GUILTY PLEA DEAL ACCEPTED - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #111

[Chimera]

I agree 100%. I was an Ann Rule reader. I was fortunate enough to exchange a few emails with her. She always wanted to do right by the victims. Ted Bundy really bothered her. BTK book took so much out of her. KR to me seems like she wants to profit and see where she went wrong. I won't read her book. imho

Awww... I miss Anne Rule, read quite a few of her books back in the day !!
So sad how she ended up in her final years.

Not as familiar with KR but might pick up some of her books at the library or purchase second hand.
Imo.

 

[pittsburghgirl]

Also, what if the victims' parents, who all appear to have different perspectives on the pleas, and the Life In Prison (LIP, saying it this way since I'm not sure about no parole being a given) versus the DP, implore the judge to hand out a different type of sentence for their own child versus the others?

I'm not sure what you mean. The "fixed sentence" means "life without parole." That's the plea deal. It's likely to be the sentence the judge hands down. There is no way that one murder will get a different sentence than the other 3. What BK did is one crime with 4 counts of first-degree murder. One murder is not worse than the other.

The judge's job in any case is to sentence a criminal within the penalties that apply to that crime. For example, grand theft auto in my state carries a sentence up to 7 years and a fine as high as $15,000. The judge considers factors such as prior criminal history, whether the car was taken by force (carjacking, using a gun, etc.) in determining the severity of the sentence. For a low value vehicle and a first offender, the sentence can be as low as probation.

This case does not present a lot of leeway in sentencing. Four first degree murder charges in Idaho would get either life imprisonment or the death penalty. With DP off the table in the plea deal, he's going to get the 4 fixed sentences, consecutive, with the burglary maximum on top of that. It's not that things can't go sideways--see the Pike County Ohio case, for what happens when a new judge gets the case. But we have one judge, Judge Hippler, who does not color outside the lines. This is a heinous crime and BK is a danger to the public. He'll be put away for life.

 

[Arkay]

Using his drawings, letters, interviews, and Rader’s unique codes, she presents in meticulous detail the childhood roots and development of one man’s motivation to stalk, torture, and kill. She reveals aspects of the dark motivations of this most famous of living serial killers that have never before been revealed. In this book Katherine Ramsland presents an intelligent, original, and rare glimpse into the making of a serial killer and the potential darkness that lives next door."

This may be true, as I haven’t read the book. Yet, IMO, if the purported outcome here is to provide “rare glimpses” into “the potential darkness that lives next door,” clearly her antennae failed her when in contact with Bryan.

It does give me vibes that she felt tricked, or fooled as she stated, and she now has a personal quest to unravel why she didn’t pick up on any clues. Maybe for her own ego and reputation, maybe not.

I agree 100%. I was an Ann Rule reader. I was fortunate enough to exchange a few emails with her. She always wanted to do right by the victims. Ted Bundy really bothered her. BTK book took so much out of her. KR to me seems like she wants to profit and see where she went wrong. I won't read her book. imho

I’d never heard of Ramsland before Bryan. I don’t know if in this particular case, she’s just an ambulance chaser, despite her pedigree in authoring a book and having important papers published in her field.

Also I agree with those who say he’s not fond of women, so if he allows Dr. R to interview him, there is something he feels he will gain by it. He needed her before because he had to obtain a good grade. He needed AT to help him walk free.

What need does he have for Dr. R now? I can only presume to keep his name in the pantheon of notorious killers.

I much prefer he fades into obscurity.

JMO

 

[zachs mema]

Anger, yes. Violence against them, no! The way that he can make an impact if he feels wronged is to seek a legal recall of the judge.

I had a very good friend that was murdered. The pain that it caused everyone was pain that could not be fathomed. His wife and children have never been the same. The person has not been caught, if he/she was caught, I assure you they would feel the same. His wife had a stroke very young after this. The grief was so strong, it still is. I will not condemn or judge anyone wanting the ultimate punishment. She fought in her life to live, he's fighting for her in her death. just my humble opinion.

 

[zachs mema]

Awww... I miss Anne Rule, read quite a few of her books back in the day !!
So sad how she ended up in her final years.

Not as familiar with KR but might pick up some of her books at the library or purchase second hand.
Imo.

I miss her too If you have kindle unlimited, you can get a few of her books as well. I used to be a book in hand person, but as I get older I can change the font lol.

 

[maskedwoman]

I agree. I think the reason that Kohlberger pled was because his defense attorney had a "Come to Jesus" moment with him and told him that they no longer had any valid defense for the case. She tried everything. And that if he didn't plea, he stood a very real chance of getting the Death Penalty.

I agree. And what sticks in my craw is remembering AT saying "Brian didn't kill anyone". This is where my childlike sense of fairness comes in to play. My adult side understands that her job is to defend him. My inner child think it's totally crap that it's okay for her to say that in court when, based on latest events, she couldn't really have believed that.

