GUILTY PLEA DEAL ACCEPTED - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #114

  • #1,741
Has anyone seen anything in all the ISP documents (or any others) or any interviews, etc, about the fellow female CJ grad student we learned about in the Dateline episode?

We had heard about her vaguely before in regards of her having an apartment break in, being scared, and asking BK to install a security camera for her.

Then in the Dateline episode they gave her name (SO NOT COOL), and said she shared an office with him. Said she had a crush on him (AGAIN, NOT COOL, UNLESS THEY INTERVIEWED HER AND SHE GAVE PERMISSION). They said the night she discovered the break in (burnt cake moved from kitchen counter, bathroom toiletries moved around), she called BK and asked to stay at his apt (she lived in the same complex). She eventually wondered if it has been him who had entered her apartment because that day, she had went to get her apt keys from her office desk drawer (where she always put them) and they were gone. She said she had been out of the office earlier for a bit, but when she discovered the keys were gone, BK wasn't in the office. Later he came in, and she asked him if he had seen the keys--he said no. But they turned up later that day.

The only reason I'm asking is because the ISP dump includes tons of interviews with other grad students in the program and accounts of BK being in their offices and preventing them from leaving/coming in uninvited. It struck me that I didn't recall seeing any interview that could have been with her (and I think he may have even had 1 more office mate).

Maybe ISP is not releasing documents pertaining to her/that incident in order to protect her privacy and that's fine. After all, we've not seen anyone else other than Dateline mention that she was an office mate, supposedly had a crush on him, or seen her name elsewhere. I'm sure there was at least a subset of Probergers after the Dateline episode that tried to find and attack her via email/social media.

I was just wondering if I had missed it in the recent document dumps.
I haven't seen it but I haven't been able to go through all of them - there's almost 600 pages!
To save time I found it faster to use a word search on the link which Mass Guy provided - posted on all the first few pages of this WS thread. Maybe try a word search to check?
 
  • #1,742
How can he not know what he looks like, how he comes across, how inept he is in society? That is of course rhetorical. JMOO

The problem is...

His perception of himself is disturbed.
Because his mind is disturbed.

Everybody sees oneself through one's filter.
How you or I see ourselves
differs how others see us.

The extreme example is
how a painfully thin anorexic girl sees herself in a mirror - she sees herself as fat.

And what's more...
No two people see us in the same way.

Because
we all interpret differently what or who we see.

JMO
 
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  • #1,743
  • #1,744
On the second para yes I do think he's also been radicalized post 2010 but this is based on the new BK statements in the WSU bundle.
For me, he just doesn't seem to be the same person he was on the TapaTalks. ( More resentful, bitter and angry. )

We know he'd spent the intervening ten years living a fairly solitary but very online life. I'd happily put a wager on FBI having found he'd previously been a member of gamer chats and Incel forums. (R/eddit's dedicated forums were only banned in the late 2010s.) In the WSU docs he references ideas which were also prevalent there - eugenics/ who doesn't deserve to procreate, misanthropy, a Professor is unable to grade me accurately because she's foreign etc etc. (BTW I don't think we'll ever see the full FBI digital investigation, just as the Cellebrite couple recently explained so this hunch can't be proved )

Anyway, load the impact of thos forums on top of all of his pre-existing difficulties and challenges from childhood and teens -including something like ASPD as you suggest - and increasingly a double-life centered on specific p/orn & compulsions for hard-core violence & SK material. A catastrophic mix.

The WSU dump, plus the Cellebrite stuff explains so much. Prior to these and for so long he was viewed as an enigma, as unfathomable. Now I do feel many of the ' But why did he do it?' type questions have now been resolved, for me.


Anyway have a listen to this Levy show if you get chance, see what you make of it. Levy covers a handful of WSU documents we've already discussed on WS but she adds extra commentary


the very calculating Mr Kohberger
18mins. Perhaps BK was considering a kind of counter-attack - wrt another male member of staff - in the event that BK was disciplined for sexual harassment. (Kinda blackmail on WSU CJ Dept)

ETA - not a literal, physical attack

At 28 minutes
Angenette Levy picks up on something this WSU student noticed. After the 1122 murders, when everybody is discussing them he doesn't participate but once the students start linking them to Bundy's Chi Omega murders, she speculates that he feels more comfortable and wants to get off on talking about those with her instead


and at 36mins Levy speculates on his questioning a WSU grad he likes- where do you live and what kind of ( guard) dog do you have?
He also told this woman ' whoever did the murders must have been pretty good' and discussed why the timing was right
People in the office thought he ' might be a possible future rapist' and discuss whether he might be an incel

Included is a clip of Ann Taylor speaking in a pre-trial hearing about the hundred hours of WSU interviews and the ' unkind things' that WSU said about him, ' mean' comments' . She attempted to mischaracterize the WSU testimony as ableist & autism-related. Prosecutor interjected, we're not using them at penalty phase anyway because we have evidence which is far more aggravating.
Thanks for sharing this video. What the Cellebrite interviews and WSU documents did for me was correct any notion I had that the now-Inmate had the capacity to be a functioning adult in the academic or working world. The calls to his parents are shocking in terms of his need for not just daily contact but near-constant contact and his expectation that his parents are there on demand for him. I wonder if he talks to them like he talked to the professor who felt "controlled" by BK dropping in to chat late on Friday about essentially nothing. In this case, hour and hours of talk about maybe nothin.

