GUILTY PLEA DEAL ACCEPTED - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #112

[Chimera]

That would be terrible. I hope we are misunderstanding.

Agreed 100 %.

 

[Arkay]

I’m completely confounded. I am certain we heard the judge stipulate that BK is waiving his right to appeal.

As to the potential for ineffective counsel, I don’t see how he could go that route. At the hearing Hippler asked him point-blank questions regarding whether he felt his counsel represented him well, and he said “yes.”

As to AT, I’m eager to see the back of her. Bye-bye soon, I hope.

JMO

 

[Dotta]

So....

If I understand correctly
(mind you, I'm not an English native speaker )

DP is off the table
but
Right to appeal still stays???



I wonder what Kaylee's Dad thinks about it?

 

[BUF]

From what I am reading via a Google search, an appeal might be allowed under the following circumstances:

• Ineffective assistance of counsel
• Lack of knowing & voluntary plea (coerced into plea agreement)
• Violation of plea agreement

Not a lawyer but I feel those chances of occurring, if applicable to ID law, are slim to none. I wouldn’t worry too much. JH is likely being wise & safe for the time being.

MOO

Yes. This is the case the judge brought up about the appeal (Garza v ID). From what I remember from the plea hearing, Hippler was pretty thorough asking Kohberger to answer specific questions with his simple yes/no answers and covered these concerns.

https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/18pdf/17-1026_2c83.pdf

 

[MTW2011]

I hope that we have an appellate attorney from Idaho who can clarify this. I saw an attorney on TV that we all know saying that there is, perhaps, the possibility that he could raise ineffective assistance of counsel between now and sentencing to appeal. Sounds like they need to be sure they dot every I and cross every T between now and the sentencing is vital. Therefore, I think the judge made the prudent decision because what is the sense of blowing it all up over waiting just another six days? I think after sentencing, he cannot appeal.

But I would like to hear from an appellate attorney, the difference between keeping the record sealed until after sentencing versus not, and more importantly, does he still have the right to appeal anything that happened up until his sentencing? That doesn't seem to make sense. In other words, once we get to sentencing next week, at that point, aren't all of his appellate options off the table?

Anyone questioning that this plea deal wasn't a good maneuver just needs to look at what's happening with this right now. Anne Taylor is one hell of an attorney and you can only imagine how many tricks she had up her sleeve by the time four months of a trial went by.

I’m not an appellate attorney from Idaho, but I can say he absolutely can appeal after sentencing.

Some of Taylor’s previous cases have moved forward on appeal, arguing some of the very same arguments at issue in the case Judge Hippler mentioned today. That case he mentioned went its all the way to the US Supreme Court, that case is Garza v. Idaho. Should it come to it, it certainly helps Kohberger that this is a US Supreme Court case, as that sets precedent over all the states. Can see more of the specific case here: Garza v. Idaho - Wikipedia

I personally feel bad for any who felt that his plea deal made any appeals a “done” deal, because they are likely in for some disappointing news with this serial . Yes, appeals are very limited on what issues and types of issues can be raised but his plea deal doesn’t mean he is not allowed to try. Yes, this deal saved the victims’ families from the unknowns of death penalty related appeals, but that’s really it. JMOO.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

Concerning Hippler continuing to blah blah about an appeal, he needs to stop that. It’s confusing things and upsetting people.
How I see it, the waiver doesn’t remove BK’s right to appeal says the judge. That always and forevermore exists. However, once an appeals court sees his signed signature on a valid document declaring his guilt and waiving any appeals, they will dismiss it.
I am not concerned.
However, if he starts appealing things, the State of Idaho needs to immediately re-invoke the death penalty.

 

[Miss Poovy]

I’m not an appellate attorney from Idaho, but I can say he absolutely can appeal after sentencing.

