Oscar Pistorius Defense

[44ALLAN]

I believe Oscar intentionally killed Reeva. There is still part of me that is hoping to be proven wrong by the defence though - not because I give a whit about Oscar, but for Reeva and the many who love her. They already are forced to face everyday without her and will already always wonder 'what if'...



The problem for me is that everything presented so far really does contradict Oscar's 'version'. I either have to invent or ignore evidence to make it work. So my logic wars with hope.

I think you know he could see her and he executed her.................the 1st sounds were not gunshots.............NO WAY!
The 3am'ish sounds were the angry bat strikes/kicks/punches etc that damaged the door/rest of the house etc enough for him to see her through the door.................that's why witnesses heard her screaming after this time.....................no other explanation whatsoever no matter how we look at it unfortunately
Also remember Johnson heard a mans voice calling help help help just after the woman called for help.............so Reeva was still alive when he did that!!!!
Chilling that testimony.

Original post by Britskate but somehow didn't paste correctly my apologies

 

[Carmelita]

TY for finding that! Muchas gracias!

I find it strange that a screenshot of those messages wasn't included in the article, especially since a screenshot of other texts was included and even more especially since the purported texts about a blow-up doll are so titillating that I'm surprised a screenshot wasn't included in order for NBC to authenticate them.

Even though it's apparently been mentioned in an MSM article, I'm still skeptical since NBC didn't include a screenshot. I'm a tough audience.

I agree that the MSM reporting it doesn't mean it is an actual quote. I take everything the MSM says with a grain of salt. They have their own agenda and bias.

 

[44ALLAN]

Yes I know that he is lying. The reason he is lying is because if Reeva did not say a word and only made the mag rack cause a sound then OP wants that sound to be coming from any area other than the area that he fired at. Because if he fired at the wood sound that means he fired at Reeva (Mr. Intruder) and that is murder. He wants the court to believe that he accidentally fired four bullets in to the door in random locations, not at the person behind the door.

I cannot think of another reason why OP wants the mag rack to not be under or near where Reeva was when she was shot.

EXACTLY.................but the judge knows that as well believe me

 

[BritsKate]

BBM - has it ever been suggested that Reeva was scared of OP 24/7? Not by anyone here, I don't think. Text messages read out in court showed she was scared of him sometimes, not all the time. Most women who have been brutally murdered probably had odd occasional periods in between the abuse where things seemed 'normal'.

RBBM

Absolutely. If there weren't moments of 'normalcy' in abusive relationships, no one would ever stay. It's part of the manipulation - you think the worst is over, you believe him when he promises never again, and you dare to hope he loves you as much as you love him. It's just a ploy to keep you there, of course. An abuser's worst fear is losing control over their victim which is the very reason why people leaving such a relationship are at the highest risk of homicide.

JMO

 

[homegirl]

BBM

I'm not seeing the above bolded text messages in the attachment nor when I go to the NBC link. I only see text messages that have been read aloud in court.

The problem is that content is added to that page constantly, with the newest first. You have to go to the bottom of each page and hit the Load More button about six times, then scroll down. The messages are beneath this photo and headline. The others are ones that we heard read in court.



I saved that message some time ago. I did not post it because I thought it might lead to a lot of unproductive speculation. I kind of wish I hadn't posted it. We can't know what it means or if it is relevant at all.

 

[44ALLAN]

What was Dr. Stipp thinking when he entered OP's house that morning? Three adults, a dead woman and nobody had phoned an ambulance or the police. To make matters worse, somebody had collected bin bags, rope and tape. Something is just plain wrong here.

Nail on head IMO.

Bin bags rope and tape................summation from Nel should be interesting but I doubt he'll go there because he doesn't need to or he already would have..............it's already been inferred and the judge will not have missed it.

He's hoping the Standers will be called.................but I doubt it somehow
AIMVHO

 

[sorrell skye]

The problem is that content is added to that page constantly, with the newest first. You have to go to the bottom of each page and hit the Load More button about six times, then scroll down. The messages are beneath this photo and headline. The others are ones that we heard read in court.

