs of boots Angela bought in sizes 10.5 and 11 are:

Reeboks Mens Rapid Response and Tactical Research Kiowa Boot - Sage Green.

These, and 2 pairs of women's boots, are the only boots that I see listed under Boot Tread Research.

Uploaded by
Local12WKRC
State's Supplemental Discovery March 20, 2019
Angela Wagner | PDF

Interesting to note - from Canepa at Jake's guilty hearing - that Angela bought George & Jake their boots in the sizes and styles they did not wear. Thought that was enough to evade LE, probably why the Wagners did not seem concerned leaving footprints.

George Wagner request for bail denied after hearing reveals new details
Bloody shoe impressions on floor at Chris SR's = Starts at 1:12:40 = Photo

 

[IType]

I just looked a minute ago at CourtView for BW. There is no date set for his next hearing, which I find a little odd. It seems to me that most of the time (but not always) the defense, prosecution and the court set their next hearing date at the time they are in court for a hearing, i.e., the last time BW and GW4 were in court, their next hearings were scheduled and announced while they were in the courtroom (BW 11/17/21 and GW4 12/22/21). My question: Why didn't they set BW's next hearing date?

In an MSM article (link below) from the day of BW's hearing a couple weeks ago, I also found a couple of odd things:

1. "Judge Randy Deering said he would hold off on making a ruling for defense motions until Billy’s final pretrial hearing in February." My question: Why would BW be having a final pretrial hearing in February when he doesn't even have a trial date set yet? Is this a typo from the reporter? Is the reporter confusing BW with GW4, whose trial is set for April 2022?

2. "The judge did say Wednesday that the attorneys on both sides will conduct a meeting away from the courthouse in December. What that meeting will center around is unknown. My question: Why are the defense and prosecution having a meeting? Is BW considering changing his plea? Is there a direct correlation between BW not having his next hearing scheduled yet and this meeting outside of court?

Pike County Massacre: Wagner family patriarch returns to court

Just curious what other posters opinions are.

 

[Covert Operative]

I just looked a minute ago at CourtView for BW. There is no date set for his next hearing, which I find a little odd. It seems to me that most of the time (but not always) the defense, prosecution and the court set their next hearing date at the time they are in court for a hearing, i.e., the last time BW and GW4 were in court, their next hearings were scheduled and announced while they were in the courtroom (BW 11/17/21 and GW4 12/22/21). My question: Why didn't they set BW's next hearing date?

In an MSM article (link below) from the day of BW's hearing a couple weeks ago, I also found a couple of odd things:

1. "Judge Randy Deering said he would hold off on making a ruling for defense motions until Billy’s final pretrial hearing in February." My question: Why would BW be having a final pretrial hearing in February when he doesn't even have a trial date set yet? Is this a typo from the reporter? Is the reporter confusing BW with GW4, whose trial is set for April 2022?

2. "The judge did say Wednesday that the attorneys on both sides will conduct a meeting away from the courthouse in December. What that meeting will center around is unknown. My question: Why are the defense and prosecution having a meeting? Is BW considering changing his plea? Is there a direct correlation between BW not having his next hearing scheduled yet and this meeting outside of court?

Pike County Massacre: Wagner family patriarch returns to court

Just curious what other posters opinions are.

I thought it was a little strange also and that there may be some plea in the works. I could not see anything besides LWOP so not sure it would take that long to make that deal. Sometimes they use the wording pretrial/hearing/ pretrial hearing interchangeably. The judge may have referred to it as final but it is not the final one.
I think they did mention in the hearing what they would be meeting about in December or what they claim they will be meeting about. Unfortunately the complete video of that hearing is not available so I do not remember for sure what they said.

 

[Niner]

@IType - from my notes - from each of their last meetings.

for GW4
10/25/21 Update: Have been talking about the motions in Chambers resolved some. Some are withdrawn some at future hearings. Motion will be filed requesting a Dalbert hearing re shoeprint evidence on 12/22/21 @ 9 am.


for GW3:
11/17/21 Update: Pretrial Motions hearing. State & defense are meeting in December to organize dates & times for Daubert hearings on shoe prints & ballistics; all transcripts of taped interviews have been provided to defense, all reports of evidence i.e. forensic testing & related data has been handed over to defense. Attorneys for Billy & George Wagner have said they're concerned their clients could still face the death penalty if the prosecution isn't satisfied with Jake's testimony. So, they have fought to get it officially removed. Judge Randy Deering has already denied that motion in Billy's case. His attorneys may still try to get some of the murder charges against him modified. Wagner will be going to trial. Next hearing on 2/1/22.

 

[Covert Operative]

LOCAL 12, WKRC-TV | Facebook BW last hearing. Complete Video
@NWLady

 

[Covert Operative]

I just looked a minute ago at CourtView for BW. There is no date set for his next hearing, which I find a little odd. It seems to me that most of the time (but not always) the defense, prosecution and the court set their next hearing date at the time they are in court for a hearing, i.e., the last time BW and GW4 were in court, their next hearings were scheduled and announced while they were in the courtroom (BW 11/17/21 and GW4 12/22/21). My question: Why didn't they set BW's next hearing date?

In an MSM article (link below) from the day of BW's hearing a couple weeks ago, I also found a couple of odd things:

1. "Judge Randy Deering said he would hold off on making a ruling for defense motions until Billy’s final pretrial hearing in February." My question: Why would BW be having a final pretrial hearing in February when he doesn't even have a trial date set yet? Is this a typo from the reporter? Is the reporter confusing BW with GW4, whose trial is set for April 2022?