It seems likely to me that commuting to undergrad classes, doing the master's online, and living at home meant his parents were available to him for hours a day; maybe he didn't need as much talk if they were in the same house for hours at a time. I'd love to know about that home. But I imagine his parents thought that WSU was a launch into adulthood and independence but I'm sure the 7-8 am phone calls (PA time, Eastern) destroyed the hope that he would be OK on his own--which explains his dad flying out to Pullman to ride home with him at Christmas. He may have demanded that--or the parents knew he was incapable of doing that trip on his own.

I'd love to hear a top forensic psychologist talk about this.
 
  • #1,745
  • #1,746
Given BK's multiple known mental health diagnoses, in addition to those we don't know about or that were never properly evaluated or diagnosed, as well as the complexity that arises when people have multiple diagnoses, its not possible to attribute specific behaviors to a particular diagnosis.

But some behaviors and behavior patterns do tend to be associated more strongly with some diagnoses than others. As an example, the hand washing until hands are red and raw would commonly be associated with OCD, and less likely with something like Generalized Anxiety Disorder.

IMO, BK's behavior of talking extensively AT people without paying attention to whether they want to keep engaging, can commonly be associated with the autism spectrum. I would speculate that these specific topics BK insisted on talking to everyone in his program about were one of his major special interests, if not the only one.

For people on the ASD spectrum, it is common to have a subject or topic (or more than one) that can become all-encompassing. These can last for short periods of time, or they can last for years or decades. This can be quite positive if the person can channel their special interest into a career.

I'm guessing that this was his family's hope - they saw that BK found a topic he was deeply passionate about, and this motivated him to pursue higher education. If he didn't have all the other problems and issues, he very well could have become an expert in his special interest area, and that could have led to a successful career. Being able to succeed in that area would then lead to other positive experiences such as increased self-esteem, etc.

For some on the autism spectrum, their special interest can become something that they want to talk about any chance they get. It may be difficult for them to resist the urge to talk extensively about their topic as it is so meaningful to them. They may have spent hundreds if not thousands of hours studying and learning about their special interest. They may actually know more about it than others simply due to the fact that they've spent so much time immersing themselves in it.

Conversation can then become a time to "info dump" or "monologue" about the special interest as opposed to an opportunity to connect with another person. A quick google search on terms like "special interests" "monologuing" and "info dumping" will pull up hundreds of articles about this.

Of course, BK is a complex person, and autism spectrum disorder (ASD) is only one element of his overall psyche. Clearly there are more things at play here. Just as we cannot attribute everything about him to ASD, we also cannot remove it entirely from our understanding of him. There are many other elements of his behavior (that are known to us so far) that I believe connect quite strongly to being on the autism spectrum IMO, but I decided to focus on these recent posts about his interactions with people at WSU.

All MOO and a caveat - I hope/think our community here at WS has the wisdom to know that discussing how autism spectrum disorder potentially plays a role in a specific person's actions (in this case, BK's), it doesn't equate to a global judgement/assumption about all people who are on the spectrum.
 
  • #1,747
Haven’t watched this yet but it should be interesting.

Thanks @MassGuy that was very interesting. This couple were contacted by the FBI to assist on the phone data recovery. They said that they were planning on extending an invitation to the families of the victims to meet with them in person and answer any questions they may have about what they found.

I find that deeply touching and respectful. That want to provide them with any answers now that the gag order has been lifted.

They touched on some of the strangest things they found the murderer did on his phone and computer. Like he spent all of Christmas Night into the next day on a SK website. He did use a program called Eraser to delete a lot of his browser history and they explained why large chunks of information could have missing.

I think that is why The Defense and The State (conceded) that they didn't have PROOF of a digital connection between the murderer and Maddie, Kaylee, Zana and Ethan.

JMO
 
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  • #1,748
Given BK's multiple known mental health diagnoses, in addition to those we don't know about or that were never properly evaluated or diagnosed, as well as the complexity that arises when people have multiple diagnoses, its not possible to attribute specific behaviors to a particular diagnosis.

But some behaviors and behavior patterns do tend to be associated more strongly with some diagnoses than others. As an example, the hand washing until hands are red and raw would commonly be associated with OCD, and less likely with something like Generalized Anxiety Disorder.

IMO, BK's behavior of talking extensively AT people without paying attention to whether they want to keep engaging, can commonly be associated with the autism spectrum. I would speculate that these specific topics BK insisted on talking to everyone in his program about were one of his major special interests, if not the only one.

For people on the ASD spectrum, it is common to have a subject or topic (or more than one) that can become all-encompassing. These can last for short periods of time, or they can last for years or decades. This can be quite positive if the person can channel their special interest into a career.