View attachment 43287

I saved that message some time ago. I did not post it because I thought it might lead to a lot of unproductive speculation. I kind of wish I hadn't posted it. We can't know what it means or if it is relevant at all.

I appreciate your reply.

Since the author of the article didn't include a screenshot of the alleged text messages, the public can't determine if those texts actually exist.

The article gives a specific date pertaining to the texts. Although I'm skeptical, I'm inclined to believe the texts are real. I just find it odd that she would post screenshots of texts that were read aloud in court, but chose not to post screenshots of texts that the public has not heard about.

The author's bio states that she's an investigative producer for NBC. One would think she'd know better than to post titillating information regarding a high profile case without backing it up with hard evidence.

 

[toevlugsoord]

I think you know he could see her and he executed her.................the 1st sounds were not gunshots.............NO WAY!
The 3am'ish sounds were the angry bat strikes/kicks/punches etc that damaged the door/rest of the house etc enough for him to see her through the door.................that's why witnesses heard her screaming after this time.....................no other explanation whatsoever no matter how we look at it unfortunately
Also remember Johnson heard a mans voice calling help help help just after the woman called for help.............so Reeva was still alive when he did that!!!!
Chilling that testimony.

Original post by Britskate but somehow didn't paste correctly my apologies

RSBM
I also believe a lot leans towards bat first.
Why has the state not gone with shots first? Not enough of a case for it? I think it fits their case better.
(Also....literally CANNOT wait until the trial starts again! West Coast here so I'll be up late...starts at 12:30am here.)

 

[Interested Bystander]

The problem is that content is added to that page constantly, with the newest first. You have to go to the bottom of each page and hit the Load More button about six times, then scroll down. The messages are beneath this photo and headline. The others are ones that we heard read in court.

View attachment 43287

I saved that message some time ago. I did not post it because I thought it might lead to a lot of unproductive speculation. I kind of wish I hadn't posted it. We can't know what it means or if it is relevant at all.

Apparently YOU magazine are going to publish more of the conversations between RS and OP. There is a link below of one of the texts that was not read out in court.


http://mediaslutza.com/2014/04/04/you-10-april-2014

"There’s one stream in particular that I think will get people talking (for different reasons), and that is the sex-texts sent on 1 February 2014…"

I don't think we should be under any illusion that they did not have a fairly normal sex life. I think it would be false to think religion played any part in what they did or didn't do.

 

[BritsKate]

RSBM
I also believe a lot leans towards bat first.
Why has the state not gone with shots first? Not enough of a case for it? I think it fits their case better.
(Also....literally CANNOT wait until the trial starts again! West Coast here so I'll be up late...starts at 12:30am here.)

RBBM

How? There was screaming heard for approximately 10-15 minutes that the State contends was Reeva. Gunshots first mean Reeva couldn't have been screaming. The first bangs, shortly after 3am were only heard by 2 witnesses as opposed to all 5 who heard the bangs at 3:17am. And due to the severity of Reeva's injuries, it's unlikely if not completely impossible, she could have been alive any longer than a few minutes. Arterial spray below stairs makes the defence timeline absolutely impossible.

If anything the defence should have conceded shots at 3:17 because they still have to explain why no witnesses heard bangs when OP says he fired (Johnson was still hearing screaming); if bangs shortly after 3am were the shots, why Oscar waited so long to call netcare; and how Reeva defied all medical probability to have left arterial spray so long after being shot. Of course, if they did concede 3:17, they'd have to explain why Reeva was screaming for so long and Nel would be doing a happy dance on Masipa's bench, having proved premed BARD.

MOO

 

[homegirl]

I appreciate your reply.

Since the author of the article didn't include a screenshot of the alleged text messages, the public can't determine if those texts actually exist.

The article gives a specific date pertaining to the texts. Although I'm skeptical, I'm inclined to believe the texts are real. I just find it odd that she would post screenshots of texts that were read aloud in court, but chose not to post screenshots of texts that the public has not heard about.