Some of Taylor’s previous cases have moved forward on appeal, arguing some of the very same arguments at issue in the case Judge Hippler mentioned today. That case he mentioned went its all the way to the US Supreme Court, that case is Garza v. Idaho. Should it come to it, it certainly helps Kohberger that this is a US Supreme Court case, as that sets precedent over all the states. Can see more of the specific case here: Garza v. Idaho - Wikipedia

I personally feel bad for any who felt that his plea deal made any appeals a “done” deal, because they are likely in for some disappointing news with this serial . Yes, appeals are very limited on what issues and types of issues can be raised but his plea deal doesn’t mean he is not allowed to try. Yes, this deal saved the victims’ families from the unknowns of death penalty related appeals, but that’s really it. JMOO.

In states where the death penalty is approved, you see appeals against the LWOP plea deals (done deal) occasionally. It may be messier & more drawn out than the regular appeals process, or at least it seems that way.

 

[LMDlong]

What does this mean?

I wondering if it means he can appeal the gag order?
IMO I don’t think he can appeal his deal . Can he appeal the decision on the gag order?

 

[LMDlong]

Concerning Hippler continuing to blah blah about an appeal, he needs to stop that. It’s confusing things and upsetting people.
How I see it, the waiver doesn’t remove BK’s right to appeal sanity the judge. That always and forevermore exists. However, once an appeals court sees his signed signature on a valid document declaring his guilt and waiving any appeals, they will dismiss it.
I am not concerned.
However, if he starts appealing things, the State of Idaho needs to immediately re-invoke the death penalty.

I agree

 

[StarryStarryNight]

I wondering if it means he can appeal the gag order?
IMO I don’t think he can appeal his deal . Can he appeal the decision on the gag order?

I think today, any talk of appeals was concerning mostly what sealed things can be unsealed and the gag order.

 

[gremlin444]

The US Supreme Court in Garza v. Idaho confirmed that appeal waivers in plea agreements do not entirely end a defendant’s appeal rights.

That case clarifies the circumstances in which a defendant may use their right to appeal despite a waivers:

• An appeal waiver based on a plea agreement can only affect the claims specified in the agreement, not those outside its scope. A defendant can file an appeal if the subject of the appeal is outside the scope of the waiver.
• If the prosecution breaches the plea deal, the defendant can appeal any claim, including those previously waived. (which wouldn't happen here because the prosecution isn't going to suddenly recommend death
• Waivers must be made ‘knowingly and voluntarily’ with a complete understanding of the consequences. A defendant could challenge the validity of a waiver in appeal if these factors did not exist when they agreed to the waiver. CLEARLY MET AND VERIFIED AT THE PLEA HEARING
• Criminal defendants have the right to effective assistance of trial counsel based on the Sixth Amendment. A defendant could file an appeal despite a waiver if denied this right. HIPPLER VERIFIED BK'S SATISFACTION WITH HIS COUNSEL UNDER OATH AT THE PLEA HEARING

 

[cottonweaver]

Exactly, not cool. Look what Chapan's said the other day...

Ethan Chapin's Parents React to Bryan Kohberger's Guilty Plea | Court TV Video Ethan Chapin's Parents React to Bryan Kohberger's Guilty Plea

Defense attorney Skye Lazarro just said ( on Surviving Survivor) that BK has the right to appeal his sentence ! IDK how reliable she is - she's from a different state - but just saying....

If she's right, that appeal period - with respect to unsealing docs - could be many months? ! A formality? Irritating nonetheless.

 

[Arkay]

I wonder what Kaylee's Dad thinks about it?

I literally worry for his well-being.

I hope that as a layperson I am just misconstruing some legal blah blah, and of course I have no clue as to Idaho’s finer points of law.

It sure sounded, however, as though any and all appeals were off the table.

For the Goncalves family, if they are interpreting this as Bryan will indeed be able to appeal, I sincerely hope they have an advocate, or multiple advocates, to explicate the meaning of this, as well as to endure their anguish in a way that brings one degree at least of peace.

