Peru - Stephany Flores, 21, murdered in Lima hotel room, 30 May 2010 #18

[hollyblue]

Huh? I don't get this post. Is it directed at me? My post is basically asking for what you are saying that is for the conspiracy theorists to explain/answer the non conspiracy theorists questions for the sake of logic.

I was basically agreeing with you....that answers to the questions asked by others-- be answered-- but since we weren't going to get that, the conspiracy theory should be moot. Sorry the prior post was not clear.

 

[Chanler]

I don't think it was so much that he was a judge in waiting as much as it was their interviews and in my opinion their callous attitudes toward the Holloways and Twitty's.JMO

Hi, McDraw. The Van Der Sloots parents gave very few interviews, They were much less numerous and much less influential than the interviews that the bereaved Holloways gave. And, in fact, the most frequently mentioned indications of Van Der Sloot callousness come not from their interviews, but from Holloway summaries of their few encounters, which I think have to be read through the prism of their quite understandable emotions. The families were in intrinsically incompatible positions; both were terribly, viciously slandered.

 

[passionflower]

What would make Joran to dispise women so bad to lead to murder???

 

[hollyblue]

Started this a bit ago and then got sidetracked. Its not great quality but it will serve the purpose:

apologies to r a d a r

TY. It looks like there is no sink or shower....only a commode?

 

[cat thief]

I'm also glad they were released. I have to admit I didn't want to see them, but figured it's a must, to really understand what happened to Stephany. Her death really looks like "overkill" to me. Why the brutality?

The crime scene photos seem to be of such poor quality, my guess is someone took pictures of the pictures with a cell phone or something.

These photos were not officially released.

 

[suzihawk]

Hi, SuziHawk, you're right to bring up the Greta video, which I forgot about until after I posted. The tape was made less than two months before Paulus died of a sudden heart attack. If Paulus and his wife somehow supported that cruel fabrication by Joran, I have yet to hear of it. More likely, it helped kill him.

The Van der Straaten "godfather and best friend" mantra has been repeated and repeated and repeated, just like the false claim that Paulus was a judge, but is it true? That the two knew each other for years seems true, but how did the friendship help him: Joran faced multiple extended interrogations not once, but twice by Aruban, Dutch, and FBI officials. Paulus himself was brought in. In comprehensiveness, the investigation put to shame the vast majority of homicide investigations in Natalee's home state. All of which, by the way, was in the wake of Paulus not receiving the judgeship that he had come halfway around the world to get. All the dark talk of a Dutch/Aruban fix is based on the idea that our gut convictions should be enacted directly in legal systems.

The interview with Greta was in 2008, IIRC. Paulus died in February of this year. That's two years, not two months. I'm sure AVDS and PVDS were not happy about it. However, I saw no evidence that they withdrew their support because of it.

The close friendship between Van de Straaten (Chief of Police) and Van der Sloot was well known and well documented and never denied by either one of them, as far as I know.

In the article with Anita just today, she says:

"Joran was once a nice guy. He was two when my husband Paul to Aruba and got a job as a judge on the island we went live." :waitasec:

http://translate.google.com/translate?js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=1&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.rssonline.nl%2Frel_5389724_joran-bekende-alleen-om-uitlevering.aspx&sl=nl&tl=en

Actually, it was my understanding that he was a "judge in training", which he never received the full judgeship (as you pointed out above). Reasons were never disclosed, which I find curious.

I could get into all the reasons I believe the authorites were/are corrupt and the reasons anything related to the investigation was delayed, stalled and covered up in this case, but it will take much longer than I'm able to do this evening. To make it short and sweet for now, I'll just say it had everything to do with nepotism and tourism.

 

[Kat]

I am thinking that picture 15, might be the blood in the hallway.

http://www.cbsnews.com/2300-504083_162-10003848-15.html?tag=page;previous

Nora, maybe I'm looking at that wrong but to me in pic # 15 to the far left of the picture it looks like wood. Then directly in front of the carpet where it looks like tile, I'm seeing it as the tile on the wall. Because in picture 16 I do not see anything that is close enough to be the wood we see in picture #15.