The author's bio states that she's an investigative producer for NBC. One would think she'd know better than to post titillating information regarding a high profile case without backing it up with hard evidence.

That's a good point!

 

[Carmelita]

The problem is that content is added to that page constantly, with the newest first. You have to go to the bottom of each page and hit the Load More button about six times, then scroll down. The messages are beneath this photo and headline. The others are ones that we heard read in court.

View attachment 43287

I saved that message some time ago. I did not post it because I thought it might lead to a lot of unproductive speculation. I kind of wish I hadn't posted it. We can't know what it means or if it is relevant at all.

Hi Homegirl and thanks for the clarifying.

Attribute my questions to my curious mind.

I personally think the text is significant as it was little less than a month before Reeva was killed when she would have texted playfully with Oscar about shouting at him and he received it playfully.


As to speculation, I brought that up myself as there seems to be a lot of speculation here and I was told that is the way this forum rolls, people speculate about facts and theories, so why would it be wrong to speculate about that text in particular?

Thanks

 

[Cherwell]

Apparently YOU magazine are going to publish more of the conversations between RS and OP. There is a link below of one of the texts that was not read out in court.


http://mediaslutza.com/2014/04/04/you-10-april-2014

"There’s one stream in particular that I think will get people talking (for different reasons), and that is the sex-texts sent on 1 February 2014…"

I don't think we should be under any illusion that they did not have a fairly normal sex life. I think it would be false to think religion played any part in what they did or didn't do.

Well, the date is one reason why it might get people talking but I'm sure it's a typo (not yours, IB).

 

[toevlugsoord]

RBBM

How? There was screaming heard for approximately 10-15 minutes that the State contends was Reeva. Gunshots first mean Reeva couldn't have been screaming. The first bangs, shortly after 3am were only heard by 2 witnesses as opposed to all 5 who heard the bangs at 3:17am. And due to the severity of Reeva's injuries, it's unlikely if not completely impossible, she could have been alive any longer than a few minutes. Arterial spray below stairs makes the defence timeline absolutely impossible.

If anything the defence should have conceded shots at 3:17 because they still have to explain why no witnesses heard bangs when OP says he fired (Johnson was still hearing screaming); if bangs shortly after 3am were the shots, why Oscar waited so long to call netcare; and how Reeva defied all medical probability to have left arterial spray so long after being shot. Of course, if they did concede 3:17, they'd have to explain why Reeva was screaming for so long and Nel would be doing a happy dance on Masipa's bench, having proved premed BARD.

MOO

Oops - I'd meant why has the state not gone with bat first!

 

[lisasalinger]

Did OP say why Reeva would have gone to bed and left her jeans lying on the floor, especially given her description of him "incessantly picking on me"? I can't see her giving him reason to find fault with her.

Nel did point out to OP that everything else that Reeva owned at his house was neatly packed away - her overnight bag and the toiletry bag in the bathroom. The only thing out of place were her jeans which were inside out and just thrown on the floor, on top of the duvet... which had blood spatter on it, along with other blood spatter on the edge of the jeans and the carpet.

Of course, in true OP fashion, he claims to have no idea why her jeans were like that. Oh but, the duvet was definitely on the bed. :facepalm:

 

[BritsKate]

Oops - I'd meant why has the state not gone with bat first!

They did. On redirect, Nel asked Vermeulen if he could state that all the marks to the door were made after the shots. Vermeulen said he could not state a sequence definitively. Nel further asked if the bat may have been used to hit the door or if the door could have been kicked in order to scare someone prior to the shots. Vermeulen allowed for this possibility. It's definitely being suggested this may have been the first bangs.

Many here who feel Oscar is guilty believe something like this:
The bat was used to beat the door trying to intimidate Reeva into coming out or something like that. At some point a piece of the door may have been broken, allowing Oscar a visual of Reeva. He shot four times, changing his angle after the first shot - pause. And then, after the shooting, he picked up the cricket bat that was already there and used that in conjunction with upper body strength to pry/prise the panel from the door.