 

[Rolypolyoly]

The Morphew case appears much different than what was going on with BK. SM may have feared BM toward the end but I doubt she felt that way for their entire 25 year marriage. As for BK, it appears a lot of posters on here, myself included, found him to be creepy right away. JMOO

I think we all thought he was creepy when we saw his picture after his arrest, but I also think that we were biased by knowing what the stood accused of at the time.
He has a very intense state, especially for the camera, and that is what I think makes him look so off, im just not sure e if we were to come across him as some random face on the street that we would feel it so strongly.

I do also think that any conversation with him would give off a vibe, possibly more awkward than serial killer at first impression though.

 

[Sachi]

This may be true, as I haven’t read the book. Yet, IMO, if the purported outcome here is to provide “rare glimpses” into “the potential darkness that lives next door,” clearly her antennae failed her when in contact with Bryan.

It does give me vibes that she felt tricked, or fooled as she stated, and she now has a personal quest to unravel why she didn’t pick up on any clues. Maybe for her own ego and reputation, maybe not.



I’d never heard of Ramsland before Bryan. I don’t know if in this particular case, she’s just an ambulance chaser, despite her pedigree in authoring a book and having important papers published in her field.

Also I agree with those who say he’s not fond of women, so if he allows Dr. R to interview him, there is something he feels he will gain by it. He needed her before because he had to obtain a good grade. He needed AT to help him walk free.

What need does he have for Dr. R now? I can only presume to keep his name in the pantheon of notorious killers.

I much prefer he fades into obscurity.

JMO

This

 

[Tragg]

As an aside, I was also surprised to hear Ramsland say she thought he'd had great potential. Like you, I don't think he's very smart. A diligent & obsessive student, sure.

RSBM. Intelligence can take many forms, and I am sure Ramsland was referring to academic potential which leans to linguistic and mathematical forms.

What Kohberger lacked for his murder project was intrapersonal and interpersonal forms of intelligence, and more importantly cunning: instinctive skill in achieving one's ends by deceit - street smarts. But maybe that's what you meant!

 

[Ghostwheel]

I imagine it has already been said, but IMO coiffing those furry eyebrows so heavily prior to and in the lead up to the trial speaks of ‘consciousness of guilt’. MOO

I thought it quite an odd thing. He was pleading guilty. What did it matter? I'm guilty, but I don't have bushy eyebrows?

 

[Arkay]

I thought it quite an odd thing. He was pleading guilty. What did it matter? I'm guilty, but I don't have bushy eyebrows?

Same.

For me, all the evidence, which was quite significant, is past-tense now.

He pled guilty to all charges.

It may satisfy us emotionally or intellectually to have every last detail be addressed, but as vital as the evidence was earlier, the case has been proven by BK’s admission of guilt in all facets of this crime.

Just my opinion. I know others feel differently.

 

[pittsburghgirl]

I agree that it’s much more likely that BK didn’t see DM. I always thought the Good Vibes sign must have blinded him from seeing her as he made his way from Xana’s bedroom.

I only considered the possibility that BK could see DM, yet inexplicably leave her alive, after reading the bushy eyebrow court document, in which DM herself insists BK looked right at her. Of course, DM thinking he saw her doesn’t mean it’s true.



I agree that the two Indiana traffic stops seem suspicious, but LE explained it plausibly (Indiana pulled over out-of-state drivers to see if they were transporting drugs). We also know that LE doesn’t have to tell the truth outside of court or court docs. The only reason I believe what LE said is that sending two separate uniformed officers to encounter BK alone seems too dangerous. If the FBI were following BK (which I think far more likely), they were probably freaking out when they saw BK being pulled over twice in quick succession.

Like most everything else in this case, we only know what we’re told in court documents, or in court hearings. And a lot of that may have been challenged during the trial.

So really all we know is what BK admitted to be true during the plea hearing—which is not a lot more than we learned after reading the PCA.

So we spend time here weaving different theories that fit what we do know.



With respect to the slider, @iamshadow21 made a good point that such doors are easily opened, regardless of whether they are locked. There are ways to improve the security of such sliders, but as iamshadow21 reminded us, the students living at 1122 King Road and across Moscow thought they were safe. Until BK took their innocence away.



Yes! Soon, soon.

The FBI had Kohberger under surveillance. No need to risk LE lives stopping him. Source--Newsweek

 

[Boxer]

The FBI had Kohberger under surveillance. No need to risk LE lives stopping him. Source--Newsweek

Turns out it looks like ISP and Sheriffs do randomly stop cars to evaluate them for drug trafficking.
Maybe BKs obvious discomfort caused a second stop.