Also peace and advocacy for all the families, because most of them seemed very relieved that he allegedly couldn’t appeal.

JMO

 

[MTW2011]

I literally worry for his well-being.

I hope that as a layperson I am just misconstruing some legal blah blah, and of course I have no clue as to Idaho’s finer points of law.

It sure sounded however, as though any and all appeals were off the table.

For the Goncalves family, if they are interpreting this as Bryan will indeed be able to appeal, I sincerely hope they have an advocate, or multiple advocates, to explicate the meaning of this, as well as to endure their anguish in a way that brings one degree at least of peace.

Also peace and advocates for all the families, because most of them seemed very relieved that he allegedly couldn’t appeal.

JMO

Unfortunately that’s just not the case. Even with a waiver, the highest court in the USA has said there are some

and JMOO - but the State knew this and just judging by the talk on social media after the plea and today, it seems like many believed any and all future appeals were off the table. The State didn’t (understandably) go out of their way to say that wasn’t the case. I can only hope that the families were advised of this ahead of today but I’m honestly not sure. Heck, they didn’t even have BK sign the Written Factual Basis with the correct month and date on it. I know it’s a minor thing but still.

I hope the families weren’t finding out this news with the rest of the public today. They really deserve better. JMOO.

 

[INfisherman]

JH was being thorough in his mentioning of the appeal. As mentioned before, Garza v. Idaho may be the key behind his words. I’m not worried. BK will spend life in prison, barring new evidence or a major screw up comes to light in the future.

….Hippler also said that although Kohberger's plea deal requires him to waive his right to appeal, that doesn't mean he doesn't have a right to appeal under the U.S. Supreme Court decision in Garza v. Idaho.

"Now, I recognize the plea agreement includes a waiver of the right to appeal," he said. "But as the parties probably know, the U.S. Supreme Court in Garza versus Idaho has indicated the fact that a defendant waives the right to appeal doesn't mean they don't have the right to appeal, and so it may affect the outcome of that appeal, and it may affect, the underlying case and the plea agreement."

Bryan Kohberger judge lifts gag order after Idaho killer's confession

The Idaho judge overseeing Bryan Kohberger's murder case in the death of four college students has lifted a gag order that was in place since early 2023.

www.foxnews.com

 

[gremlin444]

The other part of what needs to be clarified is the very simple fact that an appeal court does NOT HAVE TO accept an appeal. Just because an appeal is filed, it does not mean that it is automatically accepted to be heard.

 

[Tragg]

Not sure defense attorneys have always been this way, but I find it slimy when they know their client is guilty, but stretch the truth (or outright lie) to get people off. I thought defense was for falsely accused, now it's about getting criminals off.

I know defense attorneys who do not ask whether the client is guilty, because their job is to defend the client to the best of their ability whether guilty or not.

How would it work, in your view, if the attorney you ask to defend you instead decided to turn you in??

 

[Tragg]

The other part of what needs to be clarified is the very simple fact that an appeal court does NOT HAVE TO accept an appeal. Just because an appeal is filed, it does not mean that it is automatically accepted to be heard.

BBM. This is true of only the highest court in the state or nation.

Every defendant has one appeal "of right" to an intermediate court, to address issues the defense raised at trial that were rejected by the judge.

 

[LAborn]

I know defense attorneys who do not ask whether the client is guilty, because their job is to defend the client to the best of their ability whether guilty or not.

How would it work, in your view, if the attorney you ask to defend you instead decided to turn you in??

Attorneys and clients have confidentiality agreements--attorney-client privilege.

 

[Tragg]

Attorneys and clients have confidentiality agreements--attorney-client privilege.

Yes of course but I was trying to get my mind around your statement, "I thought defense was for the wrongfully accused..." How would that work, in your view?

I come into your office as an attorney, you evaluate my case, and you say, "Sorry I can't represent you because I think you are guilty?"

Is that how you think defense lawyers should work?