MOO

 

[shane13]

Rape is usually quite evident at the time of autopsy. I can't imagine that if true this would not have been brought up by Nel. You might not be able to see traumatic changes from initially consensual relations that got out of hand.

For absolutely no reason except my own hunch, I don't think they had 'sex' that evening, jmo.

A good point.

Alas the autopsy report prob. includes whether there was sex that night. But the people are denied the report. Which does not occur for the same crime committed by others in SA...

It would answer some things. If she did not have sex on V-day, it's unlikely IMO they were physically intimate. And again that could be--on V-day-what got an argument started.

Might even be why he had no gift for her.
She was a Christian as Nel raised, and maybe waited a long time. And they only had what 10 dates. Her private life and her public personna with the cheesy photos could have been very different things.

The autopsy report might settle this issue. But it doesn't look like that will be released. Maybe this aspect is even part of the reason for that?

ETA: OTOH, As I.B. above posted, they could have had a normal sex life too.

Of course OTOHA, if he viewed with a woman nearby wth a beautiful face and figure...again questions.

 

[DebinGA]

Nel did point out to OP that everything else that Reeva owned at his house was neatly packed away - her overnight bag and the toiletry bag in the bathroom. The only thing out of place were her jeans which were inside out and just thrown on the floor, on top of the duvet... which had blood spatter on it, along with other blood spatter on the edge of the jeans and the carpet.

Of course, in true OP fashion, he claims to have no idea why her jeans were like that. Oh but, the duvet was definitely on the bed. :facepalm:

Roux will have to get that duvet off the floor and the jeans and fan off the duvet. I hope whatever sacrificial lamb is tasked with showing that is being paid very well, because his reputation may go the way of Dixon's.

 

[kittychi]

A good point.

Alas the autopsy report prob. includes whether there was sex that night. But the people are denied the report. Which does not occur for the same crime committed by others in SA...

It would answer some things. If she did not have sex on V-day, it's unlikely IMO they were physically intimate. And again that could be--on V-day-what got an argument started.

Might even be why he had no gift for her.
She was a Christian as Nel raised, and maybe waited a long time. And they only had what 10 dates. Her private life and her public personna with the cheesy photos could have been very different things.

The autopsy report might settle this issue. But it doesn't look like that will be released. Maybe this aspect is even part of the reason for that?

ETA: OTOH, As I.B. above posted, they could have had a normal sex life too.

Of course OTOHA, if he viewed with a woman nearby wth a beautiful face and figure...again questions.

Back to square one on the Oscar Speak/Oscar Think game board. :abnormal:

 

[crasshopper]

A good point.

Alas the autopsy report prob. includes whether there was sex that night. But the people are denied the report. Which does not occur for the same crime committed by others in SA...

It would answer some things. If she did not have sex on V-day, it's unlikely IMO they were physically intimate. And again that could be--on V-day-what got an argument started.

Might even be why he had no gift for her.
She was a Christian as Nel raised, and maybe waited a long time. And they only had what 10 dates. Her private life and her public personna with the cheesy photos could have been very different things.

The autopsy report might settle this issue. But it doesn't look like that will be released. Maybe this aspect is even part of the reason for that?

ETA: OTOH, As I.B. above posted, they could have had a normal sex life too.

Of course OTOHA, if he viewed with a woman nearby wth a beautiful face and figure...again questions.

Hello Shane,
I agree on many of these points, especially

BIB1- Although potentially disturbing, I think the Steenkamp's stand a much better chance at uncovering the truth had they supported the disclosure of the autopsy results. It is quite possible that they want to conceal the nature of any sexual contact that evening but I just can't see Nel leaving it out...unless at the family's request or if stipulated.

BIB2 - Never occurred to me that they had been on so few dates but considering when they reportedly became involved this is possible. Things could have also moved pretty quickly like a lot of relationships. I wonder how many times she spent the night at his place.

I, personally, think it was really early for Reeva to tell him she loved him...jmo