You can also see carpet meeting tile on the walls in pic #1 and pic #7. In pic #8 we see her legs laying over carpet up against a tile wall.

Just trying to figure it out.

 

[KR2tonenow]

http://drlillianglass.com/body-lang...ed-to-confess-and-continues-to-play-“victim”/

Did L. Glass actually write this? I don't blame AVDS. Enabling is not good, but I bet he ruled the roost in that home.

 

[Sanny]

What would make Joran to dispise women so bad to lead to murder???

He might very well have been watching how his father treats(ed) his mother.
I think he idolized him and was so much closer to him than to Anita.
From what Melody stated, he began to lie to her regarding his cheating issues.
This may have been around the same time that Joran began or was hitting the casinos. He had the unlimited credit line from his dad to gamble and to drink all done underage I might add.
Why would his father do this for him? Why? Did Joran hold something over Paulus' head.....or was it Joran's uncontrollable temper that must've been shown to the entire family if he didn't get his own way. So....they gave in to his whims.
Instead of dealing with his violent temper, they chose to ignore it and give him what he wanted....whenever he wanted it.

AIMO

 

[TwiceIrish]

NG back to Jean. Reading more from the psych evaluation. Deficient social conscience, constantly looking for new experiences that allow him to feel stimulated.

Tom Shamshak, former police chief: cold hearted psychopaths pursue immediate gratification at expense of others; profile consistent with past behavior; and his behavior that has been captured on camera.

Dr. Lillian Glass: gets high from doing things out of the normal realm of society.

Ray: psychopathic poker player is coming out and he'll fight this all the way.

NG talking to Doug about this going before 3 seasoned judges instead of a jury; not the time to roll the dice. Doug is saying Joran has no hand to play! Doug also repeating what Peruvian president said about not extraditing Joran anywhere until Peru has tried him.

NG to Victoria about Joran dressing Stephany in his shirt, she can't understand why he would do that. V saying he was trying to clean up and dispose of the body in a suitcase, so he would've (wanted to) taken everything out together.

on to another topic.....the end

I really hope at least one of the judges is a woman.

 

[georger]

Jwarner, I don't know what photos you are looking at but I CLEARLY see gloves on # 6 - blue jeans pic, #10 & 11 - Tennis Shoes pics, and # 13 - travel bag pic.

What are you seeing?

You are correct. I was looking at a photo which had the glove drawn so
tight it looked like no gloves but now I see gloves, in fact one photo shows several techs in the background both wearing gloves ...

I am very glad for this because I want no basis for appeals! That was my
concern...

 

[danielabc]

Are the Peruvians tall people.......JVDS reported to be at least 6 ft 5.

No, the average Peruvian man is short (like 5'4 - 5'5).

FWIW, the pic of Stephany's foot that shows the greenish bruising (healing bruises) shows bruises exactly in the same spot that my youngest daughter always has bruising on her feet from practicing footwork. Soccer. Another member brought that up but I can't remember who, I agree with that poster that it's a distinct possibility. JMHO.

Yes, I read that she practiced Soccer and played for her University. I don't know how often she practiced or how serious she was about it, but I think it's a possibility.

I noticed in the pictures that the coffee cups were from Hollys Coffee... it's a Starbucks-like coffee shop (it's a Korean franchise) and the shop is 2 blocks away from the hotel (map here)... I passed by Holly's this afternoon.
I had guessed that VDS didn't go to Wong because Wong opens at 9am, but thought that maybe he got the coffee from the gas station store.

When Joran first confessed I think we read that confessing would lower the maximum sentence? If the confession is thrown away and he's found guilty anyway, would he ge eligible for a higher maximum sentence?

 

[KR2tonenow]

What would make Joran to dispise women so bad to lead to murder???

Look at some of these husbands that kill their wives and children. They appear normal, hardworking then BAM! I think its part of of the sociopathic personality. Some men get off over the power over women. Clearly JVDS has rage and control issues big time.