2. "The judge did say Wednesday that the attorneys on both sides will conduct a meeting away from the courthouse in December. What that meeting will center around is unknown. My question: Why are the defense and prosecution having a meeting? Is BW considering changing his plea? Is there a direct correlation between BW not having his next hearing scheduled yet and this meeting outside of court?

Pike County Massacre: Wagner family patriarch returns to court

Just curious what other posters opinions are.

I found the complete video from BW last hearing and I think the judge says formal pretrial and not final pretrial maybe? That is how it seems with Closed caption.

 

[Covert Operative]

It doesn’t say if it was a new fracture, ether, I believe, or the type of fracture. He could have hurt it doing the work he normally does…

Could it have been fractured from a gun shot wound?

 

[LMDlong]

Could it have been fractured from a gun shot wound?

That is my opinion gathered from the redacted autopsy report so far .

 

[Cool Cats]

Could it have been fractured from a gun shot wound?

That is my opinion gathered from the redacted autopsy report so far .

I believe the gun shot wound to the torso fractured his spine. Doesn't say healed fracture, meaning it was currently fractured at time of autopsy.

Bullets fracture and paralyze people's spines frequently from torso shots.

Gunshot Injuries to the Spine

Spinal cord injury from gun shot wounds may be due to direct injury (transection/laceration/contusion).

Indirect injury from a concussive/blast effect.

Vascular injury resulting in spinal cord ischemia (a restriction in blood supply to any tissue).

 

[Cool Cats]

Might need a new theory.

I theorized Chris was shot in the torso from the front porch, standing in or near the living room doorway, but then was still able to make it to the bedroom where he was shot through the door. But with a fractured spine there is no way he could have run through the house.

BJM did not mention any gunshot holes in the front door so I always thought it was the bedroom door. The back bedroom where they were found. I thought Chris was in that bedroom because he had run to that bedroom then Gary was the one dragged through the house not Chris.

"...the way his head was tilted indicates that Christopher Rhoden Sr. was shot through a door."

First time I remember seeing this, both chest and stomach not just torso:

"The autopsy states he was shot nine times in the head, chest, stomach and forearm, possibly a defensive wound."

No wonder he had a fractured spine.

• New information released in unsolved Rhoden family massacre
• https://www.wcpo.com/news/state/sta...reporters-to-inspect-slain-family-s-autopsies

 

[Covert Operative]

That is my opinion gathered from the redacted autopsy report so far .

Your opinion seems like it would make sense. I believe GR was shot in the LR/Entryway and CRsr heard something initially and came up but then retreated back. He may have been shot near the LR on some part of his body but made it to the back of the home. The indicments say in count 9, moving CRsr and/or GR body, so I am not sure both bodies were moved.

I feel that maybe GR caught them off guard and it caused some type of commotion they had not planned on. Maybe he actually heard them and went to the door or was right at them when they came in and they were not expecting that. When that happened they did not have the surprise attack on CRsr that they had planned.

 

[Dudly]

IMO (no proof) CRsr's fractured back may have been from someone stomping him when he was down. Does anyone recall steel-toed boots being mentioned? MOO.

It doesn’t say if it was a new fracture, ether, I believe, or the type of fracture. He could have hurt it doing the work he normally does…

Could it have been fractured from a gun shot wound?

Yes

 

[Covert Operative]

G4

11/30/2021 SHERIFFS RETURN ON SUBPOENAS SERVED ON SHERIFF, TRACY EVANS, ON 11-24-2021 FILED

11/30/2021 WARRANT FOR REMOVAL FROM ROSS COUNTY JAIL ON DECEMBER 2, 2021 AT 10:00AM
A plea deal?

 

[Cool Cats]

G4

11/30/2021 SHERIFFS RETURN ON SUBPOENAS SERVED ON SHERIFF, TRACY EVANS, ON 11-24-2021 FILED

11/30/2021 WARRANT FOR REMOVAL FROM ROSS COUNTY JAIL ON DECEMBER 2, 2021 AT 10:00AM
A plea deal?

11/30/2021
WARRANT FOR REMOVAL FROM ROSS COUNTY JAIL ON DECEMBER 2, 2021 AT 10:00AM

This is day after tomorrow, wonder if he is going to court?

Need to watch the news and docket.

The only way I see a plea is if Jake and Angela have said enough to solidly implicate him in the murders. His attorneys say he didn't shoot or kill anyone but still, J & A could explain his involvement in helping that night to the point he knows he will lose at trial.

And can do better with a plea.....What is better?

Angie's sentence rather than LWOP.

Just thinking out loud.

 

[Dudly]

Might need a new theory.

I theorized Chris was shot in the torso from the front porch, standing in or near the living room doorway, but then was still able to make it to the bedroom where he was shot through the door. But with a fractured spine there is no way he could have run through the house.

BJM did not mention any gunshot holes in the front door so I always thought it was the bedroom door. The back bedroom where they were found. I thought Chris was in that bedroom because he had run to that bedroom then Gary was the one dragged through the house not Chris.

"...the way his head was tilted indicates that Christopher Rhoden Sr. was shot through a door."

First time I remember seeing this, both chest and stomach not just torso:

"The autopsy states he was shot nine times in the head, chest, stomach and forearm, possibly a defensive wound."

No wonder he had a fractured spine.

• New information released in unsolved Rhoden family massacre
• https://www.wcpo.com/news/state/sta...reporters-to-inspect-slain-family-s-autopsies

Again, it depends on the fracture as to what he could after. I had a compression fracture at L1 for over a month and did not know it. A regular X-ray did not show it. It took a CAT Scan with contrast to show it. I had pain but not debilitating pain.