 

[pittsburghgirl]

Turns out it looks like ISP and Sheriffs do randomly stop cars to evaluate them for drug trafficking.
Maybe BKs obvious discomfort caused a second stop.

And it turns out he's a stupid driver who follows too closely and stops in crosswalks (which we do have in PA). Just another indicator that he's not as smart as he thinks he is. A person who has just committed 4 horrible, notorious murders should not make mistakes driving across country.

 

[NavySubMom]

His trial appearance would have been irrelevant. All the prosecutor had to do was to show the selfie photo with his bushy brows and it would have matched the surviving roommates description of him. Suspects change their appearance in court all the time to appear more sympathetic to a jury. It's allowed. Probably his lawyer was allowed to bring the razor into jail for him to shave his brows.

You seem to be 100% positive his trial appearance would be irrelevant.
However, The Judge stated D.M.’s testimony about his eyebrows is highly relevant.

his “bushy eyebrows” were the important and relevant subject of several Motions and Orders.
I was asking because his eyebrows are the positive identifying evidence of Kohberger being the person seen creeping around the murder house, on the night of the crime, therefore identifying him as the murderer.

Usually, once something is identified as evidence , it cannot be tampered with, gotten rid of , or altered. Kohberger altered that eyebrow identification evidence. It changed his appearance. If the actual evidence can be physically submitted, it is always better than a photograph. He has had those eyebrows his whole life. I feel it is safe to say, this was the first time in his whole life, he drastically just about shaved off his eyebrows. He did it on purpose, to change his look. And they are important evidence , the actual subject of several written Motions and Orders.
I understand photographs can be used as evidence.

Quoting:

“In a series of orders announced Friday on motions from both sides in the murder case against Idaho student stabbings suspect Bryan Kohberger, the judge said there was no basis to grant a defense request that the lone eyewitness be blocked from mentioning the "bushy eyebrows" she saw on a masked intruder during the murders.

"D.M.'s testimony about ‘bushy eyebrows’ is highly relevant in this case," Judge Steven Hippler wrote in his order, using the witness's initials. "D.M. is the only eyewitness to the intruder responsible for the homicides. It is the jury's task to determine whether Defendant is that person."

MOO

 

[Dotta]

And it turns out he's a stupid driver who follows too closely and stops in crosswalks (which we do have in PA). Just another indicator that he's not as smart as he thinks he is. A person who has just committed 4 horrible, notorious murders should not make mistakes driving across country.

It seems to me
he is "a Law unto himself".
And does as whatever fancy takes him.
Mostly "living in his head", detached from the world.

That is my view of this criminal.

JMO

 

[gremlin444]

Things that I don't expect to be released once the non dissemination order is lifted after sentencing, from what's happened in other cases:

--detailed autopsy reports/photos--general summaries of the reports might be allowed. Thinking of Richard Allen case where the girls' autopsies were sealed after sentencing.
--crime scene photos that show the victims in place
--any of the reports created by the defense team's mitigation experts that would have been used in the sentencing phase.....family histories, medical histories, school discipline history

I also expect a fair bit of redaction. Anything that might allow people to identify the Doordash driver is one that pops immediately to mind. Specific names of students and professors at WSU who were interviewed as to his behavior pre and post murder.

 

[NottaYutz]

The only other drawing toy I can remember from all those DECADES ago is Etch A Sketch.

That would be useless in trying to draw eyebrows because it frustratingly only drew horizontal and vertical lines.

I don’t think there is any gadget in the universe capable of making BK appear harmless. It oozes out of him, IMO.

There was Hairdo Harriet but I think she came much, much later.

 

[Sundog]

We can't be both disappointed that the plea deal did not include allocution and disappointed that serious authors are interested in providing the insight we crave into BK's actions and motivations.

Ramsland's BTK book contained the killer's verbatim statements, but I don't think she can fairly be described as his "mouthpiece". And while Rader didn't get anything out of it but a chance to tell his story, 75 percent of the proceeds went to his victims' families. She took years to research and write the book.

<modsnip: No link to quote from book review>

Blum, a former reporter with two Pulitzer Prize nominations (one for coverage of this very case), is also a serious crime writer: his American Lightning - about the bombing of the Los Angeles Times building in 1910 - earned an Edgar Allen Poe Award in the category, Best Fact Crime.

Either would do a decent job if given the opportunity IMO, but Blum would be more inclined to look for commercial success while these murders remain a subject of public fascination: Ramsland would be going for scrupulous accuracy and attention to detail: a portrait of BK's inner life. She would take as long as it takes to do that, and she'd be my choice if a choice is made.

Very well said, IMO.

 

[Sundog]

What need does he have for Dr. R now? I can only presume to keep his name in the pantheon of notorious killers.

<snipped for focus>

I think this says it all, as far as what BK's motivations would be to work with Ramsland.