 

[Sanny]

Did L. Glass actually write this? I don't blame AVDS. Enabling is not good, but I bet he ruled the roost in that home.

Yes Dr. Glass wrote her assessment on Joran.
I can absolutely see why AVDS would be afraid of Joran's temper when he didn't get whatever he wanted.

He needed medical help long before NH disappeared and now AVDS says he was due to go prior to leaving Aruba for Peru?
I'd like to see the medical facility information where Joran may have or was registered for care. Once I see that, then I will believe he was supposed to go there. Until then.....nope......this is coming out too late for me to believe.

 

[Kat]

The crime scene photos seem to be of such poor quality, my guess is someone took pictures of the pictures with a cell phone or something.

These photos were not officially released.

They were leaked by someone close to the investigation is what I read reported.

If you look at the one's posted on radaronline (which I just looked at myself just right now) you will see that radaronline has a clear picture of the shoes with a gloved CSI tech holding them up as pic # 12. The CBS link shows the exact same picture of poorer quality as their #12. The other pictures are different though. JMHO.

 

[epiphany]

Which begs the question, did Joran's mental process think...hmm, Stephany's blood is all over my shirt, so maybe if I place it on her body they won't know it's my shirt?!?

Crazier than crazy trying to figure out the mind of a murderer.

Could be why my husband is so creeped out that I follow some of these cases so closely. LOL

:floorlaugh:

 

[ziggy]

I think pic 15 is looking down at the carpet after she'd been removed: decomp from where she had the most injuries - head and face. That looks like the area between the wall and the bed taken from the bed with the wood being the nightstand.

 

[georger]

I read your previous post, looking at the crime scene photos as I was reading through it, and came to this conclusion also. Seeing Joran wearing the shirt in the hotel video, it seems large even for him....so I can't imagine Stephany actually wearing it without having the sleeves rolled up quite a bit, assuming she would even have a reason to have it on. MOO

I will reply to this it bring it up to date: Joran now says in an interview he
lifted Steph up post mortem and slide his shirt over her. (he had no
explanation why).

But I have a new concern. Her legs drawn up fetal post mortem. If Joran
thought she was dead when he pulled her up and placed his shirt on her,
then placed her back down to the floor, I seriously doubt her legs were
drawn up at that point. So, was she really dead? Or did she die later
even after he left ... pulling her legs up in death pose at that point?
(Its not easy thinking about these things...)

 

[KR2tonenow]

Yes Dr. Glass wrote her assessment on Joran.
I can absolutely see why AVDS would be afraid of Joran's temper when he didn't get whatever he wanted.

He needed medical help long before NH disappeared and now AVDS says he was due to go prior to leaving Aruba for Peru?
I'd like to see the medical facility information where Joran may have or was registered for care. Once I see that, then I will believe he was supposed to go there. Until then.....nope......this is coming out too late for me to believe.

Its funny you say this because when I read the article from the Dutch newspaper, I thought the same thing. Maybe she gave JVDS an ultimatum. I think his mental instability has been apparent since his adolescence -
Adolescence (from [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latin_language"]Latin[/ame]: adolescere meaning "to grow up") is a transitional stage of physical and mental human development that occurs between [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Childhood"]childhood[/ame] and [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adulthood"]adulthood[/ame]. This transition involves biological (i.e. [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puberty"]pubertal[/ame]), social, and psychological changes, though the biological or physiological ones are the easiest to measure objectively.

 

[Sanny]

Look at some of these husbands that kill their wives and children. They appear normal, hardworking then BAM! I think its part of of the sociopathic personality. Some men get off over the power over women. Clearly JVDS has rage and control issues big time.

I think his rage & control issues may have started after Melody and he broke up. She said he was cheating and lying to her.....he said Relationships are based on trust.....this is really something coming from a liar.

I consider Melody one of Joran's LUCKY ONES who got away from his anger and controlling.......which actually hadn't surfaced then but was forming.

Poor Stephany saw that Rage & Anger first hand. It was probably the last thing she saw as she died in room 309