I'm guessing that this was his family's hope - they saw that BK found a topic he was deeply passionate about, and this motivated him to pursue higher education. If he didn't have all the other problems and issues, he very well could have become an expert in his special interest area, and that could have led to a successful career. Being able to succeed in that area would then lead to other positive experiences such as increased self-esteem, etc.

For some on the autism spectrum, their special interest can become something that they want to talk about any chance they get. It may be difficult for them to resist the urge to talk extensively about their topic as it is so meaningful to them. They may have spent hundreds if not thousands of hours studying and learning about their special interest. They may actually know more about it than others simply due to the fact that they've spent so much time immersing themselves in it.

Conversation can then become a time to "info dump" or "monologue" about the special interest as opposed to an opportunity to connect with another person. A quick google search on terms like "special interests" "monologuing" and "info dumping" will pull up hundreds of articles about this.

Of course, BK is a complex person, and autism spectrum disorder (ASD) is only one element of his overall psyche. Clearly there are more things at play here. Just as we cannot attribute everything about him to ASD, we also cannot remove it entirely from our understanding of him. There are many other elements of his behavior (that are known to us so far) that I believe connect quite strongly to being on the autism spectrum IMO, but I decided to focus on these recent posts about his interactions with people at WSU.

All MOO and a caveat - I hope/think our community here at WS has the wisdom to know that discussing how autism spectrum disorder potentially plays a role in a specific person's actions (in this case, BK's), it doesn't equate to a global judgement/assumption about all people who are on the spectrum.

BK and Defense used ASD to explain away behaviors. I am not buying it and it is disrespectful to anybody who is on the spectrum. Just shows you how manipulative he is, and what lengths they go to in applying diversional tactics. JMOO
 
  • #1,749
"Two high school friends of Bryan Kohberger's, Casey Arntz and a young woman named Bree said:

'Kohberger was overweight
and was bullied a lot in high school,
until his senior year, when he lost about 100 pounds'.

Casey Arntz says,
'He was rail thin
and It was after that weight loss that a lot of people noticed a
huge switch'."

RSBM
This is what I see in his pictures. The picture of him overweight, he has normal eyes, though a little unfocused, an open face. After he lost the weight, he has the bulging, staring eyes and a closed face. I don't know what happened in there, but something did. Maybe he found out that the weight wasn't really the issue. Maybe he thought if he just lost the weight, people would accept him but if people weren't his strong suit, losing weight does not fix that. And I have no idea where his drug habit fell in the timeline.
 
  • #1,750
TRO on media releasing any further bedroom crime scene photos.
( media outlets FOIA'd 200 photos and were expected to publish over time. Maddie's Mom initiated the TRO, understandably)

 
  • #1,751
TRO on media releasing any further bedroom crime scene photos.
( media outlets FOIA'd 200 photos and were expected to publish over time. Maddie's Mom initiated the TRO, understandably)

In case anyone else didn't know:

TRO = Temporary Restraining Order
 
  • #1,752
  • #1,753
  • #1,754
  • #1,755
They hate him this much, according to a prison official interviewed by News Nation.

2 Cents
also, what else do they have to do? they have plenty of free time.
 
  • #1,756
Regarding the ISP document dump, is that blue stain running down the wall next to the backpack blood cast off ?!? Is that what it looks like with disclosing solution?
I believe so, the description of that area of the crime scene is in the ISP documents
 
  • #1,757
I bet they are so ready to put this case behind them.

jmopinion
I hope they don't though; the Idaho Statesman that is. The relevant ISP narrative doc clearly shows that this was simply a misunderstanding by one LE officer who then conveyed that misunderstanding to a second officer (who is authoring the narrative). All of DM's actual interview docs mention no naming by the killer.

I was hoping the appropriately named Kevin Fixler would set the record straight on the non-event of the killer using KG's name.

Moo, anyone interested in accuracy should not rely on Banefield. She did her usual sensational, poorly researched reporting. One more piece of misinformation introduced to the public which will probably never entirely lose its legs. Jmo
 
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  • #1,758
I hope they don't though. I was hoping the appropriately named Kevin Fixler would set the record straight on the non-event of the killer using KG's name.

Moo, anyone interested in accuracy should not rely on Banefield. She did her usual sensational, poorly researched reporting. One more piece of misinformation introduced to the public which will probably never entirely lose its legs. Jmo
Yes, of course. They want the correct information to be known. I'm just sure they are sick of the sensationalism - must be tiring to deal with it for years.

jmo
 
  • #1,759
I hope they don't though; the Idaho Statesman that is. The relevant ISP narrative doc clearly shows that this was simply a misunderstanding by one LE officer who then conveyed that misunderstanding to a second officer (who is authoring the narrative). All of DM's actual interview docs mention no naming by the killer.

I was hoping the appropriately named Kevin Fixler would set the record straight on the non-event of the killer using KG's name.

Moo, anyone interested in accuracy should not rely on Banefield. She did her usual sensational, poorly researched reporting. One more piece of misinformation introduced to the public which will probably never entirely lose its legs.



IMG_5011.webp
 
  • #1,760

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